NY 118 - BBM's Large Normal Mafia (Game!)

[danakillsu]

Yeah, I come from a very different background than most of you, I bet, so my posts would naturally stick out. That's what I've always thought, anyway. Trust me, though, I've been town in at least 5 games where the overwhelming majority of the other players were completely sure I was scum. Not that I expect that to really help me in this game. I wouldn't know about Furcolow, but I'm pretty sure he isn't usually posting this way (I have played one game with him in it).

[Shanba]

No, I legitimately thought you were scum.

Shanba, I don't know how else to explain it...maybe it's just bias, but every single post he makes I wind up thinking to myself "Hey, I could see this coming from a scum perspective".

So because you're bad at reading him we should ignore anything he does that is scummy?

Hell, maybe we should just declare him town now and zone him as off limits from any lynch attempt, because after all, he always looks scummy, right?

[xRECKONERx]

Please point to where in my argument I insinuated we should just declare him town now and be like LOL OKAY HE'S OFF LIMITS.
Please, show me. Because that's the most overeager, overreaching statement I've seen in a long time.

I simply asked you a question. Dear God what an awful response.

[UltimaAvalon]

Please point to where in my argument I insinuated we should just declare him town now and be like LOL OKAY HE'S OFF LIMITS.
Please, show me. Because that's the most overeager, overreaching statement I've seen in a long time.

I simply asked you a question. Dear God what an awful response.

Sad thing is that's par for the course, as far as this game is concerned

[Shanba]

Please point to where in my argument I insinuated we should just declare him town now and be like LOL OKAY HE'S OFF LIMITS.
Please, show me. Because that's the most overeager, overreaching statement I've seen in a long time.

I simply asked you a question. Dear God what an awful response.

You didn't. But that's the idea that's implied by your questions.

What I understood from your probing was that you believed the pressure on dana was at least partially due to dana's playstyle, to things that he does that makes him look scummy regardless of whether or not he's scum or town. That's why I asked for specifics, because I wanted to know whether there was anything I could disregard as just a function of the way he plays/thinks. But you couldn't give me any.

Which means that your posts probing me were essentially worthless. So he always looks scummy to you. Great. How am I supposed to adjust my play to correct for his meta of 'scummy-looking'? Answer: I can't. I can't say we should give a certain portion of his scumtells a free pass (give him more leeway), I can't say we should learn to read him better (because you've given me no indication of how such a thing could be done.) It's a bad meta because it's a useless meta, yet you clearly wanted me to do something because of it or else why ask me?

Better to stamp that kind of thinking out hard before it's allowed to spread.

[xRECKONERx]

My post was more of a cautionary warning that if you tunnel on him too hard, you're going to wind up ignoring other potential scum.
Not that you were tunneling. But since you haven't played with him before, I think you're town, because it's only natural to attack him given his playstyle.
If you had played with him before and were tunneling on him, I'd probably be looking at you harder since he's an easy mislynch target (just ask anyone who's played with him before).

So, there we go. My first town read. Hot damn.

[Shanba]

My post was more of a cautionary warning that if you tunnel on him too hard, you're going to wind up ignoring other potential scum.
Not that you were tunneling. But since you haven't played with him before, I think you're town, because it's only natural to attack him given his playstyle.
If you had played with him before and were tunneling on him, I'd probably be looking at you harder since he's an easy mislynch target (just ask anyone who's played with him before).

So, there we go. My first town read. Hot damn.

I don't think I'm tunneling, but warning taken.

[Furcolow]

Frank: Are you more certain of the case against dana or the case against UA (bearing in mind your case against UA is based on him protecting dana)?

The case against UA requires dana being scum, but since he is the bigger fish, I would rather get him. I am less certain, though, as I have been saying that BenMage might be the better candidate for our leads.

@dana, what specifically has Frank done to make you think he is scum? So far, I've only gathered an OMGUS vote and you complaining that he might be making a weak case against you (hint: it's not weak). These are not scum tells, that is simply you pissed off at the notion that someone wants you lynched.

Also, I still don't understand how anyone can be so sure of a read this early in the game. It could very well be possible that dana is just playing terribly, you can't know for sure. To act as if it's an open and shut case and we should lynch a few pages after the game started is ridiculous. Both JDodge and now Frank are guilty of this.

'
Thank you for saying my case isn't weak. You flip-flop on this somewhat by discrediting it for being early on in the game. I can only tell you what happened. I skimmed the RVS quickly (It's not that serious, is it?), saw JDodge complaining about the RVS with reasoning and logic in #68, which to me ended it, and then saw this incredibly scummy post #72 from danakillsu:

Well it's funny to see the reactions I got from pretending I knew UA was scum. I have played with him before, I believe. At any rate, no one as experienced as me would really pretend that they knew someone was scum in the RVS. And the fact that it's tradition to start with a bandwagon on UA should make my actions even less remarkable. Anyway, I'm glad I make it worth it to you, UA.

unvote

Good to see some discussion starting.

But it's all just pretend, you guys. It's not remarkable. unvote, nice guys, discussion. GJ YOU GUYS.

Followed by these two posts, #s 73 and 74:

what?

Unvote vote: danakillsu

What what?

vote: Shanba

Blatant OMGUS ftw!

Blatant OMGUS?

Then I come along to save the day:

Dana follows with a TERRIBLY scummy post, which is way too defensive for the point of the game we were at, and then digs his hole deeper by OMGUS on Shanba when Shanba voted him for that scummy post. Dana was thinking we were still in the RVS, when, in fact, we weren't.

unvote: wickedest
vote: danakillsu

Also, #115 is straight flailing, followed by his saying "he's going to scumhunt" at like 5:26


...he then votes me at 5:29.
I'm sorry, but I like to spend a little bit more time analyzing than that. He sure can make something up quick...

vote: Furcolow

Didn't take long to do that scumhunting. He contradicts himself twice. First he says he's not switching his vote, then threatens to do so. Second, he calls UA an idiot, then says "in case your an idiot" like he's not an idiot. And finally, he says UA has been buddying me, which could not be farther from the truth.

Notice first how he votes me at the top. This goes in line of his unvoting in a previous post and TELLING people he's going to scumhunt when he's lying. If he was going to actually scumhunt, he would simply do it, not indicate a willingness to do something he's not actually doing whatsofuckingever.

Blatant OMGUS indeed.

Let's lynch mister 3-minute-scumhunter.

[Furcolow]

/confirm

And Xite speaks the truth about A2Rudeboy.

IS he still in this game?

@Mod

requesting prod

[Porochaz]

What if I don't like the way you have posted thus far and hate even more the fact that you are suggesting we do tomorrow before we are even started at all on day 1?

You might not like to eat lettuce, but it is good for you

Really bad metaphor fail.
Really bad patronising fail.

You also haven't changed my opinion one bit.

You were pretty vague on your opinion of what about my posting you haven't liked, so it would be pretty hard to change anything... not like i would. i might, though, so spit it out.

You are splaffing. Talking lots but saying little. Of value at least.

[Porochaz]

Too many people all attacking each other for some reason that probably shouldn't be attacking :<.
You all gave me a headache reading these pages <_<.
I haven't gotten any reads on who could be positive scummy, so my vote can wait.

Hello. No opinion at all after 7 pages of pretty much content. Might not be major to you but you should be mentioning the minor things instead of giving yourself an excuse to hide in the shadows.

[Mysterio]

Thank you for saying my case isn't weak. You flip-flop on this somewhat by discrediting it for being early on in the game.

Not at all. I said your case wasn't weak, not that dana is sure fire scum, which is what you've continuously implied in your posts. He is indeed the scummiest player

so far

, which is why I wanted to give him a chance to explain his weak scumhunting case against you. Having said that...

@ Mysterio
I could understand if you didn't read the thread, but if you did...what? How can you not know what Furc has done? The very first post I made in our argument lays it out clearly. His posts have been full of self-contradictions, confusing/invalid logic, and assumptions used as proof. He wants UA lynched more but is voting for me, for instance. And he wants the day to end ASAP judging by the nature of his posts.

This is a completely worthless reply. I asked you to explain yourself, not just repeat your claims. I saw no contradictions in his posts, and everything else you've just repeated is exactly what I already categorized as you thinking Frank has a weak case against you. Even if I were to accept your claims 100%, at worst it simply means Frank is wrong about you. It does NOT, however, mean that he is scummy. That is something you've failed to make a valid case for.

As it happens, you've neither shown that Frank is wrong or explained how he is scummy. As such, I'll go ahead and

Unvote

,

Vote: dana

.

[Furcolow]

What if I don't like the way you have posted thus far and hate even more the fact that you are suggesting we do tomorrow before we are even started at all on day 1?

You might not like to eat lettuce, but it is good for you

Really bad metaphor fail.
Really bad patronising fail.

You also haven't changed my opinion one bit.

You were pretty vague on your opinion of what about my posting you haven't liked, so it would be pretty hard to change anything... not like i would. i might, though, so spit it out.

You are splaffing. Talking lots but saying little. Of value at least.

i disagree with you.

[xRECKONERx]

I'll try to catch up either tonight after I'm not as drunk or tomorrow afternoon after I get back from the beach.

[Porochaz]

Don't see Reck's point on this page.

Furcolow, you do realise this game only started 25 hours ago approx from my post? Your a bit nimble on the prod button.

Ninja edit, I guess you would do, and up until the point you asked, you were, since reading you have gotten better. Still up to that point you were splaffing.

[Furcolow]

Well, I was just getting settled in. I should take the spotlight less, but if it benefits us as a town by nabbing two scum, I will keep doing it. If there is but 1 mislynch, I offer myself up to be lynched if you guys want.

If you all hold me to that, though, I might pick UA over dana. Doubtful, though. I'm going to keep my vote where it is.

^Splaffing?
I'm trying to get this word down. Is it a British colloquialism? I'm not familiar with it. It reminds me of some nasty term, though, so I don't really like it as a word.

In response to your "25 hour" remark, I am used to only having a 48 hour day cycle, so I guess I am forced to work fast. This would be about the time we would be making our closing arguments and analyzing the wagon on who changes votes to who.

If you are saying "slow down, we should take advantage of the 19 days and 23 hours we have left", then I will oblige your request.

[Flameaxe]

/confirm

And Xite speaks the truth about A2Rudeboy.

IS he still in this game?

@Mod

requesting prod

He confirmed in thread, and the game has barely been going for a day. Cool your jets.

[Bunnylover]

Too many people all attacking each other for some reason that probably shouldn't be attacking :<.
You all gave me a headache reading these pages <_<.
I haven't gotten any reads on who could be positive scummy, so my vote can wait.

Hello. No opinion at all after 7 pages of pretty much content. Might not be major to you but you should be mentioning the minor things instead of giving yourself an excuse to hide in the shadows.

Wasn't giving myself an excuse, I simply have nothing to add at this point, but when I do I will post, like now.
I have a different way of thinking which could mean that my thought process of this could be totally off, but it seems like you want me to vote for one of the several people that are gaining the attention (Dana, UA, JDodge, etc.) of most of the group, or you want me to find some minor detail that will allow others to exploit which could mean nothing at all. There is no point in me mention minor detail unless someone wants a specific person dead or will is trying to lead some down a wrong path and stray from mafia.
Like I said I have a different way of viewing things, which could mean my entire post is wrong.

[nhammen]

[.size=1]ya[/size]

You bad boy you. (note: I added the dot)

Vote: Hip-Hop

Woops, wrong thread!

Unvote

^_^

So, then would be a pretty nice random vote. And yet... you unvote. Why? And this vote was starting a bandwagon. So really, why the unvote? Worried about where that wagon would go?

Vote: Kise

1. Random voted hiphop, then unvoted before hiphop even aknowledged the vote and doesn't random vote again.
2. Encourages hiphop to selfvote.
3. Asks for reasons to bandwagon Wraith in the RVS. Why does there need to be a reason?

Agree.

Can we not demarcate the game into "random vote stage" and "serious stage" and instead focus on actually playing from the start? I hate having to sift through a bunch of needless crap just because someone thought that there was a magic point at which things suddenly began to matter.

Agree so effing much. Even though in this case you are wrong.

Well it's funny to see the reactions I got from pretending I knew UA was scum. I have played with him before, I believe. At any rate, no one as experienced as me would really pretend that they knew someone was scum in the RVS. And the fact that it's tradition to start with a bandwagon on UA should make my actions even less remarkable. Anyway, I'm glad I make it worth it to you, UA.

unvote

Good to see some discussion starting.

Excuse me? "Oh I was just acting." So awful. Especially the way it is done. Have you done this before as Town? If so, provide links.

Vote: danakillsu

I still want a response from Kise though.

Yes.

Whatever. Wagon me. Don't care. You'll probably realize it's pointless eventually, because I know the people here in general are smart enough to see through your lies. It's obvious Poro just wants me lynched, because all he's done is say my post is BS without saying why or how that makes me scum. I'm not going to stoop to the level of "no, it's not". The truth of that post is for me to know, and for you to guess. Poro is guessing.

AtE does not become you. Now, AtE is not too much of a tell normally, but combined with your previous "I was just acting" stuff, it seems scummy.

VOTE: danakills

And now I get to see where the thread explosion begins. Dana, Ben, Dodge, UA; this is just awful.

Unvote

Vote: JDodge

Way too sure of his reads this early in the game when half the players haven't even posted yet.

Interesting thought Mysterio. I didn't see this, but you could be right. Except, isn't it surety about Town reads that is usually the scumtell? Also, noted for future reference.

Reasoning: JDodge, imo, efficiently ended the RVS through explanation of UA's insane play. It was a nice post, not great, but nice.
Dana follows with a TERRIBLY scummy post, which is way too defensive for the point of the game we were at, and then digs his hole deeper by OMGUS on Shanba when Shanba voted him for that scummy post. Dana was thinking we were still in the RVS, when, in fact, we weren't.

RVS is a misnomer. There is no stage. Saying that someone is scum for random voting after the random voting phase is over is horrible play. But what else should we expect from the player that once promised to hammer anybody that claimed a power role on day 1. I still think that dana's post is extremely scummy, but I felt that this comment needs to be addressed. Note: I may have a slight prejudice about furc after reading a specific game that I was so lucky not to be in.

Oh boy! Now furc is getting in on the thread explosion action!

And dana's OMGUS vote looks

really

bad.

Dana's not really getting any better and Franks splaffing everywhere without making any sense whatsoever.

QFT

I'll also comment on hiphop's activity during the RVS, which I think was just a random wagon to garner reactions from anyone who jumped aboard. He can't have anything actually against me considering I've never played with him and this is my first post here.

Whoa! Defensive much?

Votecount 1.2 shows the real problems with the approach that has been taken so far: on page 6, and half of the players haven't even posted/voted.

Rest of page 6 is dana says "RAWR! FURC IS EVIL!" and then furc says "RAWR! DANA IS EVIL!" Or do I have that backwards? Whatever. Either way, you two are just cluttering the thread. It isn't even a case anymore. It's just "no you are!"

*sigh*
Fine.

Oh and what the fuck. Benmage is in this game?
hahahahaha

Vote: Benmage

read

before

voting. That way, we actually have, you know, an opinion.

Too many people all attacking each other for some reason that probably shouldn't be attacking :<.
You all gave me a headache reading these pages <_<.
I haven't gotten any reads on who could be positive scummy, so my vote can wait.

Nice input there... So, everyone is still null right now? If not, can you give an opinion of your own?

Have you ever played with dana before? Because I tend to wind up thinking he's scum in every damn game I play with him.

Cool, you have meta. Have you ever seen him try to use an early game gambit like the one he claims to have used here?

furc's 182 is wrong in so many ways I can't even respond to it without destroying every sarcasm meter on mafiascum. OK, so he does get a few things right. OK, one thing: the "it's all pretend" comment was awesome.

/confirm

And Xite speaks the truth about A2Rudeboy.

IS he still in this game?

@Mod

requesting prod

Sigh... I'm sorry that not everyone posts as frequently as you do... We really should work on that. Then we could have thread explosion times 10!!!! And it would be sooooo awesome.[/do I even need a sarcasm tag for this one?]

[nhammen]

Too many people all attacking each other for some reason that probably shouldn't be attacking :<.
You all gave me a headache reading these pages <_<.
I haven't gotten any reads on who could be positive scummy, so my vote can wait.

Hello. No opinion at all after 7 pages of pretty much content. Might not be major to you but you should be mentioning the minor things instead of giving yourself an excuse to hide in the shadows.

Wasn't giving myself an excuse, I simply have nothing to add at this point, but when I do I will post, like now.
I have a different way of thinking which could mean that my thought process of this could be totally off, but it seems like you want me to vote for one of the several people that are gaining the attention (Dana, UA, JDodge, etc.) of most of the group, or you want me to find some minor detail that will allow others to exploit which could mean nothing at all. There is no point in me mention minor detail unless someone wants a specific person dead or will is trying to lead some down a wrong path and stray from mafia.
Like I said I have a different way of viewing things, which could mean my entire post is wrong.

And yet, you still give no opinion. Are you seriously saying that everyone is still null after all that has happened? And why should we believe you? This could just be an act to hide, as poro has stated. Or it could be newb-scum that doesn't know how to fake scum-hunting. Either way, this looks bad.

I would change my vote now, but I still want a response about dana-meta, because I have some follow up questions in mind in either case.

[nhammen]

Actually, dana has plenty of pressure. He can go without my vote on him for a bit. But those questions still better be answered.

UNVOTE: dana
VOTE: bunnylove

Start giving opinions.

[danakillsu]

Well. nhamn's post does not seem at all patronizing or oversimplifying, does it? Not to mention the fact that he pretty much dismisses at least half of this thread as useless.

[danakillsu]

The only question that I see to me is: Have you done this before as town? No. I have not. I have not done it as scum, either. As I've said before, I've enjoyed seeing others do crazy things in the RVS, and thought I'd try it myself, but it immediately started a wagon that has not decreased one bit since.

[Bunnylover]

Too many people all attacking each other for some reason that probably shouldn't be attacking :<.
You all gave me a headache reading these pages <_<.
I haven't gotten any reads on who could be positive scummy, so my vote can wait.

Hello. No opinion at all after 7 pages of pretty much content. Might not be major to you but you should be mentioning the minor things instead of giving yourself an excuse to hide in the shadows.

Wasn't giving myself an excuse, I simply have nothing to add at this point, but when I do I will post, like now.
I have a different way of thinking which could mean that my thought process of this could be totally off, but it seems like you want me to vote for one of the several people that are gaining the attention (Dana, UA, JDodge, etc.) of most of the group, or you want me to find some minor detail that will allow others to exploit which could mean nothing at all. There is no point in me mention minor detail unless someone wants a specific person dead or will is trying to lead some down a wrong path and stray from mafia.
Like I said I have a different way of viewing things, which could mean my entire post is wrong.

And yet, you still give no opinion. Are you seriously saying that everyone is still null after all that has happened? And why should we believe you? This could just be an act to hide, as poro has stated. Or it could be newb-scum that doesn't know how to fake scum-hunting. Either way, this looks bad.

I would change my vote now, but I still want a response about dana-meta, because I have some follow up questions in mind in either case.

In case people can't read this was in my first post:
"I haven't gotten any reads on who could be

positive scummy

, so my vote can wait."
I don't play like everyone else, I don't go THIS PERSON HAS A SLIGHT SUSPICION OF BEEN SCUM SO MY VOTE GO ON HIM."
When I vote, its because I am more then sure that the person I am voting for is mafia, or someone who is harmful for the townie.
I have given my opinion, but not on what you guys want. I don't think the people who have posted have shown positive scum, some have done some things that are a little suspicious, but to gain anything in game you have to risk yourself, which i did state, and I gave my opinion on Poro action, which I guess you just ignored.
Also my post states that I think differently, so I'm not sure if I am correct, so why question me on rather or not you should believe me. You don't have to believe me, because its my opinion. And if I wanted to hide why would I even answer Poro post if he is the only person out of 24 people who actually noticed that I posted. If I wanted to hide I could have ignored it and just let it die as everyone else try to dominate the topic.
And i don't know how to fake scum hunt. I really don't know what that mean to be honest :<.

[Furcolow]

@bunnylover: What is your natural language, bunnylover? Not being mean

@nhammen: Would you care to explain yourself on your acting like dana actually made a case on me previous to me making mine on him? What do you hope to gain from this? Were you testing to see if I was actually reading? Would you like me to lump you in on a scum team with him, because that's what you're making me do. Explain why you purposefully did that, or explain why you didn't actually even read the topic past page 2.