Mini 1036 - DEFCON Mafia - Over

[RedCoyote]

I won't let you get away with this. NOT BY A LONG SHOT.

Vote: SpyreX

I certainly don't like this reaction, and, frankly, I feel as though at this point Calcifer is doing whatever he can to shed votes off him and turn attention away from him. If I was in Calcifer's position, I would be annoyed by Spyrex's advances, but I have to think that I wouldn't let myself get this much out of sync. Calcifer is playing extremely reactionary, coupled with his earlier information broking, means I have to think something sinister is at play.

---

Spyre, don't nuke-threat anyone in here like that. It will bring up ALOT of wifom.

This is a prime example of why I'm voting you. Could you be any less relevant to the game? I understand catching up, you know, and I sympathize with that. But what is this? It's like some random, forced comment on something. It's a stark contrast to the Hinduragi of old.

What? You backed off Calcifer because he's clarifying something? I didn't see much clarification because the entire vote is still not explained. Why mention the "like Enigma did" part?

VV brought more substance to the game, I think (although I'm changing my opinion here again ). However, I unvoted him before the drop and before all these shenanigans with Spyrex. I mentioned "like Enigma did" because I felt that our reasons for dropping the vote were probably very similar.

Yup, "active lurking" vote. Nice one. Let's just ignore the fact that I may actually have stuff to do.

Prove me wrong. It's a judgment call on my part. Maybe you're busy, maybe you're letting Spyrex and Calcifer tear each other apart. Who's to say?

It is a fact, regardless, that this a completely different Hindu than the one that was playing D1. I will continue fight you and Percy on that point.

Pray tell, what did Doombunny do that gives him the pleasure of being on your backburner?

Posted. Responded to his attackers. Continued to attack. All good things.

---

Easy rectification would be!
Spy: OKAY CALCIFER FESS UP!
Calc: NO! NO NO NO NO NO!!
Spy: Okay! Sheesh! I stop now and prevent further damage!

NOT:

Spy: OKAY CALCIFER FESS UP!
Calc: NOO!!
Spy: FUCK YOUU WITH A GODAMN NUKE.

As comical as this may be, this reads nothing but tunnelled to me. For Spyrex to press you on having a night result that was, at one point, good enough to vote someone, and only later, when called out on it, wasn't, is absolutely logical play. For him to press you as hard as he is is a debatable move, but it tells me that he's serious. I think he smells something, and I, for one, don't blame him.

---

but my original point still stands - your original read on Hindu seemed to come out of the blue.

I still don't quite understand what expectations you're expecting me to adhere to, but I'm getting a vibe that you have some sort of perfectionist standard that you're applying directly to my reads on the game. I try to be as precise as possible with my reads, but mafia is very much an imperfect science. I gave Hindu a modest town read based on the things I've already told you. It was a D1 read with some 10 pages into the game. There have been serious, undeniable differences in his play since then.

Why was Doombunny on the backburner and not Hindu, or anyone else? You seem to be the player who, like me, likes to put a lot of thought into his voting, but this Hindu business rubs me the wrong way. And this is not the first time Doombunny has been out of your notice, you did leave him off your first scumscale...

The latter was an error in my typing. I had typed nearly that entire post up in one sitting, so that was just an oversight (I'm sure there are plenty more within that post). Doombunny has been making stuff happen, Hindu has been letting stuff happen. That's significant. I agree that we probably are both very careful with our votes, but perhaps you don't put as much stock in playstyle shifts as I do. I sense a strong change in Hindu's play.

Moreover, this is not some sort of staic position. Hindu and Doombunny can both still prove me very much wrong. I acknowledge your case against Doombunny as rational and sincere; I don't understand why you're not giving me the same courtesy.

---

Voting for percy after targetting him IS THE SAME THING WE JUST WENT THROUGH. If its a damn investigation say so. If not DONT DO WHAT JOHNNY DONT DOES.

This.

It's your turn Enigma. Since it's impossible for a town power role to use information they may or may not have gathered at night and build

around

it, then I don't think I can trust anyone enough to make a move like this without informing us.

[Doombunny9]

423- So I say I think Spyre is voteworthy and he says that that makes me voteworthy? Can you say OMGUS?
425- So because I put the thing about lurking in there means its the main reason I'm voting him? Despite all the other times throughout the thread I said it was because the lack of any contributions? Yeah... Have fun with that. Yes lurking was one of the reasons for voting him but really made me want to vote him was the lack of actual content. Please read moar next time.
426- Most of his actions recently: Tunneling on Calcifier, Barely focusing on anyone other than calcifier, his pushing to get Calcifier to claim and give out information despite its pretty damn obvious calcifier isn't going to, letting others pass by except for calcifier etc.
441- I agree with Spyre, this vote needs to be explained.

[Hinduragi]

Is it so hard to accept that Andy has an established meta of softclaiming/breadcrumbing with somewhat silly reasons?

Oh, hell no. I'm done seeing this. You just said you were hopping on the Spyrex wagon BECAUSE of his established meta. And you're defending yourself/Andy with the same reasoning.

Anyways, as to this tunneling thing, Calcifer, did you claim radar or what? I'm still confused.

All that text, but still no vote? Who is your top suspect and why aren't you voting for them?

I wasn't sure at the time who I wanted to vote for. I just wanted to see responses to my wall before my vote went out.

This is a prime example of why I'm voting you. Could you be any less relevant to the game? I understand catching up, you know, and I sympathize with that. But what is this? It's like some random, forced comment on something.

How is that a random, forced comment? I said that for a reason and only scum should want this advice to be ignored. It's a prime example of nothing. You voted me for not posting here, not random, forced comments.

VV brought more substance to the game, I think (although I'm changing my opinion here again ). However, I unvoted him before the drop and before all these shenanigans with Spyrex. I mentioned "like Enigma did" because I felt that our reasons for dropping the vote were probably very similar.

What did the drop have to do with unvoting VV? Also, I don't like that. The like Enigma did part largely feels like you want to be indirectly associated with him since he's garnered town points.

Prove me wrong. It's a judgment call on my part. Maybe you're busy, maybe you're letting Spyrex and Calcifer tear each other apart. Who's to say?

I'm defending against a judgement call, something pretty similar to gut. What do you want as proof? An essay I wrote? Seriously.

Posted. Responded to his attackers. Continued to attack. All good things.

I'm doing the same thing. It doesn't exactly get me on your backburner, now does it? Who are your other scum reads?

Vote: RedCoyote

His reasoning for voting is inconsistent and he has ignored his original case to go for me because I was lurking. His vote is on me and he is now getting at the reasoning that Im letting Spyrex/Calc attack each other. I had V/LA come Friday, it wasn't my fault. Before then, how was I supposed to know Spyrex would press a case like this? He has put Doombunny on his backburner because of more pressing issues yet his reasoning for doing so was crap. More than that, his previous comment to the Spyrex/Calc issue was just egging it on, yet he wants to go for me under the same visage.

[Doombunny9]

Anyways, as to this tunneling thing, Calcifer, did you claim radar or what? I'm still confused.

Heres the lowdown:

-Calcifier is radar
-Last night Calcifier chose Enigma
-Enigma visited Percy
-For whatever reason, this made Enigma want to vote Percy

Also, something I wanted to ask percy before but forgot to:

@Percy- You're beginning to look even more like option 3 in one of my previous posts (you're only taking from my posts what you want to see). In post 425 you link to one of my posts with my case on Socio and from the not one, not two, but four reasons I provided you concluded that my case on Socio was just because he lurked. why then, despite the FOUR reasons I posted did you only think it was due to lurking? Added on to the fact that I constantly stated my reason for voting Socio was not just due to lurking I cannot see any way you would think otherwise. Explain.

[SpyreX]

Hindu while I dig RC not a tech vote.

AS IT SITS WE GET TO PLAY ENIGMA DANCE NOW

[RedCoyote]

You know, RayFrost explained that "tech" thing to me, and I still didn't get it.

Hindu's trying to pin me for being inconsistent, but the bigger point is that he's made a playstyle shift from leading to being passive. He says because he was writing a paper, and that may be true, but I'd like to see more from him than just reacting. Percy doesn't see this, but I do. It's a big deal. Say what you will about Doombunny, but he's unchanged from D1 to D2. I honestly would've expected Hindu to see my vote, say, "Ah, yeah, sorry guys. I've been a little busy. What's with this here? Why did you do this? X doesn't sound right", instead of, "WOW I'm voted for lurking?!", implying I was somehow wrong with my expectations.

That's way too defensive, and it doesn't sound like Hindu from D1. That's all I'm saying. Am I really the only one who sees this?

[Faraday]

You know, RayFrost explained that "tech" thing to me, and I still didn't get it.

Hindu's trying to pin me for being inconsistent, but the bigger point is that he's made a playstyle shift from leading to being passive. He says because he was writing a paper, and that may be true, but I'd like to see more from him than just reacting. Percy doesn't see this, but I do. It's a big deal. Say what you will about Doombunny, but he's unchanged from D1 to D2. I honestly would've expected Hindu to see my vote, say, "Ah, yeah, sorry guys. I've been a little busy. What's with this here? Why did you do this? X doesn't sound right", instead of, "WOW I'm voted for lurking?!", implying I was somehow wrong with my expectations.

That's way too defensive, and it doesn't sound like Hindu from D1. That's all I'm saying. Am I really the only one who sees this?

No, but look at my play. It's pretty much the same deali-o. I don't really see it as something scum are more likely to do knowing it happens to me quite a lot in games so yeah.

I'm really trying to sink my teeth into something here.

[Percy]

I've got no idea why Enigma is voting for me; there is nothing incriminating for Enigma to find. I'm not going to waste any time on any more setup stupidity.

Enigma's confirmation (I guess since he's not voting Calcifer) of Calcifer's target means I feel much more comfortable about things. It's clearly not what SpyreX originally suggested (a scummy attempt to draw out the cop), and I for one am willing to let the matter rest.

Hey

@SocioPath

, why Calcifer? What do you think about anything else that's gone on in this game?

Why did you target Percy?

Guys, we've got less than a week until we have to lynch somebody. We can waste that time on more claiming and setup speculation, or we can scumhunt.

@RedCoyote

:

I sense a strong change in Hindu's play.

...and I sense a strong change in your case. I asked you what your read of Hinduragi was, you said "I have a vote free" and voted him. This reasoning now feels retroactive.

Maybe that's how you play, and maybe your case has developed over time. Hmmm. I'm going to have to think on this for a while.

425- So because I put the thing about lurking in there means its the main reason I'm voting him? Despite all the other times throughout the thread I said it was because the lack of any contributions? Yeah... Have fun with that. Yes lurking was one of the reasons for voting him but really made me want to vote him was the lack of actual content. Please read moar next time.

Hahahahahaha

Next time, you try reading what I said. You didn't have five billion reasons to vote SocioPath, you voted him because you said he wasn't producing content, then gave some examples. Examples are not the same thing as points. There are others who have produced very little content (either D1 or D2), but you don't seem to care about those guys. That is one of my points against you.

As for the SpyreX thing, let's look at what went down.

(1) You say SpyreX is tunnelled on Calcifer, and is too concerned with setup.
(2) You unvoted because you thought Calcifer was acting like "silly scum" and wanted more explanation.
(3) Two people vote SpyreX.
(4) You say all you wanted was for Calcifer to clear up the role information / gut read inconsistency.
(5) Calcifer does so, and you go back to voting Sociopath, saying that now SpyreX is worthy of hammering.

That is some suspicious activity. It smacks of opportunism, also playing both sides of this issue. Especially (2), but (4) after (3) is the same sort of deal.

[Enigma]

Percy, I received a

result

which I believe is quite likely to be incriminating. Do you have an idea why that might be?

[Doombunny9]

Next time, you try reading what I said. You didn't have five billion reasons to vote SocioPath, you voted him because you said he wasn't producing content, then gave some examples. Examples are not the same thing as points. There are others who have produced very little content (either D1 or D2), but you don't seem to care about those guys. That is one of my points against you.

You're changing your story. Previously you said that you thought my lack of content was based on lurking and I still want to know why. Lurking =/= content. I can post 1,000 times and none of them can have any content and likewise, I can barely post at all and each of those posts can have a lot of content. Basically, the only problem I'm having a real fo' srs content problem with are Socio (D1 and D2) and Spyre (D2). FYI I am focusing on them both.

Also, even though its just an awkward timing issue (from my PoV) I can see where you're coming from on the Calcifier point but I see nothing wrong with the Spyre one. I have made it clear already that Spyre is my second FoS and at the end of the day I will vote him if I can't get a socio lynch. I'd rather have my second FoS die than no one die.

Also, I'm willing to trust Enigma at this point. I don't think scum would try to claim cop at this point when they could easily just wait until it would be more important for them to do so. Also, even if it were a ML we would still have caught Enigma-scum tomorrow. Either way we have scum.

Unvote, Vote: Percy

[Calcifer]

Percy, I received a

result

which I believe is quite likely to be incriminating. Do you have an idea why that might be?

I don't understand. Why didn't you autovote him at the start of D2 then?

[Enigma]

Are all investigative roles supposed to claim on Day 2? I must have missed that memo.

Still waiting on the response from Percy.

[Percy]

Percy, I received a

result

which I believe is quite likely to be incriminating. Do you have an idea why that might be?

No.

Previously you said that you thought my lack of content was based on lurking and I still want to know why. Lurking =/= content. I can post 1,000 times and none of them can have any content and likewise, I can barely post at all and each of those posts can have a lot of content.

You're quibbling over words, my points are the same. Voting someone for no content (whether you describe their lurking as active or not) is dubious, and doing so inconsistently is a scumtell.

The fact that you unvoted (a soft move in and of itself) to clear up the Calcifer issue throws doubt on your conviction in your SpyreX suspicions.

[Percy]

Also, I think it's pretty incredible that Doombunny has gone "Enigma is claiming a cop guilty on Percy", since it's quite obvious he's not.

[Percy]

Fuck, I think I just figured it out.

If it's what I'm thinking, Enigma, then I am going to be fucking speechless.

[AlmasterGM]

[Day 2, Vote Count 4 - Terminate her. Immediately.]

"Join the Army, see the world, meet interesting people - and kill them." --Pacifist Badge, 1978




[Votes]

AurorusVox

(0)

Calcifer

(3) - SpyreX, Zhero, AurorusVox

Doombunny9

(1) - Percy

Enigma

(0)

Faraday

(0)

Hinduragi

(2) - RedCoyote, SocioPath

Percy

(2) Enigma, Doombunny9

RedCoyote

(1) - Hinduragi

SocioPath

(0)

SpyreX

(1) - Calcifer

Zhero

(1) - Faraday

Not Voting

(0)

[Activity]

The deadline is 27 September at 11pm EST. No prods currently needed.

[Doombunny9]

Voting someone for no content (whether you describe their lurking as active or not) is dubious, and doing so inconsistently is a scumtell.

So by your logic someone who only posts crap and fluff and doesn't contribute anything is just as scummy/townie as someone who writes well thought out and detailed posts the majority of the time? And voting person because of this is scummy? WHAT? Also, I've stayed pretty consistant throughout the game on my socio points so I don't se where you're coming from. Also you STILL failed to answer my question. Why say my case was a lurkerhunt despite evrything I've said throughout the game. Come on, humor me.

since it's quite obvious he's not.

I have to say this made me lol. At least you did end up realizing it XD

[Percy]

Oh, this game.

So by your logic someone who only posts crap and fluff and doesn't contribute anything is just as scummy/townie as someone who writes well thought out and detailed posts the majority of the time? And voting person because of this is scummy? WHAT?

No and no. Nice spin, though.

Also, I've stayed pretty consistant throughout the game on my socio points so I don't se where you're coming from.

You're being deliberately obtuse. I haven't accused you of saying two different things about Sociopath. I have accused you of both (1) Having no conviction behind your SocioPath vote and (2) Being inconsistent in focusing your attention on SocioPath over other players.

Also you STILL failed to answer my question. Why say my case was a lurkerhunt despite evrything I've said throughout the game.

Because it is what it is. I'm not going to explain my case to you a million times. It's not you I'm trying to convince, after all.

Also, what? You voted me because you said Enigma was claiming a cop guilty, and either Enigma is telling the truth or he's lying scum. Now you're saying you know that's not the case... then why are you voting me?

[Zhero]

Yeah, I don't think there's any way Enigma has the case he says he does.

Unvote. Vote: Enigma

I like the case on Doombunny so far, and Hindu/RC reads town vs. town to me.

[Doombunny9]

(1) Having no conviction behind your SocioPath vote and (2) Being inconsistent in focusing your attention on SocioPath over other players.

False.

Because it is what it is. I'm not going to explain my case to you a million times. It's not you I'm trying to convince, after all.

It takes what? A second of your time? what can you possibly lose from this? Just humor me.

Also, what? You voted me because you said Enigma was claiming a cop guilty, and either Enigma is telling the truth or he's lying scum. Now you're saying you know that's not the case... then why are you voting me?

No, tis still the case.

[Doombunny9]

Also @Zhero- Why don't you see Enigma as being legit?

right now me thinks its Percy/Zhero/Spyre scumteam and Socio SK

[SpyreX]

Likely to be incriminating?

JESUS H.

Why has everyone lost their mind this game.

right now me thinks its Percy/Zhero/Spyre scumteam and Socio SK

Ohh I'll bite in this pure awesome: Why is Socio an SK and not scum?

[RedCoyote]

No, but look at my play. It's pretty much the same deali-o.

Do you think I'm satisfied with that? A man only has one vote.

---

...and I sense a strong change in your case.

I really thought [Hindu] had a strong first day, but he's been kind of absent from anything going on today

Hindu's trying to pin me for being inconsistent, but the bigger point is that he's made a playstyle shift from leading to being passive.

---

I think I'm just going to hide out in a bunker with AV, Zhero, and Spyrex and we'll just nuke everyone else.

[Faraday]

No, but look at my play. It's pretty much the same deali-o.

Do you think I'm satisfied with that? A man only has one vote.

This is weird, have you mentioned it in relation to me? I mean, you've got one vote but you can type as much or as little as you like.

[Faraday]

Yeah, I don't think there's any way Enigma has the case he says he does.

Unvote. Vote: Enigma

What do you think of Percy's 464 then?

I've no real idea what Enigma/Percy are dancing around, I'm sure it'll come out eventually if needed. Still pretty happy with my Zhero vote who looks like scum and all that.