Cold War Mafia - GAME OVER!!

[Furcolow]

Furc is really annoying and useless. He likes to just ask questions such as "explain this statement" and quote somoene. His questions don't seem to have much purpose ever, but his way of providing "input", if you can call it that.

If you HAD to pick between the wagons being scum-motivated, David, whose wagon would you say had more scum on it? Amrun's, or ThAdmiral's?

Don't know; don't care. This game isn't black and white. It's not as simple as one wagon being more scum-motivated than another. For all we know there is a scum-motivated wagon on scum. Or a town-motivated wagon on town.

@davidparker, i was referencing you PUSHING the lynch
if he flips town, are you willing to die for this lynch?

What a dumb question.. What do you think? Once again, this game is not black and white. It's not as simple as if we lynch JMJ and he flips town then we lynch me. Sure, i'll look scummier but that's something I'm willing to deal with.

Oh God Nachomamma is probably scum. Because he called me probably scum. The nacho I know would have just called me scum, not "probably scum". That doesn't sit right with me. Sitting up a scum-read on me to use later.

My current shortlist for scum:
JMJ (and now whoever replaced him)
GhostWriter
Nachomamma

And, Furc, before you ask, "please explain your reads" is not a valid response to this post.

Insulting someone is really going to get you far, David, and make people like you
/sarcasm

Anyways, I really dislike your dodging of my question. Care to actually answer? Which of the top 3 wagons do you feel have scum on them? Is that really hard to answer? Why are you dodging?

Your one question has turned into two from your refusal to answer, and I am very seriously considering voting you for this little spiel. More people than I consider you to be scummy this game, and ad hominem

just isn't going to cut it.

Furthermore, you list nachomamma as scum because you're "probably scum" to her - this is borderline omgus on an FoS. Hilarious.

Anyone receptive to a DavidParker late-day-cycle-switch?
I know I am.

[Furcolow]

vote: davidparker

1) ad hominem
2) refusal to answer questions/strawman nearly/misrepresenting my arguments to being "black and white"
3) FoS on someone for being suspicious of him

I see bad play I make in him, and it really makes me want to improve my own play. I feel that he has been open to bandwagonning, and is a very good alternative lynch to the ones that have been proposed. If this wagon doesn't kickstart, where it is late in the phase, I will consider re-voting Amrun (though I have actually liked him more than PI for the town), or voting for mothrax when he gets caught up based upon the content he provides or doesn't provide.

[LlamaFluff]

@Everyone

- If you are not voting for one of Thad, Amrum (PI) or moth (jmj) in your next post, explain in depth why all three are beyond a doubt town. This is the point in the game where stuff needs to happen, we have three big wagons and absolutely zero reason for people not to be on one them.

[InflatablePie]

And for the record, I do not appreciate being called a retard, thank you very much.

can dish it out but not take it?
you're guilty of ad hominem

Alright, that was hypocritical of me. I apologize, furc. For the record, though, me chalking things up to you being an "idiot" (or just playing as what I think is bad play) is why I have a townread on you, in case you didn't notice that part.


David can wait till tomorrow, I'd rather go for one of the top 3 today. Unless mothrax pulls a huge townie post in the next short while, then maybe I can switch to David if there's more support besides me and furc.

[bvoigt]

I agree that Feysal could be town, and his effort surely shows that, but I am not familiar enough with his scum play for myself to bring him out of the lack of a read category. I have a couple town reads, and am suspicious of a few players (amrun (moreso due to PI and conflicting FoSs), smargaret somewhat, and possibly lowell(maybe just due to playstyle)). I am pretty confident that you are bandwagonning here for the sake of bandwagonning, though,

bvoigt. What is your response to that accusation?

Well, yes, I am bandwagonning to some extent. The wagon on my #2 suspect didn't seem to be going anywhere, so I switched my vote back to my #1 suspect. At this point, I agree with LlamaFluff that it's time for a lynch, and would be willing to vote for ThAd. Mothrax still feels like a lurker/policy lynch to me, though.

Oh dear. More mothrax votes please.

If you can make a better case than I did on Amrun in my ISO #23, then maybe I

would

be willing to vote for him.

[LimMePls]

@Everyone

- If you are not voting for one of Thad, Amrum (PI) or moth (jmj) in your next post, explain in depth why all three are beyond a doubt town. This is the point in the game where stuff needs to happen, we have three big wagons and absolutely zero reason for people not to be on one them.

QFT.

[Stephoscope]

Steph's replacement

nah, I'm still here. I know I haven't seemed particularly useful so far, and for that I apologize. I'm going to try my best to step it up.

I agree the game sorely needs a claim. I'm going to vote Amrun for now, although that vote is subject to change, because the wagon on ThAdmiral seems super town to me. I'm not looking to be a sheep, but I can't help but consider that. bvoigt and Furcolow, my top two suspects, are on this wagon also--so the claim/flip would be interesting to me.

Unvote
Vote: Amrun

[Amrun]

So your sole reason for voting for me is you think other people are scum?

[Feysal]

@Everyone

- If you are not voting for one of Thad, Amrun (PI) or moth (jmj) in your next post, explain in depth why all three are beyond a doubt town. This is the point in the game where stuff needs to happen, we have three big wagons and absolutely zero reason for people not to be on one them.

Have to agree. Time to make up my mind.

I already covered PoisonIvy/Amrun in my last post. I think she is town, I won't be supporting that wagon.

As for jmj3000/mothrax, since we just got a replacement, I'd prefer to give him a chance. Also, I searched for jmj's recent posts, and found out he has really not been active on the site. He replaced into another game a while back, and in his third post he requested replacement, since he could not handle two games at once. That is when his flaking in this game began. Contrary to what ThAdmiral said in #588, I don't find he has been very active on other forums either, and when it comes to mafia games, the issue is not having time to post but having time to read. The evidence suggests that whatever troubles he was referring to were real, and him actually replacing out invalidates the accusation that he was scum because of stalling. The slot could be scum despite him replacing out, but not because of it.

Ok, I have gotten too far behind in this game. I have been trying to catch up, but each time I get 1 step forward, I fall two steps back.

Mod: Please replace me, as me being so far behind is going to hurt the fun of everyone else in the game.

Can we just lynch this slot before a replacement comes in and everyone forgets how scummy JMJ was?? A replacement at this point will be a fresh start more or less and I'm not happy with that.

I'm not happy with this. When jmj3000 replaced out, it should've been obvious that he was genuinely flaking instead of stalling for time, and since that was pretty much all DavidParker found him scummy for, I don't like him continuing to push a case that just went down the drain. All that is left to suspect jmj3000 for is that he made a random vote despite having suspects. I find that slightly suspect, but really not lynch worthy.

That leaves ThAdmiral. I did an ISO read of him, and actually got a scummy feeling from him. On my first read I thought it was really odd how Nachomamma8 called him scum with no explanation, and suddenly people agreed with him. I think I get it now. In addition to what others have said, I find him and Furcolow flip flopping on each other to be most curious, particularly how they both claimed the other was town due to meta.

I looked through some of their games, the ones ThAdmiral posted and more. ThAdmiral was scum and Furcolow was town in two games, The Lies of Locke Lamora and Rivertown Mafia. In one of them Furcolow was fooled by ThAdmiral, in the other he was not, so I'm really not putting much stock in Furcolow's claim of being able to read him. Instead, I think they might have been distancing. They both voted the other, and quickly unvoted for meta reasons.

For the record, my attempt of getting a meta read of ThAdmiral by looking at his past games was a waste of time. Well, almost. I did come across some things worthy of note.

ive done that on my alt
i dont do that on this
this is my VI account
get over it

Furcolow, you

are

a village idiot. You

know

you are a village idiot. You have

admitted

that you are a village idiot. It is also because you are a village idiot that you are still alive, anyone else would've been lynched for the things you've said and done today. So you can drop the act of being all hurt, accusing me and InflatablePie of ad hominem for calling you that.

Other things I found were an example of Furcolow using a reaction test as town, in Rivertown Mafia, where he false claimed miller as explained here. Apparently he does do reaction tests as town too. Oh, and I chanced upon a rather hilarious anti-Furcolow tirade by boberz in Ohne Mafia here. Not very relevant to this game, but I was getting the same scummy feeling reading Furcolow in Ohne Mafia as here.

This just is ADMISSION you're trying to get mislynches, and that you are going to bandwagon.
I am ever-so-more suspicious of you, Feysal, but I'm happy with where my vote is right now. I could easily get on the biggest bandwagon of ThAdmiral. I don't believe I'm going to do that.

It is recognition of the fact that you're not getting lynched today, and so I should look for scum elsewhere, fool. I'm not of any use to the town if I tunnel on you.

Feysal in his #560 defends Amrun/PI's play, expect to see a hop onto the ThAdmiral wagon from him. Very possible that he is buddying as scum here.

Or I could just be confident in my townread on her. And I won't be scared out of voting ThAdmiral by you. I think that he is the most likely wagon to be scum, and in fact your partner. There have been so many times ThAdmiral has made excuses for you this game.

Vote: ThAdmiral

[DavidParker]

JMJ Had been stalling for time for a week... Finally when he had stalled so much he decided to flake. More later, have to leave for work now.

[Furcolow]

of course feysal hops onto thadmiral wagon
he is seriously seeking mislynches galore this game
furthermore, he is dipping back into ad hominem

this is not the feysal-town that i know and love

[Furcolow]

unvote

[RedCoyote]

I am ABSOLUTELY not dodging it. I answered your little sceneario. What is the problem? Also, how has Amrun "dropped from my my radar"?

That answer was so absurd that I had hoped you wouldn't bring it back up. Dropped from your radar as in I asked you why you were voting Ivy and you got all huffy about it. You claimed that Ivy was the worst and convinced me of that fact. Then I go to bed at night, content with the fact that me and LMP were going to force this town to lynch Ivy, hand-in-hand. My dream turned into a nightmare when, the next day, you completely threw Ivy off your list and went after ThAdmiral.

I think, when Amrun flips scum (even if it's not today), you're going to have some explaining to do. I just want you to know I'm not going to forget what you did today.

[Amrun]

Red, you better revise that little scenario in your mind.

I think you're likely town, but you've got at least one misread. I won't flip scum.

Obviously I realize you can't write off the idea that I am scum, but you should at least consider the possibility that I flip town. What will you think about LMP then?

[RedCoyote]

That he's probably okay.

[LlamaFluff]

unvote

Hi.

We are not lynching "not voting". Please vote one of the three lynch possibilities or explain why they are all town in your next post.

[ThAdmiral]

@ feysal - a few things you should know:
1. Lies of locke lamora was mine and furc's first game together so it really shouldn't be a surprise he didn't know my meta then (I think it was also the first game I played since I came back after a break as well). Since then we've played together in at least 2 or 3 other games. As you mentioned he picked me correctly as scum in rivertown recently, and picked me correctly as town (albeit not at first) in frenzy mafia. I linked to it earlier in this game so you can check it out if you want.
2. The comment about furculow and his "VI account" is an understandable misrepresentation, as it caused similar confusion in the game it first appeared in. He was referring to his account in which he was hydra-ing with and learning from the (well-known and excellent) mafia player Vi. It does NOT refer to an account were he plays as a Village Idiot.

Also as far as I can tell this is your case against me:

That leaves ThAdmiral. I did an ISO read of him, and actually got a scummy feeling from him. On my first read I thought it was really odd how Nachomamma8 called him scum with no explanation, and suddenly people agreed with him. I think I get it now. In addition to what others have said, I find him and Furcolow flip flopping on each other to be most curious, particularly how they both claimed the other was town due to meta.

Other than the flip flopping between furc and I is there anything else you actually find scummy? Or are you just another one of those people who are agreeing with Nacho for no reason?

[Lowell]

Normally tunnelling annoys me, but I find myself agreeing with Llama's last few posts. It's like this game is allergic to lynches.

[Furcolow]

unvote

Hi.

We are not lynching "not voting". Please vote one of the three lynch possibilities or explain why they are all town in your next post.

I see more than three possibilities. You want one?

Vote: No lynch

[Furcolow]

eat that, Lowell!

[Lowell]

Haha, nice.

[RedCoyote]

Sure, joke around. It's not going to be so funny when that's what actually ends up happening, Fur.

[Sotty7]

Day I, Vote Count XIV

Amrun - 5 -

XScorpion, Beasts of the Sea, RedCoyote, bvoigt, Stephoscope

ThAdmiral - 8 -

Nachomamma8, EGL, LynchMePls, LlamaFluff, smargaret, GhostWriter, Amrun, Feysal

mothrax - 7 -

DavidParker, Scott Brosius, Lowell, Artem, InflatablePie, gonnano, ThAdmiral

No lynch - 1 -

Furcolow

Not Voting - 3 -

mothrax, Fuzzyman, Sathoris

With twenty-four of you alive thirteen votes will lynch. The day will end on Sunday February 20th at 9am GMT.

Beasts of the Sea has made me aware of a V/LA

Fuzzyman is being replaced

[Furcolow]

Amrun wagon feels best to be, but 5 votes is indicative of how well he has replaced into that slot in terms of being pro-town, and contributing. I have to defend my Admiral read. I am not sure if I would openly defend him if he were my buddy, note whatever you want. I have voted JMJ at one point... I believe the main case on him is lurking.

I noticed he always had an excuse for not posting, and I haven't seen anything that stuck out at me as pro-town from mothrax. TheAdmiral might be scum, though, so I don't want to hand him an easy pass when I could be off on my read of him. Such a tough decision, it is really easier to just joke around, RC.

I also have fear of wanting to spotlight improperly when I need to be laying low. That is not how I want to come across right now, at this stage.

However, I'm going to have to vote. not voting, abstaining, or voting for NL is just improper at this point.

I'm sure Feysal is going to rage over my play

vote: mothrax

L-5 competing wagons are pro-town IMO

[Furcolow]

unvote;
vote: amrun

I just did a little researching, and I've found something I find suspicious. I am not going to just openly bandwagon - I'm going to lynch who I find to be scum.

Amrun is likely scum, even if his play appears pro-town and detailed. I have picked up on something he does as scum. I will have to see if he does this as town as well. I will be right back. researching!