NY 117: The Vanillaside (Game over)


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Post Post #150 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:10 am

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

@Mod: Please delete the one post with the username The Master Hand. This is the exact same post, so keeping the other one would be useless.


Strangely, I get the message; 'you can only delete your own posts'. It will just have to be.

- Hoopla

RayFrost wrote:1. That's semantics. If something "screams wrongness" it means I dislike it. Would you prefer that I slightly altered it to say "the majority of this post screams wrongness" instead?
Yes, because it makes more logical sense and it wouldn't look like a contradiction.
RayFrost wrote:2. I hadn't noticed the bankable deadlines - I was considering raw play in that, in general play, it is crucial to not lynch early or late, making the whole discussion over it by you rather pointless. I repeat: the obvious play for town is to not lynch as soon as possible and to avoid a deadline lynch.
Most people tend to lynch when there's less then fourty-eight hours left in the deadline. That's very close to a deadline lynch. Lynching six days before the deadline is still relatively close to the deadline, but it's not a deadline lynch either.
RayFrost wrote:3. Even with bankable deadlines, I don't see much point in carefully planning out the deadlines to try and find an optimal time spread - it will change depending on new information anyway, making it too variable to matter.
Given the player list, I find it highly unlikely that we'll receive a replacement due to flaking anytime soon. Even with replacements, they do not = deadline extension unless the deadline is very close to the deadline and right now, I'm not seeing that happen in this game yet. Also, planning on when to lynch can give us more time in the long run to find scums.
RayFrost wrote:His post doesn't display a worry about his wagon past it being on him - MPR's PoV would be that he was town, so wanting a wagon on somebody else is a natural follow through regardless of how concerned one was about the wagon.
Wanting a wagon on someone else means that you want pressure reduced on yourself and when done later in the game then when he did it, it becomes a lot more evident and a lot more scummier. Considering that he did it during RVS, I take it as mildly scummy, but it becomes a serious scum tell later on.
RayFrost wrote:When hybrid had quite clearly stated that MPR was
concerned
worried about being lynched
This is wrong. DemonHybrid stated that he didn't like how MehPlusRawr dropped his yelling act by the time that post came along. He also stated that he thought MehPlusRawr was scum at the time, so he kept his vote on him until switching to me later yesterday.
RayFrost wrote:First bit: accidental hammers can happen from people not knowing the vote count as well (and has happened outside of newbie games that I've been in).
That is because they didn't read the last vote all the way up to the latest post before accidentally hammering and I honestly doubt most of those accidental hammer happened during RVS. They need to read before hammering anyone.
RayFrost wrote:Second bit: That doesn't even counter my point that people can misunderstand what is said quite easily. (probably aren't countering this because it's a fact...)
Everyone view things differently, that is a fact that I will give you, but it is not a fact that bandwagons will lead to lynches. Are bandwagons necessary for lynches? Yes they are, but not all bandwagons will lead to lynches.

vezokpiraka wrote:Too many walls of text.
If you can tell me it would be very helpful.
Don't expect us to do your work for you. 150 posts is not really that much to look over and I highly doubt you'll spend over thirty minutes looking over the thread, so there isn't an excuse for this.
Last edited by Hoopla on Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #151 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:11 am

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

MehPlusRawr wrote:You're not in this game.
Sorry about that, accidentally posted with my modding account for an ongoing game. I need to check my account before posting
anything
.
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Post Post #152 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:21 am

Post by Hoopla »

Day 1, Vote Count #3


With fourteen alive, it takes
8
votes to lynch. Deadline is schedueled for 22:00 GMT, August 16th <Countdown>.


DemonHybrid -
4
(Socrates, SpyreX, Nachomamma8, vezokpiraka)
Super Smash Bros Fan -
3
(DemonHybrid, RayFrost, xRECKONERx)
RayFrost -
1
(Ellibereth)
MehPlusRawr -
1
(Super Smash Bros Fan)
SpyreX -
1
(MehPlusRawr)
Socrates -
1
(Korts)
Korts -
1
(Incognito)
vezokpiraka -
1
(Seraphim)

Not voting -
1
(Jack*)

*Asterix denotes unconfirmed players
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Post Post #153 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:44 am

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: DemonHybrid


Did a reread. Yep. Though I'm still watching Vezok.
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Post Post #154 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:56 am

Post by SpyreX »

While I still dont like DemonHybrid I think I know what has to happen here:
vezo wrote:Anything intresting in the last 6 pages?
I am always down for a lynch on DH
Vote DemonHybrid
This is one of those single magnificent gems that is enough to go all the way live for.

We've got a pair of 3 people wagons up and, of course, the declaration of not reading anything and an immediate preference for one.

Which, of course is immediately followed up by a read and confirmation of vote.

Yea, this would be where the bullet goes. Or a rope.

Unvote, Vote: Vezo
@SpyreX: Elaborate on your town reads (talking about your second post here)?
I can't... yet. Soon, hopefully. Lets just say there's two types of games: games that get clouded in muck and games where the sifter starts showing beautiful town flowers right off the bat. This really looks like the latter half and that, good sir, is the kind of game I like.
Show
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Post Post #155 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:09 pm

Post by Socrates »

unvote, vote:Vezo


Is anyone else scum? Any town reads? Which post, specifically, made you think Demon Hybrid is scum?
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Post Post #156 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:11 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Unvote
Vote: Vezo


Right now I'm just following Socrates and Spyre BTW.
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Post Post #157 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:44 pm

Post by MehPlusRawr »

I don't like the way Seraphim keeps changing his votes. Are you going to follow up *any* of them?
I think I'm back. Mafiascum just became 20% cooler in 10 seconds flat.
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Post Post #158 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:45 pm

Post by Seraphim »

MehPlusRawr wrote:I don't like the way Seraphim keeps changing his votes. Are you going to follow up *any* of them?
Eventually, yes. Am I not allowed to change my mind?
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Post Post #159 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:00 pm

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

Seraphim wrote:Unvote
Vote: Vezo

Right now I'm just following Socrates and Spyre BTW.
To be honest, this doesn't really sit well with me. Now granted, I don't have a problem with voting vezokpiraka, as I am suspicious of him. However, for you to follow up Socrates and SpyreX on voting vezokpiraka without really giving additional reasons of your own definently doesn't scream "town" to me.
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Post Post #160 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:28 pm

Post by Socrates »

The incessant pressure from other players to come up with independent reasons for ones opinions (thus being forced to ignore the cases other players put forward) and never ever back down from them for fear of being "inconsistent" is probably one of the greatest failings of what is traditionally thought of as good town play.

In my opinion, of course.
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Post Post #161 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:34 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Does that make me town or scum?
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Post Post #162 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:42 pm

Post by Incognito »

I'm just not at all seeing the
*bling blam bloom*
screaming scum tell that everyone else seems to be seeing with DemonHybrid. After his responses to my questions, I think he seems ok so far.

@MehPlusRawr:

Who's scum? Your wagon's gone, so you can't use "I WAS BUSY DEFENDING MYSELF" as an excuse for not producing reads. Your vote's still on SpyreX, and you haven't really commented on people's alignments. So do so.

-~-~-~

I'd like vezopiraka to provide a short summary of the game so far. I too am not a fan of him popping into the thread and voting one of the large wagons and then confirming his vote when he apparently "reread" the thread. Please prove that you did a read and explain why you think DH is scum.

@Seraphim:

What are you trying to accomplish?





Where's Jack?
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Post Post #163 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:48 pm

Post by Korts »

Catching up, expect some outdated replies and a somewhat lengthier post.

Reck's death, which I consider inevitable before his confirmed alignment could hold any big benefits in POE, would be optimal for the town if it happened by scumkill, but the existence of the Innocent Child's vanillizing ability helps scum with each passing night--if the day cop finds a power role, a vanillizing by redirection and a kill the same night will give scum a foolproof safeclaim. There are facets to this dilemma that need to be taken into account, and I think decision on this front is a priority for town second only to the longer term one of finding the scum. I refuse to let this issue pass without a discussion at least, and outbursts of "why the fuck is discussion necessary" are highly suspicious from this point on, if not retrospectively. Ignoring the issue is also the same as refusing to address it or dismissing it. At the very least, a stance should be taken by everyone.

Incog, discussion is helpful. Your vote and your attempt to pre-empt any further elaboration don't make sense to me. What reason would I have as scum to force this discussion on town?

SSBF pushing the MPR quicklynch anxiousness issue with such vehemence in post 62, for instance, is really off-color. The issue is completely irrelevant and doesn't deserve such in-depth analysis; MPR's reaction and later rationalization were both understandable to me, and making such a big deal of it seems like more than just an effort to spark discussion. He seems to be eager to make MPR a scapegoat.

Neither am I comfortable with the nitpicking in 118 regarding the entire post vs. response to Socrates part, nor the response to DemonHybrid with the loaded question that DH doesn't want an easy way of getting rid of scum. The former is useless logical masturbation and pointless filler; the latter question implies that SSBF had presented an easy way of getting rid of scum, when all he did was say in unnecessarily many words that there is an extremely slim chance of town killing the scumteam by Day 2.

I really don't like DemonHybrid's post 87. What little of the post is actually spent on answering the question in reply to which the whole was apparently written is concerned with SSBF's setup speculation, which was well-reasoned as far as I can see. Nor can I see scum motives that DemonHybrid is ascribing to the bolded sections. Seems like a bad attempt at painting someone black. I somewhat agree with the target, but not with the particular reasoning--why not attack me, for instance, when I invited that speculation you so harshly attack?

Nachomamma stands out by nature of passivity far more than vezokpiraka. Nacho rides both the MPR and Hybrid wagons blatantly and without explanation, and gives no material to work with. Don't like him at all.

vote: Nachomamma


Feel free to join in.
scumchat never die
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Post Post #164 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:57 pm

Post by Seraphim »

What am I trying to accomplish? I'm trying to find scum, that's what I'm trying to accomplish. What are
you
trying to accomplish?
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Post Post #165 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:05 pm

Post by Super Smash Bros. Fan »

Seraphim wrote:Does that make me town or scum?
Right now, I personally have a null leaning town read on you. However, I personally disliked ISO: 10 as stated before.
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Post Post #166 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:07 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:
Seraphim wrote:Does that make me town or scum?
Right now, I personally have a null leaning town read on you. However, I personally disliked ISO: 10 as stated before.
That was directed at Socrates. Your post was straight forward enough.
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Post Post #167 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:07 pm

Post by MehPlusRawr »

Incognito wrote:
@MehPlusRawr:

Who's scum? Your wagon's gone, so you can't use "I WAS BUSY DEFENDING MYSELF" as an excuse for not producing reads. Your vote's still on SpyreX, and you haven't really commented on people's alignments. So do so.
My usual "gut glance over the playerlist" tells me that Nacho's scum(miest). Attempting to explain why is harder. Anyways. Nacho only has 4 posts, all of which are completely useless.

SSBF and DH are both really hard to read, and they're usually pretty good vigshots.

Didn't know I still had my RVS vote. Whoops. :P

Unvote, vote: Nacho
I think I'm back. Mafiascum just became 20% cooler in 10 seconds flat.
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Post Post #168 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:19 pm

Post by RayFrost »

MehPlusRawr wrote:
Incognito wrote:
@MehPlusRawr:

Who's scum? Your wagon's gone, so you can't use "I WAS BUSY DEFENDING MYSELF" as an excuse for not producing reads. Your vote's still on SpyreX, and you haven't really commented on people's alignments. So do so.
My usual "gut glance over the playerlist" tells me that Nacho's scum(miest). Attempting to explain why is harder. Anyways. Nacho only has 4 posts, all of which are completely useless.

SSBF and DH are both really hard to read, and they're usually pretty good vigshots.

Didn't know I still had my RVS vote. Whoops. :P

Unvote, vote: Nacho
Vezok has five posts that are completely useless (or four if you want to count the vote as useful... somehow), so what makes nacho scummier from your PoV over vezok?
don't you feel silly now?
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Post Post #169 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:26 pm

Post by Socrates »

Seraphim wrote:Does that make me town or scum?
The only reason I bothered to make that statement is because of my aforementioned town read of you, though I am not ready to take that read to the bank.

I don't think you action is indicative of alignment at all and was more lamenting the tell itself more than anything.
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Post Post #170 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:33 pm

Post by xRECKONERx »

Scum will certainly try to redirect people to me, but that would involve targeting me, which involves them losing their redirector, Korts.

Seriously, me dying is a stupid idea.
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Post Post #171 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:35 pm

Post by Ellibereth »

SpyreX wrote:Ellli help me out here because I just want to slam 87 to the wall and kill it dead because stretchinggggggg
STRETCHING LIKE RUBBER IT IS.
SCUMMY? I THINK NOT!

k Ray vs. Demon town on town, Next.
vezokpiraka wrote:Anything intresting in the last 6 pages?
I am always down for a lynch on DH
Vote DemonHybrid
every game always or just this game always
And Yeah I skipped all the walls too. for later...:P

unvote
FLASH OF GREEN
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Post Post #172 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:36 pm

Post by Ellibereth »

TOWN
Sera
Meh
Reck
Elli
Soc
Spy

LEaN TOWN
Supersmash
Ray
Incog
Demon
Korts

PEOPLE LEFT
Jack
Vezokpiraka
Nachomamma8
FLASH OF GREEN
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Post Post #173 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:45 pm

Post by Ellibereth »

VOTE: NACHO
FLASH OF GREEN
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Post Post #174 (ISO) » Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:49 pm

Post by RayFrost »

xRECKONERx wrote:Scum will certainly try to redirect people to me, but that would involve targeting me, which involves them losing their redirector, Korts.

Seriously, me dying is a stupid idea.
Actually, the redirection doesn't count as a target, and the mafioso that does it is not vannilia'ed. I talked with hoopla about it when I signed up.
don't you feel silly now?

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