Mini 1102 - Rivertown Mafia (Game Over!)

[Olinea]

Olinea, purge through the thread again. You've only just revived old points that have already been answered.

I revived old points detailing when you made these conflicing statements. ThAdmiral said he'd have backed off had you stated it earlier. I was looking for the first time that you stated it was specifically pushing a bandwagon.

As for the strawman, it's not a strawman. I needed to know what he thinks on bandwagons before I could reply, he still has not given me enough information which is why I am still continuously asking him for it so I can reply to his statement appropriately.

Fair enough. Forgot there wasn't a universal opinion on bandwagons.

Regardless, the conflicting statements earn you my vote for the time being.

[Furcolow]

Umbrage, do you have any off-site experience to justify your level of arrogance? Or does it just come naturally?

hahahahaha

[Furcolow]

i almost said "i bet he unvotes umbrage before page 6"
hahahahahahaha
right at the bottom of page 5
the problem here is el simo and ortiz are both likely town from my eyes and have accrued the votes.......
el simo over people misunderstanding him... i can relate to that
ortiz because of his style i believe... hopefully pages 6-8 will give some explanation as to why umbrage or thadmiral don't have a ton of votes on them

[Furcolow]

A random vote might not be random, but a pressure vote is anything but random.

chamber's defence looks more like honest town than buddying scum to me. Doesn't mean el simo's not scum though.

post feels like you have more information than i do

[Furcolow]

Sora, don't vote me based on your own lack of understanding. I am saying the act of voting was random, not the target of the vote. These are two separate actions all together. What you are suggesting is that I chose a random person to vote on, what I actually said was that the decision to cast a vote was random. The point of making this statement was to let people know that I wasn't voting him based on the previously mentioned accusations, regardless of the fact that I agreed with said accusations.

What Umbrages backtrack has to do with ortiz lie, or "misunderstanding" I don't know, but my vote is on ortiz because I want it there and not on Umbrage. Why is this scummy? If it's not, why do you mention it?

And that isn't a good enough answer. How did I bandwagon? How is this different to a good bandwagon? Why are some bandwagons bad and others good? Explain yourself properly please. These questions go to Umbrage as well as he still hasn't answered me either.

Still want Admirals answer too.

geez el simo is good
he has already pegged the same two guys
and i thought

i

was a good player

[Furcolow]

unvote: Umbrage

I just made another ranting post about how you don't understand, and then noticed at the bottom of the post you said, "I just don't what to think," which implies I'm right and you don't understand, I guess that can be townie motivation.

Vote: Ortiz

NO NO NO NO NO
YOU HAD IT
WHY DID YOU UNVOTE?
FFS

[diddin]

Votecount

ortiz1193 (2) Cyberbob, TheLonging,
el simo (4) Umbrage, ThAdmiral, sorasgoof, Olinea
ThAdmiral (0)
Furcolow (0)
Umbrage (2) chamber, Furcolow
chamber (0)
sorasgoof (0)
Nicodemus (0)
Olinea (1) ThirdKoopa,
Cyberbob (0)
Thirdkoopa (0)
TheLonging (0)
Not Voting (3)Nicodemus, ortiz1193, el simo

It is now day one. With 12 Alive, it takes 7 to lynch and 6 to no lynch. Deadline is Wednesday, January 5 at 10:41 AM Central Time.

I appreciate the activity but I request that you do not spam the thread, Furcolow.

[Furcolow]

I just don't believe you.

vote: el simo

So what do you believe?

I believe there is a discrepancy between what you are saying and what you have done. I think that you have been backed in to a corner by the early vote and are scrambling.

5 posts in a row doesn't help either, bro.

I don't believe there is a discrepancy in what he has said whatsoever. He decided to randomly vote to put some pressure on someone who was behaving erratically. It was pro-town from my eyes, but I guess my vision of what is correct and pro-town is different from most people's.

If you dislike 5 posts in a row you must be hating my current catchup style, but i don't really care, because i'm fairly certain i don't have to be nice to you and convince you i'm town and to not vote me later on in the game (like in a lylo scenario where we are both town) because you are scum.

i see no other reason for you not having wagonned umbrage, or for your actions on the bottom of page 5
funny you said 5 posts in a row. nice using that number for me. i wonder if that's what made me remember you on page 5

you asked umbrage to explain the picture
you thissed umbrage around page 4 when you had your vote on him
you then sheeped umbrage's vote on the bottom of page 5 which wasn't even your alls case...
it wasn't a scum case at all, it was a town case (from my eyes) by ortiz... pretty sure both ortiz and el simo are town, and umbrage and thadmiral are scum.



@diddin, i am catching up, modkill me if you wish

[el simo]

Olinea, purge through the thread again. You've only just revived old points that have already been answered.

I revived old points detailing when you made these conflicing statements.

Again, old points that have already been answered, ie things that people brought and things we have discussed. My vote was unrelated to the previous two votes as it was not on Umbrage for the same reasons - I wasn't voting him because he was stifling discussion. It being the third vote doesn't make it related to the two before it.

Furcolow, I'm going to give you some advice to make it easier for us to follow you. Don't post as you read, when you read and find something worth noting, take the number of the post down, make a note of, continue reading. Then when you've finished take your notes compile them into one post and make a case on your targets, preferably in a chronological and coherent manner. This way you'll seem less like the town crazy and more like an active scum hunting player - ie more people are likely to listen to you.

[Furcolow]

ive done that on my alt
i dont do that on this
this is my VI account
get over it

[Furcolow]

also, diddin, apologies... it is your thread after all
this is mafiascum, though, and i don't see ANY WARNINGS FOR SPAMMING EVER.

[el simo]

Fur you claim you want to get better but then you ignore our advice. We're trying to help, well I am.

[Furcolow]

Town

:
Furcolow
chamber
Olinea
sorasgoof

Leaning

town

:
el simo
ortiz1193

Null/

Neutral

:
Nicodemus
Thirdkoopa
TheLonging

Leaning

scum

:
Cyberbob

Scum!!!!!!!!:

ThAdmiral
Umbrage

[Furcolow]

also, REALLY want to hear more from thirdkoopa

[Umbrage]

OH MY GOD FURCOLOW SAID BEFORE HE READ THE FREAKING THREAD THAT HE THOUGH I WAS SCUM AND EL SIMO WAS TOWN AND OH MY GOD OH MY GOD HE HAS THE SAME OPINION AFTER READING THE THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT A BIG FUCKING SURPRISE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Let's lynch these clowns already. The only thing that could possibly sway my opinion of them is a Mason claim.

[el simo]

Umbrage, what evidence do you have to suggest Furcolow is scum?

[diddin]

It was just a personal request Furc. It doesn't count as a strike towards a modkill.

[ortiz1193]

Furcolow, you can post in the same style, just open each quote in a new tab, copy each quote to a reply page, and you can respond to all of them in one post.
---
Aside from the annoying posting style, Furc's content seems solid - I agree with his reads for the most part.
---
Umbrage: It wasn't really a sudden turnaround, I just had an epiphany and understood what el simo was saying.
---
Those voting el simo: Look at it this way, what is the scum motivation for him lying? I don't see his play as being more likely to come from scum than town.
---
#214 is a major . What's with the overreaction? And to repeat el simo, how do you get furcolow scum out of his play so far? Just because he's voting you? His play seems pretty town-sided to me.
---
Looking back at Umbrage's ISO.

The scummiest players so far are ThAdmiral and Cyberbob. They come in, vote un-randomly, and disappear. Don't like.

Also, people shouldn't have to explain their random votes. That's because they are random.

I added the part about disappearing because you can throw down a serious vote in RVS, you just have to be around to follow it up. I didn't like the way you just left after laying down a vote that appeared to be not part of RVS. It's like pulling the fire alarm and running away.

vote Umbrage

- RVS Contradiction (seems similar to the reason he's been going after el simo), + #214 is a mega scummy post + Umbrage still pushing hard on el simo (slight town read, and a town read in Furcolow) makes Umbrage scum.

[el simo]

I can't say I disagree with ortiz. Pushing a Furcolow wagon seems to me like an easy mislynch for scum day 2 (he certainly was in our last game). He has literally done nothing other than disagree with Umbrage and Umbrage is already calling for his lynch.

And as ortiz pointed out, I've always maintained back peddling and inconsistent logic to be scum scummy. There isn't really a reason why a townie would contradict himself, they don't have to make up nonsense to try and lynch people.

This and his constant pushing of my wagon over such absurd reasons leans me towards a

vote: Umbrage.

Not sure what I think of Admiral yet, he isn't posting much. Don't know how I feel about Furcolows random vote over wagon pushing, I'd need a good meta on him to make a judgement on that.

Still waiting on Sora, Umbrage and Admiral to answer me.

[sorasgoof]

Still waiting on Sora, Umbrage and Admiral to answer me.

Every time I see you say this, it makes me want to wait a little longer. Pestering me is not going to get me to answer your questions. I'm not the kind of person who answers every single little question like I'm a teacher or something, whether I'm town, mafia, or third party. Sorry.

I already answered you anyway. Not satisfied with the answer? Read a little harder; it answers your question. Did you think it was confusing? Huh, so was your whole fiasco over random voting/bandwagoning/whatever.

That being said, I can sort of see where you were coming from with the random thing, not that I like the way you went about it/worded it/(un)intentionally misled. I'm going to

unvote

for now.

[el simo]

Your answer provoked more questions sora. I'm not trying to make you contradict yourself I'm trying to get your understanding on bandwagons so that if I need to educate you on the subject matter I can do so, as well as defend myself from implied accusations.

[sorasgoof]

Your answer provoked more questions sora. I'm not trying to make you contradict yourself I'm trying to get your understanding on bandwagons so that if I need to educate you on the subject matter I can do so, as well as defend myself from implied accusations.

To me, a bad bandwagon is when someone votes for little to no reasoning or for a lot of reasons that are obviously bullshit. Or bandwagons that look suspicious under the circumstances, such as your vote. To me, it truthfully looked like you were saying you were picking a random target and it happened to be the largest bandwagon at the time (I think).

A good bandwagon, in my opinion, is one that furthers the game positively, such as garnering discussion, votes that have solid reasoning behind them, or any other helpful motivation (as far as I can tell). Based on your explanation, your vote was a good bandwagon in my eyes, but the way I saw it, it was a bad bandwagon.

Is that good enough? I don't know what else to say.

[sorasgoof]

EBWOP: Maybe I should look for bad bandwagons as a starting place for finding scum based on my own definition which I've put into concrete words for the first time just now.

[Thirdkoopa]

k done with my re-read

El Simo and Umbrage both seem odd to me right now but what's the full case on El Simo summed up? I'm seeing more of something in umbrage now unlike before so I'll

Vote: Umbrage

- Will unvote if he gets too close to a lock without a claim. Anything I say pretty much comes across as a repeat with this case but tl;dr: mostly scummy voting patterns and trying too hard to blend in.

Never really got this but what's the case on Ortiz?

Where's TL, for that matter? I'm probably a bit tired and missed a few things.

I'll start to at least talk more but all these quote wars and posts just end up giving me more questions than solving questions this game. Things seems to be more settle now in my eyes so at least I'll be able to make a few more posts.

[Cyberbob]

this is my VI account
get over it

Unvote, Vote: Furcolow