Blackest Night Mafia (GAME OVER!)

[Andrius]

Hey Kdub, did we ever get a N3 action out of you? Or was there a reason for you not claiming?

I understand where you are coming. You have to be sceptical. That said I think NoPoint’s claim of Hider who CANNOT be targeted by anything if he hides and does NOT die after hiding behind scum is comically bad.

But his role and MY role are direct contradictions to each other.

I actually clicked the flailandfail.com link. Its broken.

I Hope you can get confirmed soon MoI. It'd be nice if one of Kdub or I lived to see tomorrow *hinthint*, as even if I die it shouldn't be too hard for you guys to figure out what I've been up to for the last few nights.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I actually clicked the flailandfail.com link. Its broken.

Lulz. It isn't an actual site. I was just being funny and didn't bother to correct MS when it made it an actual link.

[Kast]

Not going to be around for the weekend. At this point everything looks to hinge on Andy's decision. If you decide to lynch me, give me a chance to share final thoughts on Monday.

If anyone has questions, I'll get to them Monday.

Also @Kdub/Andy-an alternative for proving myself; send a vig kill at me and I'll redirect it to your designated target. If I'm lying, you'll kill me (you pick the vig).

There's several probable scum:
If it's 4x per color, then AGM, one of {Kast, MoI}, and one of {KageLord, NPIAU} are scum.

My flip would finger MoI

NPIAU's Hider claim interaction with Vi marks him as potential scum. It also conflicts with MoI.
KageLord claiming Yellow-pick says he is either Yellow or lying.
Tans Unlynchable + Odd Vig conflicts with Blue Brother making town vigs. Andy's PR also indicated Tans scum
KK claiming non-Blackest Night character. Also claiming to have a ring when the claimed character is not a lantern and does not have a ring.

We've got 1 Red, 1 Orange, 2 Yellows, and potentially 1 Black.
Red- probable AGM, Kage, or KK
Orange- probable NPIAU, MoI, or Tans
Yellow- probable MoI, Tans, or Kage
Black- probable KK or AGM

@Dana-

Removing your comment essentially protects KK's false claim. I can see if you're concerned that your comment makes KK's false claim less plausible, however, consider a parallel, if players are believing a false claim thanks to a mod error (ie. player claims double voter based on an incorrect vote count), you'd still have to correct that vote count and that would directly screw over the false claiming player. Using Tomar Re, instead of using an appropriate character for the series was an error that you already publicly stated (rightly so, since it misleads players who are less familiar with the flavor). The comment didn't directly impact the game and doesn't directly affect KK. But redacting it while KK is using that redaction as support for his implausible fake claim...that's a bit not so cool and more of a direct impact...

[Andrius]

Also @Kdub/Andy-an alternative for proving myself; send a vig kill at me and I'll redirect it to your designated target. If I'm lying, you'll kill me (you pick the vig).

You clearly don't understand how we work, and I'm pretty sure we've explained the Vig thing well enough.

There's several probable scum:
If it's 4x per color, then AGM, one of {Kast, MoI},

You forgot about Stove.

NPIAU's Hider claim interaction with Vi marks him as potential scum. It also conflicts with MoI.

And mine. I can't explain why without at least crumbing my actual role (which I've done before), but Hider is WEAK.

[AlmasterGM]

I like how you are so obsessed with making me RED because you are RED and you need that read to go away.

I'll be the one LULZING later when you flip RED.

Wow, AGM has been visiting http://www.flailandfail.com! Not a single person has a Red read on me. Way to continue to fulfil the mindless part of the Red ‘mindless rage’.

I certainly can’t wait to endgame when I can throw this back in your face since you are so clearly wrong and flailing.

In fact you know what you are personifying? Scum Panic!!

\
I like how you cut out the line from my quote where I said "show me the case and I'll respond." Do you not want me to respond, or something?

And I admit to flailing around - it's because I don't know WTF is going on and 1) people keep saying, "setup spec says your scum," which I don't know how to respond to other than with a "um, no" and 2) MoI keeps referencing this invisible case and complaining I'm ignoring it, but then he ignores my request to find the case.

[MagnaofIllusion]

First posting that I probably will have little access this weekend, so consider me V/LA until Monday.

--

I like how you cut out the line from my quote where I said "show me the case and I'll respond." Do you not want me to respond, or something?

Lol. If I didn’t want you to respond I would not have made the response at 1740 that destroyed your ‘he’s lurking under pressure’ attack. Really this is just lazy bad on your part. It’s not my job to be your servant and present everything to you on demand. I wrote it in the first place for a reason. Read the thread.

I presented it to you once before. You ignored it. I call you out on it and you act like my 6 year old (I can’t find it find it for me). Then you proceed to pretend that I never did so in the first place and try to imply it is scummy.

And I admit to flailing around - it's because I don't know WTF is going on and 1) people keep saying, "setup spec says your scum," which I don't know how to respond to other than with a "um, no" and 2) MoI keeps referencing this invisible case and complaining I'm ignoring it, but then he ignores my request to find the case.

Translation

– Poor little AGM I’m so lost and not able to understand why people are calling me Red Scum. Mean old MoI keeps calling me scum. Leave me be so I can drink your heart blood.

Seriously the case on you isn’t invisible.

1. You aren’t scum-hunting but cruising trying to avoid the radar. You've only 'perked up' when your name suddenly is on the firing line.
2. You played to your self-professed scum meta by bussing Sensfan as your only significant vote and suspicion all game.
3. Your attacks have gotten progressively scummier as the days have gone on.

Not very hard at all to understand.

[Kdub]

Kast, I already said you can assume our actions can't be redirected. Even if you were telling the truth, you couldn't prove it.

Andy:
I wasn't planning to claim, but I think you (and a couple others I think) already know what my N3 action was. Any new thoughts from your reread? I don't really have anything else to discuss today.

[Andrius]

I haven't started the reread, actually. I've been distracted all day. :S

Again, I echo Kdub in the essence that you can't assume our actions can be redirected... but could they be blocked? Interesting thought there.
OH NEVER MIND I KNOW WHAT YOU DID LOL I AM DUMB AS HELL. XDDD

[The Stove]

I posted a massive wall in our QT, that a lot of it can be cut down because it was stream of conciousness posting.

Red made a very good point to spread their votes out during D1. Look at Zito's analysis - the flipped reds are never on top of each other. I think that rules out Tans as red and Kdub, who we don't have a scumread on atm anyways. Andrius is also unlikely red, in the event that he is scum pre-recruiter shenanigans (highly unlikely), because he was driving between the two red wagons at various points during D1 (Gud/Sens). You don't set up to bus two separate partners in ANY day as scum - you try and get 1 lynched or none. Trust me on that one. Kage opposes red wagons vehemently throughout their tenure, while getting on the xvart and Kats wagons at awkward times. Also, I'd guess Almaster isn't red, because the last person I'd think anyone would want to bus on their team is the bomb, as they have a good chance of doing some damage.

Tans strikes me as yellow scum due to PoE of red scum, but also due to his involvement on the Kdub wagon, which I'm not sure I remember why it got so far ahead, but there is WAY too much town influence on that wagon already, and adding Tans-town really doesn't add up. The biggest hitch to Tans-yellow, which really doesn't count as it's almost completely justifiable, is that Kats started up on Tans, but it could've easily been some light distancing, as Kats pushes the Kdub wagon past the Tans wagon when push comes to shove, and when the Kdub wagon fizzles out, pushes the Sens wagon so it is ahead of Tans as well. Tans doesn't oppose the Kats wagon, and is fourth onto it, but could have very easily foreseen the coming lynch once Starbuck claimed what she did and simply attempted to apply some distance between the two of them.

Other than that, nailing yellow down via pattern voting of any kind is pretty sketchy at best. MoI is pushing the counterwagon to almost every yellow wagon, save when Tans is up for the lynch.

I'd put yellow in one of Kage/MoI/Tans. Kage could flip either scum and it wouldn't shock me, but he does look to fit the profle of a yellow scum, avoiding any real wagons D1, but then hopping on Kats at the point of inevitability and onto xvart a bit earlier, but that wagon was already pretty much announced from D2->D3 so there could've been some prep there.

I'm slightly buying into the Andrius theory of "AGM Black Recruiter", not because of the whole "OMG N3" but more because Almasters game has been VERY under the radar this entire time, fitting the way you'd want to behave if you're part of an unknown faction at this point.

Andrius - I don't think Kast forgot us. Re-read the end of D2. For funsies. Starbuck, specifically.

[The Stove]

Also - we feel best course of action is lynching among the yellow candidates and letting "fireworks take care of our other problems tonight." We've explained the theory before.

[The Stove]

^^^^

-AGar

[danakillsu]

@ Kast
Suffice it to say the redaction was not my idea. Therefore, if players feel it impacts the game, I will state it again. I obviously had no idea that Tomar-Re was dead by the time of the events of Blackest Night. I do not know the source material PERFECTLY, and just like anyone else, I can make mistakes.

[Dekes]

Posting from phone. Just a heads up, won't be able to post properly for another ~24 hours.

[nopointinactingup]

Tans is obv-scum and there's a small chance he's not yellow from what he is saying (Blac, Orange??). MOI might also not be his partner-in-law but I'll be keeping a grizzly eye on him. I agree with Stove dude about getting yellow lynched and sick of justifying for those people calling me that yucky color Orange. Andy or Kast might be Blac but it is mostly gut feeling.

[The Stove]

@ Kast
Suffice it to say the redaction was not my idea. Therefore, if players feel it impacts the game, I will state it again. I obviously had no idea that Tomar-Re was dead by the time of the events of Blackest Night. I do not know the source material PERFECTLY, and just like anyone else, I can make mistakes.

I'm requesting one of our flavor gurus to explain how this impacts the game. I'm not sure if I'm getting anything from it. Because I read up some, and as far as I read, Plum's dude is actually a black lantern until like.. the end of shit.

So I feel like I know nothing.

[The Stove]

^^

AGar

[nopointinactingup]

don't worry AGar. I know nothing (literally) ^^

[danakillsu]

I'm just going to mass prod, since it's been almost 24 hours since ANYONE posted.

[Kublai Khan]

Also - we feel best course of action is lynching among the yellow candidates and letting "fireworks take care of our other problems tonight." We've explained the theory before.

Yeah, that theory is the major reason why I think you're recruited. Eliminating 1 of the yellows and crossing your fingers and hoping for a mass bloodbath cross-kills event is the absolute worst strategy for town at this point in the game. We have to take the reins and eliminate one of our fractured enemies. Especially an enemy that can't grow.

Your attitude of "Let's ignore that ever-growing cult problem and hope it just takes care of itself and goes away" isn't a good one. At all. The killing scum groups are going to WIFOM mind-fuck their way into not killing who we want them to kill. The town needs to eliminate the worst problem first with our ability to lynch, then pick out the worst problem out of what's left alive tomorrow.

P-Edit: Yeah, this game is stagnating. Let's lynch Kast.

[KageLord]

We have to take the reins and eliminate one of our fractured enemies. Especially an enemy that can't grow.

What? Shouldn't we, if at all possible, eliminate our enemy that

can

grow (i.e. black)? Of course, eliminating orange or red wouldn't be bad either, but the best scenario for us today is lynching black.

Andy, you probably talked about this already, but do you still think tans is sure scum if you weren't RBed?

[Kdub]

Responding to prod. Just waiting for the go-ahead from Andy. I'm down for either a Kast or tans lynch, with the provision that the other get vigged tonight.

Kage, Andy's action is, for all intents and purposes, unblockable. tans is scum.

[Kublai Khan]

We have to take the reins and eliminate one of our fractured enemies. Especially an enemy that can't grow.

What? Shouldn't we, if at all possible, eliminate our enemy that

can

grow (i.e. black)? Of course, eliminating orange or red wouldn't be bad either, but the best scenario for us today is lynching black.

Er, yeah.. That's exactly what I meant. We should aim to eliminate Black.

[Dekes]

I'm caught up now. I still think Kast is our best bet today.

Especially now that I'm having second thoughts about nipau. Yes, I know his claim is whacky as hell and his playing so bad he should be punished for it. But the main thing that's bugging me is his N1 claim. If he was action immune instead of hider why would he claim he hid behind Vi? That was sketchy as hell back then and he got a lot of heat for it but it is explainable after Vi's role got revealed. But unless he knew Vi's role why would he take such a big risk in lying if he could've claimed some other target easily? Maybe this was mentioned in one of the cases against nipau (MoI?) and maybe I'm just paranoid, I don't know.
Anyway, tans should get killed tonight. If he isn't orange, I guess I will settle for nipau then.


Kage, who is black then? You weren't exactly blackhunting today...or scumhunting at all except for that alibi-threat against nipau. Don't like your quietness at all today with all the black shenanigans going on. In the improbable event Kast doesn't flip black, scum and vigs should take a look this way.

Andy, how's the reread going?

[tanstalas]

Prod received. I have nothing new to say at this point. You either believe me when I say I am green and I can't be lynched or you don't. If you think I am yellow you shouldn't be voting for me since a red, black or orange lynch would be the optimal choice. I agree with the statement that lynching any scum is usually good play, however in the situation that town find themselves in now - not taking out a kill tonight would not be good. KK summed up the case for me nicely in 1793.

[Andrius]

KageLord, my action is 100% reliable if I wasn't RB'd.
And due to the nature of our actions, I'm skeptical if a RB can even affect me.
But, who knows?

Reading today. It'll happen. Tomorrow was a waste of a day for me. xD Sat around and didn't do much. lol