Last Will Mafia II (Over)

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

RichardGHP (11) - Ythan, Super Smash Bros. Fan, jahudo, Chronopie, Nachomamma8, Charlie, Battousai
Super Smash Bros. Fan (7) - Amished, Rhinox, Xite91, Plum, MichelSabelheart, kmd4390
Charlie (2) - RichardGHP, Locke Lamora
Ythan (1) - animorpherv1
animorpherv1 (1) - eurospiritus

Not Voting (1) - holycon

Locke Lamora is V/LA untill Saturday

[MichelSableheart]

Nachomamma, do you have reasons to want our powerroles lynched? Yesterday you didn't comment on anyone except on the person who turned out tracker. Today, you haven't been doing anything except going after our claimed CPR Doc. Your play in this game is significantly subpar. I know you can do better then this.

To come back to an old argument of yours: I'm not that sure that a scum roleblocker would have been on Twomz night 1. Twomz inventor claim came in the middle of a number of fakeclaims, and wasn't referenced at all till day 2. When reading day 1, I forgot about it, only remembering when Twomz asked Ythan why he hadn't killed anyone. I wouldn't be surprised if scum had forgotten about that claim too.

[Rhinox]

I'm prepared to hammer Richard, but I want to see the VC first. Michel gave me a good reason that chrono isn't scum. I haven't really heard a good argument for SSBF not being scum. I don't think Ythan is scum, and I'm not sure about Richard, but I'm at the point where if his lynch will get that question mark out of the game so the town can focus on finding scum, then its a good lynch.

Of the rest of the players...

Still have a gut feeling Amished is town, but not as strong as earlier in the game. Battousai has seemed very pro town since taking over for PB. Michel seems town. Xite seems town. Jahudo, probtown based on meta.

Then there is nacho, esurio, Locke, KMD, ani, charlie, holy. Obviously not all scum, but thats starting to look like a group which encompasses most of the scum in this game.

[Kmd4390]

Xite, that makes no sense. You are saying I am only commenting on big things. Yeah, anything that is a big deal, I'll post about. Anything else doesn't matter as much.

And that doesn't answer my question. Let's put me in the shoes of smash bras buddy. I've been calling him town all game. I called richard scummy til he claimed. Now that ythan comes out with what some consider evidence against richard, smash bras gets votes. Why would I not jump on richard?

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Nacho, if richard or ythan was roleblocked, they could both be telling the truth. Nobody is willing to lych ythan though, so I picked the non-richard lynch that could actually happen.

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Amished, hard to tell from my phone.

[holycon]

from what i have caught up with already the two wagons are ssbf and richard

were SSBF is concerned I don't get scum from him and i guess i don't see what others are seeing with getting a scummy vibe from him

Richard well from Richards attitude and play throughout this whole game has seemed super scummy to me it has since Day 1 and he hasn't changed and my opinion of him haven't changed

Ythan to me seems town and putting his ISO against Richards ISO Richard seems way more likely to lie then Ythan would be


my other suspect Chrono he like richard has seem scummy to me and yes he pointed out the princess thing but isnt it the point of scum to try to seem town

[Xite91]

I'm prepared to hammer Richard, but I want to see the VC first. Michel gave me a good reason that chrono isn't scum. I haven't really heard a good argument for SSBF not being scum. I don't think Ythan is scum, and I'm not sure about Richard, but I'm at the point where if his lynch will get that question mark out of the game so the town can focus on finding scum, then its a good lynch.

Huh? Why do you have to see a vote count first?

Xite, that makes no sense. You are saying I am only commenting on big things. Yeah, anything that is a big deal, I'll post about. Anything else doesn't matter as much.

And that doesn't answer my question. Let's put me in the shoes of smash bras buddy. I've been calling him town all game. I called richard scummy til he claimed. Now that ythan comes out with what some consider evidence against richard, smash bras gets votes. Why would I not jump on richard?

How does this make any sense at all? Particularly that last part. You said SSBF was town all game, yes, but as soon as he starts getting a good amount of votes, you say he's scummy based on "reactions" he's given. But to me he's been playing about the same. Please, where are these reactions? And please reorganize your thoughts of that last post so that I can understand them. kthnx

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

5) Really? Worst. Argument. Ever.
You do realize of course, that no matter what wagon, there will be scum, and they are possible to be ANYWHERE on said wagon, and not more likely to be in any particular spot. And sometimes, they stay OFF of a town wagon just to gain town cred, and then guess what they do? They say there was definitely scum on said wagon.

Yes I do. However, as said before, I am not ruling out the possibility of scums being earlier on a bandwagon (I have major suspicion on Charlie, who was in the middle of the Shattered Viewpoint's bandwagon). However, I feel that scums are most likely going to be late in the bandwagon. The bandwagon by then has already been established and will likely go through, so scums do not have to worry about doing much of the work.

6) Fence-sitting is just as scummy most of the time, though

While I was fine with the EGL bandwagon, I was not fine with how some people joined the EGL bandwagon. I voted for my top suspect, Shattered Viewpoint, yet I thought some people had scum motivation for joining the wagon, would that be considered fence-sitting?

[Charlie]

Actually, I have something I wanted to say which has aleardy been covered by MichelSableheart in #1526. It is true that Nachomamma8 is playing subpar. I already said earlier that my past experience with him he was very pro-town to the point of being ridiculous. He isn't the same here. This can only mean 2 things.

[Kmd4390]

Please, where are these reactions?

What reactions?

And please reorganize your thoughts of that last post so that I can understand them. kthnx

What part?

[Kmd4390]

Oh, and Xite, why didn't you tell me the big news? [/offtopic]

[Rhinox]

Huh? Why do you have to see a vote count first?

Huh? Why shouldn't I wait to see a vote count first?

(yes, I'm blatently avoiding answering stupid questions)

[Kmd4390]

There was a vote count at the top of the page and no votes on this page. You should consider voting elsewhere though.

[Rhinox]

There was a vote count at the top of the page and no votes on this page. You should consider voting elsewhere though.

When I made post #1527 last, there was a placeholder where the VC is now. You should know that because you posted 9 minutes after me. Not sure whether the VC was actually there by the time Xite posted though.

[Kmd4390]

So...you haven't seen it yet or...?

[Xite91]

Rhinox, mostly his tone, especially after votes started piling on. I kind of caught a few of those "tells that are significant to me, but no one else will buy". I can share if you'd like, but I doubt you'll agree with them.

Also, he's not Richard.

Well, it's not exactly "reactions" but I figured that's what you meant. What were these "tells"

Oh, and Xite, why didn't you tell me the big news? [/offtopic]

Which big news? there's a lot of that going on with me. Also, who told you?[/still offtopic]

[Kmd4390]

Xite, see my response to plum asking me the exact same question.

And THE big news. Can't say who told though. That's top secret. [/more offtopic than you]

[Chronopie]

Why is the day dragging on so long?

It's like a cop and his guilty, you don't lynch outside the pair. (At least you shouldn't)

[Xite91]

Xite, see my response to plum asking me the exact same question.

And THE big news. Can't say who told though. That's top secret. [/more offtopic than you]

Didnt you just quote a bunch of his posts?

And WHICH? About my mom or me. And i need to know who, because I need to know how far it spread

[Kmd4390]

I used quotes, yeah. Might be a good idea to read what I wrote under them too.

And the news is about you and I don't think it has spread very far.

[MichelSableheart]

It's like a cop and his guilty, you don't lynch outside the pair. (At least you shouldn't)

Unlike the cop and his guilty, there is a significant chance that scum have set up this situation, because they easily could have been aware of the intended nighttargets before the night started. I have significant enough bad feelings about the Richard wagon to be unwilling to hammer.

[Charlie]

Upon closer inspection of the thread, I have to comment about this:

To come back to an old argument of yours: I'm not that sure that a scum roleblocker would have been on Twomz night 1. Twomz inventor claim came in the middle of a number of fakeclaims, and wasn't referenced at all till day 2. When reading day 1, I forgot about it, only remembering when Twomz asked Ythan why he hadn't killed anyone. I wouldn't be surprised if scum had forgotten about that claim too.

This is a poor assumption to make.

[Locke Lamora]

I'm back, should be catching up and posting by tomorrow.

[Jahudo]

@Rhinox how many more points are in your SSBF case? I think I can only name two (him looking at the EGL wagon for scum, and his comments about Ythan/Richard/whoever night action spec).

<snip>SSBF is over-explainy about his votes as scum, feeling the need to justfy his votes and overcompensating

This seems to be your strongest point?

Does anyone have an example of SSBF explaining his vote less as town? I don't see what is inherently scummy about this, and I don't think this showed up one time I saw him as scum. But maybe there's a difference between alignment.

My top suspicion is Super Smash Bros. Fan, though. The main thing that drew my attention was post #732. Everyone on the SV wagon from Amished onwards was blatantly bandwagoning. Why would he only look at the last 5 players on the wagon, when their behaviour is exactly the same as that of at least three other players?

This seems to be your strongest point? That he acknowledges how fast the shattered viewpoint wagon gained steam but then gave an inaccurate time on when that started. I guess that's something but his detailed analysis in 768 kind of explains how kmd is not thrown into the mix. That post might be an example of his overcompensating if that is a reliable tell.

Furthermore, ISOing Diacra, SSBF was her top suspect, giving him a strong motive to kill her. SSBF was the player pushing for the beloved princess kill early day 2.

I don't put much stock into NK analysis and think Diacra could have easily been killed by his scum picks, town picks or anywhere in between.

Pushing for a beloved princess lynch is a bad idea strategically, and I think scum (who are concerned with how their words are interpreted anyway) might take a cautious stance.

ok, looking at amished's reasons next.

[Ythan]

Why the hell is this day not over.

[Battousai]

Because you want it to be.