Mini 1012: Mafia In Soraville (Game Over!)

[DemonHybrid]

Weird in a "everyone who thinks I have anything to do with town is scum by association" way of course.

This is Jack we're talking about.

[DemonHybrid]

*and Pie we're talking about.

Sorry. Funny things happen when you've just woken up.

[InflatablePie]

Weird in what way?

"Weird" as in it wasn't really content. You kinda flip-flop on DH (although expressing a slight town lean by the last part) and say you'll have to think about esurio/oritz. Doesn't really contribute much, is all. Any useful thoughts?

[Friend]

Sorry, it was late at night and I was extremely tired, having just gotten home from the beach. I'll be back in like a couple hours and I'll say something about the others.

[Fugitive]

I said I founhd it frustrating, I never said I found it scummy.

I know what you said. I never claimed you said it was scummy. I find it scummy how you're acting though.

Vote: Deadline Extension

[ready2rock]

OK, I thought you were incorrectly mocking my reasoning. Fair enough.

That's 6 votes for the deadline extension

[DemonHybrid]

Well, I said what I needed to say about Ortiz and Kov at least. If anyone needs to ask me something, go ahead, but I have no other original thoughts to give that wouldn't be me repeating myself.

[Friend]

DH: Do you have any specific examples of scummy things ortiz/MvK did besides the whole neighbor-outing point you bring up?

[sorasgoof]

Deadline extended.

[Fugitive]

Someone tell me why I extended that? I assume we're giving everyone time to unvote DH and vote for Twomz or Pie.

[Jack]

Someone tell me why I extended that? I assume we're giving everyone time to unvote DH and vote for Twomz or Pie.

Nope. Giving friend time post some more.

[DemonHybrid]

Well, the only interaction I had with Ortiz before the neighbor outing was the Kov ordeal. I gave him town points at the time for putting up a good argument....

...looking back though, I don't like his first post with the reads.

He says he can't get a read on Jack....I find that staying a little on the safe side with a tricky character like Jack is somewhat scummy, but furthermore, I think he's been portraying a very stubborn VT-like playstyle all game. There are those that find it scummy, those that find it town, but very few that are hard-pressed to really find a read on him. I don't really like it that much. Even those that were on the edge have found their niche on the Jack argument.

His read on TL is exactly like everyone elses. "Could be town, but he looks scummy at face value". I find this going with the flow moreso than having a good read.

His reaction to Twomz seems to be bus behavior. I firmly believe that most 3 man mafia teams are set-up as such: There's a scummy talker, a lurker and one that people trust. It happened in SHM:OT, with diddin being the scummy talker, 2003/FingerQuick being a lurker, me being the one that people trust. Skimming through games, it's been like that too. Keeping that in mind, I'd like to think that this game fits that niche as well, and I think it's a cop-out to blame Twomz for lurking most of all (He mentioned buddying with Pie, but Pie's not obvscum)

He seems to think r2r is fully town as well, when his play hasn't really been that much different than Twomz...sure, he's put up a good case or two, but looking through, he's only a skip above Twomz and Kov when it comes to the lurking regard, especially when I see him browsing the forum often enough and not saying anything.

His Fugitive read is also a safe call.

I just overall think he's been playing it safe and only raising a case when there's an opportune time to do so. Stuff like "Why are you blaming Kov for making a bad gambit when you yourself did the same thing?" when it's hardly defensible...we both can't prove why we did what we did or even if what we did was real/planned out. Instead of making a case based on actual mixed up priorities and post proof like I did, he relies on safeties and obvious arguments.

I guess that's basically it in a nutshell, but I think my catch produces more than enough scumminess to disclude all of this analysis and still be an eyebrow raiser.

[ready2rock]

What about MvK's play? He seemed pretty town to me.

[ortiz1193]

So basically, my neutral reads when I replaced in are me playing it safe, awesome. That was what, page 15ish?

Even those that were on the edge have found their niche on the Jack argument.

I have too, I believe Jack is town. I didn't have a read on him at the time due to his posting style, and I had just joined the game.

My read on TL was he's being scummy, and I believe I preview edited that exact post saying that TL was town, because he was obv PR telling and I was trying to avoid him having to claim, which can be repeatedly seen by me saying stuff like "stop that, TL is town"

Bussing Twomz? I was the only person to put any suspicion on him, I pushed for his lynch ever since my first post in this game. The only reason I even switched to your wagon was because everyone refused to follow me on Twomz and you were my next scum read. I have no reason why you think my relationship with Twomz is bussing.

I'm 99.9% sure r2r is town. He town-told early on before I had even replaced in.

I had no read on Fugitive at the time, he had done nothing but posted Pie is scum, and still hasn't. I still don't have a solid read on Fugi, I've seen him play reckless as town and scum. He's done nothing to provide town or scumtells either way.

"playing it safe" - I came into the game pushing for a Twomz lynch and then pushing for your lynch. Over half the players in this game have played 10x as cautious/safe as I have. DH has no case on me, he literally decided I was scum when esurio said DH was town and I said DH was scum and chose me as the most likely scum neighbor. He just went through and looked for something to make me scummy, and the best he could come up with is my opening read post where I called the 2 hardest people to read neutral.

[TheLonging]

MvK was town, ortiz is town.

DH is scum (although this is very slowly eradicating)
Pie is scum
One of essi/Twomz is scum.

unvote[/b[

Vote: Pie

If this doesn't take off I will hate you all

[ortiz1193]

Its best to lynch one of the neighbors today isn't it? When DH flips scum it should clear me/esurio. Only reason someone shouldn't support the lynch of one of us 3 is if they think we're all town, and I would assume you don't considering 2/3 are on your scum list. >_>

[DemonHybrid]

Its best to lynch one of the neighbors today isn't it? When DH flips scum it should clear me/esurio. Only reason someone shouldn't support the lynch of one of us 3 is if they think we're all town, and I would assume you don't considering 2/3 are on your scum list. >_>

Big assumption there. "It should clear me/esurio".

So, you -know- that there's one scum on the neighbor team? What about the possibility of two?

[TheLonging]

Its best to lynch one of the neighbors today isn't it? When DH flips scum it should clear me/esurio. Only reason someone shouldn't support the lynch of one of us 3 is if they think we're all town, and I would assume you don't considering 2/3 are on your scum list. >_>

you're forgetting the part where DH can't be roleblocker (he just doesn't seem like the type who could). I'm betting Pie is more likely to be out of essi/Twomz and DH.

DH: That's why they call it AN ASSUMPTION

[DemonHybrid]

"playing it safe" - I came into the game pushing for a Twomz lynch and then pushing for your lynch. Over half the players in this game have played 10x as cautious/safe as I have. DH has no case on me, he literally decided I was scum when esurio said DH was town and I said DH was scum and chose me as the most likely scum neighbor. He just went through and looked for something to make me scummy, and the best he could come up with is my opening read post where I called the 2 hardest people to read neutral.

Yeah. Picking on the lurker and then the one with the most heat on him IS playing it safe.

And I guess you completely forgot the neighbor outing. "Oops, I guess I forgot scum can talk to their partners if they're neighbor scum" doesn't cut it.

[esuriospiritus]

._.

I still think both of you are probtown. DH's is case is not particularly convincing, and actually gives me some doubts because something about the timing of his suspicions on ortiz just seems... weird to me. But I don't know. Weird doesn't necessarily equal scummy, and it's the only thing that twinged my gut all game. :/

DH is scum (although this is very slowly eradicating)
Pie is scum
One of essi/Twomz is scum.

... Assuming the scumteam

were

DH/Pie/me, what makes you think I'd be dumb enough to loudly proclaim both of my buddies are town when I haven't set myself up to look hugely town myself? Friend will know this best out of everyone here, but uh, that's not how I roll.

[TheLonging]

WIFOM.

Really I'm leaning more TO Twomz being scum than not.

[ortiz1193]

I asked earlier if it was possible for there to be 2 neighbor scum and got no response, so I'm assuming there's 1. It seems unorthodox for there to be 2 doesn't it? I will repeat that I've never played with neighbors before and the wiki page I read didn't give too much detail. So yes I am assuming there is one scum neighbor max. I'm sure you'll tell me that's a scumtell.

DH is once again attempting to make me look like scum by twisting facts. "and then the one with most heat on him" - You had the most heat on you

because of me

. You had 1 vote on you and there was a kov wagon forming at the time, and I said that I thought kov was right and you were wrong. You did not have the most heat on you nor were you an easy target, which I'm sure you'll say next based on past experience in our games.

TL, you're right on 2/3 atleast. It's DH and Twomz for 99% sure. Esurio is town since I doubt there are two scum neighbors. Twomz is still scum. Don't know about Pie.

[ready2rock]

lol at DH not replying to ortiz's entire post because he doesn't have a case.

lol at DH thinking ortiz is scum because he disagrees with his read on me.

Preview edit @ortiz: the game I played in with neighbors had 2 town and 1 SK, IIRC

@Fugi: we don't need any more claims on day 1.

[Jack]

There could be 2 scum neighbors.

But I think it's DH/haschel/friend.

DH's play has been scum scrambling to save himself since before his claim.

[DemonHybrid]

lol at DH not replying to ortiz's entire post because he doesn't have a case.

lol at DH thinking ortiz is scum because he disagrees with his read on me.

Preview edit @ortiz: the game I played in with neighbors had 2 town and 1 SK, IIRC

@Fugi: we don't need any more claims on day 1.

Ortiz basically -restated- his original post.

What, do you want me to requote my response to Friend?

And it's allllllllllllllll about you, r2r. Yes, the whole reason why I think Ortiz is scum is because he finds you town.

All about you, you pretty and unique snowflake princess.