/Invitational 11: Pick your Poison 5 (Game Over)

[Elmo]

Vas: Also, please answer my questions?

from #986.

I agreed with him that my behavior could point to scum, but I warned him that he is wrong and his tunnel is bad. He continued to tunnel and got worse.

How does him continuing to push arguments that you largely agree with make him "worse"? If he's town and thinks you're scum, I think it's highly unnatural for him to drop it based on you merely telling him he's wrong.

Then ooba soft defense with little to no mention of his reads on ooba was the tipping point.

I can't find much detail on this, but looking through his posts, his interactions with ooba seem fine to me. Can you go into more detail about why this is suspicious? You do appear to have OMGUS'd ooba on an initial reading.

I could maybe go for zoraster also. Unless he picks up, I wouldn't want him to see endgame, meh.

[zoraster]

We still have 6 days or so but we really need to start laying down the law here. People, in their next post, should post the order of preference for three of the current "wagons" going right now or even better, change your vote for who you want to lynch. Game is stagnating a little and this needs to be rectified.

VasudeVa>>>>zoraster(so THAT'S why people are voting him)>>DGB

Why do you say three wagons and have DGB up there and not Ooba?

I want a real caught up post from zoraster before I delve into the pot o' three that isn't VV.

do you want to know about anything in particular? I'm not going to do a post-by-post thought thread. I don't find it helpful, and I don't tend to think like it. That's not just an "empty" request designed to look active without doing anything or because I'm lazy; I'm serious. I'd rather address something specific with some direction.

I could maybe go for zoraster also. Unless he picks up, I wouldn't want him to see endgame, meh.

That's as good a reason as any articulated, I think. All I can say is once I'm "into the game" so to speak, I'm far more active.

[Kmd4390]

Sera, if you are saying there are 4 viable wagons, why should we only rank 3 of the 4 wagons? Why not just rank all 4?

[Ellibereth]

I don't get what you keep saying about getting info the elmo-tajo thing.
You being zor.

And what do you think aboue people OTHER than DGB.

[Seraphim]

in particular, VasudeVa and ooba.

I dunno, three was an arbitrary number I picked off the top of my head.

VasudeVa>>>>zoraster>>>DGB>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ooba

I am a long way away from being convinced on ooba.

[mith]

DGB>zoraster>>>ooba>VasudeVa

(zoraster return to the game has jumped him ahead of Seraphim, despite the weird ooba omission; Papa Zito sixth, to round out "everyone who has a vote" list, though I need to do a fresh reread of him in light of Herodotus' vote.)

ooba: From post 1080: "Also I find it intriguing that you were able to look at the kills, go back and see the D0 exchanges and come up with that theory in under 5 minutes ..
Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:49 pm
Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:55 pm" - Huh? Can you explain what you're talking about here? I don't see any posts with those timestamps.

[Seraphim]

I think, despite the omission, I have made it abundantly clear that I find the ooba bandwagon to be very questionable and incredibly shaky.

[Patrick]

Votecount

VasudeVa (3) -- Seraphim, ooba, SpyreX
ooba (4) -- Papa Zito, Plumegranate, Rhinox, ekiM
DrippingGoofball (2) -- mith, Elmo
Seraphim (1) -- My Milked Eek
zoraster (4) -- DrippingGoofball, Ellibereth, VasudeVa, Kmd4390
Papa Zito (1) -- Herodotus

Not voting: AdumbroDeus, zoraster
17 alive, 9 to lynch.

Deadline: 11th of September, 6 am GMT.

[Herodotus]

I don't get what you keep saying about getting info the elmo-tajo thing.
You being zor.

And what do you think aboue people OTHER than DGB.

+1


Sera, your call to consolidate on fewer wagons was definitely self-serving given the suspicions some have had of you. But that's okay, neither townies nor scum want to be lynched (usually.)

[AdumbroDeus]

*Taps foot at SpyreX and VasudeVa*


I don't like people ignoring my questions.

VOTE: VasudeVa

[ekiM]

Opinions!

zoraster ~ ooba >>> DGB > Vasudeva,

Vasudeva

I think is town. I just don't believe that he'd be allowed to play like this if he had a scum team that knew there was a vig about. I haven't seen a convincing response to this argument yet. Seraphim, this is why I think VV is town.

ooba

's switch of opinion on VV is a solid point. See Rhinox #1000. Fluffy posts today.

zoraster

- 1037, 1038 - agree. Everything's terrible today.

DGB

Changed my mind on her now; quite a lot of DGB is saying makes sense to me, which is a good sign.

This game is almost unreadable for me right now, but I'll try to post something more insightful soon.

[Seraphim]

My counter-argument: I think that the scum team either figured that VV would be less likely of a vig target if he acted like he did now, playing up the VI aspect of his play and trying to convince people of that aspect, or that VV was expendable.

[ekiM]

Village idiots are prime vig targets. How would playing up his VI aspect seem like a way to avoid the vig? And I doubt a scum team just gives up on a player from the get-go in a game with roles like vig and tracker that can randomly blow things open.

[Seraphim]

well obviously he didn't get vig'd last night and most people seem to think he's town, at least according to how the day has played out.

[ekiM]

He happened not to get vigged. That doesn't mean that acting in a VI-way isn't labeling yourself prime vig-bait.

[ekiM]

UNVOTE: ooba
VOTE: zoraster

[mith]

zoraster: "I'd rather address something specific with some direction." - Here's something specific: Who do you find suspicious, and why? Apart from rehashing your DGB argument (which comes down to "I can see her making the gambit as scum" - and even as someone who finds her quite scummy, I think that's a poor argument), you have given

no

opinions on anything going on in this game (and you've now made eight posts in the past two days - that combinations reads as "scum who was lurking until someone poked him in the quicktopic, and now is posting without much content other than a lame not-into-the-game defense").

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't get what you keep saying about getting info the elmo-tajo thing.
You being zor.

And what do you think aboue people OTHER than DGB.

+1

We shall never find out

The scum will take the secret to his grave

[zoraster]

I don't get what you keep saying about getting info the elmo-tajo thing.
You being zor.

And what do you think aboue people OTHER than DGB.

+1

We shall never find out

The scum will take the secret to his grave

obviously I'm a bit biased, but this type of semi-joke (said meant to be serious but in a humorous way) is DGB scum at her core.

Regardless, what Elli (and now mith) have asked for is time consuming given the amount of review it takes. It will come, but posting "heh heh he's not posting on it" ain't going to make it happen faster.

[DrippingGoofball]

obviously I'm a bit biased, but this type of semi-joke (said meant to be serious but in a humorous way) is DGB scum at her core.

Submit proof - otherwise it's an empty statement like every other "statement" you've made in this game.

Regardless, what Elli (and now mith) have asked for is time consuming given the amount of review it takes. It will come, but posting "heh heh he's not posting on it" ain't going to make it happen faster.

You really do want to take it to your grave.

[DrippingGoofball]

Really, I just want you to give us your buddies before we lynch you.

Just list them, you don't have to review anything.

[Plumegranate]

We shall never find out

The scum will take the secret to his grave

obviously I'm a bit biased, but this type of semi-joke (said meant to be serious but in a humorous way) is DGB scum at her core.

Regardless, what Elli (and now mith) have asked for is time consuming given the amount of review it takes. It will come, but posting "heh heh he's not posting on it" ain't going to make it happen faster.

This is getting ridiculous. If you're going to tunnel on DGB all game in lieu of doing

something

(I'm not picky; analysis of even one player who's a top wagon right now would suffice; I know the game is big and dense and scary but heck, a bit of basics ought to be doable) at least pick out things which aren't null-DGB, y'know?

UNVOTE:

VOTE: zoroaster

zoroaster>>ooba>>>DGB>>>>>>>VV

[Herodotus]

Zoraster, Vas, Rhinox, PZ, and probably others (judging by 1109, Spyrex):
We have a deadline. No stalling, please.

vote: Zoraster

I

think

that's L-2. I hope that the big wagon on him is NOT going to make the others feel that they can relax and lurk.

[Rhinox]

Sorry for falling off the last few days. Holiday weekend and all.

@Rhinox and SpyreX: As of right now, who do you wanna lynch toDay and why?

I'll hold off on answering this til I catch up to the present.

@Rhinox:
Do you have any clarification regarding the second quote from post 1052?

Well I was just thinking that assuming scum had a goal of outing a vig ASAP, giving the town a tracker could lead to a vig being outed by way of being tracked to a kill. So in that way, the presence of a tracker lends some credibility to PZ's theory. But at the time I was forgetting that the RB was limited shot, making it ineffective for vig hunting, so that kinda shoots the theory down. That, and nearly everyone supported giving scum the RB anyways. By 1052 I had already dismissed the "ooba is vighunting scum" theory.

If you're saying I haven't clearly been saying that VV is scum for a good long time and MOST OF SAID TIME been dealing with "ohh meta says #E$&*(#&($&#($H" well I don't know.

Well, the difference between you and Seraph lets say is that seraph is here arguing his damndest to get VV lynched with quotes and facts and whatnot. You haven't even given us a couple sentences explaining why VV is scum, and you've been curiously lurking back today letting seraph do all the hard work.

"ooba: Answer Rhinox's point in 1000: Why did you go from a stance of "zoraster>VV" yesterday to voting VV, on the basis of 801?"
The way he asked questions in 801 - looked like a random bunch of questions thrown around with no purpose - Got a very strong scum vibe.

I guess I just don't see what makes those questions the nudge that makes VV scummier.

People, in their next post, should post the order of preference for three of the current "wagons" going right now or even better, change your vote for who you want to lynch.

I'll get to this at the end.

One related thing I think suggests ooba-town is the postscript in ooba ISO 2. Gut says that the scum wouldn't want the town to be aware that the scum would be allowed to select which of them received the PR's, especially given his reason for bringing it up.

Thats a good point. On the other hand, I've been struggling with the opposite - scum would be more interested in knowing how they would be given their roles if it were looking like they would have to come up with some fakeclaim strategies for a mass claim. But you've got a point that it doesn't make sense for scum to make that information public.


Alright, caught up to the end. I agree with a zoraster lynch, based on the points brought up today, and zorasters lack of any response really. ooba lynch looks less good based on the point hero brought up, but still a good lynch IMO. I prefer a zoraster lynch though. I don't like DGB or VV lynches at all.

UNVOTE: ooba
VOTE: zoraster (L-1)

[zoraster]

All right, I'm at L-1. Before anyone hammers, give me half a day or so to get my thoughts on all the players, which despite what DGB has insisted, was coming anyway. Anyone who hammers before then should be shot or lynched.