Open 269: Multirole Mafia: Over. Town Win

[Akira]

Soo...shouldn't you vote?

[Chronopie]

Prodding chkflip again, if he fails to post within 24 hours, he will be replaced.

No one else needs prodding at this time.

[andrew94]

chkflip hasnt posted in all his games...

[ThAdmiral]

I've been meaning to post something more meaningful for a few days and haven't had time, but do today! Basically I feel like akira has been scummier than chkflip. Here's why:

Both talk about andrew at the start. In fact they are both against lynching andrew but for different reasons.
Chkflip:

I just finished a game where all his 'gut' reads were spot on. Finished a newbgame some time back where he whooped my ass with a gambit. So, to say the least, I don't support an andrew PL as a) I don't support PL's period, and b) we can easily attribute him to being townie/scummy by the way he acts... it just takes a VI filter.

Defensive? I'm anti-PL as it is, they're simply too anti-town for my liking. I, personally, have never seen a situation that gained for the town from a policy lynch. So it's with that in mind that I say "hey, let's at least give him a chance first"; however, that doesn't mean I like the guy's playstyle any more than anyone else who's played with him. I'm not psychic (not to mention the fact that we're only on page 3), so I couldn't give you an exact figure, but there's just a certain angle he takes when he's scum. Not necessarily that his whole demeanor is different or his opinion flip-flops or anything over the top like that, it's moreso his stance when being put under pressure.

Though that's a common tell, don't you think?

Akira:

It's actually pretty easy to recognize a scummy andrew from a town andrew. Let's have a long day and we'll soon be able to meta him.

As I said in my last post, I believe andrew to be easy to read. It's as chkflip says.
I've only played one game with him, but it was enough to classify him as easily readable in the right circumstances. And these circumstances won't appear on page 3, that's for sure.

Well it sure sounds like you have enough experience with andrew to make a reliable call on that.

Not me alone, I guess it was other players telling me about andrew's behavior which made me sure about it.

Chkflip has a pretty strong reasoning for not wanting to lynch andrew, i.e. that he can be quite effective as town and that he is against policy lynches no matter what because he has never seen them help the town. Furthermore he believes andrew can be read as town or scum depending on his playstyle.
Akira also says that he believes andrew can be read as town or scum depending on his playstyle, however when he is called on it he says that he claimed this because of one game's experience with andrew, and then when called on this further he says it was only because of other people's reading of andrew's playstyle rather than his own.
Chkflip's reasoning makes sense, akira's is quite a bit more flimsy. I'm not sure why he would want to defend andrew but it could be for a number of reasons. If andrew is town he could be getting town points for defending him, or even be setting him up as an easy lynch later on. If andrew is scum then it would be obvious why he wouldn't want him to be policy lynched.

Akira's vote on chess is bad too:

chesskid is probably scum, so yeah.
VOTE: chesskid

This was all he said on why he was voting chess, and he kept his vote on him the entire day because of this.

Admittedly chkflip's vote on jessesheffield isn't much better, but at least he has something resembling a reason:

I'm not going to pretend like I have anything to add here. The only thing that strikes out to me is that chesskid seems like a total jag and I doubt I'll be listening to anything he has to say.

I'm not going to pretend like I don't think this is scum trying to float through the first few pages.

VOTE: JesseSheffield

[andrew94]

vote akira

[Akira]

Regarding chesskid, I thought I wouldn't have needed to state a reason after all his weird behavior. I've seen people do it all the time and thought this was one of those situations where the vote was 'self-explanatory'.
I should've drawn a line between scumminess and just plain VI.

And regarding andrew, what can I say? I already admitted that it wasn't an opinion I formed up on my own. I don't see why you'd want to pull that out again.

[ThAdmiral]

Regarding chesskid, I thought I wouldn't have needed to state a reason after all his weird behavior. I've seen people do it all the time and thought this was one of those situations where the vote was 'self-explanatory'.
I should've drawn a line between scumminess and just plain VI.

Can you explain now what was scummy about what he was doing. In particular what was the scum motivation for playing the way he was playing?

[drmyshottyizsik]

Soo...shouldn't you vote?

SO SCUMMY!!!!!!!!!

[Chevre]

drmyshottyizsik, shouldn't you be revealing your insight on the game? It appears you DO have the opportunity to post.

[implosion]

SA's analysis is interesting. I agree with most of it - I disagree with:

Vote: ThAdmiral

His avatar actually intimidates me. That's a first.

Town points to thad. This doesn't look like a post you'd make to your scumbuddy.

It's an RVS vote, so I don't really see how it gives townpoints since it could easily be distancing.

Also, I disagree that the scumteam could be chkflip/Smash/drmy, considering that we already have one dead scum.

Chkflip is being entirely too defensive of Andrew.

chesskid is being entirely too aggressive on Andrew.

The Bus Driver Organization looks the scummiest thus far.

'Chevre' looks entirely too much like 'chévere' which means 'great' or 'fantastic' in Spanish.

This post makes me think that one out of Chk/Chevre is scum, because this just seems like the kind of post where he'd mention

at least

one scumbuddy. Just psychologically, I doubt a scum member would feel comfortable just mentioning 3 town in a post like this. I'd also think it's likely that one of the two is town, because again psychologically it'd seem more likely not to mention both scumbuddies.

The other time when Chaotic mentions Chkflip has already been explained by SA and Akira, and I agree with that as well. So Chkflip today, Chevre if he flips town makes the most sense.

Not sure about Akira right now.

[implosion]

Whoops, forgot to VOTE: Chkflip

[drmyshottyizsik]

/confirm

Hey there andrew.

Blatant Buddying!
+1 Scum point

It's actually pretty easy to recognize a scummy andrew from a town andrew. Let's have a long day and we'll soon be able to meta him.

Setting up a fall back in case Andrew get to scummy.
+2 Scum point

As I said in my last post, I believe andrew to be easy to read. It's as chkflip says.
I've only played one game with him, but it was enough to classify him as easily readable in the right circumstances. And these circumstances won't appear on page 3, that's for sure.

chesskid is probably scum, so yeah.
VOTE: chesskid

Votes with no real reason +1 scum points
Still tries to justify not lynch andrew, wants him to live later in the game "so we can meta him then".

Well it sure sounds like you have enough experience with andrew to make a reliable call on that.

Not me alone, I guess it was other players telling me about andrew's behavior which made me sure about it.

@chesskid: Any reason why you chose me specifically? You could have had an easier time with someone who already has a vote.

Focuses on making sure that Andrew isn't PL'd. Nothing wrong with that, but he over does it. +1 scum buddy point

@chesskid: So there is a reason? In that case, tell me why you think I'm scummy or your vote will have no meaning at all.

Well put, Jesse.

Hypocrisy! +3 scum points

Sleepless should post more, and I agree with what ThAdmiral said regarding him, as much as I like being called town (jk it doesn't mean anything without a reason).
VOTE: Sleepless

Also, the only thing I know about shotty is that I'm lucky to have never met him in a game yet. Is he an andrew-like VI?

Just piggy backs other peoples thought, doesn't give a real reason for voting
+4 Scum points

Whoops I didn't mean to call shotty a VI, more like just I.

Personal insult, maybe an atempt at AtE(since not everyone likes me). +1 scum point

Soo...shouldn't you vote?

I hate when people try to shepard people or what not
+.5 scum points

Regarding chesskid, I thought I wouldn't have needed to state a reason after all his weird behavior. I've seen people do it all the time and thought this was one of those situations where the vote was 'self-explanatory'.
I should've drawn a line between scumminess and just plain VI.

And regarding andrew, what can I say? I already admitted that it wasn't an opinion I formed up on my own. I don't see why you'd want to pull that out again.

Chesskid3 is wierd, but wierd != scummy!!!! You need to give reasons yes!!!
+2 Scum points



Ok so 15.5 scum points in 11 post, I think that warrants my vote.
I only found 2 of his posts not scummy :\

unvote
Confirm Vote Akira

[Akira]

Regarding chesskid, I thought I wouldn't have needed to state a reason after all his weird behavior. I've seen people do it all the time and thought this was one of those situations where the vote was 'self-explanatory'.
I should've drawn a line between scumminess and just plain VI.

Can you explain now what was scummy about what he was doing. In particular what was the scum motivation for playing the way he was playing?

Well, trying to push an easy lynch onto andrew was the main scummy thing. The rest was not contributing to the scumhunt, and the whole 'pressure' thing on me. The last two only qualify as weird behavior, not something scum would do more than town, so like I said I should've drawn a line between scumminess and just plain VI to distinguish the two.
Calling those two actions of his scummy was a mistake.

shotty, I'll get to my explanation tomorrow. All I can say is it looks like you're pretty biased toward finding what you wanted to find in my posts.

[drmyshottyizsik]

I couldn't find it if it wasn't there!

[chkflip]

Yeah, sorry about that. Lost internets but now it's returned. So here I am. I'll respond to everything in due course.

[andrew94]

dude drmyshottyizsik answer my question that you said you would answer after your 'homework'

[drmyshottyizsik]

Andrew they were just the people who seemed slightly scummy Akira is the main one, and I've listed reasons

[andrew94]

no i wanna know y u have the same suspect list as me

[drmyshottyizsik]

because they are who I thought was kinda scummy

[andrew94]

EXACT SAME LIST AS ME

[drmyshottyizsik]

ya and.....?

[chkflip]

Shotty, he's calling you a sheep/parrot.

Andrew, he doesn't have any

other

points that you don't reference?

[andrew94]

i dont get what your saying

[drmyshottyizsik]

I don't either

[chkflip]

Well certainly he could find them scummy for reasons different than you, thus not being a parrot/sheep?