Open 254 ~ Trust Issues (FvEvE) Game Ends


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Post Post #125 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 9:24 am

Post by Equinox »

V/LA until Wednesday


Real-life load surge. I'd initially planned on replacing out, even PMed a couple of people to ask if they were willing, but I think I'll try this instead of flaking out so soon. Right now, I'm looking at cold meds and an increase in workload for school, so my access is going to be limited for the next couple of weeks. I should have foreseen this (except the sniffles and headaches), but I was stupid. Anyhow, V/LA 'till Wednesday to see how much of this I can get taken care of; it would be a lot better for me if I didn't try to multi-task. If this doesn't work out, search for replacements will commence again.

I'll address the stuff I need to catch up on later today... assuming I don't crash. And if I crash, I'll address them on Wednesday.
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Post Post #126 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:47 am

Post by CSL »

Roll Call IV

Equinox -2- Nobody Special, Nexus

Nobody Special -1- quadz08
Sevei -1- Zed
singersigner -2- Antihero, Lowell
quadz08 -1- Equinox
Antihero -1- singersigner
Nexus -1- Sevei
Lowell -1- a2rudeboy
Pomegranate -1- springlullaby
Non-Voters -1- Pomegranate

12 in class, 7 expels

Pomegranate is V/LA starting Thursday, lasting until Saturday night.
Equinox is V/LA until Wednesday
Nexus is V/LA until Saturday

Deadline is in two weeks, the 6th of October, at 7:00pm EST. Deadline hitting now means Equinox gets kicked out
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Post Post #127 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:39 pm

Post by Equinox »

Okay.
Sevei wrote:You quote Singer out of order and then dismiss her calling you out about it; I have read and reread that post of yours and it still looks like a deliberate misrep.
I fail to see the deliberate misrepresentation. Antihero's post made perfect sense to me when I read it; the first quote from singersigner is the most recent post to which he's responding, and his response consisted of two quotes from singersigner. Those two quotes were in chronological order.
Nexus wrote:I always thought that every rule set had "No spoilers" and suchlike?
Some do; some don't. It's one of those things players need to check prior to doing it.


singersigner wrote:I stand by what I said. I wasn't insisting. I made an RVS vote for the random reason that Equinox hadn't answered her own questions yet. Then in response to her saying
why
she hadn't answered her questions, I said "why not?" Then I said ^this.
If I were to compare your response to the other responses I've seen in other games (including my own) to that particular RQS procedure, yes, you were pressing the issue. I don't think that's scummy, though.
Antihero wrote:That was an
honest
copy/paste mistake
, and that should be obvious from the post. You are really not building a case off of THAT are you?
Well, now
I
am.

This cannot be a copying and pasting mistake. The order in which you pasted the three quotes from singersigner was not entirely chronological, but it was perfectly logical. (See above.)

I can accept claiming that it was a "fail" because it resulted in two players misunderstanding your intention. However, now you say it was an "honest mistake." Really?
Zed wrote:I like to watch how things play out without my intervention, because that gives me more to go on.
On the other hand, we don't have much to go on when we're reading you if you go with this tactic. Transparency is pro-town.

Also, if you actively intervene, you not only get more to go on, but you also can trust the results of your efforts because you know your own alignment.

[/soapbox]
springlullaby wrote:- Equinox is not getting town points for her over defensive reaction to people not liking her questions. Why are you not content with your questionnaire getting reaction since it is what you were apparently aiming for?
Overly defensive?
Seriously?


You also seem to be under the impression I was reaction fishing with the questions. I was, to an extent. All of that was explained already, and I'm happy with the responses I've gotten so far. What I neither wanted nor expected were the noobish "OMG SCUM" responses to what I thought was a standard RQS.
springlullaby wrote:
FOS Equinox
, I haven't counted, but seems there is plenty of votes already there.
Record-breaking two votes. Too scared to pile on?

Are you in the habit of making multiple FoSes like that, springlullaby?
a2rudeboy wrote:Equi for me is getting town points, even though the exchange over the questions rifled me a little bit. I will say however, that that is the first time i have seen someone rationalize their thoughts behind their RQS, which is refreshing in my mind.
Question: You don't think it's strange that someone went to the trouble of explaining each RQS question? You even gave me town points!


Let's start with this:

SCUM
: Antihero > quadz08 > Pomegranate > Nexus

Antihero: Backpedaling.
quadz08: Stretching a case on me based on my RQS questions. This may just be due to a difference in opinion about theory (which would make his attack a null tell), but I'm not happy with how he chose to tag-team with singersigner (which is a possible scum tell). He's disappeared, though I saw him post elsewhere on the site that he was busy IRL at the moment.
Pomegranate and Nexus: To steal from Sevei, they're "commenting from the peanut gallery." Nexus has been slightly more helpful than Pomegranate... but only slightly. Need more comments on the past 5 pages.

I'm either null or leaning town on the rest.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Antihero
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Post Post #128 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:27 pm

Post by Antihero »

:?
Equinox, you're going to have to explain to me the difference between a fail and an honest mistake. They're synonymous to me.

The point is, I didn't mean to have that random floating sentence there, and I feel that is the source of the confusion.

And of all the things on that text wall above, how is what I did the scummiest by any stretch?
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Post Post #129 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:33 pm

Post by Equinox »

Random floating sentence? Are we thinking of the same post?
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Post Post #130 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:41 pm

Post by Antihero »

Maybe not.
Antihero wrote:Seriously, people, what's with the sphincteritis about Equinox answering the damn questions? It's a red herring, drop it. (Side note: I think equinox is a "she")
rudeboy wrote:oh, and vote:quadz because the Cavies suck
I don't know who the cavies are, but I think that random vote on page 3 suck. IGMEOY

Why would your answer influence others' answers? I see no reason why you shouldn't answer your questions now, unless you're just pretending that you actually had a reason for not answering your own reasonably standard questions.

singer wrote:...what?

I'm not pushing Equinox...it was a joke about an RVS vote...
Really? What's this then:
singer wrote:Why would your answer influence others' answers? I see no reason why you shouldn't answer your questions now, unless you're just pretending that you actually had a reason for not answering your own reasonably standard questions.
singer wrote:For the record, I never insisted on anything, nor did I press the matter in any way, shape, or form.

Welcome those who have had yet to post, and have now posted!
Backtracking is bad
The cut and paste fail/mistake is in
orange
.

I started to think the cause of dispute was the random orange sentence. Am I completely oblivious? Is that wrong?

What's the freaking argument over, again?
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Post Post #131 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:54 pm

Post by Zed »

Unvote Vote:Lowell


I keep forgetting to do that.
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Post Post #132 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 6:15 pm

Post by Equinox »

Oh...

Oh. We
were
thinking of the same post, just not the same area. I saw that the first time I read it but not the second time. /self-slap

Yeah, that is an honest mistake. But why the discussion about quoting "out of order"...? Mind is blown at the moment. Saving this for after my V/LA.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: quadz08
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Post Post #133 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:03 pm

Post by singersigner »

Equinox wrote: UNVOTE:
VOTE: quadz08
What? Why?
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

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Post Post #134 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:05 pm

Post by singersigner »

Well, not that I entirely disagree, but you haven't even given reasons for the vote/change of heart, which is what I'm curious about.
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

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Post Post #135 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:05 pm

Post by Equinox »

I thought it was obvious. He's second on the list after Antihero.
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Post Post #136 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:08 pm

Post by Equinox »

That first sentence probably came off too confrontational... not my intention. Sorry the wording's bad. >_<
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Post Post #137 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:19 pm

Post by singersigner »

What are you saving for after your V/LA? A vote on Antihero? Or do you just not find him as scummy anymore? And right, I looked back and saw your case on quadz, sorry. I just don't know why you switched your vote just like that.
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Post Post #138 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:27 pm

Post by Equinox »

Reviewing the argument you and Sevei were having with him. I was under the impression it was over how he ordered your quotes, but now that I realized he'd actually messed up the quote tags, I may have missed the gist of the argument entirely... so I have to look again, but after Wednesday.

singersigner: It was a revote. My vote was on quadz08 earlier, and then I switched to Antihero when I thought he backpedaled. Now that Antihero has explained that it wasn't a backpedal, Antihero isn't my top suspect anymore.
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Post Post #139 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:35 pm

Post by singersigner »

Equinox wrote:Reviewing the argument you and Sevei were having with him. I was under the impression it was over how he ordered your quotes, but now that I realized he'd actually messed up the quote tags, I may have missed the gist of the argument entirely... so I have to look again, but after Wednesday.

singersigner: It was a revote. My vote was on quadz08 earlier, and then I switched to Antihero when I thought he backpedaled. Now that Antihero has explained that it wasn't a backpedal, Antihero isn't my top suspect anymore.
Part one: It was over how he ordered the votes. But then I felt like he was misrepping what I said because it looks worse out of context. It needed to be read in context to understand why I was saying what I was saying, etc.

Part two: Ah, that makes more sense. Carry on.
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

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Post Post #140 (ISO) » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:05 pm

Post by Sevei »

Nexus wrote:
Sevei wrote:
UNvote

I am less confused but :igmeou:.

Vote: Nexus

Actively lurking and commenting from the peanut gallery?

Also. Explain this.
Nexus wrote:I remember now. I thought Equinox had more votes, so counted up. Then saw your name, and made the mistake.

VOTE: Equinox
What is there to explain? I had intended my vote to be on Equinox for a RVS wagon. I was counting the number of votes on each player, and read NS last, so accidentally voted for him. As soon as I recognised my mistakes, I voted Equinox.

That explained enough?
I think so...it was just phrased oddly.
unvote


springlullaby...first, I appreciate this comment:
springlullaby wrote:As general advice, please stop saying that people's play are stupid. You may feel so but 1)you may not be right 2)it is not of any use to the game.
Second: Why FoS two people and make cases but then vote someone you never talk about?
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Post Post #141 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 3:16 am

Post by CSL »

Finding a replacement for Nobody Special.
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Post Post #142 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:11 am

Post by CSL »

The phone rings, so I answer it. Nobody Special flees the room, while kunkstar7 takes his place.

"Nobody Special is switching classrooms with kunkstar7. I trust you all will be ok with that? Your homework for Science is..."

kunkstar7 replaces Nobody Special, effective immediately.
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Post Post #143 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:45 am

Post by kunkstar7 »

Ok just preliminary thoughts on entering the game:

Pages 1/2 seem to be just RVS/RQS. The RQS failed quite a bit in my opinion, but I'm going to leave this theory debate out right now.
Page 3 seems still a lingering continuation of random stuff...
Zed wrote:Now I'll share my hunch. Lowell and Antihero are scum buddies. Antihero was under pressure so Lowell is trying to divert attention while Antihero gets things under control again. Lowell is not voting for me though, because he doesn't want to lead the town in lynching me.

Oh, and you never explained your vote on singer.
I'm not sure how you can see those coordinating tactics from them with nothing really concrete. Saying Lowell's posts are diversions is like saying my replacing is a cover for {{insert player}}. Its grasping at straws, kind of ridiculous for even this early. Do you have any other case that supports one or the other being scum, because if you take your hunch and separate out the players, your hunch falls apart because you have no evidence like a flip or other scumtells to support either player being individually scummy.
Zed wrote:Oh, and Antihero and Lowell are taking my original hunch post the same way. Coincidence, or are they both trying to discredit my ideas?
This is confirmation bias, which I find especially poor considering the original hunch.
springlullaby wrote:3. What is your favorite role? Pumpkin shooting laser from its ass
4. Chaos or order? Stupid questions get stupid responses.
Win and Win.
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Post Post #144 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:06 am

Post by Zed »

Did you read anything else? Did you read my post where I said it was half serious and half OMGUS? I'm the only one you have anything to comment on about?
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Post Post #145 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:30 am

Post by a2rudeboy »

@ Equi-
It's just in the games i've encountered RQS in so far, the questions haven't really accomplished anything more than random votes. The person usually asks, some people answer or refuse to, and then something gets blown out of proportion. What I guess I meant was that I had not yet seen the initial poster of the questions give rationale behind the answers they received to the questions (ie, by the end of your breakdown, it seemed much more of an active scumhunting technique than just an alternate way to start the game)
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Post Post #146 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:12 am

Post by kunkstar7 »

Zed wrote:Did you read anything else? Did you read my post where I said it was half serious and half OMGUS? I'm the only one you have anything to comment on about?
I read the whole 6 pages so far. Wasn't too hard. :P

You said it was half serious and half OMGUS. The OMGUS part is bad, and the serious part spurs the rest of my comments on you. The funny thing is that the post following your admission of the half OMGUS/half serious you post what I considered confirmation bias, which showed to me that you are holding some weight to your hunch, and therefore it must be scrutinized.

Yes, you are the only one I have to comment on right now, your posts stood out to me the most out of the start of this game.
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Post Post #147 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:34 am

Post by Zed »

Well if it seemeed like you paid attention to my later posts on the issue then I wouldn't have had to ask.

So are my reasons are worse than Lowell's? You're only going to comment on my side of things, and not his then?
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Post Post #148 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:38 am

Post by Zed »

And I'm sorry, I realize I might be coming off a little rude right now. It isn't my intent, and I don't mean it. Your comments are just making me think and question you now, especially since I didn't have even the slighest tingle about NS's status.
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Post Post #149 (ISO) » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:43 am

Post by Sevei »

Derp, look at this.

Let's talk semantics. Look at how much CYA is going on in a2rb's posts, shall we?
a2rb wrote:Equi for me is getting town points, even though the exchange over the questions rifled me a little bit. I will say however, that that is the first time i have seen someone rationalize their thoughts behind their RQS, which is refreshing in my mind. It's always read as just another semi-useless way to start the game (although, no question is a stupid question in Mafia since there's no telling what reactions will bring) On that case...I should probably answer them.
Basically:
He's sucking up to Equinox while also sucking up to the people who questioned Equinox by saying that she's town, but the people who questioned her might have a point. He's acting like he's never seen a point behind RQS until now, and Equinox has actually shown him the light...even though of COURSE there are no stupid questions in mafia because questions result in reactions.
a2rb wrote:I feel like the antihero v singer debate is mostly town v town based largely on semantics. I don't think there's much info to be gleamed from that unless flips prove us otherwise.
Or..."I think they are both town but they may also be scum." (How about some syrup with that waffle?)
a2rb wrote:It's just in the games i've encountered RQS in so far, the questions haven't really accomplished anything more than random votes. The person usually asks, some people answer or refuse to, and then something gets blown out of proportion. What I guess I meant was that I had not yet seen the initial poster of the questions give rationale behind the answers they received to the questions (ie, by the end of your breakdown, it seemed much more of an active scumhunting technique than just an alternate way to start the game)
Even though he's already said there are no stupid questions in Mafia, the questions in all of his other games have only resulted in...discussion, gasp. But Equinox and her questions are TOTALLY different, and of COURSE she is scumhunting and not just trying to get the game started...unlike every other person who uses RQS.

Okay. Buddying/Sucking up to Equinox noted. Refusing to take a firm stance that condemns anyone's behavior noted. Massive amounts of CYA noted.

Vote: a2rudeboy
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