Newbie 1046: Game Over

[hurristat]

Also to hurri @ 291: You say you've pursued Stefan a bit. Do you think his vote pattern D1 was too open or wishy-washy?

Ultimately, not really: when I was playing during d1, I really didn't notice that he had switched votes 4 or 5 times, and thought that he was either a) lynching the right person or b) it was RVS stage. I think that vote-swapping during D1 isn't entirely indicative of anything -- it's either a mafia trying to get a town lynched or it's a town putting pressure on people and seeing how they react. 5 or 6 times may have been much, and I can see where the criticism is coming from, but ultimately, I think it doesn't reveal anything about Stefan's alignment.

I was trying to get something out of StefanB because I thought he was kind of tunneling on AP a bit. He answered with a satisfactory defense, so I'm satisfied with SB for the moment.

I still suspect you, because we had to practically drag you out into the light to get you to post, but AP's more

actively

suspicious.

Ah, fair enough.

Some questions:

Deer voted for me and hasn't been seen since. Where is he? Is he V/LA? Is he trying to hide in the shadows? His behavior is making me quite suspicious at this point.

AP: There have been many charges leveled at you that you have ignored -- would you care to either a) answer them, or b) explain why you haven't answered them?

Haylen: I know your life's been busy, which is completely understandable, but you were fairly inactive even before your life got hectic. What level of activity should we expect?

So far, I like Nocmen and Zachrulez.

Mod Edit: Quote tag fixed.

[Zachrulez]

Deer hasn't been on site since the 27th and I would expect that he is going to eventually be replaced.

[Ghostlin]

Which means we'll probably get another replacement via Glados soon; I'm not going to vote because while it's pretty bad, flaking is flaking.

[Ghostlin]

EBWOP: That should read not going to vote Deer.

[hurristat]

This is my last post before I leave for vacation. I'll probably stop in once a day after this until Sunday, but until then, adios!

[Ghostlin]

I'll say one thing about the doc issue. I'm from the future. I can here in a time machine that the Doc invented. Now I need his help to get back to the year 1985.

Interesting joke. Particularly since it could easily be taken the wrong way as being flippant. Neat reference, tho'.

Now, let me ask you this: are you willing to claim now?

[Ghostlin]

EBWOP:

No one hammer until I get my answer unless you want to jump the list of suspect to #1 scum. I mean it.

[Haylen]

Haylen: What the ....?

(a)

Thats all? Zach did question you, were did he say that you are scum?

(b)

That's pretty much in OMGOS theretory, (even stronger because Zach wasn't votting for you) and puh thats all.

(c)

And sorry meta is somethink that I know much as newbie but someones meta of you is so strong that he comes in a game and knows imidiatly your role? Thats somethink I have difficulties to believe.

(a)

Zach at least implied that I was scummy, if not say it directly.

Haylen was trying to claim that she expected the bandwagon to die after her (L-1) vote because people seemed to be finding Nik/hurristat scummier. Clearly, this wasn't the case. Her reasoning for expecting the bandwagon to die is/was flawed.

(b)

It's not OMGUS, I put out my reasons for voting him. If those reasons are justified then it isn't OMGUS. OMGUS is where you believe somebody is scum because they voted for you or attacked, without having any other reasons.

(c)

Zach obviously read the thread and then posted his thoughts, obviously he didn't just come into the thread and immediately lie comment on finding me suspicious because of my logic. In fact, he's fencesitting because he never actually says whether I'm scummy or not, he just implies it.

Also you have been lurking, and while lurking you have been paying attention to other games while ignoring this one

You mean the ones I'm modding? And I've been as active in this game as I have in your game. So this is wrong.

I can see how part of the first quotation about awesome poe could be doc-fishing, however, don't understand how the second part is - it seems to me like he is just talking about the doc.

Haylen: I know your life's been busy, which is completely understandable, but you were fairly inactive even before your life got hectic. What level of activity should we expect?

I become more active as a game goes on. I find the first few days of a game difficult because of the amount of people you need to keep tabs on.

[Zachrulez]

Haylen: What the ....?

(a)

Thats all? Zach did question you, were did he say that you are scum?

(b)

That's pretty much in OMGOS theretory, (even stronger because Zach wasn't votting for you) and puh thats all.

(c)

And sorry meta is somethink that I know much as newbie but someones meta of you is so strong that he comes in a game and knows imidiatly your role? Thats somethink I have difficulties to believe.

(a)

Zach at least implied that I was scummy, if not say it directly.

See now you get it right. That's not calling you scum btw, that's calling a post you made scummy. You exaggerated my suspicion into an absolute declaration.

(c)

Zach obviously read the thread and then posted his thoughts, obviously he didn't just come into the thread and immediately lie comment on finding me suspicious because of my logic. In fact, he's fencesitting because he never actually says whether I'm scummy or not, he just implies it.

You're contradicting yourself by saying I took a stance, and fencesat at the same time.

Also you have been lurking, and while lurking you have been paying attention to other games while ignoring this one

You mean the ones I'm modding? And I've been as active in this game as I have in your game. So this is wrong.

It might very well have been the games you were modding. I used search to see what you were posting in while you were inactive here, but I didn't check to see what context you were posting in be it player or mod.

I can see how part of the first quotation about awesome poe could be doc-fishing, however, don't understand how the second part is - it seems to me like he is just talking about the doc.

Contextual misinterpretation here I think. When I said he was openly speculating about the doctor, I was talking about the role-fishing I'd pointed out in the first quote. The point was he was attacking someone for something he was also doing.

[AwesomePoe]

Very busy at this point in time. If you'll be kind enough to give me til tomorrow, I'll claim, response and everything else.

[StefanB]

Sorry Haylen, just concentraiting on the Zachrulezpart (I leave the Chkflippart out, where you have an argument, but one that isn't as strong.)
If I interprette you right. Your point on Zach is:
1. He know Scum-Haylen.
2. He attacks you, but should know you are not scum.
3. He would like to kill you as scum.
4. So he is attacking you so he is likly to be scum.

So basicly you voted him because he attacked you, but should know better, right? So if you leave out Meta (sorry that's somethink that I can't comment about, since Nocmen considers himself still a newbie, that would be a question for Zach and yourself, sorry you are both not neutral enough to get an answer)
So basicly you are voting him, because he attacked you with a little metathink (and a reason for Chkflip)
Sorry but the Zachpart of your argument is close to OMGOS at last the parts I can understand. (Sorry complicated Meta and this is complicated is nothink you can really exspect people who haven't played a lot on this site to completly understand)

Your stand on Poe is interesting. I don't want him hammered before he clams, but can you give us a bit more, why you think he is probably town? I'm very convinced that he is scum, but a lot of the thinks he did you make no sense as town. Yet you read him as town. You are our IC (have a lot of experience) can you help us to understand you PoV?

Ghostlin:

I want the claim. His joke would have been cool if it were the beginning, as the only defence, it's bad.

[GLaDOS]

Day Two Vote Count #5

4 AwesomePoe (StefanB, Ghostlin, hurristat, Zachrulez)
3 hurristat (Deer, Nocmen, AwesomePoe)
1 Zachrulez (Haylen)

With

8

alive it takes

5

to lynch. Deadline is February 11 at 8:30 PM CST.

Not Voting – 0 – Nobody

[Ghostlin]

Sorry Haylen, just concentraiting on the Zachrulezpart (I leave the Chkflippart out, where you have an argument, but one that isn't as strong.)
If I interprette you right. Your point on Zach is:
1. He know Scum-Haylen.
2. He attacks you, but should know you are not scum.
3. He would like to kill you as scum.
4. So he is attacking you so he is likly to be scum.

So basicly you voted him because he attacked you, but should know better, right? So if you leave out Meta (sorry that's somethink that I can't comment about, since Nocmen considers himself still a newbie, that would be a question for Zach and yourself, sorry you are both not neutral enough to get an answer)
So basicly you are voting him, because he attacked you with a little metathink (and a reason for Chkflip)
Sorry but the Zachpart of your argument is close to OMGOS at last the parts I can understand. (Sorry complicated Meta and this is complicated is nothink you can really exspect people who haven't played a lot on this site to completly understand)

Your stand on Poe is interesting. I don't want him hammered before he clams, but can you give us a bit more, why you think he is probably town? I'm very convinced that he is scum, but a lot of the thinks he did you make no sense as town. Yet you read him as town. You are our IC (have a lot of experience) can you help us to understand you PoV?

Ghostlin:

I want the claim. His joke would have been cool if it were the beginning, as the only defence, it's bad.

Pretty much your first two paragraphs are horrible WIFOM. Granted it's WIFOM that Haylen herself created: ("well, Zach knows me, so he should know what my scum play is like, so he should be able to cite what scum Haylen is like, but since he can't cite meta proving I'm scummy, I'm not scummy, hence his argument is wrong and he's scummy.") but it's WIFOM nonetheless, not OMGUS. She's not actually saying his play is bad, she's saying he's kind of setting up a fake argument against her. However, even he's not convinced. Why? He didn't vote for her, so this at this point is somewhat academic.

So, Haylen, let me ask you a few relevant questions:

1) Are you convinced that the meta argument really holds water? Maybe you changed your meta just a touch between the last games you played with him, or he's forgotten what the meta was. How relevant do you consider meta to be in this game?

2) Why do you think AP is town?

3) If it was 24 hours before deadline, who would you lynch: AP or hurristat AND -why-?

[Nocmen]

Sorry Haylen, just concentraiting on the Zachrulezpart (I leave the Chkflippart out, where you have an argument, but one that isn't as strong.)
If I interprette you right. Your point on Zach is:
1. He know Scum-Haylen.
2. He attacks you, but should know you are not scum.
3. He would like to kill you as scum.
4. So he is attacking you so he is likly to be scum.

So basicly you voted him because he attacked you, but should know better, right? So if you leave out Meta (sorry that's somethink that I can't comment about, since Nocmen considers himself still a newbie, that would be a question for Zach and yourself, sorry you are both not neutral enough to get an answer)
So basicly you are voting him, because he attacked you with a little metathink (and a reason for Chkflip)
Sorry but the Zachpart of your argument is close to OMGOS at last the parts I can understand. (Sorry complicated Meta and this is complicated is nothink you can really exspect people who haven't played a lot on this site to completly understand)

Your stand on Poe is interesting. I don't want him hammered before he clams, but can you give us a bit more, why you think he is probably town? I'm very convinced that he is scum, but a lot of the thinks he did you make no sense as town. Yet you read him as town. You are our IC (have a lot of experience) can you help us to understand you PoV?

Ghostlin:

I want the claim. His joke would have been cool if it were the beginning, as the only defence, it's bad.

Acutally, I asked to replace into the SE slot that was left by Chk. It's past the confirmation stage, SEs can replace in for newbies at that point.

I agree wholeheartedly with Ghost on the WIFOM

[AwesomePoe]

I claim Town, and when I flip Town you will be sure.

For real about the doctor issue: I don’t know who he is, that’s plain. I have made inferences about who the Doc might have protected. I understand that could send people looking for information that wouldn’t be in the best Town interest. Mostly if we do have a doc, sorry for the stress. The behavior change analysis brought to light some things I could have covered better. That was my only reason to say what I said. I found a pattern in peoples play and I ran with it before considering the scumminess of the post.

Difference between nikit and cflip: nikit didn’t participate in either the scum hunt or actually voting people. He was not like Deer or cflip who had votes on people for a long time throughout the day. If he were scum, he would have at least voted somebody just to have another vote on a wagon. Hell, I gave plenty of scummy material to work with, but he didn’t go for it at all. The nikit position was neutral day one.

If I do get lynched, let me say: I’ve learned what “lynch all lurkers” means and why it’s a common saying. If Town people keep trusting each other you’ll win the game, I’m sure. The lurker positions are deadly to keep around and risky. I do regret some of the risks I made, but not my whole playstyle. Some of it I’ll refresh and review. This is a fun game, pretty long too.

For shits and giggles:

Unvote

Vote Deer

[Ghostlin]

For the good of town, I am going to eat crow and choose to trust AP at this time. I also want to make sure to apply pressure to our other suspect, and I want to get enough votes to get him to claim as well. He's been lurking, also been kind of fishing and I still do not trust him. I'm going to have a full case for you later tomorrow. I am willing to risk my own town cred on the fact AP is town. I think he's been using a gambit to suss out who might care about the doctor most.

Unvote.

Vote: Hurristat

[StefanB]

Warning Hurristat is at L-1.

He is mostly VLA until the 6th.

Nocmen: Sorry, just took the:

4. Well I've played a few games, but I'd probably still call myself a complete newbie.

you posted in 235 perhaps a bit to serious. So SEs are Nocmen, Zach, Deer (and however replaces him) and Ghostlin (you became it while playing I think) right?

The OMGOS-part: Sorry I misunderstood. I thought OMGOS is voting for someone that is voting you, for the reason that he is voting you. Basicly Haylen's argument is that whith meta as reason for it. But okay it is acedemic.

Sorry I don't know how much time I have this weekend, somethink happened that is bad (not really somethink completly horrible, but it will need more work)

[Ghostlin]

Warning Hurristat is at L-1.

He is mostly VLA until the 6th.

L-2; AP removed his vote.

[StefanB]

Upps, sorry. Yes AP voted Deer, thanks Ghostlin.

[Ghostlin]

Warning Hurristat is at L-1.

He is mostly VLA until the 6th.

Nocmen: Sorry, just took the:

4. Well I've played a few games, but I'd probably still call myself a complete newbie.

you posted in 235 perhaps a bit to serious. So SEs are Nocmen, Zach, Deer (and however replaces him) and Ghostlin (you became it while playing I think) right?

The OMGOS-part: Sorry I misunderstood. I thought OMGOS is voting for someone that is voting you, for the reason that he is voting you. Basicly Haylen's argument is that whith meta as reason for it. But okay it is acedemic.

Sorry I don't know how much time I have this weekend, somethink happened that is bad (not really somethink completly horrible, but it will need more work)

Still not an SE yet. Once 1046 is done, I'll be an SE because that'll be my second game that I've been in that's been completed, I'm in four right now, three of them theme games.

[Ghostlin]

EBWOP: 1042, not 1046, which is this game.

[GLaDOS]

Mod Note

: Replacing Deer.

[Haylen]

Btw, just for info guys. It's really poor form to lynch somebody whilst they're V/LA, it's one of those few things that make me yell in a game.

As previously stated, I could get behind a Hurristat lynch or a Zach lynch, which reminds me that I need to go back and answer some questions about Zach, I think. Don't I.

[Zachrulez]

Btw, just for info guys. It's really poor form to lynch somebody whilst they're V/LA, it's one of those few things that make me yell in a game.

You mean Ghostlin's hurristat vote?

What bothers me about it is that he unvoted right after Poe's claim and is trying to run up Hurristat to a claim as well. All this does is narrow down power roles for scum.

[Ghostlin]

Btw, just for info guys. It's really poor form to lynch somebody whilst they're V/LA, it's one of those few things that make me yell in a game.

L-2 is still quite far from a lynch with 8 left alive. Accidentally hammering AP was more of a concern, and I wanted to keep the pressure on.

You mean Ghostlin's hurristat vote?

What bothers me about it is that he unvoted right after Poe's claim and is trying to run up Hurristat to a claim as well. All this does is narrow down power roles for scum.

Any claim does this; particularly close to hammer. I don't mind having two suspects on the broiler at once; particularly if someone makes a claim that leads to a fatal counterclaim. Someone once told me it's always better to catch scum then it is to catch town. What AP didn't say was much more interesting then what he did.