Mafia on Holy Orders (Game Over!)

[Me=Weird]

Iecerint, friend, can you please restate your cases on me? I would ask furc and vezo, but their votes are mindless bandwagoning(more reasons to lynch furc).
Friend, what AGar said. And please, if you're just going to mindlessly say that I'm scum and furc's town and provide pointless furc meta, shut the fuck up.

[Iecerint]

Glancing through your iso, your targets (vez, Furc, me) do little to inspire confidence with regard to your scumhunting motives. Also, your predecessor was naughty.

I think the best way to convince me that you are town would involve making a case on someone or a town/meh/scum tier post or something. It looks like you're going after easy suspects. Your targets also mirror SP's, and I think he may be scum based on meta in large games like this as I just stated.

I am waiting to see whether Plum agrees with me about SP before I go too far down that rabbit hole.

I admit that Friend is a little shifty but I don't think he's scum with you (which is why a MW=>Friend case isn't going to convince me; it's just showing me that you're probably not scum with him).

[Furcolow]

For the first question I asked - it's a general sitewide belief that town should not be interested in their self-survival. They still can win if they die. Worrying about your own death is something scum tend to do, as it greatly hinders their ability to win the game.

I don't give a fuck if I die in the night, I just don't want to be mislynched. I want to lynch scum.

For the second question I asked, I want to know why you're concerned about looking like scum. It has been addressed.

Because I'm not scum.

For the third, how do you know that they are lurking scum and not lurking town? Lurking is a null-tell. Active lurking is different, but you do not seem to be specifying.

I would rather pressure people who are lurking to get information regardless of how "null" said strategy is. Are you worried because a lot of your scumbuddies are laying back and lurking, so you are trying to get us to not utilize this strategy? If you are town, and weren't playfighting with mothrax trying to get us off your scent, you need to step up your game and stop fucking tunneling.

For the fourth, so you'd like to run up wagons and possibly claims on people just to get them to post? There's things called prods. And replacements. Both much more effective, in my experience.

Yes. I would like to wagon lurkers. I disagree with a lot of what you've said here. Prods are worthless except for one post. Replacements? Don't make me laugh. When I get replacements in a game they can turn a scummy slot into the most pro-town slot and still be scum. I hate seeing replacements. I have completely different opinions on how to play mafia than most people on this site obviously. I like to make it very apparent when I am not scum. That is just my thing to do. I am going to fix it later in my mafia career, don't get me wrong, but at this juncture in time it is inadvisable for me to do so. Maybe next week.

The contradiction here is:

the fact judge is getting mad shows my defense was better than he liked
also the fact he didnt really respond to me makes me want to bang my head into the desk,

because i am fairly sure he is town

due to his interaction with mothrax, and I want us all to be on the same page.

If I was scum, you can guarantee different people would have been dying in the night. Plum would not be alive.

anyways

vote: zwetchenswasser

reasons:
he hasnt posted since september 5th, his goofy post restriction early on, and I am willing to die tomorrow if he isnt scum.

and wifom is only an argument mafia use to make town look questionable the way you and

your scumbuddy judge

are using it

Look at the bold.

I didn't even post in between the two posts. What so emphatically changed your reads?

I'm not spouting lies about contradictions. I'm following up on a scumtell that I have seen success with in the past. You have contradicted yourself on multiple occasions. It doesn't matter if you disagree with them, it's what everyone else believes of them.

I'm not tunneling nonsensically - I'm simply gunning for who I find scummiest. I'm not ignoring other players, in fact, I've actually requested things from others in this very game in each of my 3 previous posts.

So far the only defense of you I have seen is Friend spouting "meta" which I don't buy, and you with a mix of WIFOM ("No.. if I was scum, I'd have done

this

..."), self-meta and asserting that you are obviously town based off of interactions with one player, while trying to accuse another player who had similar interactions of being scummy (hey look, there's one of those contradictions I pointed out, in detail). In my eyes, that's no defense. Also, about the mothrax thing, there's a little technique scumteams can use called "breaking the meta" where they do the EXACT opposite of what one would expect. It can easily be followed with a WIFOM trap of "Dude, there's no way I could be scum with him - it would be suicide for scum to do that." You're damn near close to following a similar path here with your assertion that your interactions with mothrax are clearing of yourself.

You ARE tunneling
"gunning for someone you find scummiest" when I had a fucking wagon on me from scum on day 2? You play like an idiot.

You are scum trying to twist everything dark into appearing like it is light. I am sure of it now. I was judging your reactions to my "contradictions", judge, and you've failed. I am not changing my vote, though, because I am pretty fucking sure beefster was one of your scumbuddies.

[Furcolow]

Iecerint, friend, can you please restate your cases on me? I would ask furc and vezo, but their votes are mindless bandwagoning(more reasons to lynch furc).
Friend, what AGar said. And please, if you're just going to mindlessly say that I'm scum and furc's town and provide pointless furc meta, shut the fuck up.

Oh, now you push on me when I'm fucking voting you
such good play, me=weird. Textbook, buddy. You're a great player, who'd you learn from, Judge?

[Vi]

Vote Count XXXVI

~ A real Friend

Me=Weird (L-2) ~ Friend, Iecerint,

Furcolow,

Furcolow, vezokpiraka

Furcolow (L-4) ~ AGar, Me=Weird

zwetschenwasser (L-12) ~

Furcolow

Not Voting:

Chronopie, pacman, Plum, curiouskarmadog, SocioPath,

vezokpiraka

AGar 0 | Chronopie -- | Me= 0 | Friend 0 | Furc 0 | Iece 0 | pacman 0 | Plum 1 | ckd 0 | Socio 1 PROD1 2 | vezo 0

-Chronopie is being replaced. Please hold...

--With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

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(66%)

[Me=Weird]

I WAS VOTING YOU AND PUSHING FOR YOUR LYNCH BEFORE YOU VOTED FOR ME WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!?! I LIKE HOW YOUR RESPONSE TO CONTRADICTION ACCUSATIONS WAS TO "JUDGE HIS REACTIONS" AND SAY HE FAILED. JUST KEEP FLAILING, SCUM.

[curiouskarmadog]

vote Iecerint

....I got a feeling that scum lie here.

[Friend]

No, M=W + AGar, Furc is town and stop telling me to shut up. Your cases are wrong.

[Chronopie]

-Chronopie is being replaced. Please hold...

Wait. What?

It's not 72 hours since my last post (okay, it is NOW, but that because I took a while writing this)

And the above quoted definitely wasn't.

Your last post was midday Wednesday.
The announcement was late-day Saturday.
I win. ~Vi

--

I was going to say that I believe Furc is town. VI-ish, but town. And M=W is just pushing this (fail-)case as a counter wagon.

VOTE: M=W

[vezokpiraka]

There is mini theme 1000 where furc acted the same way and he was scum. He got to day 4 and finally got lynched.
Don't think he is town. He is smart and knows how to appear town.

[Friend]

Nope, he didn't act the same way. He acted way differently.

I think vezo is scum.

unvote, vote: vezokpiraka

[vezokpiraka]

I think Friend is scum.

unvote
vote friend

See what I did there.
Seriously friend. You are not helping. Stop calling people scum or town just cause you think so. Do something.

unvote
Vote M=W

[Friend]

Heh, vezo telling people to do something is very ironic. You're parroting AGar's shitty attacks on me in a hypocritically scummy way.

[AGar]

This game is devolving into pure ad hom and I'm dying with laughter.

Friend, did you ever even consider that Furc is a bit smarter than you've given him credit for and might have learned to try and emulate his town meta as scum? If this is his town meta, it's really not that hard to play like a VI.

Let's just ignore meta for a post. Honestly. I want your uninfluenced opinion.

I have highlighted MULTIPLE major contradictions in Furcolow's posting this game. Contradictions that can also be chalked up as backtracking. He has provided no defense other than sidestepping the issue at hand, WIFOM, self-meta-ing and ad hom.

Last I checked, none of those 4 are actual defenses for actions committed by a player.
Last I checked, I have found scum contradicting themselves in their posting.
Last I checked, backtracking was a widely accepted indicator of a player likely to be scum.

If this was any slot other than Furcolow, committing these same actions with no prior meta to use, would you find them scummy?

Since I have OPENLY declared that I do not feel meta is a strong enough reason to dispell these suspicions, and I've given support for that belief, what is wrong with my case? If I don't buy into meta defenses, what real reason do I have to believe that Furc is town?

Also, don't misrepresent me - I don't want you to shut up. I want you to stop spewing a meta defense of Furc and convince me that he is town some other way and convince me that another player is scummier than he is, leaving meta out of the picture.

[curiouskarmadog]

Vez, if you are town, you have to be one of the worst players I have ever seen.

I dont get the Me wagon...and I really dont get those reasons for being on it.

[SocioPath]

he's a total softie and never pushes his scumfriends like that unless they start it (i.e. by signaling I WOULD LIKE TO DISTANCE NOW PLZ). He does softbus by joining wagons, but he never rhetorics against scumpals.

I am offended that you think this way.

[Iecerint]

I have been scum with you zillions of times. You are a benevolent overlord.

[SocioPath]

I push more than you think.
Like oh I don't know, even the last game we were in together.
IA II.
Where DGB called me town the whole game, I made a great case against her, got her lynched, then used that to get the SK lynched, then rode the rest of the game with my other buddy for a smooth victory.

Vote: Iec

^
YOU SEE WHAT I DID THAR?

[Iecerint]

That is in no way how I recall DGB being lynched. As I recall, she tried to get me lynched, failed, whined about it and tried to re-push by making up meta on me, and got caught. Then MO (or Tar?) noticed other little inconsistencies in her play, etc. As I recall, your first post against her kinda followed mine, and any real rhetoric was after things were pretty much set. I suppose Haylen (SKscum) was in the running a little, but only just.

CKD, why do you think I'm scum?

[Me=Weird]

No, M=W + AGar, Furc is town and stop telling me to shut up. Your cases are wrong.

Why is he town? And don't go spouting of more of your meta crap.

Nope, he didn't act the same way. He acted way differently.

I think vezo is scum.

unvote, vote: vezokpiraka

So now you're reduced to voting anyone who disagrees with you?

-Chronopie is being replaced. Please hold...

Wait. What?

It's not 72 hours since my last post (okay, it is NOW, but that because I took a while writing this)

And the above quoted definitely wasn't.

Your last post was midday Wednesday.
The announcement was late-day Saturday.
I win. ~Vi

--

I was going to say that I believe Furc is town. VI-ish, but town. And M=W is just pushing this (fail-)case as a counter wagon.

VOTE: M=W

Where do you get the town feeling? How is it a counter wagon? If anything, the wagon on me is the counter wagon. And what do you mean, fail-case?

[Friend]

M=W, I'm beginning to get the feeling you're not very bright.

[Me=Weird]

How come? Cause I'm beginning to get the feeling you're an idiot.

[Friend]

Heh.

Either you're scum or you're stupid. One of the two.

[Me=Weird]

How come? Cause I'm beginning to get the feeling you're an idiot.

[Friend]

How come?