Mafia 124 - Dilemma Mafia (Day 6)

[Llamarble]

I find quicklynching me to be the move of scared scum.

Oh really? I find writing in all caps to be the move of scared scum. Case in point.

@DLG: WHY WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO ACCEPT THE LYNCH OF ANY OTHER PLAYER THAN ONE YOU CAUGHT LYING? YOUR PLAY IS CEASING TO MAKE SENSE FROM A TOWN PERSPECTIVE. AND WE HAVE A WEEK LEFT AND I HAVE PLENTY LEFT TO SAY, SO NOBODY HAMMER ME WITHOUT AT LEAST GIVING ME TIME TO TELL YOU WHO ALL THE SCUM ARE.

ALSO RESPOND TO MY CASE ON BIDDERSKINS; IT'S EASILY THE STRONGEST PRESENTED AGAINST ANYONE SO WHY ARE YOU IGNORING IT?

If you have to write in all caps in order for people to pay attention to your substance, then that must mean you don't have much substance. Oh, and we can see how your case on me is the strongest of anybody with all the people jumping on my bandwagon. [/sarcasm]

Do you know why it is weak? Because it is birthed from desperate scum and built on a contradiction. You say that you don't like my case on DBE, then you say that you find Darla to be scummy. Then you vote for me and call me the scummiest player around. You think that Darla is scummy and yet you think that the main pusher of the Darla wagon [me] is scum. Your default stance on Darla is that she is town, and yet when you look back at her posts, you realize that she's been posting scummy. So you panic because she's your partner and you chainsaw me.

Also...

We have more time and as I have only had a couple of days to get caught up I find quicklynching me to be the move of scared scum. Yosarian was talking about wagon growth speeds; this one on me has been TURBOSPEEDY as soon as I pointed out bidderskins as scum.

and yet in the same post...

I'm shouting that we should lynch Bidderskins because I am confident I have caught scum and I have about a week to convince a whole town whom I just met and don't particularly trust me yet.

Look who's wanting a speedlynch now. And keep in mind that your player slot has been scummy from very early on. I'm not sure if he ever got a real proper wagon on him, but there have been people voting for him for pretty much the entire day. The reason for the speedy wagon is that your play has been especially scummy lately.

Okay, not inside your quote anymore. I specifically disliked BubB's logic, which discussed DBE's hesitancy with her vote and moving around, both of which seemed perfectly reasonable behaviors from town. There is a HUGE difference between tunneling somebody all day until a near lynch with weak reasoning and simply expressing suspicion. My reasoning was based on a general lack of scumhunting, which is a more reliable tell since the primary difference between town and scum is that the town is actually looking for scum, but I ended up deciding she had given off enough sincerity/towntells and the wagon on her was scummy enough that Bub is a vastly better lynch.

Wait, what? So now you think DBE is town? But didn't you say this:

Huh, maybe I was totally wrong on my first pass and Darla is actually scum. I don't see much attempt to figure out who the scum are coming from her; she seems to care more about convincing others not to vote her.

What's with the rapid swings man?

Caps lock is not a scumtell. Have a look at some games with Fate in them.
"PEOPLE AREN'T VOTING ME SO THE CASE MUST BE WEAK HERPADERPA" IS HORRIBLE REASONING. CLEARLY THE EARTH IS 4000 YEARS OLD.
I don't think DBE is scum. On my second readthrough I found her lack of content scummy-ambiguous, then read some more the next afternoon and decided she was still town and Bub was scum.
QUICKHAMMERING ME IS NOT THE SAME THING AS LYNCHING YOU SOMETIME BEFORE THE DEADLINE YOU MISREPPING SCUM.

[DLG]

Lawl @ DLG "SOMEBODY QUICKHAMMER PLEASEPLEASEPLEASE BEFORE HE FINDS US ALL SO I CAN LYNCH YOU REAL EASY TOMORROW HEHEHE"

Everyone recognizes that

you

have only been in the game a couple of days. Your slot, however, has been here all along. Quit trying to blur the line. Plenty of time has passed for reads to be solid enough for a lynch. No one is asking for a quickhammer play. As you, yourself pointed out

I've produced more content in 3 days than most players in this entire game. Why do you want to lynch me again?

Your reliance on an invalid defense of players trying to quickhammer is scummy. The contradiction between you posting a significant amount of content and claiming players are trying to quickhammer you is scummy. I want to lynch you because you and your slot look scummy enough to justify doing it.

[CryMeARiver]

I've read it, I feel that to be an accomplishment with this pounding headache, but I'm not doing a post by post analysis like I had started to do.

Scum

Ender's Slot, now Llarmable
Darla
Bobsnox

Null

Albert's slot, now Flinter (leaning scum)
Pom's slot, now Fishy
Brokenscraps (has remarkably flown under my radar)
Nikanor (leaning scum)
MoreWhisky (leaning scum)

Town

DLG
Jahudo
Bub
FinalFires
Yos (leaning null)

Vote: Lla...wait just checked vote count and this is a hammer. I'm comfortable with a hammer after a) agreement from the town b) a non-pr claim

[Bub Bidderskins]

Llamarble, claim now.

Oh, and by the way, nice job "destroying" my post.

I don't think DBE is scum. On my second readthrough I found her lack of content scummy-ambiguous, then read some more the next afternoon and decided she was still town and Bub was scum.

Liar, liar. You added me to your "scum pile" with your second content post of the game, right after you said Darla "looked town" and right before you said that Darla looked like scum. Also:

I've produced more content in 3 days than most players in this entire game. Why do you want to lynch me again?

Pro-tip: If you have to

say

that you've produced a lot of content, then that probably means you haven't produced a lot of content. Cornered scum at it's worst. And you should really stop using caps, it's not good internet manners you know...

[CryMeARiver]

Llamarble, claim now.

Oh, and by the way, nice job "destroying" my post.

I don't think DBE is scum. On my second readthrough I found her lack of content scummy-ambiguous, then read some more the next afternoon and decided she was still town and Bub was scum.

Liar, liar. You added me to your "scum pile" with your second content post of the game, right after you said Darla "looked town" and right before you said that Darla looked like scum. Also:

I've produced more content in 3 days than most players in this entire game. Why do you want to lynch me again?

Pro-tip: If you have to

say

that you've produced a lot of content, then that probably means you haven't produced a lot of content. Cornered scum at it's worst. And you should really stop using caps, it's not good internet manners you know...

If she doesn't claim within her next post (or by the time I wake up in the morning) I'm hammering. Let it be known to town.

[Llamarble]

Lawl @ DLG "SOMEBODY QUICKHAMMER PLEASEPLEASEPLEASE BEFORE HE FINDS US ALL SO I CAN LYNCH YOU REAL EASY TOMORROW HEHEHE"

Everyone recognizes that

you

have only been in the game a couple of days. Your slot, however, has been here all along. Quit trying to blur the line. Plenty of time has passed for reads to be solid enough for a lynch. No one is asking for a quickhammer play. As you, yourself pointed out

I've produced more content in 3 days than most players in this entire game. Why do you want to lynch me again?

Your reliance on an invalid defense of players trying to quickhammer is scummy. The contradiction between you posting a significant amount of content and claiming players are trying to quickhammer you is scummy. I want to lynch you because you and your slot look scummy enough to justify doing it.

Yes, my slot has been in the game a long time. I however have demanded enough time to read the thread and discuss other players, which you have tried to prevent by hammering within the next day despite the better part of a week being left. There is no protown motivation of any kind for that. This post is a TERRIBLE justification for lynching. I am not "relying on complaining about quickhammers as a defense." I am criticizing the idea because it is bad play. I am defending myself by posting good content and being pro-town and explaining actions that have confused other players.

@CMAR: please read and comment on my case on Bub. I intend to claim only after a good number of responses to it or on Tuesday, whichever comes first. That will still leave 4 days for post-claim discussion. RUSHING THE END OF THE DAY IS PRO-SCUM. Various players haven't even posted a stance on my wagon as it currently stands. Why do you want to let them get away with lurking and producing minimal content?

Posts 0, 1, and 2 of my ISO are before/during my first readthrough. During that readthrough I felt Darla looked town and Bub looked scum. In post 3 I have been doing my second readthrough and am having doubts. In my post 4 I have more thoroughly read Bidderskins and decided he is almost certainly scum. There is no contradiction here; I read through, put down my reads, read through again and had some doubts, and then after doing some more ISOing decided Bub was obvscum. A contradiction would be holding multiple conflicting viewpoints simultaneously, which I have not.

WHY DO YOU PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF HAVING AN INITIAL READ AND UPDATING IT AFTER DOING MORE READING???

BB's latest post is more obvious strongarming garbage. He wants to lynch me because I am using caps, that I have said I am producing content, and because I updated my reads as I read more. The first two of those are obviously null and the third one is a town tell (scum prefer to read all the way through before posting since being honest and thinking aloud might get them or a buddy lynched). HE DOES NOT CARE ABOUT LYNCHING SCUM BECAUSE HE IS SCUM. HIS REASONING FOR HIS BOTH HIS DBE VOTE AND NOW HIS VOTE FOR ME IS TERRIBLE.

Bub is OBVIOUS STRONGARMING SCUM. LOOK AT TH

[Llamarble]

Heh, I started that last paragraph twice while I was in the middle of other paragraphs after getting fired up by Bub's scumtasticism. This town is in bad shape; Only having 2 legitimate D1 wagons to think about tomorrow leaves us with way less information than normal. Bub continues to fail to actually respond to the case against him; This is because my logic against him relies on FACTUALLY TRUE statements unlike his misrepresented garbage against me trying to paint rethinking my reads as contradicting myself. I think I'll summarize my case against Bub concisely and then claim after a couple responses. If you all lynch me today you had better sheep my town corpse tomorrow to a bublynch.

[bobsnox]

CryMeaRiver you really think I'd be bussing my scumbuddies this hard on Day One with no provocation?

why do I keep getting listed as scum with the people I think are scum?

Llamarble - why do you keep saying "let me live longer so I can do some scumhunting!" when your scumhunting consists of repeating previously established arguments?

Time to a) claim and b) come up with better excuses for why you should still be alive.

===[]

[Final Fires]

I'll go ahead and address your Bub case (All the quotes are Bubs, except the first. Bold is llama):

Oh yeah Bub has been trying real hard not to get me lynched... Scum don't care which townie they lynch. D1 they want to be thought of as trying to scumhunt and they want to get a townie lynched. Bub never said anything like "we shouldn't lynch Ender because stuff." Bubscum has been fine with either lynch all along. And you saying I'm probably scum if Bub flips scum is RIDICULOUS. I am voting him because I see his play as scummy, and as has been pointed out I was not even the first to notice his scummy behavior.

1. Bub tunnels his vote on Darla, despite ender's scummy play.
2. He spends a lot of time interrogating darla, practically none on ender.
3. Once things start to look hopeless, he switches his vote to ender.

If you were in my position, and for some reason bub was lynched and flipped scum, wouldn't the logical thing to do be to lynch you next?

I really find whisky to be kind of strange. He has a... unique way of expressing himself that can be dificult to understand. Having said that, his vote on DBE looks really bad. Seriously, you vote for somebody because they say their on the phone? That's a seriously crappy reason to get on the biggest bandwagon.

Painting the bandwagon he supposedly believes is on scum as driven by opportunistic scum.

Scum will jump on bandwagons too. There's nothing wrong with accusing someone on a bandwagon you started as being scum - because they might be. Especially since whisky just voted darla because she was on her phone. I feel like him accusing whisky of voting for darla for scummy reasons was a fair accusation at the time.

If we lynch DBE and she flips town, bobsnox and whisky should be suspects number one and two.

OMG LINING UP LYNCHES MUCH?

This is more a newb question than anything, but what's wrong with lining up lynches? It seems natural that if some people flip a certain way, then we can begin to associate them with how others reacted to them. Especially because if we did lynch DBE and she flipped town, bob and whisky would've been top suspects the next day (alongside bub of course). Plus saying that "we should be suspicious of" isn't the same as lining up a lynch.

I agree that bob looks really scummy if you assume that you are town. Since I do not hold that assumption, I do not feel that bobsnox is very scummy. However, if it so happens that you are town, then bob is extremely scummy. I've already said that. I feel bad repeating myself.

Continuing to build cases against people he supposedly thinks are helping him lynch scum.

Again, I feel like the statement bub made was fair. Assuming darla's innocence lends itself to assuming that bob is at least a little scummy.

My vote will stay on DarlaBlueEyes. I think that she is the most probable scum, and I have already demonstrated why. However there is another reason to lynch her, and that is the fact that we will gain the most knowledge based on her lynch.

I'MMA DISTANCE MYSELF FROM A DARLA TOWNFLIP SOMEMORE.

I don't see how this is distancing at all. In fact, it seems like the opposite to me. He's still trying to get people to switch their vote, and is still providing reasons why people should vote for her.

[bub] is tunneling/voteparked on DBE but doesn't like the other members of the wagon on her.
He has lined up Bobsnox or Whiskey lynches for D2 in the event of a Darlatownflip.
I'm not really impressed by his case on DBE.

Okay, so you said you're not impressed with the case on Darla.

Way to not respond to my case on you

But you also said:

What you said (on your reasoning why to vote him) is pretty much irrefutable. However, voteparking in itself isn't scummy if you really believe the person you're voting for will flip scum. (Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe) Yos has voteparked too, but right now he's not consider scummy. And likewise, some lynches are natural if the lynchee flips a certain way. If darla was town, then I do agree that bob, whiskey, (or bub) lynches be the best choice for day 2. Would you disagree with that?

Especially because I consider whisky and bob scummy, I actually found that more towny than scummy.

So you don't like my case on Darla, but you think she's scum?

As I've said, I replaced into this game a couple of days ago and am still figuring it out. I never thought your case against Darla was good, but I thought she might be scum for lack of scumhunting effort. At this point she looks town and you look like scum

.

There's not really anything to address, but just to be fair I put in here anways .

After some thought, I'm going to

unvote; vote: Llamarble

The Darla wagon seems to have fizzled out, and Llamarble's contradictions are perhaps even worse than ender's questionable play. As for more whisky, I don't know. I want to hear his response to some of the questions directed at him, though.

OSHI HE CAUGHT ME, LYNCH HIM FAST GUYZ! THE WAGON I WAS PUSHING THAT STILL HAS A NUMBER OF VOTES ISN'T GOING ANYWHERE, BUT I DON'T ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT LYNCHING SCUM SO WHATEV! I'MMA FENCESIT ON MOREWHISKY SOME MORE EVEN THOUGH HE'S CONTINUING TO HELP VOTE PEOPLE I SUPPOSEDLY THINK ARE SCUM

This isn't really a fair translation at all. If we were to assume he's scum, it would be more like, "UHOH THEY ARE GOING TO LYNCH LLAMA! I'D BETTER START BUSSING!" If we were to assume he's town it would be, "The Darla wagon seems to have fizzled out, and Llamarble's contradictions are perhaps even worse than ender's questionable play. As for more whisky, I don't know. I want to hear his response to some of the questions directed at him, though." Plus if he were scum and you were town, why would he change his vote? That way he couldn't be held accountable if you did flip innocent the next day.

I don't really have time to address all the other posts, but I feel good about this lynch.

Please claim.

[Llamarble]

@FF:
Scum have a STRONG disincentive to lynch their scumbuddies since their buddies dying is what makes them lose the game. Thus if I drive a Bublynch from no votes to completion and he flips scum I will have demonstrated my towniness more thoroughly than any other player and will probably get killed tonight. Lining up lynches is scummy because scum want to execute a sequence of mislynches, and it is convenient for them to have their next target all prepared for the next day. It also often causes a vig to shoot their target at night instead of hitting scum. Saying you want to lynch somebody for information is distancing from a lynch because it prepares excuse-making in advance for after that player flips town. Town don't care about preparing excuses; we just want to lynch whoever is scummiest. And tunneling with a weak case is a scumtell because a player who is sincerely scumhunting will vote along with the best cases instead of sticking to a lynch that they do not have a good reason to stick to.

[Llamarble]

@Bob: Much of my scumhunting time is being spent answering cases, but forcing people to fully state their reasons for voting me will be useful for analysis tomorrow whether or not I'm lynched. Also I think I've found scum at this point and am spending a lot of my time explaining why BB is scum. Who's listing you as scum with people you think are scum? I agree that that is silly (hence my statement that FF's BB/Llama are buddies stuff is ridiculous). Also does all the Ender/Darla interaction really look scumonscum to people and why???

Fishy & Broken:
You're the two I played games with before. In my game with Broken I was killed N1 after pointing out two of the scums and catching a fakeclaiming mason (who happened to be a VT unfortunately). Fishy I was scumbuddies with in a pretty dominating win. So both of you can respect that I'm reasonably good at this game and might be worth keeping around? I find it very frustrating being lynched D1 when I feel I can contribute a lot in this town. At least read my updated case on Bidderskins that I'm going to post tonight.

[brokenscraps]

We should keep you around because you're good at being scum?

Maybe we should keep you around for spamming up this thread. Maybe the fact that you're appealing to your good scumhunting in one game to prove your not scum should be the reason we should keep you around. I don't know, these all sound like great reasons to keep you around, I don't know which to choose.

[Llamarble]

Meh, I've already said my points against Bub in posts 8 and 20 of my ISO (and scattered other places but the main stuff is there.) It's not like there are going to be oodles of new things to dig up; I already read him pretty thoroughly. So basically just go read those. Repeating myself won't really be useful. Hopefully I've raised enough hackles and generated enough content to help you guys dig yourselves out of this situation tomorrow.

ROLECLAIM: VANILLA TOWNIE

Summary of response to case against me:
Ender was a confused townie who apparently thought his townflip would somehow prove Darla was scum despite the fact that she wasn't even really attacking him. And he didn't vote her despite this belief because he apparently didn't even understand why he held it himself. This behavior makes absolutely no sense from either alignment, but here it happens to have come from a townie.

My reads changed around early after my replacement because I was getting new ideas about who the scum were during my first couple rereads. Things became coherent and settled out shortly thereafter.

There's still plenty of time till deadline though so if anyone has questions etc. I'll answer.

@Broken: lynching productive scumhunters D1 tends to reduce town's chances of winning (though obviously lynching scum is paramount). I find you accusing me of spamming the thread offensive, but maybe you're just playing to a scum wincondition.

[Llamarble]

By the way it'd be anti-town if somebody hammered before Flinter, Yosarian, DBE, and Nikanor weigh in. We don't want scum lurking to victory without having to even talk about the day's lynch. There's plenty of time before the deadline for prods to force all of them to post.

[Fishythefish]

Noone hammer Llamarble. From a skim, the last few pages are good stuff, and there is absolutely no excuse for cutting this day short. There is no urgency about this lynch, and the only reason for a hammer now is for scum to curtail discussion.

[Fishythefish]

I'm sure I don't want a claim or a lynch until I've given this game a look with an eye more awake and more sober than either of mine are right now.

You are the only player who lost their nerve when I insisted I would place the hammer. Were your eyes sleepy and drunk when you posted this?

ender (Llamarble)
1. I didn't like his early vote for FF. By then, I think FF looked much better, and I think ender's line of FF looking like he knew what he was doing isn't a credible line of thought. FF's story of being thrown by coming from another rings really true, and I don't see how you could interpret it as scummy. After unvoting, not voting again until it was pointed out might betray that he was thinking more about his image than about his target or what his vote will do. Which is a little bit scummy - townies think about both.

2. His post 150 - "feel free to lynch me to show Darla's scum". You see these kind of appeals, usually from noobtown. But this one really doesn't ring true. When you see this from town, it is from tunnelled town who have shouted themselves hoarse about the object of their tunnel, to no avail. ender, on the other hand, had given DBE a middling FOS, since when he had voted MW for his reasons for voting DBE. This doesn't add up. He explains with "I think if everyone thinks Darla is scum that it would be a wise choice to kill her, if i have to be killed for a scum to be taken out then i am willing for that to happen." That doesn't sit well with me. If he doesn't really think DBE is scum, there's just no way that can feel like a good trade from where he's standing.

3. After an absence, ender comes back and throws an accusation at bob, a popular target at the time, for no stated reason, and does not vote him. A move which scum might well have made (it's a shame we can't ask him why).
...
On the scale of day 1 certainty, I think it's quite likely exactly one of Darla and ender is scum. I think the ender wagon feels more like a scumwagon - difficult to get going, not so many easy votes on it. Reading the game thinking "the scum don't want ender lynched" feels better than reading it thinking "the scum don't want Darla lynched". I think good reasons for voting ender have attracted remarkably little attention, which you wouldn't expect if the rival wagon was on scum. So I'm leaning ender, and my vote stays there.

I saw my votee was at L-1, with a lot of posts and a LOT of votes since I'd last seen the game. I wasn't up for reading all that, so I unvoted. If you want to call that losing my nerve, that's just fine with me. As for the other quote - I meant every word of it. But a quickwagon on Llama is potentially

very

significant to my read on him (particularly given the last paragraph). I'd be a fool to ignore it.

This wagon feels wrong to me. Really wrong.

BB moves onto Llama for contradiction when Llama was clearly catching up. Weak. Very much not in keeping with any of his opinions through the game. From his posts up until Llama attacked him, you couldn't ever have guessed that BB was thinking about going after Llama. This change of stance is not at all convincing for me. Also, read post 339. It's a triumph of rhetoric that I really doubt BB actually believes:
1. Tries to undermine Llama because the latter writes in capitals. Painting your opponent as desperate scum is always easier than actually analysing their play.
2. Calls Llama's case on BB weak because it's built on the contradictions of Llama changing on DBE, and of disliking both DBE and BB. This is

incredibly

weak. First, he makes no attempt to address Llama's (entirely believable) claim that his reads changed while he was catching up. Second, Llama's contradiction, or lack of it, is

totally irrelevant

to his case on BB. It's totally valid to call both DBE and BB scummy, and be more certain about either than the other. Thirdly, BB simply doesn't bother to defend the actual points! Trying to discredit the attacker instead of defending yourself is a scummy way to go about things.
3. Accuses Llama of trying to speedlynch him! He is comparing

trying to build a wagon in a week

with

demanding claims and hammer

. These are clearly incomparable, and this is just BB trying to win an argument.
That's really what that whole post is about. BB is trying to win an argument. Not to defend himself, not to rebut Llama, but to get Llama lynched - and he's happy for truth to fall by the wayside to achieve that. It's a very scummy attitude.

DLG is massively trying to strongarm a Llama quicklynch. Very disturbing, considering Llama was his third option not long ago, and the others (DBE, MW) are possible lynches. Points he's since used against Llama:
- Saying he doesn't want to be quickhammered, and that people pushing that line are scummy.
- The contradiction (?) between Llama posting content and accusing people of trying to quicklynch him. Not sure I understand this, but that's what it says.
- Not having an entirely original case on BB.
- Saying he's "go back and look for the case on ender" when he's already mentioned ender.
- Accuses Llama of trying to stall the momentum of the town by asking for a couple of day.
- Changing mind during read of game.
- Llama basing an argument on BB knowing he was town. That's a line of argument used

all the time

. It's a common scumtell that scum know what flips are going to be, and going after Llama for using it is totally ridiculous.
These points are

awful

. DLG is trying to throw absolutely anything he can find at Llama.

Why would scum being going after Llama? Who would they be saving? Not DBE. The main options are MW and BB.

Llama's case on BB is ok:
- Weak vote on Darla. Doesn't look like a particularly scummy vote to me.
- I agree about identifying scum on his own wagon, although as I've said I'm not sure how reliable that is. I think it's a pretty unnatural thing for townies to do - what I can't make up my mind about is whether it's something scum would do often.
- Saying DBE is a good information lynch. Yes, I can see that's a way scum would push a wagon without having to commit too much to it.

VOTE: BB

To the town on Llama's wagon: I think you are feeling far too comfortable on that cosy wagon of yours. You've got some nice company, and you're having a lot of fun shooting Llama down. He's ranting, and looking rather desperate, and you have the warm glow of being in a majority. There seems to be a bit of a consensus that Llama is scum. This is

fun

.

But none of that means he's scum. Read his posts. Read them thinking "would this make sense if he's town"? Read the posts against him. Read them thinking "is this

really

a fair point against him"? It's all too easy to see the arguments that reinforce your opinions, and not question them enough. I think there are some pretty terrible arguments going around against Llama right now.

Perhaps I'm wrong. Perhaps he's scum. But the last few pages do not look that way at all. Llama is reacting very much like I'd expect town to here, and his wagon is the scummiest thing we've seen in the game so far. Don't be a part of it.

[Fishythefish]

To be clear, my BB vote is based entirely on his recent play on Llama. The points from before that are minor in comparison.

[Empking]

Vote Count 15

1. bobsnox (1) - DarlaBlueEyes,
2. DarlaBlueEyes (3) -, CMAR, MoreWhisky, flinter
3. flinter
4. DLG
5. Jahudo
6. Bub Bidderskins (2) - Llarmable, Fishythefish
7. Fishythefish
8. Brokenscraps
9. CryMeARiver
10. Nikanor
11. Yosarian2
12. Final Fires
13. Llarmable (7) - Yosarian2, Nikanor, bobsnox, Bub Bidderskins, Brokenscraps, Final Fires, DLG
14. MoreWhisky (1) - Jahudo

Not Voting:


With 14 alive its 8 to lynch.

[Nikanor]

Unvote.

I don't want anyone to hammer until that scummy lurker Nikanor gets a chance to weigh in.

[Yosarian2]

Lawl @ DLG "SOMEBODY QUICKHAMMER PLEASEPLEASEPLEASE BEFORE HE FINDS US ALL SO I CAN LYNCH YOU REAL EASY TOMORROW HEHEHE"

So, now that he's voted you, you're calling DLG scum as well? First bub is scum, then me and bub are scum together, now you're calling DLG scum because he wants you lynched.

Anyone who votes you is scum, huh?

I've produced more content in 3 days than most players in this entire game. Why do you want to lynch me again?

Honestly, nothing in the desperate flailing you've done in the past few days seems especially town to me. I'm glad you're posting, I realize you replaced into a bad position, and I know how much that sucks, but I still think you got a scum role.

I pointed out that Ender did strange stuff and stated my intention to redeem the slot by good scumhunting.

I don't think you have. Most of your attacks look like OMGUS to me. I don't see Bub as suspicious at all. I also think your "Yos and Bub are scum together and they're part of an elaborate plan to lynch Darla" theory is raving paranoia at best; it dosn't seem to be based on any actual evidence of anything in the game, it more seems like a wild theory you cobbled together based on nothing to allow you to attack the people who suspect you.

[Yosarian2]

Noone hammer Llamarble. From a skim, the last few pages are good stuff, and there is absolutely no excuse for cutting this day short. There is no urgency about this lynch, and the only reason for a hammer now is for scum to curtail discussion.

Meh. I don't like this kind of stalling. If you don't think Llamarble is scum, that's fine, but if you do, extending the day just to get "more discussion in" is useless, and is more likely to make a good bandwagon stall out and die then anything else. There's no reason that every day has to go all the way to the deadline just because we can; it's not especially helpful to the town to drag out a day once we know who we're going to lynch, and once that person's been given a chance to claim.

[CryMeARiver]

CryMeaRiver you really think I'd be bussing my scumbuddies this hard on Day One with no provocation?

why do I keep getting listed as scum with the people I think are scum?

Llamarble - why do you keep saying "let me live longer so I can do some scumhunting!" when your scumhunting consists of repeating previously established arguments?

Time to a) claim and b) come up with better excuses for why you should still be alive.

===[]

That was completely based off of play, not interactions.

[bobsnox]

CryMeaRiver you really think I'd be bussing my scumbuddies this hard on Day One with no provocation?

why do I keep getting listed as scum with the people I think are scum?

Llamarble - why do you keep saying "let me live longer so I can do some scumhunting!" when your scumhunting consists of repeating previously established arguments?

Time to a) claim and b) come up with better excuses for why you should still be alive.

===[]

That was completely based off of play, not interactions.

It still doesn't make sense. To have us all listed as scum I must be bussing hardcore.



Fishythefish - if we lynch Llamarble today and he flips Vanilla Townie, then you have some good targets for the lynch tomorrow. Right now you're just killing a darn good bandwagon.

[Fishythefish]

Noone hammer Llamarble. From a skim, the last few pages are good stuff, and there is absolutely no excuse for cutting this day short. There is no urgency about this lynch, and the only reason for a hammer now is for scum to curtail discussion.

Meh. I don't like this kind of stalling. If you don't think Llamarble is scum, that's fine, but if you do, extending the day just to get "more discussion in" is useless, and is more likely to make a good bandwagon stall out and die then anything else. There's no reason that every day has to go all the way to the deadline just because we can; it's not especially helpful to the town to drag out a day once we know who we're going to lynch, and once that person's been given a chance to claim.

That was stalling while I did some serious reading. I wanted it strongly worded so I could definitely get that done. Having done that, I'm totally unconvinced that Llama is scum, and I want the people on the Llama wagon to have every chance to reconsider their position. Did you read my next post?

Fishythefish - if we lynch Llamarble today and he flips Vanilla Townie, then you have some good targets for the lynch tomorrow. Right now you're just killing a darn good bandwagon.

At this stage of the day, bandwagons are good if and only if they are on scum. If Llamarble flips Vanilla Townie - which I think he will - this day is a

failure

. The information from his lynch is not nearly enough to make up for lynching town. I have some good targets for the lynch

now

, based on this terrible bandwagon, and I don't feel the need to wait until the mod confirms that it's wrong as well as terrible.

What do you think of BB and DLG's parts in this bandwagon (see my previous post)? Same question to everyone.

[bobsnox]

You sound

awfully sure

about Llamarble.

I'd support a BB lynching

after

we lynch Llamarble (for my previously mentioned reasons).

DLG I don't find scummy ATM. That's probably because I agree with what he has been saying.