ATHF Mafia OVER(roles and whatnot revealed)

[Fate]

Seacore

l
l
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V

[podium123456]

AKA Timeline:
1. Fate CAPSLAWKESTYLE cases podium
2. Podium- I can't get a read on Fate. He seems to be intense and has a somewhat legitimate case on me, but it would require me to be really dumb/naice scum
3. Fate Ok Podium, you've almost convinced me you're town. But here's one thing that still continues to bother me REASONABLESTYLE
4. Podium YOUR A FUCKIN JOKE. BLOW IT OUT YOUR ASS. FUCK YOU. IM NOT RESPONDING

hah. you have your order wrong, toots.

it went:

1. (repeat many, many times)
4.
3.
2.

[podium123456]

this game should be in the GD mafiascum hall of fame.



and we're only on D1.

[Fate]

If you think you are doing #2 right now you are wrong.

You are being incredibly anti-town. If you are town, dragging this out between us is wasting time. You are encouraging me to keep my vote on you by refusing to discuss my case on you.

This means that my vote is tied up. This is not a good thing for town. It also won't help you get a read on me (though in our back and forths you have never really seemed like you were trying to get a read on me. Its only when VV a THIRD PARTY asks your read on me that you can give it in case form.)

Because right now, things like "I thought you were a decent player, but you really are just a petty damn fool" and "I don't care if you vote me, I'm huntin scum" scream of you knowing my alignment is town already.

Also when you first were calling me a joke, it was in a more friendly "herpa derpa" kind of way. Now it has devolved into hate-based anti-town play. You are refusing to do the pro-town thing and explain yourself

just out of spite.

This is for lynching.

[Fate]

The fact that Seacore didn't even post just now, implosions recent catchup posts, Zedenek, etc. etc.

These are ALL directions that I want to explore and have yet to comment on because you refuse to answer my question.

And I swear to ALL THINGS holy if you respond only after VV asks you (and that clown better fuckin ask you) I'll vig you N1. I really will.

[podium123456]

If you think you are doing #2 right now you are wrong.

Thanks, i always appreciate the occasional assurance that im not presently shitting my pants.

*ba dum tshhhh*

here:

1. (many, many times)
4.
3.
2.
3.
4.

...if it makes you feel better.

the point was that you didn't start acting reasonable until i said i was through putting up with your crap. you cant piss all over someone and act like a maniac, and then say that they are being unreasonable or anti-town when they get tired of your shit.

at least, you cant with me.

I dont understand why you told me that you were going to vote for me unless i answered one final question from you, and then i said fuck you, and now we are still discussing it.

[Fate]

I dont understand why you wont answer my final fucking question.

You being scum or stubbornly, irrationally, spitefully anti-town Town

Are the only answers I could come up with.

So you die.

(you still are talking to me like I'm town though, so you might want to come up with some BS reasons about when I turned into a town read)

[podium123456]

(you still are talking to me like I'm town though, so you might want to come up with some BS reasons about when I turned into a town read)

You see, you apparently dont realize that i have never called you a scum read.

If you would have dialed down the crazy and dropped the tunnel glasses a little earlier, then maybe you wouldn't be so confused right now.

[podium123456]

I dont understand why you wont answer my final fucking question.

you cant constantly piss all over someone and act like a maniac, and then say that they are being unreasonable or anti-town when they get tired of your shit.

at least, you cant with me.

[podium123456]

Look, fate... i actually have a pretty strong town read on you at this point, and it sounds like you are leaning that way with me. But you aren't going to get me to answer any more of your questions about my case at this point... when i reach a decision like that, im not going to change.

Let me put it to you this way.... let's say that i AM scum. Do you think that i'm the type of guy that couldn't come up with a plausible way to answer this one question? ... Understand what i'm saying? So it really isn't as important as you might think it is. I feel it is more of a personal thing to you, than a scum hunting thing. I could be wrong, but that's just my impression of you right now.

My advice to you is to let this go for now, and start focusing all of your... 'energy' ... into areas that are more likely to actually contain scum.

[Nachomamma8]

First, you jokingly entered the podium wagon.

No. Jokes in a post does not a joke post make. I meant everything I said in that post. I think.

You just copy pasted GW's shit attack

???
Quote =/= my point. Quote was to put GW's case and podium's rebuttal side-by-side, so I could point out that something hadn't been done. Read closer, bromeo.

he apparently has some sort of post restriction

Actually he apparently probably doesn't.

He also slipped onto the Podium wagon.

Slipped? Baby, I didn't slip. I hopped on the wagon while singing camp songs through a megaphone. I did not slip.

I’d like some elucidation on your read on Vibebox.

He's like a watered down version of podium. Not as potent, not as condensending, not as active, not as scummy.

Do you really expect me to sheep? Really?

No, but I had to try. It's difficult being a sheep when you have two shepherds.

I disagree with your assessment of Nacho based solely on personal direct experience with Nacho. He’s not the greatest scum-hunter in my opinion but his scum play was easily recognizable to me the last game we played together. And his play here is not scum-play.

Last game we played together was Perpetual MyLo (I think), where I'm almost positive you weren't the one who caught me. So, you don't know my scum meta as well as you think you do, and should watch out from clearing people with weak reasoning.

Hey, here’s a thought – why not elaborate on why Zin is public enemy number 1 but Zdenek and The Butterfly get off scot free for the same offense.

WHO IS ONLINE
Users browsing this forum:

Look at nacho's ISO. Tell me what scumhunting he has done.

Compare that to mine.

Are you fucking serious?

Switch names and it's still valid. Why? Because you don't explain you just get angry. Use your words, mister.

Why are there so many sheep in this game?

UNVOTE
VOTE: Ghostwriter

Baahhh.

Pod, why put up his shit when he's yelling and being loud and being rude but not when he's being reasonable? I mean, I understand not being able to handle someone as manly as fate, but... why scared now, and no scared then?

[Nachomamma8]

Do you think that i'm the type of guy that couldn't come up with a plausible way to answer this one question?

All these defenses that say "I'm too good as scum to do this" don't help you at all, bro.

But you aren't going to get me to answer any more of your questions about my case at this point... when i reach a decision like that, im not going to change.

I understand.

[Zdenek]

Seacore was coaching podium in ISO9, if either flip scum, it will be something to consider. I also think that he's defending Podium a bit (for instance in ISOs 6 and 31). Finally, I feel that Seacore's hesitation to vote podium is forced, and I think that his argument that Podium is scum for attacking the arguments against him is BS.

I don't have anything to say about MoI except that I think his posts are reasonable. I'm willing to trust MoI's read of nacho today.

I still have to go through the recent exchanges of GW and Podium in more detail, and I will comment as GW requested soon.

[Zdenek]

Let me start with GW's 240: the comment about VV's 176 was accurate. Personally, I think VV is scummy for the reason's mentioned here independently of Podium's flip.

Implosion's catch-up post 241: I think he is right about both the relationship between Seacore and Podium, and VV. On the other hand, I think Implosion's 252, is drivel. He lists the places where Podium did some scum hunting, but chastises him for not doing more (despite the fact that others have done less, as Podium points out later), he attacks Podium for attacking the arguments against him. He acts as though players can't have different perspectives on the game. He also seems to suggest that just making suspect lists is scum hunting.

Implosion in post 263 suggests that Podium is Jester. This is a bizarre thing to do at this point. Podium has been fighting his lynch constantly, so it's doubtful that he'd be a jester. I can't really see why Implosion would want to derail the wagon. I think Implosion is probably just stupid.

I think Podium has defended himself pretty well against GW's attacks. As far as Fate's attacks go, I can easily see town being pissed off and refusing to answer Fate's last question, just as well as I can see scum doing it. So for me, this part of the argument is null. As far as the show me the breadcrumb tell (the last remaining point of Fate's argument against Podium) there are scummier things to look into.

[Zdenek]

I've been fairly suspicious of VasudeVa because he seems to have been avoiding a lot of the major conflicts in the game, so I've been re-reading his posts, and I have a request of Ghostwriter.

GW, could you please explain this paragraph:

You claim to not believe that I thought it was an obvious RVS vote whilst calling it an obvious RVS vote. You say that I should have seen it as reasonable for Podium to see it as a serious vote, but, as I have pointed out already, it is nothing more that Nacho's vote defined. If Nacho's is seen as RVS, Fate's was RVS. The corelation between the two is undeniable. When you simplify what Fate said, you end up with what Nacho said, and, assuming you read things in order, or ever went back and read what Nacho said first, this is obvious to see. If it isn't, then someone isn't thinking on the level I need them to think on as town. And rather than assume someone unable to grasp that fact, it seems far more likely that he is scum.

[Zdenek]

Slipped? Baby, I didn't slip. I hopped on the wagon while singing camp songs through a megaphone. I did not slip.

You didn't provide any reason other than sheeping Fate (which by the way, could be good scum cover).

[VasudeVa]

@VV regarding 176 – I understand your thought process in labelling Podium’s reaction to the way Fate plays. That said the point I find strongest against him is his ‘scum-hunting’.

What is wrong with podium's 'scumhunt'? There has been very little that has happened that wasn't about podium vs. Fate. This game is like 8 pages of Podium and Fate insult swordfighting with each other with Seacore refereeing and then had like 3 pages of other people when you posted this. In fact, when you posted this, there was barely any scumhunting from anyone else.

Done reading. Blah. Long story short: MoI is right, podium has blatantly done no scumhunting at all (until earlier this page, and that's kind of shitty anyway). He just complains. And complains. And complains. His reaction to Fate is somewhat scummy IMO (though it's possible that it isn't) but the rest of what he's doing just isn't town. It just isn't.

This is a lazy opportunistic scum vote^tm.
Then later in this post, You start doing a long wall with horse shit reasoning that assumes podium is scum.

You barely talked about the case on podium at all. You just hopped on it, without making any

good

analysis of your own. ('I think that's scummy' is

not

a good analysis.)

And you automatically assumed motivations on my #176..without even criticizing the post in question. Why would you assume a scum motivation if you didn't even analyze it? Horrible.

176: You claim to not believe that I thought it was an obvious RVS vote whilst calling it an obvious RVS vote. You say that I should have seen it as reasonable for Podium to see it as a serious vote, but, as I have pointed out already, it is nothing more that Nacho's vote defined. If Nacho's is seen as RVS, Fate's was RVS. The corelation between the two is undeniable. When you simplify what Fate said, you end up with what Nacho said, and, assuming you read things in order, or ever went back and read what Nacho said first, this is obvious to see. If it isn't, then someone isn't thinking on the level I need them to think on as town. And rather than assume someone unable to grasp that fact, it seems far more likely that he is scum.

It was pretty obvious that people were already talking about claims, so it was not unreasonable for Podium to think otherwise. You are making too much of a reasonable query. (Fate did too, but he's Fate so yeah.).
And haha, you. You think that someone who doesn't think like you is automatically not Town? Yawn. Garbage attack is garbage.

Next, you talk about my post 59. The problem is that if he's going to even acknowledge what Fate says, then actually do something. If you think was he's saying is pure horse manure and that you want nothing to do with it, then say so ONCE, and let it go until he says something that you, or a good-sized number of your peers, consider to be a legitimate case that you need to argue against. What the hell is good about him just saying "herp derp" until he has multiple pages in his iso making it look like he's posting well when most of it is pointless drivel and contentless babble that has no point?

Soo, your main point is...everyone

should

do what you said otherwise, they are scum?

Do I even need to point out the fallacy here?

My 101 is not saying that at all. You tell me, where was my discussion going? In circles. I don't feel like restating my point and restating my point and restating my fucking point. Oh, just because he says "Nuh uh" to what I say, that makes it true? No.

No. You are not looking into the meat of the argument. It is basically Fate playing dirty(he admitted to this, but it's null with Fate's play.) because he read podium as scum. He didn't even need to admit to it, it was pretty obvious if you actually read Fate's ridiculous reasonings. You did not look into that at all. Therefore, you are not reading into anyone.

That whole post, essentially, was a textbook chainsawing of Podium's attackers. You voted me, the loudest person on the Podium wagon who isn't Fate. You FoS'd Nacho, a quieter member of the wagon who appears fairly solidly locked in. You attempt to dispell Fate by chalking it all up to "you guys just don't know how to deal with Fate, and you're being taken advantage of for it" by use of the "Fate-virgins" term, without actually coming out and FoSing him. I assume it's due to fear. You cut through Seacore's attacks and call them all bad, but leave him alone, I assume because Fate is already after him partly, and you'd rather wait for Fate to commit to it more, and then follow by using this post as your jumpoff. Quite frankly, if Podium flips scum, this post alone would be my motivation to come after you right after.

Oh wow, the chainsaw accusation! Let me take a page of what I learned from Glork.

'Chainsaw defense' is one of the most horrible 'tells' in the existence of this site. It is the a Townsperson's duty to dispell any shitty attacks. If your attack is shit, you deserved to be called out on your shit. If people are lazily wagoning on people based on shit attacks, they

should

be goddamn called out on it.

That all you got, scum?

[VasudeVa]

I've been fairly suspicious of VasudeVa because he seems to have been avoiding a lot of the major conflicts in the game, so I've been re-reading his posts.

There have been two major conflicts in this game. Fate and the mindless sheep Vs. Podium and the minor-conflict inVibeBox vs. MoI-Vas-Seacore AVDWPVOLNU(Alliance Versus Douchebags Who Post Vague One Liners Noone Understands.)

I've commented on the Fate and the mindless sheep vs. Podium and was a part of AVDWPVOLNU. I have also started Vas, Finder of scum Vs. GhostWriterManScumGuy and his sidekick Nachoscumma8. How am I avoiding major conflicts here?

A thought occurs. What if podium is a jester? I'm not sure but I think he might be going out of his way to be scummy... he just ignored my question for the second time in a row, and I'm pretty fucking sure it was on purpose. Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Add this to my points against implosion in #263. Zdenek summed it up real well.

Quote =/= my point. Quote was to put GW's case and podium's rebuttal side-by-side, so I could point out that something hadn't been done. Read closer, bromeo.

GW's attack on him is stupid. He already had attempted to explain his side to Fate. GW's attack was 'Oh, it's obviously RVS'(it wasn't, due to seacore's claim discussion.). There had been multiple pages of podium trying to say 'Well, I didn't think it was RVS! I thought Nacho's was RVS, but I didn't know that Fate's was!'. Seriously, that argument had been long drawn out by that time, I think.

He didn't need to do anything about it because he was actually in the process of trying to do something about it.

---

Podium, Fate is making peace with you now. Can you please get out of your pissy pants and make peace with him too? That recent argument between you is just stupid now. Yes, yes, he yelled at you for 10 pages but just drop it and can all move on.

[implosion]

Implosion's 252, is drivel. He lists the places where Podium did some scum hunting, but chastises him for not doing more (despite the fact that others have done less, as Podium points out later)

The thing is, several people had been specifically asking podium to scumhunt. He's been posting constantly, but there's been very little in general.

he attacks Podium for attacking the arguments against him. He acts as though players can't have different perspectives on the game. He also seems to suggest that just making suspect lists is scum hunting.

Making a list of suspects, saying someone is scum, taking a goddamn opinion with legitimate reasoning within the first 50 posts you make... all of these constitute scumhunting. Maybe a better phrase would be taking stances. podium has taken no stances that actually had good reasoning behind them.

Implosion in post 263 suggests that Podium is Jester. This is a bizarre thing to do at this point. Podium has been fighting his lynch constantly, so it's doubtful that he'd be a jester. I can't really see why Implosion would want to derail the wagon. I think Implosion is probably just stupid.

He's been fighting his lynch, but on the other hand notice how even after several iterations of me asking my question, he didn't answer. The same applies to Fate's question that is supposedly the reason Fate is still voting him. If he were town, he'd answer. If he were scum, I still think he'd BS an answer. Which is why I have some suspicion. Not enough to act on at this point by unvoting.

I think Podium has defended himself pretty well against GW's attacks. As far as Fate's attacks go, I can easily see town being pissed off and refusing to answer Fate's last question, just as well as I can see scum doing it. So for me, this part of the argument is null.

What about

my

argument, to which he eventually just responded that I have to trust him?

Done reading. Blah. Long story short: MoI is right, podium has blatantly done no scumhunting at all (until earlier this page, and that's kind of shitty anyway). He just complains. And complains. And complains. His reaction to Fate is somewhat scummy IMO (though it's possible that it isn't) but the rest of what he's doing just isn't town. It just isn't.

This is a lazy opportunistic scum vote^tm.
Then later in this post, You start doing a long wall with horse shit reasoning that assumes podium is scum.

First of all, it is neither lazy nor opportunistic. First of all, I had to read through 10 pages since I haven't been keeping up. Second of all, he looked the scummiest to me. I had just come back into the game - how is me voting for him opportunistic?

You barely talked about the case on podium at all. You just hopped on it, without making any

good

analysis of your own. ('I think that's scummy' is

not

a good analysis.)

I gave an explanation. The reasoning that I had been thinking already existed in the thread. Maybe I didn't go in-depth into explaining myself but I think the reasons I voted him were clear.

And you automatically assumed motivations on my #176..without even criticizing the post in question. Why would you assume a scum motivation if you didn't even analyze it? Horrible.

I criticized your post... without criticizing your post. Interesting. The main reason you said that podium was essentially definite town was the way he reacted to Fate. Are (or were) you implying that a Fate-virgin scum would literally give up? OH BTW he did give up against me... what do you think about that?

The problem I have about your post is that I honestly don't think an honest, rational person could come to the conclusion that podium is obviously town. A dishonest, rational person could come to such a conclusion.

The fact that Seacore didn't even post just now

IIRC he said he'd have limited access this weekend and would only be able to read the game.

I'm done attacking podium for now, since he appears to have given up in post 268.

[VibeBox]

Wow. That's a metric fuckton of posts to catch up on. @_@

[podium123456]

all this stuff he wrote

I think Implosion is probably just stupid.

[Zdenek]

I've commented on the Fate and the mindless sheep vs. Podium and was a part of AVDWPVOLNU. I have also started Vas, Finder of scum Vs. GhostWriterManScumGuy and his sidekick Nachoscumma8. How am I avoiding major conflicts here?

It's the style of your comments that bugged me. For instance:

podium, do you think Fate is scum? What do you think of Vibebox?

You just ask questions, which would be fine, but they are part of an earlier pattern of noncommittal actions.

Well, Vibebox, now that you are actually explaining what you meant with your #65, it's not at all IIoA now isn't it? Your #65 alone is fillyed shitty unexplained statements on stuff happening in thread that I couldn't even understand what you meant by them. It may be partially my fault that I didn't understand it and saw it as shitposting, but it is also partially your fault that you didn't even bother to explain what you meant with some of those statements because you choose to be the that one guy with lame one liners that he thinks universally understandable.

Here you let VibeBox off the hook really easily.

Your ISO 9 is okay, but it is almost IIoA. It certainly contains some analysis, but a lot of just deals with general reactions to fate and playing with fate.

[Zdenek]

Implosion's 252, is drivel. He lists the places where Podium did some scum hunting, but chastises him for not doing more (despite the fact that others have done less, as Podium points out later)

The thing is, several people had been specifically asking podium to scumhunt. He's been posting constantly, but there's been very little in general.

I said your post was drivel, and it wasn't just because you commented about Podium's scum hunting. You can break my post up and try to deal with each point in some mediocre way, but it won't change a damn thing.

he attacks Podium for attacking the arguments against him. He acts as though players can't have different perspectives on the game. He also seems to suggest that just making suspect lists is scum hunting.

Making a list of suspects, saying someone is scum, taking a goddamn opinion with legitimate reasoning within the first 50 posts you make... all of these constitute scumhunting. Maybe a better phrase would be taking stances. podium has taken no stances that actually had good reasoning behind them.

But just a few posts ago, you said:

I've made a (sort of RVS) accusation of seacore, I've listed my top suspects as of now.

as evidence of your scum hunting. Why do you hold others to such a higher standard?

Implosion in post 263 suggests that Podium is Jester. This is a bizarre thing to do at this point. Podium has been fighting his lynch constantly, so it's doubtful that he'd be a jester. I can't really see why Implosion would want to derail the wagon. I think Implosion is probably just stupid.

He's been fighting his lynch, but on the other hand notice how even after several iterations of me asking my question, he didn't answer. The same applies to Fate's question that is supposedly the reason Fate is still voting him. If he were town, he'd answer. If he were scum, I still think he'd BS an answer. Which is why I have some suspicion. Not enough to act on at this point by unvoting.

You have suspicion that he is jester, and that is why you aren't unvoting or you can't read and you are just posting for fun?

I think Podium has defended himself pretty well against GW's attacks. As far as Fate's attacks go, I can easily see town being pissed off and refusing to answer Fate's last question, just as well as I can see scum doing it. So for me, this part of the argument is null.

What about

my

argument, to which he eventually just responded that I have to trust him?

That is not all he said.

[implosion]

Not requoting to avoid giant textblocks.

I hold him to a higher standard because he's made oh... 7-8 times as many posts as me? And yet he's only given opinions on a few people, and only after being prodded to.

And what the hell do you mean by me just "posting for fun?" It's a

mafia game.

how the hell am I posting for fun? I'm not unvoting because my suspicion that he's jester isn't strong enough. Please actually read what I say, and don't just interpret it how you feel like interpreting it.

As for that not being all he said... funfact: he still said it. And he hasn't given any real comments on my case on him since that. He's essentially given up against me, as far as I can tell.

[Zdenek]

Not requoting to avoid giant textblocks.

I hold him to a higher standard because he's made oh... 7-8 times as many posts as me? And yet he's only given opinions on a few people, and only after being prodded to.

And what the hell do you mean by me just "posting for fun?" It's a

mafia game.

how the hell am I posting for fun? I'm not unvoting because my suspicion that he's jester isn't strong enough. Please actually read what I say, and don't just interpret it how you feel like interpreting it.

As for that not being all he said... funfact: he still said it. And he hasn't given any real comments on my case on him since that. He's essentially given up against me, as far as I can tell.

The number of posts is mostly irrelevant.
You are overestimating the quality of your argument if you think he is trying to get himself hung by not answering your question.
Cherry picking quotes is scummy.