Newbie 1038: Welcome to the Jungle! (Game Over!)

[DavidParker]

David has claimed VT and has now just made another pretty blatant mistake involving tanstalas, we should lynch him. We will lose very little if he is town and gain much if he turns out to be scum, which is much more likely.

Preemptive speculation about scumbuddies:
tanstalas: He voted for someone nobody else was voting for at the time with rather shallow reasoning, possibly as an attempt to pull a bit of heat off of DP. DP immediatly sheeped him.
Mirror: Despite my town tell on him he still seemed to copy many of DP's votes and stuff earlier so I must include him as a possibility.
Lunatic (now Uite): lunatic claimed DP was townie, is very scummy just by himself, and DP seems to have tried not to bring any attention to him, attempting to start another wagon on someone else instead of just trying to strengthen the case on lunatic (Which would have been much easier). This one is most likely in my opinion, although it could be someone else entirely.

Speculating over scum buddies is a bad idea until you have seen a scum flip (in fact it hurts town, generally, and just helps mafia know who to kill at night), and it's just pointless until you've seen a flip anyways.

[Uite]

Progress report! I'm up through about page 7 reading closely, and already a couple things stood out to me. Some of it may be invalidated by stuff after that, but bear with me.

First, DavidParker is acting really weird. He's alternating super scummy stuff, with quite pro-town comments. However, most of his pro-townieness comes from his use of mafia theory, so I'm not sure it cancels out. I'm putting him in the 'scum' category for now.

Pinewolf caught a lot of flak, but I'm not sure all of it is deserved. Some of it seems to come from him being a newbie, but emphatically not all. Especially the way he is generally hesitant with his actions, as well as the many excuses he's making don't really make me think of him as town.

MirrorIrirroM has a lot of trouble getting into the game. Most of his posts up till this point are just restating what others have said, while not providing much of his own, though it does seem to pick up later on.

LlamaFluff definitely takes the IC role to heart, but I'm not seeing too much of him besides that. He's asking good questions, but I'd like to see him draw conclusions from that as well.

KingTwelveSixteen seems generally pro-town, though he doesn't always pick up on the right things.

Tanstalas seems okay too. His posts aren't very frequent, but they are good.

BrentM posts a lot, but he's not actually contributing much. I'm willing to write it off as newbieness, because I'm also not seeing anything really bad.

More to follow when I've caught up more.

[singersigner]

Hey, I'm safe and sound and back from V/LA-ness. There really hasn't been a whole lot going on since I've "been gone", but I might have a few comments on recent happenings in a bit. Uite, I'm looking forward to seeing what you have to say about the rest of the game.

[BrentM]

we need to come up with a decision, if anything else to give this game some life.

I think all of the back and forth at this point is just keeping us from moving forward. I am switching my vote to DP, he keeps jumping ship and his voting makes little sense. I have become convinced he is trying to keep the town scrambling.

unvote, vote DP

[tanstalas]

we need to come up with a decision, if anything else to give this game some life.

I think all of the back and forth at this point is just keeping us from moving forward. I am switching my vote to DP, he keeps jumping ship and his voting makes little sense. I have become convinced he is trying to keep the town scrambling.

unvote, vote DP

^^ That was

L-1

Hey, I'm safe and sound and back from V/LA-ness. There really hasn't been a whole lot going on since I've "been gone", but I might have a few comments on recent happenings in a bit.

Uite, I'm looking forward to seeing what you have to say about the rest of the game.

I am waiting patiently for Uite to catch up, I am torn between a DP and a Luna/Uite lynch. I do not want to ask the mod to extend the deadline however I will if Uite does not catch up before tomorrow.

[Uite]

I am waiting patiently for Uite to catch up, I am torn between a DP and a Luna/Uite lynch. I do not want to ask the mod to extend the deadline however I will if Uite does not catch up before tomorrow.

That may be a good idea. Somehow I thought it would be great to replace into another game as well, and though I'm now fully caught up in that one, I'm not sure if I have the energy to do much more for this one today. I should be set for tomorrow though, so we'll see how far I get then.

[DavidParker]

Vote: Lunatic

Already claimed and stated what would result from my lynch. But I suppose there are worse lynches.

[tanstalas]

Vote: Lunatic

Already claimed and stated what would result from my lynch. But I suppose there are worse lynches.

Just to be clear - that is

L-1

as well

I don't want anyone hammering then saying they didn't know it was the hammer

[Uite]

Vote: Lunatic

Already claimed and stated what would result from my lynch. But I suppose there are worse lynches.

There's nobody in this game called lunatic. And what exactly is your reason for voting here? The way I read it (with my admittedly limited knowledge) is that you're just trying to jump on the biggest counterwagon - which is definitely scummy.

[singersigner]

UNVOTE:
It's the holidays. I wouldn't expect Uite to catch up in two games at once, especially with deadlines coming up, and I think it'll relieve some of the pressure from others thinking they need to get something said/done asap before Christmas (though I think Uite's the only one who hasn't gotten a chance yet). I know a lot of people around the site are V/LA anyway, due to traveling, being with families, etc.
VOTE: Deadline extension

If this is a no-go, we have three days, so I'm hoping Uite catches up quick.

[singersigner]

Blah...while I really thought Luna/Uite was the better lynch, I don't like how DP's made it a more difficult decision. DP, your vote seems more out of desperation than anything else...what's the reason for it this time?

[MirrorIrorriM]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Deadline extension

You can do that?

[bv310]

I'm giving you the extension anyway, so don't worry about it.

[tanstalas]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Deadline extension

You can do that?

Deadline is still set for Thursday, December 23, 2010 at 11:59pm EST. If you guys want the extension, please post:

In favour of extension

whenever you can.

Checking prod timers now.

By the miracles of free airport wifi, please welcome Uite, who will be replacing lunaticlucas.

I'm open to the idea of extending deadline if you all want it

, but I'm going to wait and see if it's necessary first. If I do extend it, it's going to be until the 28th, and I'll have the thread open by New Years Day

@Mirror

- The better question is, why are you skimming the mod posts and did not see that the mod mentioned this twice?

[MirrorIrorriM]

Just realized I haven't posted anything significant in a while, so I shall do that now with a comparison between the Lunatic and DP wagons and why I think the DP wagon is better.

The Lunatic wagon is based off of 9 posts (not including confirmation post). Although alot of information could be given out in that time, I feel as if it is lacking. His posts consist of 2 scum/town lists, 3 posts about why lurking is bad, 1 post explaining his second wall post, 3 posts saying pine is scummy (second of which he mysteriously votes Llama). He also had a major attitude change halfway through the game, and his demeanor was quite scummy throughout. His 9 posts, although providing decent evidence against him by themselves, doesn't compare to the evidence on the DP wagon. In addition to his few posts, he has been replaced; destroying any opportunity to question him. The amount of evidence against Lunatic is all we will ever get, even though it is heavy (strong, good, whatever).

The DP wagon is based on his numerous posts showing inconsistent behavior. He has desperately voted on other people to try to get attention off himself many times. He refuses to answer questions and plays everything against him down like it is merely childish accusations. DP at this point is acting the most erratic of the entire game in direct accordance with how much pressure is on him; seems to me that he is breaking.

Whereas Lunatic has 9 posts with scummy sprinkled all over them, DP has much more posts backing the wagon against him.

For anyone that might wish to vote DP or Lunatic, remember that they are at L-1, so be sure of your vote before placing it!

Spoiler:

Sorry if my thing on Lunatic was longer then the one about DP. It was much easier to write because I could look at all his posts in 1 page of iso

Preview Edit:

@Tanstalas: That wasn't what I meant. I meant I didn't know you could actually divert your LYNCHING VOTE to that. I thought the mod meant for us to say

Please give an extension

(btw that is my official request mod ) not VOTE: Deadline Extension. I was questioning the fact that he can actually divert his official vote to that. Not whether we could request a deadline extension in general.

[BrentM]

UNVOTE:
It's the holidays. I wouldn't expect Uite to catch up in two games at once, especially with deadlines coming up, and I think it'll relieve some of the pressure from others thinking they need to get something said/done asap before Christmas (though I think Uite's the only one who hasn't gotten a chance yet). I know a lot of people around the site are V/LA anyway, due to traveling, being with families, etc.
VOTE: Deadline extension

If this is a no-go, we have three days, so I'm hoping Uite catches up quick.

Blah...while I really thought Luna/Uite was the better lynch, I don't like how DP's made it a more difficult decision. DP, your vote seems more out of desperation than anything else...what's the reason for it this time?

Eventhough we already have an extension, I honestly don't think delaying this any longer will help us. If you think they are both scummy, wavering at this point seems completely unproductive. We have 4 votes on DP, we have his claim, why can't you just finish this? If you are are afraid to hammer, I will unvote and hammer for you

[LlamaFluff]

Leaving my vote. Uite is picking up the wishy-washyness of lunatic without missing a beat

First, DavidParker is acting really weird. He's alternating super scummy stuff, with quite pro-town comments. However, most of his pro-townieness comes from his use of mafia theory, so I'm not sure it cancels out. I'm putting him in the 'scum' category for now.

Pinewolf caught a lot of flak, but I'm not sure all of it is deserved. Some of it seems to come from him being a newbie, but emphatically not all. Especially the way he is generally hesitant with his actions, as well as the many excuses he's making don't really make me think of him as town.

MirrorIrirroM has a lot of trouble getting into the game. Most of his posts up till this point are just restating what others have said, while not providing much of his own, though it does seem to pick up later on.

LlamaFluff definitely takes the IC role to heart, but I'm not seeing too much of him besides that. He's asking good questions, but I'd like to see him draw conclusions from that as well.

KingTwelveSixteen seems generally pro-town, though he doesn't always pick up on the right things.

Tanstalas seems okay too. His posts aren't very frequent, but they are good.

BrentM posts a lot, but he's not actually contributing much. I'm willing to write it off as newbieness, because I'm also not seeing anything really bad.

aka

DP - Goes back and forth between town and scum tells, but gets put as 'scummy'
pine - newbie not deserving all the attacks on him, but is 'not town'
mirrior - doesnt say much of use
llama - is helpful but null
KTS - does good things, but isnt perfect
tans - lurky but decent poster
brent - says little in many words, newbyish, 'not scummy'

He avoids any strong stance halfway through the game and is taking every possible route there is to not call anyone town or right off a vote on any person.

[MirrorIrorriM]

@Llama: So your saying he is taking all sides, so as not to face consequences (from scum point of view) if a person flips town when lynched?

[LlamaFluff]

@Llama: So your saying he is taking all sides, so as not to face consequences (from scum point of view) if a person flips town when lynched?

I normally see it as a way to keep options open for the player. If you avoid taking hard stances on people, you can make whatever move is most convienent from there as there is no past reads that you have to explain differently. Scum need options, stances like his give him plenty.

[singersigner]

@Mirror

- The better question is, why are you skimming the mod posts and did not see that the mod mentioned this twice?

Awww, now why ya gotta be all mean like that?

Anyway, yeah, that's the way I've always seen it done, especially when a mod hasn't already expressed willingness to give a deadline extension.

@Llama: So your saying he is taking all sides, so as not to face consequences (from scum point of view) if a person flips town when lynched?

I normally see it as a way to keep options open for the player. If you avoid taking hard stances on people, you can make whatever move is most convienent from there as there is no past reads that you have to explain differently. Scum need options, stances like his give him plenty.

This. Exactly this. Though, while I wouldn't necessarily give Uite the benefit of the doubt completely, I can understand it being the holidays and accidentally overloading. Considering the circumstance, I'd like to see if he could actually provide something before anyone does anything drastic.

I'm surprised Brent put DP at L-1 at this point...and then he says something like this...

Eventhough we already have an extension, I honestly don't think delaying this any longer will help us. If you think they are both scummy, wavering at this point seems completely unproductive. We have 4 votes on DP, we have his claim, why can't you just finish this? If you are are afraid to hammer, I will unvote and hammer for you

You already put him at L-1...I'm curious as to what makes you think you could unvote, and then hammer, lol.

[tanstalas]

@Mirror

- The better question is, why are you skimming the mod posts and did not see that the mod mentioned this twice?

Awww, now why ya gotta be all mean like that?

Not being mean. Scum skim. Lazy town does it as well, I just thought it odd that he said that when the mod mentioned we could extend the deadline

twice

.

His answer was... adequate

If you think scum hunting and asking questions is 'mean' I have a list of people you should

NEVER

play with

Though I can understand why you thought I was being mean/snarky now that I re-read what I posted. However I was looking to see if he was mearly skimming posts.

[DavidParker]

Vote: Uite

My mistake.

[Uite]

@LlamaFluff:

Of course I'm being cautious. I'm not fully up to speed, so there's information I haven't considered yet. You're misinterpreting my reads though, I have definite scum and town reads by this point. For example, I'm pretty much ready to hammer DP, I just want to wait until I'm fully caught up.

This. Exactly this. Though, while I wouldn't necessarily give Uite the benefit of the doubt completely, I can understand it being the holidays and accidentally overloading. Considering the circumstance, I'd like to see if he could actually provide something before anyone does anything drastic.

Don't worry, it being the holidays actually means I have plenty of time right now. I'm not visiting my family until later in the week.

Vote: Uite

My mistake.

Now why didn't you answer my question? Seriously, what is your actual reason for voting me? You're not making yourself look good here.

With all that said, I'm resuming my readthrough now. Should be done in a couple hours.

[DavidParker]

My reason for voting for you is because you are the replacement for Lunatic.

Translation: "should be done in a couple hours" = "gonna go do something else then come back in a few hours and hammer but make it seem like I thought the decision over and it's not just to save my own scum-ass"

[Uite]

My reason for voting for you is because you are the replacement for Lunatic.

Bullshit, from what I can tell, the only issue you had with him was his apparent lurking. Seriously, why is he scum?

Translation: "should be done in a couple hours" = "gonna go do something else then come back in a few hours and hammer but make it seem like I thought the decision over and it's not just to save my own scum-ass"

Keep digging. I like it.