Mafia 126 - Lovers Mafia! [Game Over]

[Llamarble]

Q21 / Umbrage don't look as bad to me as Kcd/Babyspice or Espy/Orange. The "I am going to give long thought process for how I arrived at the realization that there is a delete button" post was weird. I see no reason not to just give the picture there. But Q21 does seem to understand the cases against Esporange and Kcd. I don't have a strong townread on the pair but I don't think they're in the scumminess league of Esporange or Kcdaspice.

And I totally agree with GreyIce on the Kise/Reck situation. My input was just not going to be useful there as it resolved. I don't have scumreads on either Kise or Reck at the moment. I just finished a game (mini 1105) where we had a situation where it seemed like someone must be lying, and it was never explained to my satisfaction, but he turned out to be town. And Tragedy still not knowing the game mechanics at this point is ridiculous.

[Mariyta]

I'm happy with either kcda or q21 for lynches (q21 is Umbrage's partner, right?) Every time Umbrage posts, my gut screams "Scuuuuuuuuum." And I still don't like Llamarble.

[Umbrage]

Every time Umbrage posts, my gut screams "Scuuuuuuuuum."

Well, if you come up with a REAL reason, you know where to find me.

[Baby Spice]

To be perfectly frank, one of the others in the 4 person chat is Baby Spice. Also, 4 person daychat could result in exactly the behavior pattern we're seeing. kcda suddenly started apologizing for his 'shit play' and backed the *** off of what he was doing before. So, who told him off? Us in the thread? Maybe, but I don't think so. Baby Spice? Uh... yeah. No. So... who?

Nicely timed for me being able to get back into the game and read the panicky QT messages.

Sorry if there were two other people in the QT they would have told him to either back off or play better several days ago.

as it seems others have pointed out

kcda's most recent posts read like a kid

with his hand stuck in the cookie jar

.

You don't have to read the QT.

Baby Spice's most recent post was... garbage. I don't know what else to call it.

That would be the one where I asked you some questions, pointed out your scummy actions and voted for you huh?

I can easily believe Umbrage/q21 are scum AND kcda/BS are scum. ***, they even make a good scum team. Despite being the two largest wagons, they barely even MENTION each other. Like 'ooh, better not contribute to that other wagon, lets see if the town wants something else shiny.'

Umbrage and q21 could be really bad town.

Hmm, I mentioned Umbrage. I believe I agreed with him that you're scum so why would I vote

for

someone (essentially) that I agree with?

Don't care how many wagons you support, since as people point out there are two scum teams, you can quite legitimately support a wagon whilst being the scum I think you are. That aint no tell to me.

Trying to target the 'easy' lynches is. (Kcdspot, Veezok) Trying to bait xReck/Kise to keep what looks like a townvtown screaming match going is.

Espy's poll:
Top two scumspects:
GreyIce/AntiHero.
Thingyman/Emptyger

Top two town
xReck/Nero Cain
Kise/Implosion

Two pairs you think need to pick up their post (rate or quality) but you have a town read on:
Haylen/Silvador (More a neutral read but I want to see more from Haylen)
q21 - Umbrage (Kcd and I disagree here. Actually that is probably why I have them in this list )

[GreyICE]

Nicely timed for me being able to get back into the game and read the panicky QT messages.

Sorry if there were two other people in the QT they would have told him to either back off or play better several days ago.

as it seems others have pointed out

I fucking love this. No, seriously, I fucking love this. Did you just tell me that scum would play less scummy then town? You just fucking told me that kcdaspot has to be town because scum would know better than play that scummy!

DO NOT FUCKING PLAY WIFOM GAMES WITH ME. I WILL SHOVE ONE GOBLET DOWN YOUR THROAT AND ONE UP YOUR ASS AND WATCH YOU DIE OF THE POISON.

Don't care how many wagons you support, since as people point out there are two scum teams, you can quite legitimately support a wagon whilst being the scum I think you are. That aint no tell to me.

SO YOU JUST ACCUSED ME OF BEING SCUM SUPPORTING A SCUM WAGON? I'M SUPPORTING

YOUR

WAGON.

YOU JUST FUCKING SOFT CLAIMED SCUM.

[Haylen]

Scumslips - did Haylen forget who her partner was in the 4 man QT and assume it to be Baby Spice when she made the statements about needing Baby Spice's opinion? I'd think BS would want it under the radar if she did, but why Haylen, just whhhhhyyyyyy

Not the sort of thing I would forget. I was breadcrumbing Baby Spice as my lover to see what hers and everyone elses reaction would be and because my first post in games tends to be a load of rubbish in order to gouge reactions anyway, which Reck knew having played with me previously.

Vote Q51

for reasons other people have stated. There's definately not something right there and I could get behind his lynch today.

Nice slip catch from GreyICE.

[Baby Spice]

GreyIce:

You're not Fate, stop trying to pretend you are.

To be perfectly frank, one of the others in the 4 person chat is Baby Spice. Also, 4 person daychat could result in exactly the behavior pattern we're seeing. kcda suddenly started apologizing for his 'shit play' and backed the *** off of what he was doing before. So, who told him off? Us in the thread? Maybe, but I don't think so. Baby Spice? Uh... yeah. No. So... who?

I fucking love this. No, seriously, I fucking love this. Did you just tell me that scum would play less scummy then town?

Nope. Next time quote your own crap before trying to misrep someone.

I directly answered your point using the same frame of reference that you raised.

You said that KCD's recent play was indicitave of him being part of a four person scum team, and I directly scountered it by showing how it better fits his being part of a two person 'lover' team.

That's not WIFOM, that's directly countering your point. If there's any wine involved it was from you.

Don't care how many wagons you support, since as people point out there are two scum teams, you can quite legitimately support a wagon whilst being the scum I think you are. That aint no tell to me.

SO YOU JUST ACCUSED ME OF BEING SCUM SUPPORTING A SCUM WAGON? I'M SUPPORTING

YOUR

WAGON.

YOU JUST FUCKING SOFT CLAIMED SCUM.

I said legitimate, not correct.
You're also supposedly supporting at least one other wagon, though without much substance to that support.

You

can truly believe that someone is scum without lieing because you could believe that they are part of a different scum group to you.
That you now appear to claim to only support one of the wagons makes me wonder if your bussing the other one.

[SnakePlissken]

Grey can I please ask respectfully that you stop using CAPS LOCK? It's bad enough when Fate & Chesskid do it, we don't need you doing it too. Interesting slip catch though. Hmmm I think I need to take a more involved look at kcd and Baby.

[q21]

q21: You have nothing else to comment about your wagon but you just vote another bandwagoner.

What the crap?

May I please point you to these posts, vezok.
376 - In addition to pointing out the delete button this post also contains my response to GreyICE's case against me.
385 - The last paragraph of this post is comment on the nature of some of the votes on my wagon at the time and some interaction elsewhere between those players. In it I suggests the likelyhood of a scumteam with GreyICE, AH, Snake and you. Seems you missed that.

Seriously how is this guy not dead yet?

unvote
vote q21

Kise has to wait till tomorrow.

I'd also like to point out that this vote is scummy, not so much for who its on (me) but how its made. See, you've just unvoted me in order to vote me - one of two things is happening here, Either you've forgotten who exactly you were voting for and are just jumping at what appears to the most promising bandwagon at thte moment OR you're intentionally trying to make it look like you're jumping from Kise to me so that you can made it look like my wagon is gaining more momentum than it really is.

Espy's unvote would be my fault. I told him I was seeing a helluva lot of STUPID from kcda, but not necessarily scum. And that BS was V/LA for the past couple days, not lurking, and that we were jumping on this thing with very little data. Also that I found it hard to believe that a 4-person scum daytalk quicktopic would let kcda behave so darn badly, or be unable to fill him in on the right details. The fact that Emp also didn't like the wagon reinforced my caution.

Espy is wanting to play some stuff close to the chest, here, and I've been disagreeing with him about that too. :p

Okay, I can follow this I guess and I like your later vote for GreyICE, but I think I'm going to leave my vote right where it is until I finally see that case from Espy. You know the one he's promised on a number of occasions now.

[Umbrage]

Hey, I ask for more Baby Spice, we get more Baby Spice. Now for a million dollars!

I'm still looking at Esp, I still don't see anything scummy about him, other than the fact that he calls me Umbridge. PO is a pretty good player. I'm trying to see the cases on them, but I'm drawing a blank.

On the other hand, we all need to take a closer look at Tragedy/Mariyta. They've made no original content. There's something there, my scummy sense is tingling.

[EmpTyger]

I really wanted to reach consensus with Thingy, but he's not posted in quicktopic in 3 days, and I don't think I can wait. Something needs to be done. The situation in-thread is just deteriorating.

Look at the big picture.
GreyIce and Reckoner are creating a gamestate where the town's advantages are lost.

Their cases against Baby Spice and Kcda and q21 and Umbrage etc are based on taking a minor thing in someone's recent post, taking it out of context, and warping the logic. They substitute profanity and abuse for logic. Those who point this out get shouted down, and any rebuttals are ignored in place of the next set of wild accusations. And those players who try make sense of it can't, so GreyIce and Reckoner attack them for following the bad cases GreyIce and Reckoner presented in the first place.

Stop listening to them. Start voting them.

. I know a few of you already are, but we need a majority of the town to refuse to enable their cycle.

Vote: GreyIce.

Between the 2 I'd rather Reckoner, but both of them are so consistently undermining the town. Less and less analysis is occurring. More and more players are getting demotivated toward working together.

(I do know this is short on specifics. I'm on iPhone and heading to work, and don't have time for a complete fleshing out. But I don't think the general point can wait for that.)

[Kcdaspot]

I agree with emptyger but for me it's not scummy or anti-town. It's anti-fun. FFS i'd like to post without every word I type getting construed out of context and I getting cussed out over the way I used "the".

You people call this fun?

[Tragedy]

Hey, I ask for more Baby Spice, we get more Baby Spice. Now for a million dollars!

I'm still looking at Esp, I still don't see anything scummy about him, other than the fact that he calls me Umbridge. PO is a pretty good player. I'm trying to see the cases on them, but I'm drawing a blank.

On the other hand, we all need to take a closer look at Tragedy/Mariyta. They've made no original content. There's something there, my scummy sense is tingling.

And you didn't see the list of people I made for Scum/Neutral/Neutral-but-scummish.

[Mariyta]

Tragedy and I both feel the Umbrage/q21 team is scum, so UNVOTE: kcda, VOTE: q21

Lover List

EmpTyger - Thingyman
GreyICE - Antihero
Llamarble - DarlaBlueEyes
Implosion - Kise
xRECKONERx - Nero Cain
VezokPiraka - SnakePlissken
q21 - Umbrage
Maryita - Tragedy
Kcdaspot - Baby Spice
PurpleOrange - Espeonage
Haylen - Silvador
Werewolf555 - Dramonic (last... and possibly least)

We should have this on every page. Makes it easier to keep track.

@Umbrage: Your scum sense? That's pretty funny. Cause, well, you're scum and stuff.

*case for the pair coming after dinner*

[Umbrage]

And you didn't see the list of people I made for Scum/Neutral/Neutral-but-scummish.

Point still stands. Giving a seemingly arbitrary list of players ranked in a seemingly arbitrary way is not providing original content. Even now, you try and push a wagon on me, but you have no evidence, nothing original to say at all. You two are not contributing.

[Mariyta]

And you didn't see the list of people I made for Scum/Neutral/Neutral-but-scummish.

Point still stands. Giving a seemingly arbitrary list of players ranked in a seemingly arbitrary way is not providing original content. Even now, you try and push a wagon on me, but you have no evidence, nothing original to say at all. You two are not contributing.

See, but this is completely not true, and anyone who takes the time to ISO us will notice that you're full of it. You're trying to turn attention from you and your scum buddy to a team you

hope

would be an easy lynch, but it won't work. The others aren't that dumb or blind.

[Tragedy]

Removed [quote=Sens] tags around this votecount to prevent it from being misleading.
-Sens

Kcdaspot - 5 (Reck, Thingyman, GreyICE, DarlaBlueEyes, Llamarble)
q21 - 9 (Snake, silavor, antihero, Dramonic, Nero Cain, vezokpiraka, Mariyta, Haylen, Tragedy)
Espeonage - 2 (werewolf555, q21)
Haylen - 0
Umbrage - 1 (implosion)
silavor - 0
Reck - 1 (Umbrage)
GreyICE - 3 (Baby Spice, Purple Orange, Espeonage)

Not Voting - 3 (Kise, EmpTyger, kcdaspot)

13 to lynch

Sorry Sens, I did your job for you while I was bored and trying to catch up the votes as well.

What I thought of Umbrage in QT:

I don't think he notices, but he's jumping quite slowly. His "Nero Cain is Reck's lover, and one of the people Kise said he could've chatted with. With a QT, it would be pretty easy for the two of them to play on a mistake made by Kise." doesn't buy me at all. His fail reasons are failed. Meanwhile, making the attention flying away while your partner is at L3 isn't going to happen

easily

What I thought of q21 in QT:

Scum. Followed Reck's vote towards Haylen. Random pointing of scum accusation towards vezopiraka without evidence. Scum scum scum.

I'm more convinced of lynching the q21/Umbrage team since

For the sake of your living,

Vote q21

.

[Mariyta]

@implosion: Move your vote to q21, s'il vous plait.

[Tragedy]

He's being replaced, silly

Mariyta

.

Fun Fact: <<S'il vous plait>> means "Please do it" in French.

[Umbrage]

See, but this is completely not true, and anyone who takes the time to ISO us will notice that you're full of it. You're trying to turn attention from you and your scum buddy to a team you hope would be an easy lynch, but it won't work. The others aren't that dumb or blind.

NO I DIDNT U R SCUMMY BUT I CANT SAY WHY!111

Tragedy isn't any better.

His fail reasons are failed.

Still can't quite get the whole 'logic' concept, can you? Still, the reasons for voting q21 are a little more... present.

Scum. Followed Reck's vote towards Haylen. Random pointing of scum accusation towards vezopiraka without evidence. Scum scum scum.

She's got a point there. Among countless other players, q21 has actually done some sheeping. And he found vezok scummy. Which is obviously scummy. Because, you know, finding vezok scummy is just... taboo. Anyway, the important thing to remember here is that Tragedy has VERY GOOD AND ORIGINAL REASONING and you should vote q21 NOW BECAUSE SHE SAYS SO.

[Tragedy]

Scum. Followed Reck's vote towards Haylen. Random pointing of scum accusation towards vezopiraka without evidence. Scum scum scum.

She's got a point there. Among countless other players, q21 has actually done some sheeping. And he found vezok scummy. Which is obviously scummy. Because, you know, finding vezok scummy is just... taboo. Anyway, the important thing to remember here is that Tragedy has VERY GOOD AND ORIGINAL REASONING and you should vote q21 NOW BECAUSE SHE SAYS SO.

I understand what you mean vezok is obviously scummy now after a quick reread on him.
Massive jumpings are bad, man.

[SensFan]

q21 - 9 (Snake, silavor, antihero, Nero Cain, vezokpiraka, Dramonic, Haylen, Mariyta, Tragedy)\
Kcdaspot - 5 (Reck, Thingyman, GreyICE, DarlaBlueEyes, Llamarble)
GreyICE - 3 (Baby Spice, Purple Orange, Espeonage
Espeonage - 2 (werewolf555, q21)
Umbrage - 1 (implosion)
Reck - 1 (Umbrage)

Not Voting - 3 (Kise, EmpTyger, kcdaspot)

13 to lynch

---

implosion has decided to abandon his commitment to this game and all its players for no adequate reason. I will be looking for a replacement.

[Mariyta]

First off, I second Tragedy's points.

Now, let's start with Umbrage.
#1: Votes Emp for claiming, when Emp felt claiming was the best path. Then in #2, he attacks Emp's partner for defending Emp...
#4: Doesn't see a downside to claiming, but his vote is still on Emp at this point.
-Makes a super big deal over the Kise/Reckoner thing. Essentially accuses Reck/Nero of lying and trying to screw over Kise (who brought up the conversation in the first place). Point#3 in #11 is simply awful. "Well, if Kise is town, Reck

might

be scum, but if Reck is town, Kise is definitely scum, so let's lynch Reck first!"
-Continuously argues that people aren't paying attention to him or that they're not posting cases on him, when he's really just ignoring them.
-His pissing match with GI is getting old.
-Insults basically everyone (This is dick-tell, not necessarily a scum-tell).
-Calls cases/posts/content "useless" if he doesn't agree with it. (another dick-tell)
-Asks to be replaced, then asks to be lynched
-Completely overreacts to my comment that q21 is scum (when he had a decent bandwagon already and I wasn't even voting him)
-Focuses on Esp/PO with a "I don't see the case", almost pleading for someone to give him a decent enough reason to vote Esp. Says everyone needs to look at me and Tragedy and that his "scum sense is tingling" but doesn't bother posting a real case (Hi, Pot).
-And his last post is absolutely beautiful. Full of attacks and insults, but no actual arguments.

I'll do q21 in another post because I hate massive walls.

[Mariyta]

He's being replaced, silly

Mariyta

.

Fun Fact: <<S'il vous plait>> means "Please do it" in French.

Meh, fine. Then his replacement should move his vote.

Fun Fact: That's right if you translate it exactly. But it's really just the formal version of please. Not as pushy and brutal as you make it seem.


Now for q21:
-Accuses vezo and reck of sheeping.... after he mindlessly sheeped onto GreyIce....
-Hey, look at that. Then he goes and sheeps reck, right onto Haylen. Nice.
-And then we get the whole mess about the delete button.... Looks a bit like an attempt to be helpful while stirring up an already contentious, probably town v town debate.
-Again, admits to mindlessly sheeping (he does this a lot), then attacks Esp for trying to draw attention to another scum and appears to take a sarcastic comment by Esp seriously, and last but not least, he sheeps onto the kcda argument (sans vote, of course). That was a fun post.
-Then we get a semi-decent post where he actually backs up what he says with a vote. You should try this more often.
-His last post is actually ok. He makes a good argument against Vezo (who I need to take a look at at some point).

So there you have it. Umbrage is by far scummier than q21. q21's main offense is sheeping in a manner that would put real sheep to shame.

[xRECKONERx]

The q21 case makes my dick hard.

Unvote; Vote: q21