Mini 1091 Mafia Mania -- Game Over

[boberz]

Hang on, you random voted!!!!!

In fact I dont care. Is the werewolf wagon back on people???

[Beefster]

I would be willing to switch to werewolf. It's better than a moose lynch. I would still vastly prefer an AntB lynch.

[boberz]

unvote vote werewolf

then. Let's do it.

[AntB]

@Beefster
You think i'm scum based on a perceived inconsistency because you read and not skim....

Want to elaborate?

[AntB]

EBWODP:
meh... *beacause you skim and not read

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.12

Beefster - 4 - brokenscraps, Ant_to_the_max, Mariyta, werewolf555
moose200x - 2 - Substrike22, AntB
werewolf555 - 2 - Dekes, boberz
AntB - 1 - Beefster
Lateralus22 - 1 - pappums rat
Substrike22 - 1 - Lateralus22

Not Voting: moose200x

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline: December 28

V/LA: Beefster, 12-25 through 1-1 (via PM)

[Nobody Special]

Mod Note: Just a reminder that I won't be here for two days.

Happy

Holidays!

Next votecount: Sunday afternoon.

[boberz]

Beefster, AntB is definately not happening today so move your vote somewhere more useful. Same to lateralus and pappums. Especially our random voting friend.

[moose200x]

We need a lynch today or tomorrow guys, please, I am worried we won't get one. With that said

vote werewolf

Bandwagon, no brakes

[Beefster]

boberz: I don't like your attitude. Christmas is not the deadline. It seems to me like you're trying to push a mislynch.

@Beefster
You think i'm scum based on a perceived inconsistency because you read and not skim....

Want to elaborate?

No. I think you're scum because you believe moose's claim- as you want to use him to vig/double lynch, yet you want to lynch moose later/at some point. You can't do both. You either doubt the claim and lynch, or you believe him and use his powers to our advantage.

Moose: I wouldn't be entirely against a boberz lynch/vig if that's what you REALLY want to do. I'm fairly confident that he is scum, along with AntB and Substrike.

[Lateralus22]

#229 (Beefster)

: Hated this post so much. 1st paragraph is contradicting because of this post where he specifically asked moose what he was hiding. There was no buddeying, he was obviously trying to wrap his mind around moose considering he was an erratic player. I agree with what boberz said about Hiraki now, I've waited way too long on this issue and his play was just scummy.

#231 (brokenscrap

): I agree in general about moose full claiming. Pretty much qtf about Mariyta.

#237 (Mari)

: The line about quick lynches feels off. Only an idiot would risk doing that and more often than not it'd be scum motivated. I like the concern against Beefster though the linking point feels like an overreaction to me.

#239 (Beefster)

: Oh God... first off WIFOM isn't a scum tell, second off you're also guilty of it yourself with the moose getting nk'ed buiseness.
Remember when I mentioned moose fake claiming in another game? During that game the cop ending up dying the first night and the Doc wasted a protect on moose. Then the Doc made himself obvios the next day and moose got mislynched as a VT. Doc was killed the next night, not cuz he was obvios but during this time scum was able to blend in and the town lost.

The rhetorical line about your cutting the crap comment feels off. If you want moose to stop then why not say it bluntly, in a straight forward way?

And what do you mean "possible" buddeying? You can't even tell if it's buddeying or not and you're using thta as point? PS: Buddeying isn't a scum tell. Quick note: Should have been blunt about it, why are you so confident in moose dying tonight?

#243 (Beefster)

: Moose is consistently posting and participating in other games.

#254 (Dekes)

: Pretty much qft

#260 (boberz?)

: Much clearer post. One thing is can you point where he specifically says he doesn't believe in his own theories?

#255 (werewolf)

: Er what? Scummy as hell comment, not judging your precedior is stupid and the two of you have the same role. Fuck I can think of a game where newbie scum gave himself away easily yet the town lost due to having a nice clean replacement coming in on that spot.

#256 (Dekes)

: Awful, werewolf made a perfectly legitimate post and case against Beefster. Only thing that I would complain about is that Iso's are generally an awful way to scum hunt and they take things out of context. I do like his particular point in #247, I doubt Beefster's use of rhetoric claim.

#281 (Mari)

: Don't like the tunnel accusation, feels like an attempt to discredit boberz without responding to his arguements directly.

#285 (moose)

: This is actually a really good reason

not

to vig either of them. Think of it like this, you've already outed yourself as the vig and scum'll know you have the power the kill them. I think it'd make

way

more sense for them as scum to back off and hope you don't try to shoot them. Both these guys get town points from me.

#316 (boberz)

: meh, I get what you mean. Probably shouldn't have suggested it due to too many flaws.

#329 (werewolf)

: Oh God. I like his original case but now it just looks like he's trying to discredit people for the sake of with his sheeping comment when there's been legit cases against his slot.

#336 (Beefster)

: Oh bull shit. You know this AntB wagon isn't going anywhere. Don't see what's wrong with AntB's post.

#354 (Mari)

: Well, this is hypocritical. Didn't you make a big fuss about connections yet now you're making one with boberz and Beefster?

#370 (brokenscraps)

: Did you miss the memo? Moose already declared to the heaven's that he will be the one to kill boberz. Assuming moose isn't scum, scum already know his target.

#384 (Beefster)

: Eh I kinda get what you mean now about AntB. I do not support a boberz vig at all.

tl;dr: Beef/werewolf/Mari are all awful. If anyone thinks boberz is scum I'd like to see a case.

Unvote:
Vote: werewolf

Conflicted between him and Beef, but his later play is just as bad.

[werewolf555]

Conflicted between him and Beef, but his later play is

just as bad

.

In this quote, it sounds that I was not as bad as beefster, but because of my later play I appeared just as scummy. Would it not make more sense for you to lynch the person who has been scummy all the time?

[boberz]

Beefster we have 6 days. With a weekend and two bank holidays, not to mention general festivities. We look for some kind of lynch now.

Beefster swinging this onto me of all of a sudden is scummy btw everyone.

[Beefster]

@L22: What is your opinion on boberz? I understand you think he's town, but why?

Beefster swinging this onto me of all of a sudden is scummy btw everyone.

How so?

unvote

VOTE: boberz
There. Now it's official.

I will not change my vote until tomorrow night- I'll be V/LA from Christmas to New Year's Eve.

[Beefster]

EBWOP: I will not change my vote

to werewolf

until tomorrow night.

[Beefster]

Also:

Bad

play is a nulltell. I've seen just as many town players with poor play as scum players with poor play.

Scummy

play, though, is a whole different story.

AntB and boberz are scummy. moose is a bad player. Huge difference.

[AntB]

@Beefster
Show me where I actually state in plain english that I buy the Moose Vig Claim. I say that using moose to secure a double lynch is a good idea and if he is as he claims he would be fine, if not he would be quickly outed. I don't want him hanging around by LyLo because so far, he has been of little if any use to town so I believe he would help the mafia win in a LyLo situation.

This wagon you have against me is based on evidene you have altered to your needs, I believe you are scum based on that and your attempts to push it as hard as possible agaisnt me without anything solid are just plain scum.

Moose lynch isn't happening so we will see how that plays out over N1/D2.
UNVOTE: Moose200x
VOTE: Beefster to ensure we have a lynch. Beefster is now at L-2.

[brokenscraps]

@Beefster
Show me where I actually state in plain english that I buy the Moose Vig Claim. I say that using moose to secure a double lynch is a good idea and if he is as he claims he would be fine, if not he would be quickly outed. I don't want him hanging around by LyLo because so far, he has been of little if any use to town so I believe he would help the mafia win in a LyLo situation.

This wagon you have against me is based on evidene you have altered to your needs, I believe you are scum based on that and your attempts to push it as hard as possible agaisnt me without anything solid are just plain scum.

Moose lynch isn't happening so we will see how that plays out over N1/D2.
UNVOTE: Moose200x
VOTE: Beefster to ensure we have a lynch. Beefster is now at L-2.

Wait on...
moose isn't happening,
therefore Beefster
without any discussion of the werewolf wagon?

What happened to "I'm for Moose or Werewolf mainly" (post #367)?

Please give us some info if you're gonna change your mind over a few posts.

[Mariyta]

boberz: I don't like your attitude. Christmas is not the deadline. It seems to me like you're trying to push a mislynch.

This.

As far as not providing content, I think I've done just as much as many people, and more than some. Maybe not as much as you, but only moose has managed that.

Why switch the bandwagon from someone who had 5 votes to someone who had 1? How does that make any sense at all? We still have til the 28th to decide. Yes, some people will be V/LA some of those days, but most will be back by the 28th.

@Lat, re:237- Go read 90s Band if you want to know why I worry about quick lynches. And that's just a recent example. I've been in too many games where people don't pay attention and someone accidentally (or intentionally) gets QLed.

I don't see the case on werewolf. Is it based off Hiraki's play? If so, I don't see that case, either.

[Beefster]

Show me where I actually state in plain english that I buy the Moose Vig Claim. I say that using moose to secure a double lynch is a good idea and if he is as he claims he would be fine, if not he would be quickly outed. I don't want him hanging around by LyLo because so far, he has been of little if any use to town so I believe he would help the mafia win in a LyLo situation.

You can't expect a double lynch unless you believe his claim. You can't doubt the claim and believe it at the same time. You're trying to please everyone, but blatantly contradicting yourself in the process. Major scum points.

You never said you believed him in plain English,

but you implied it by other things you said.

I don't need to prove your actions to make my point. Nice panic defense.

In response to my arguments, you turn your vote back on me. OMGUS isn't usually a scumtell, but in this case, I think it is; You seem to be using it as a panic defense.

And the fact that you totally avoided the topic of werewolf really throws up some red flags. Perhaps a werewolf lynch wouldn't be that bad...

unvote

VOTE: AntB
until tonight... Just in case this gains momentum.

I think I've caught scum.

[Beefster]

Keep in mind that I would be just as happy to lynch boberz as AntB. Werewolf would be my last resort.

[boberz]

Maritya this is not a quick lynch. And I will swap the wagon where I like when I like to try and find the bestcompromise lynch. Beefster, AndB nor me is getting lynched today so leave it for tomorrow.

I do not think AntB is the townies person alive but we cant just do this to a random. We need to work towards a lynch now.

[brokenscraps]

I don't see the case on werewolf. Is it based off Hiraki's play? If so, I don't see that case, either.

I think lack of town play can be just as bad as scummy play, and Hiraki was full of this. Go back and look at his posts. Not an enjoyable experience, being walls of largely unneeded clarifications, theory discussions (about FoS and random voting, hardly could they be more irrelevant to finding scum) and nitpicking. But amongst all this clogging is barely any actual scumhunting or case making.

And werewolf has so far not redeemed him: largely pointless PBPA of beefster, outrage at players refusal to dismiss everything that Hiraki did and weak cases on boberz & dekes.

That is, I gather, the main case.

[Beefster]

Maritya this is not a quick lynch. And I will swap the wagon where I like when I like to try and find the bestcompromise lynch. Beefster, AndB nor me is getting lynched today so leave it for tomorrow.

A "compromise" lynch is not good. How about a scum lynch. We still have time. While a lot of us will be going V/LA, that doesn't mean we should throw away all thought toward a good lynch.

I do not think AntB is the townies person alive but we cant just do this to a random. We need to work towards a lynch now.

Which is what we're doing. Quit insisting that we must lynch ASAP.

Please state your werewolf case.

[Beefster]

I do not think AntB is the townies person alive but we cant just do this to a random.

What the heck does this trainwreck mean? And it isn't random. Have you even read my case?