Mini 1121: Nexusville Mafia.

[neko2086]

Neil, my questions aren't irrelevant. You made a claim about something being a scumtell, and I really don't see how it is. And if it is a scumtell, it is very odd that you singled out Implosion when you could have made the same argument for either Ice or Yoshi. Implosion looked like an easy target.

[DarthYoshi]

On Nameless’s three points in #94:

The only one I feel requires any substantive explanation is #2 (as for #1, thank you and I agree, and for #3, well, yeah). To address #2, I wasn’t explaining away Ninja’s behavior; I made an observation that what I saw was something not uncommon—very early on D1, scumhunting can be done for odd or seemingly obsessive reasons. The distinction may be subtle, but it’s there.

General thoughts--

I still don’t like WoMC’s trap from a tactical standpoint (#63), but despite the town having beaten the matter to death, I realize I don’t have any other reasons at the moment to dislike it.

On Mongoose: I find Mongoose’s explanation of basically wanting to spare us the agony of confusion in deciphering who his vote is on to be weak at best when it would have been pretty easy for us to simply scroll down, see who the last person is next to a bold “VOTE,” and know who Mongoose is currently voting for. Not sure if I am reading into his pattern what ICE is in #82, but Mongoose’s voting pattern so far does remain suspicious.

That being said, I do agree with Mongoose in #98 that there was no need for Neil to claim yet. Neil, even if you’re not into the game, why claim when you did?

Finally, I don’t like seeing the entire scumscales being posted by Implosion and mb53. I didn’t take very seriously Implosion’s kickoff of the RVS and declaration of ending RVS on page 1, but coupled with his posting of an entire scumscale in #73 (bad, bad, bad for all the reasons noted by people earlier) this comes across as a transparent attempt to try to lead/get the ball rolling in order to gain town cred (and if it means flushing out potential PRs, then it really is a win-win). Implosion, even if you don’t think it is *very* harmful, it is still *harmful* and unnecessary, and I get the distinct impression that you are experienced enough to know better. I also have no clue why mb53 played follow-the-leader in #80 (mb, why did you make that post?), but if it means that doing something harmful like posting a full scumscale is causing other players to follow Implosion’s example in this instance, I’m not liking it.

IGMEOY, Implosion.

[mongoose]

What is IGMEOY?

also, sparing the agony of confusion in deciphering is bit of a hyperbole, wouldn't you say? Allright, maybe it would be reasonably easy to figure out who I voted for, but having modded and played games on other forums, I find it annoying when people do it, so I didn't. Why do I find it annoying? Because the person effectively chooses 2 people to vote and I personally wouldn't count wither vote as a mod. that wasn't my intention, and as such I didn't do that.

[Nexus]

neil1113 has requested/is being replaced.

I will get to finding one now.

[Nexus]

KingTwelveSixteen replaces neil1113.

[silavor]

What is IGMEOY?

I got my eye on you

neil1113 has requested/is being replaced.

I will get to finding one now.

Hmm. Anyone know why neil replaced out? He complained the last time I was in a game with him about how much he hates being vanilla town, and I can't imagine him flaking on a scum role unless something serious came up.

[KingTwelveSixteen]

Pfft, I read through the whole thing without looking at the last page and my biggest suspect was Neil

Thats just kinda lame.

But anyway:

...

I'm a bit surprised that Implosion's vote on mongoose for distancing wasn't a joke.

I am not buying WOMC's "trap" argument, and I think

I would also call silavor scum, but his last point was quite good about implosion/mb53.

is ridiculous, since all silavor did was explain why implosion accused mongoose of distancing.

That was me not reading the thread correctly. Whoops.
...

How exactly did you misread the thread to come up with that?

Oh, Zdenek called you out on this...and you havn't responded.

...
I don't like the posting of entire lists of reads that has been going on for a bit. Don't like it to the extent that I'm leaning toward suspicion of those who participated, possible scum trying to start a trend they can use to gauge the towns feeling on the game. Minor FoS for Implosion and mb.
...

Only two people did that, and both said that they were only fine with it because it was so early in the game and recommeded not doing it afterwards.

[KingTwelveSixteen]

What is IGMEOY?

I got my eye on you

neil1113 has requested/is being replaced.

I will get to finding one now.

Hmm. Anyone know why neil replaced out? He complained the last time I was in a game with him about how much he hates being vanilla town, and I can't imagine him flaking on a scum role unless something serious came up.

He already claimed vanilla townie for me.
How annoying, especially since I am really the vig/bomb/cop/bulletproof combination role, obviously. /joking

[KingTwelveSixteen]

Bluh.
Forgot to point out my suspicions of mr. fingerprint avatar for his actions this game. (_over9000)
Namely, he hasn't done any.

VOTE:_over9000

[Zdenek]

silavor, I initially thought that you were referring to the post where you first voted Weapons, but I don't believe that you intended your initial vote on WOMC to be sarcastic humour. I think you voted WOMC for things that you think are scum tells, but reduced the severity of your vote but including a joke about it being RVS.

I agree with ICEninja that the unexplained/similar rankings in implosion's and mb's player rankings are very suspicious. I have often seen scum copy the reads of one another and of townies, so mb's choices are worse because he went second.

Implosion backtracked on his nameless scum-read, but mb completely ignored people's criticisms. I don't like that at all.

[implosion]

He seems to be trying to appear to be obvious town

??? how would it be possible to distinguish between someone who's "trying to appear obvious town" and someone who is in reality obvious town? Isn't it technically the responsibility of everyone (town and mafia and pretty much every other role except jester) to look like obvious town so that they don't get lynched?

Oh yeah, this is Too Townie... good call whoever said that (Nameless?)

Implosion - His "semi-legitimate" vote on mongoose was a load of crap, his list of suspects without justification is a classic filler post, having a complete list of (non)suspects at all this early on seems unlikely, and changing his stance on me the moment he's challenged by ICEninja is kind of dubious.

I don't see how that's in any way a filler post. If you want me to, I could elaborate on the reads, but it's early game so a lot of it is based on gut. I don't see how my "semi-legitimate" vote was a load of crap, either. It ended the RVS pretty effectively.

Harsh reality... To put it simple:

I'm not into this game right now. I need to refocus, but it isn't going to be happening anytime soon. Don't read too much into my posts, I'm not scum, I'm town. Lynch me if you think I'm wrong, but I'm vanilla. So it's not like I can do anything at night for you guys. Life is happening right now, and it's not helping me with this game.

First of all, holy AtE. Second of all, I find this claim completely uncalled for and more than that something that you had no reason to do as town OR scum, especially considering by your record that you're experienced at mafia. Why did you claim?

Oh. and he's gone. Woo questions that will never be answered.

Finally, I don’t like seeing the entire scumscales being posted by Implosion and mb53. I didn’t take very seriously Implosion’s kickoff of the RVS and declaration of ending RVS on page 1, but coupled with his posting of an entire scumscale in #73 (bad, bad, bad for all the reasons noted by people earlier) this comes across as a transparent attempt to try to lead/get the ball rolling in order to gain town cred (and if it means flushing out potential PRs, then it really is a win-win). Implosion, even if you don’t think it is *very* harmful, it is still *harmful* and unnecessary, and I get the distinct impression that you are experienced enough to know better. I also have no clue why mb53 played follow-the-leader in #80 (mb, why did you make that post?), but if it means that doing something harmful like posting a full scumscale is causing other players to follow Implosion’s example in this instance, I’m not liking it. IGMEOY, Implosion.

I don't see it as overall harmful. I see it as a way to stimulate discussion, and a way to make current opinions known. Those opinions don't really help the scum so early in the game, so there's essentially no harm. Also, it sounds like you're giving me the fos only because mb followed... why? How can you fos me for something someone else did?

[implosion]

What is IGMEOY?

also, sparing the agony of confusion in deciphering is bit of a hyperbole, wouldn't you say? Allright, maybe it would be reasonably easy to figure out who I voted for, but having modded and played games on other forums, I find it annoying when people do it, so I didn't. Why do I find it annoying? Because the person effectively chooses 2 people to vote and I personally wouldn't count wither vote as a mod. that wasn't my intention, and as such I didn't do that.

That still doesn't answer the question: why did you choose an RVS vote on q21 over a vote on someone you fos'd WoMC?

[mb53]

Implosion backtracked on his nameless scum-read, but mb completely ignored people's criticisms. I don't like that at all.

Wow really? Are you seriously not reading the thread?

For nameless, I don't like how he isn't really willing to answer questions. Even if you explained yourself, explain yourself again if asked to. Why not? Don't be difficult.

_________________________________________________________

I also have no clue why mb53 played follow-the-leader in #80 (mb, why did you make that post?)

I would have said that what niel said was scummy earlier if I saw it was. I didn't notice though that he wasn't answering questions. When I first saw that post, I thought it was a little suspicious that he didn't contribute anything, but then I found out that he had specific questions for him to answer, generating my response of neil=bad.

About the list:
I was stupid for posting. I remember in one of my games (or maybe it was one that I read through), that someone got called out for making a list, because it tells scum who to target. I completely forgot about it until I got called out for it >_>

Also, DAMN IT NEIL. If I was mod, I would seriously be tempted to modkill. What kind of person claims vanilla townie, after like 3 posts, on page 4, and then replaces out?

[Nameless]

To address #2, I wasn’t explaining away Ninja’s behavior; I made an observation that what I saw was something not uncommon

Let's not get technical. You offered words in another player's defense without prompting.

Implosion - His "semi-legitimate" vote on mongoose was a load of crap, his list of suspects without justification is a classic filler post, having a complete list of (non)suspects at all this early on seems unlikely, and changing his stance on me the moment he's challenged by ICEninja is kind of dubious.

I don't see how that's in any way a filler post. If you want me to, I could elaborate on the reads, but it's early game so a lot of it is based on gut. I don't see how my "semi-legitimate" vote was a load of crap, either. It ended the RVS pretty effectively.

It's a filler post because it has the appearance of scumhunting and deep consideration, but you haven't actually observed, argued or justified anything. You could have determined the order by dice for all we know. And calling your vote on mongoose even semi-legitimate is an epic reach (accidentally missing a player's name at the start of a game = distancing scum OMG). 'Ending RVS' isn't a meaningful justification since any scum could use it to handwave an early-game error and D1 is generally a gradual increase in seriousness rather than a simple on/off switch anyway.

[implosion]

Implosion - His "semi-legitimate" vote on mongoose was a load of crap, his list of suspects without justification is a classic filler post, having a complete list of (non)suspects at all this early on seems unlikely, and changing his stance on me the moment he's challenged by ICEninja is kind of dubious.

I don't see how that's in any way a filler post. If you want me to, I could elaborate on the reads, but it's early game so a lot of it is based on gut. I don't see how my "semi-legitimate" vote was a load of crap, either. It ended the RVS pretty effectively.

It's a filler post because it has the appearance of scumhunting and deep consideration, but you haven't actually observed, argued or justified anything. You could have determined the order by dice for all we know. And calling your vote on mongoose even semi-legitimate is an epic reach (accidentally missing a player's name at the start of a game = distancing scum OMG). 'Ending RVS' isn't a meaningful justification since any scum could use it to handwave an early-game error and D1 is generally a gradual increase in seriousness rather than a simple on/off switch anyway.

It isn't supposed to look like "deep consideration." It's still early game. I didn't argue or justify most of them, but I have observed the thread to make them. Again, a lot of it is gut. I elaborated on the mongoose vote earlier by the way - either he didn't see q21 (could be town or scum) or he is distancing (scum). And besides, if you're going to go through the trouble to make your RVS vote for someone with a specific kind of name, it seems a bit strange that you would miss the person that actually fits that criterion.

Regardless, my vote on mongoose is no longer RVS at all. Besides, it should be incredibly clear from the post in which I voted mongoose that I was trying to end the RVS... to say that it isn't an acceptable justification is ludicrous. Did you even read the context of that vote? I assume you did based on the "on/off switch" comment, in which case it should be obvious that it was an attempt to end the RVS.

Separate note: I won't be here tomorrow or most of Saturday. I will be here Sunday.

[_over9000]

I am incredibly sorry to those who are upset at my lack of activity, I've been really busy these past couple of days and I haven't had time to comment on anything. However, the truth is that the things I said I agreed with were pretty much all I had to say at the time. I promise that I will have much more content tomorrow.

[ICEninja]

Hi everyone. I agree with everything. Bye!

No. I shouldn't even need to say why I'm doing this.

Unvote, vote _over9000

[ICEninja]

more comments on recent posts when I have time. I'm really suspicious of neil as well, because of the parallel between his disinterest in this game and his disinterest in our game together when he was scum.

[KingTwelveSixteen]

more comments on recent posts when I have time. I'm really suspicious of neil as well, because of the parallel between his disinterest in this game and his disinterest in our game together when he was scum.

Neil does not exist. He is a figment of your imagination.
I am Neil. Neil is me. We are one.

Seriously I don't know what Neils problem was, (he was super wierd looking in his posts) but he is not here anymore. I am.

[KingTwelveSixteen]

I am incredibly sorry to those who are upset at my lack of activity, I've been really busy these past couple of days and I haven't had time to comment on anything. However, the truth is that the things I said I agreed with were pretty much all I had to say at the time. I promise that I will have much more content tomorrow.

You had four posts in this game (now five) and you said, in order:
1. /confirm
2. RVS
3. Oh woops we are outa RVS
4. That RVS is now real because...something I didn't explain.

You didn't agree with anything except that WeaponsOfMassConstruction should be lynched, and you did it in the most general way possible.

...

neil1113 has requested/is being replaced.

I will get to finding one now.

Hmm. Anyone know why neil replaced out? He complained the last time I was in a game with him about how much he hates being vanilla town, and I can't imagine him flaking on a scum role unless something serious came up.

more comments on recent posts when I have time. I'm really suspicious of neil as well, because of the parallel between his disinterest in this game and his disinterest in our game together when he was scum.

One of you here is wrong. I'm guessing its the ICEninja 'cause I'm town.

[mb53]

@MOD, can we please get a votecount? Pretty please?

[Nameless]

I promise that I will have much more content tomorrow.

Unvote, vote _over9000

more comments on recent posts when I have time.

Nice.

(SSS: a little)

[KingTwelveSixteen]

...

(SSS: a little)

SSS?

[DarthYoshi]

Another slightly scattershot post:

Nameless—being technical and precise matters.

Implosion—the reason I feel suspicious about you atm is because I am seeing your scumscale in light of your previous actions that I had before simply written off. It isn’t just because mb53 followed your example, although I now think the reaction from myself and others means that people won’t follow that example.

Your response to Mongoose in #111 was right on the money. I'm still not satisfied with Mongoose's explanations so far.

Mb53—I’m not as worried about the “neil = bad” comment as I am about the list. Okay, you said you were stupid for posting it. That doesn’t tell me WHY you did it, it just says that posting it was a dumb thing to do. People usually don’t do things because they’re dumb unless they’re auditioning for Jackass or something. The contrition seems to be masking a non-response.

(On a general level, not directed at Mb53 in particular) I agree with the amount of pressure being put on _over9000, and will definitely consider joining the wagon if he doesn't come through with his promise to post content soon. In my experience, lurking + promising content without delivering = scum.

I would also like to hear from both ICE and Silavor, since both are offering conflicting stories on Neil's meta--ICE in 117 is saying Neil showed this kind of disinterest as scum, Silavor in 105 is saying it was that Neil complained about playing VT. Which games are you guys referring to?

Also, welcome, KingTwelveSixteen. May you actually play towards your win condition.

[Nexus]

Votecount the Fourth:

WeaponsofMassConstruction (4): silavor, _over9000, q21, mongoose
_over9000 (3): mb53, KingTwelveSixteen, ICEninja
mongoose (2): Darth Yoshi, implosion
KingTwelveSixteen (2): neko2086, nameless
ICEninja (1): WeaponsofMassConstruction
Silavor (1): Zdenek

Not Voting: Noone.

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is 22nd February at 12pm GMT.

As ever, if there are any problems, post in thread or PM me.

Nobody is in need of prodding.