Mini 1046 - Murder in the Desert (Game Over!)

[Parama]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

OH GOD
BWAHAHAHAHAHA
I MEAN ARE SERIOUS
DEAR GOD
BWAHAHAHA HAHAHAHA HAHAHA

[Slaxx]

Im not softclaiming PR bro..Just sayin I cant wait for you to see my town flip

[Slaxx]

I dont mind people FoSing me, thats part of the game. But when you say I am beyond obvscum when I'm town, I cant help but laugh my ass off, but also kind of cringe at how bad I am playing.

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

Day 2 iso:

Hey folks, how are things?

I haven't had a chance to read the thread yet. Parama, you have a good head on your shoulders, even when you're scum. Who should I vote?

Or you could read 14 pages. Not that hard, especially with motivation to scumhunt.

Actually, Socrates has a bad habit of always following my lead, even when I'm scum. See: NY114.
Admittedly, I caught 2 of the 3 scum on the other team in that game so

Anyways, Xine is teh scum.

It's not exactly a "bad" habit when it leads to dead scum. You might have been scum, but following you was still the right play.

I quite like 342.

vote:Xine

Here we go with sucking up to Parama.

Parama and Slaxx arn't scum buddies.

A minimal observation. This appears to help the town, but Socrates already admitted to sheeping with Parama, which means he thought Parama was town then else he wouldn't be sheeping which reasons out to that there is no reason to establish a disconnection between Parama and Slaxx since the Parama part is redundant. Feel free to ask for clarity if needed.

Xine wagon takes off, to L-1, and suddenly,

At first the Xine wagon was cool, but now its popular so it sucks.

Setup speculation is so totally not a scum tell it's not even funny. It is a new player tell, and possibly even a mild town tell in the current site meta.

unvote

It's not necessarily the speculation of the night kill, it's the fact that Xine posted three lines of ramble that ultimately concluded nothing. Town would simplify it to "Any idea why scum killed CES?"

And this is where Socrates frantically starts to derail the wagon and save his scumbuddy; notice the shift in tone in the following posts.

I misspoke, my apoligies. I meant night kill speculation.

Welcome Socrates, why are you so sure that Parama and Slaxx aren't scum buds?
Parama: If I have this straight, your current case on me is entirely based on Bub buddying to me, is this correct?
I am trying to figure out why scum would kill CES, it seems that it would be easy to rally the town into lynching him, with his active lurking ways... so, who has reason to kill him? His suspect list included myself, Oso, and Boberz. of those 3, Oso actually did make an attempt to lead a wagon on him, and got nowhere, perhaps leading him to believe the opposite of my previously stated hypothesis, and thus choosing him for a night kill? hmmm... too bad this is not something Socrates can respond to. who else has thoughts on the night kill choice?

Parama and Slaxx aren't scum buddies because Slaxx was not happy with the fact that I turned to parama for direction. Furthermore, the way he characterized it says a lot about how Slaxx views parama himself (He see's him as a leader of the town, not something a scumbag would describe one of their buddies as).

Logical, but still a minimal contribution.

I got the exact same read on Xine's last post. The latter three lines said absolutely nothing.

Vote: Xine

This guy is scum.

What happened to your town read? You are willing to abandon it for one little mis-step. (One that is not even actually scummy, I might add).

vote: WOMC

The scuminess in Xine's post is obvious, as others would point out. My original read of Xine wasn't that strong, and Parama has a tendency to tunnel hardcore, so that partly influenced my views.

And now about the style, Socrates now speaks with unwavering conviction, giving urgency to the purpose of dissolving the wagon as fast as possible, yet at this point, he has not even read the thread, and is clearly bullshitting to try and save his partner.

Xine/Socrates scumbuddies seems painfully obvious now.

Socrates is in panic mode and is desperately trying to save his buddy from a lynch.

Characterizing dissent from your wagon of choice as scummy? I look forward to seeing you flip scum, scum.

The panic feeding need to action pulls through in the voice of this passage. This feels like English class.

I'll just leave it up to the rest of the town to decide.

Are you bussing?

Fuck, you're bussing. That's why you are so smug about this.

I hope the town isn't stupid enough to give you town cred if Xine flips scum.

And now for perhaps what stands out as the most concrete scummy post. Earlier, Socrates hopped off the wagon and hinted that he thought Xine was town (scroll back up to see the end about night kill speculation), and now he turns his view around again in order to drive his desperation case. Lastly, the last sentence is the bad kind of AtE.

What we have here is

contradiction

and

flailing

.

Fuck, I feel like DH.

[boberz]

Xine wagon looks too popular for me. (maybe that is a fallacy?) but it seems a bit strange to me.

Further I dont see why night speculation is scummy, it is bad and wrong and not usefull but I do not see why it is scummy, worth three extra votes.

VLA till Monday, sorry. Moving house. Even if I dont have internet by then I will find a starbucks or something.

[DemonHybrid]

Wow, talk about a complete fucking 180, Soc.

Vote will still be on Xine. Socrates is now above bob on the scum scale.

Two of these 3 are the remaining scum: Xine, Soc, bobz. Xine, please explain your ridiculous vote on Slaxx. I haven't heard enough jokes lately as it is and could use a laugh.

[Parama]

DH, the joke explains itself.
Thus my laughing maniacally post.

[xvart]

Good points all around the table.

DH, WOMD, what do you guys think about Xine or Oso/Socrates?

I think 2 out of Xine, Boberz, and Oso/Socrates are last scum, but I have to be honest, I am least suspicious of boberz. I will probably read more thoroughly this weekend.

Why Oso/Socrates? This is the first time you have even typed Oso's name. What happened overnight? You think the good points all around (about boberz) is only enough to make him the least suspicious of your scum grouping?

D1 scum reads on Xine and boberz are still solid (and getting more solid as D2 unfolds). Once we get a vote count I'll be voting either one of these. Anyone opposed to a speed lynch?

xvart.

[Lowell]

vote slaxx

sure it's a wifom trap, but I'm willing to engage the possibility that bub actually just

is

that dumb.

Offhand I'll say the bob case doesn't make much sense to me (I find it unlikely the top two wagons yesterday were both scum), and I'll look at Xine since he's getting so much attention.

[DemonHybrid]

vote slaxx

sure it's a wifom trap, but I'm willing to engage the possibility that bub actually just

is

that dumb.

Offhand I'll say the bob case doesn't make much sense to me (I find it unlikely the top two wagons yesterday were both scum), and I'll look at Xine since he's getting so much attention.

Wow, you must be a celebrity to used car salesmen.

[DemonHybrid]

Anyway, I'm going to ignore the blatant naivety of your post and ask you a few questions:

1. Why doesn't the bob case make sense to you?
2. Why do you find it unlikely that two top wagons are both scum?
3. How do you know that Bub wasn't just saying "We COULD be masons" instead of meaning "We ARE masons"?

Bonus question: Do you find it funny that your post is about to completely distract town from lynching obvious scum?

Make sure to write your name at the top of the paper.

[Socrates]

The Xine wagon grew way too fast over reasoning way too poor for any reasonable person to believe that there wasn't anything disingenuous about the wagon. I liked the case Parama laid out enough for a placeholder vote while I got my bearings in the game, and truth be told, if the wagon had simply gone to L-1 based off of that, I would have been totally fine with it. BUT. The fact that the wagon exploded based off of what I consider to be the flat out stupidest scum tell on the site, with the specific people joining (Charter should know better. Last time we were scum together, he, as scum, attacked a townie that had speculated on the NK in just such a context. WOMC had just claimed to have had a town read on Xine and abandoned it completely unceremoniously. DH... well, lets just say I have a low opinion of DH and leave it at that.) made it so that I could not in good conscience support that wagon.

Does this make Xine town? Not really. My whole point is NOT that NK speculation is a town tell, but that it is a NULL tell. Now, I would have been inclined to call Xine town based off of the context of the wagon, but the way that my favorite pick for scum on the wagon (WOMC) approached it (He is waaaaaaay too certain that Xine will flip scum. Especially for someone who just had a town read on her) makes me reconsider that it might be a bus.

Now, when I take off my "Socrates is always right" hat and step back, I can see how someone might think that I look like Xine's scumbuddy, but I have just walked you through my train of thought and I am not going to go against my instincts purely to avoid looking scummy. That's what scum do.

[DemonHybrid]

"Low opinion". Right >_>

And what do you think of Xine's vote on Slaxx, sir Always-right-a-lot?

[DemonHybrid]

Oh, and you haven't responded to a think WOMC said other than your flip-floppy unvote.

[Socrates]

"Low opinion". Right >_>

And what do you think of Xine's vote on Slaxx, sir Always-right-a-lot?

It's awful random. It's interesting because it is obviously not a self preservation vote because then she would have voted WOMC who already has a vote, so I don't get what the devious scum machinations she would be exhibiting with such a vote, but the town reasoning is completely opaque as well since she didn't deign to explain herself.

So.... *shrug*.

Oh, and you haven't responded to a think WOMC said other than your flip-floppy unvote.

What else should I have responded to?

[DemonHybrid]

So, *shrug* to what seems to be a little bit of a softclaim? Why would anyone want to lynch a potential softclaim?

I know Slaxx said afterwards that it wasn't a softclaim, but we can conclude that the majority of the players here who read Slaxx's post at the time thought it was a softclaim.

What else should I have responded to?

Here we go with sucking up to Parama.

A minimal observation. This appears to help the town, but Socrates already admitted to sheeping with Parama, which means he thought Parama was town then else he wouldn't be sheeping which reasons out to that there is no reason to establish a disconnection between Parama and Slaxx since the Parama part is redundant. Feel free to ask for clarity if needed.

The scuminess in Xine's post is obvious, as others would point out. My original read of Xine wasn't that strong, and Parama has a tendency to tunnel hardcore, so that partly influenced my views.

And now about the style, Socrates now speaks with unwavering conviction, giving urgency to the purpose of dissolving the wagon as fast as possible, yet at this point, he has not even read the thread, and is clearly bullshitting to try and save his partner.

The panic feeding need to action pulls through in the voice of this passage. This feels like English class.

And now for perhaps what stands out as the most concrete scummy post. Earlier, Socrates hopped off the wagon and hinted that he thought Xine was town (scroll back up to see the end about night kill speculation), and now he turns his view around again in order to drive his desperation case. Lastly, the last sentence is the bad kind of AtE.

These would be a nice start.

[DemonHybrid]

EBWOP: "So, *shrug* to what seems to be vote on a little bit of a softclaim?"

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

And we have yet another tone shift.

[Socrates]

So, *shrug* to what seems to be a little bit of a softclaim? Why would anyone want to lynch a potential softclaim?

There are a number of players on site that lynch all soft claims on general policy. Especially in the context that Slaxx did it (as a response to suspicion).

Here we go with sucking up to Parama.

This is simple framing and interpretation with no logic to back it up. There is no way to respond to this kind of thing other than to say "No, you are wrong."

So. No. You are wrong.

A minimal observation. This appears to help the town, but Socrates already admitted to sheeping with Parama, which means he thought Parama was town then else he wouldn't be sheeping which reasons out to that there is no reason to establish a disconnection between Parama and Slaxx since the Parama part is redundant. Feel free to ask for clarity if needed.

Once again, this simply isn't true. I indicated multiple times that I sheeped him because I think he is a strong scum hunter, not because of any town read on him.

The scuminess in Xine's post is obvious, as others would point out. My original read of Xine wasn't that strong, and Parama has a tendency to tunnel hardcore, so that partly influenced my views.

And now about the style, Socrates now speaks with unwavering conviction, giving urgency to the purpose of dissolving the wagon as fast as possible, yet at this point, he has not even read the thread, and is clearly bullshitting to try and save his partner.

I've said multiple times that I think the "obvious scumminess" is stupid, and I think you realize this and are deliberately over inflating the magnitude of the scum tell to justify your stance.

And yes, I am certain you are scum. Frame it however you would like.

The panic feeding need to action pulls through in the voice of this passage. This feels like English class.

Yes, this is just like English class. In English class, people pull interpretations out of their ass with no real evidence behind those interpretations.

And now for perhaps what stands out as the most concrete scummy post. Earlier, Socrates hopped off the wagon and hinted that he thought Xine was town (scroll back up to see the end about night kill speculation), and now he turns his view around again in order to drive his desperation case. Lastly, the last sentence is the bad kind of AtE.

I already explained my train of thought here. AtE is a buzzword that I give no weight to whatsoever.

[DemonHybrid]

This is simple framing and interpretation with no logic to back it up. There is no way to respond to this kind of thing other than to say "No, you are wrong."

So. No. You are wrong.

Once again, this simply isn't true. I indicated multiple times that

I sheeped him

because

Unvote, Vote: Socrates

[DemonHybrid]

Also, are you saying that AtE is okay to use because you don't like to discuss it, or....?

[DemonHybrid]

Explaining my vote a little bit more:

You can't say that he's a "strong scumhunter" and that you're sheeping him and then say that WOMC is wrong about you fully believing he's town. That's foolish either way, whether Parama is scum (you're fully believing what scum wants you to believe) OR town (because it's hypocritical). Neither is pro-town.

[Nicodemus]

Vote Count 2.03

Xine

(3): Parama, WeaponsofMassConstruction, Slaxx

Slaxx

(2): Xine, Lowell

WeaponsofMassConstruction

(1): Socrates

Socrates

(1): DemonHybrid

Not Voting:

boberz, charter, xvart

6

to lynch.

Deadline for D2 can be found here

[Socrates]

This is simple framing and interpretation with no logic to back it up. There is no way to respond to this kind of thing other than to say "No, you are wrong."

So. No. You are wrong.

Once again, this simply isn't true. I indicated multiple times that

I sheeped him

because

Unvote, Vote: Socrates

You are clearly misunderstanding something. I sheeped parama upon entering the game. There is no disputing that. WOMC claimed that I did it to suck up to Parama, which is false. I did it because I think Parama is a strong scumhunter.

Also, are you saying that AtE is okay to use because you don't like to discuss it, or....?

AtE is one of those things that people just throw around a lot without it really meaning anything. I simply said it would be dumb to give WOMC town cred if Xine flipped scum. There is no appeal to emotion there.

Preview Edit:

Explaining my vote a little bit more:

You can't say that he's a "strong scumhunter" and that you're sheeping him and then say that WOMC is wrong about you fully believing he's town. That's foolish either way, whether Parama is scum (you're fully believing what scum wants you to believe) OR town (because it's hypocritical). Neither is pro-town.

DH, I disagree with you vehemently and passionately. Being willing to follow other players when they put forward strong arguments is a skill more people should learn, but this is a playstyle thing. I can link you to a game where I have done this as town before, if you want.

[WeaponsofMassConstruction]

Socrates, do you think standardized national testing (SAT/ACT/AP) for English is legitimate?