[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[drmyshottyizsik]

even if they have to kill one town before they kill the mfaia then the town is still slightly worse.

[Terrion]

But consider that the same danger exists with all lynches, and far less of it with the neighbor lynches. In the end, unless you get a cop result and only one cop claim along with it, or somebody is acting unbelievably suspicious, or the like, lynching the Neighbors would be best just from playing the odds.

[Tragedy]

A lucky goon has 2 infos- of 2 Town Players and other mafia players.
Of course, anybody would be smart enough to lynch/kill the non-neighbors first.

[Leo]

Make one of the VT's a fourth neighbor?
Or don't necessarily make any of the neighbors scum - assign the neighbors randomly among the goons and non-PR townies, or have an N% chance of one of the goons being a neighbor.

[drmyshottyizsik]

This is an open game so I don't like chance. I'm not a big fan of semi opens. . fourth town neighbor may be good. Thoughts?

[Empking]

If you manage to lynch the scum neihbour that you get three confirmed townies. That's not good.

[drmyshottyizsik]

True, but I have a solution!
Hold up

[drmyshottyizsik]

Shotty's Final Attempt 13P Mafia

2 Goons
1 RB

2 Cops/Doctors(So you could have 2 Docs, 2 Cops(One sane, one insane), or one Sane Cop and one Doctor.)
6 Townies
2 Neighbors(Both Town)
1 Neighbor(50/50 chance of being either a goon or a VT)

[Mr. Flay]

shotty, you're not addressing the fundamental lack of balance in the game. Depending on how the coin flips in setup, you've got several wildly different games coming out of that. Stop focusing on the coinflip element and make ONE balanced setup, no variability. Then you can start to play with things that can change without screwing up said balance.

[drmyshottyizsik]

The game is balanced either way.

[Andrius]

Shotty, Mr. Flay, THE Mr. Flay just told you your game isn't balanced.

It isn't. What happens when you get two Cops and no scum in the Neighborhood? Helloooo Masonry in a mini.
You're not willing to listen to us, so don't bother posting in here until you're ready to take advice- and criticism- from people who actually know what they're talking about. (Aka, Flay.)

-The Baker

[AlmasterGM]

Seriously, has anyone here ever heard the phrase, "don't feed the troll?"

Take it to heart.

[Andrius]

Seriously, has anyone here ever heard the phrase, "don't feed the troll?"

Take it to heart.

Time to look up that Friend/Foe thing...

[Ythan]

I think Shotty is actually completely serious though.

[Herodotus]

I think Shotty is actually completely serious though.

I'm pretty certain of that.

In DRM's defense, this was probably inspired by F11

, and seems less dependent on chance than F11 is except in one case:
goon neighbor who is lynched day 1 (leaving 2 confirmed town neighbors)
2 cops (even with one being insane, the previously confirmed townies will probably buy the insane cop enough time to get a second investigation)

Okay, it's not that easy. But there is definitely a comparison.

[Slaxx]

Okay, so how about:

Gunsmith
Doc
5 VTs
2 Goons

Each goon can choose to "throw away his/her gun" at the start of the game. A goon without a gun cannot make a kill, but also appears innocent to the gunsmith. A goon with a gun can kill but appears guilty to the gunsmith. If the doc is overpowered, a Bodyguard who shows up positive on GS investigation and dies in place of target could be used instead. Thoughts?

Quoted because of distractions.

[Slaxx]

Oh, and the flip of a goon will indicate whether he/she has a gun or not.

[CheeseDeluxe]

A Shotty Final Attempt at 13P Mafia

Mafia

1 VG
1 Roleblocker
1 Neighbor

Town

2 CopDocs (They can either investigate or protect one night; 50% chance of fail)
5 VTs
2 Neighbors
1 VI

Village Idiot MUST be deliberately stupid; cannot be a newcomer.


[/sarcasm]

[Magua]

Donner Party Mafia, take 2

Based off Adel's Donner Party Mafia

12 players

2 Cannibal Mafia Goons

- Daytalk
- Each Cannibal Goon has their own larder of bodies
- Whichever Cannibal Goon submits the kill gets the body

1 Cannibal Serial Killer

- 1-shot NK immunity (even if double shot that night)
- 1-shot Roleblocker immunity
- The Cannibal Serial Killer is not notified when either 1-shot immunity is activated

1 Cannibal Vigilante

1 Dietician (Gunsmith)

- Returns a result of "Cannibal" on the Cannibal Mafia Goons, the Cannibal Serial Killer, the Cannibal Vigilante
- Returns a result of "Not Cannibal" on the VTs, the Roleblocker
- Returns a result of "No Result" if roleblocked

1 Roleblocker

6 Vanilla Townies

Mechanics
- No Lynch is not allowed.
- Cannibal: If a Cannibal night kills someone, they take the body and put it in their larder, resulting in no reveal to the town for that kill (the Cannibal who performed the kill learns the role/alignment, but no one else does). If a Cannibal night kills another cannibal, they take all of the bodies their target had as well (they learn those role/alignments as well).
- If more than one Cannibal nightkills the same target, they both learn the information, but not that the target was killed multiple times.
- If two Cannibals nightkill eachother, and are not in turn nightkilled by a third Cannibal, they and all their bodies are revealed.
- Lynch always results in public role/alignment reveal of the lynchee. If the lynchee was a Cannibal, the role/alignment of any bodies they had is also revealed publicly.

Notes
- Mafia is weaker than in a normal 1/3/9 setup; on the other hand, the Cannibal mechanic should give mafia more leeway in safeclaims, does not give town associative information immediately if a mafia is nightkilled, and the gunsmith is equally likely to get a guilty on a non-mafia as on a mafia. Still, they can lose before D2 if they're very unlucky.
- Roleblocker's purpose, setupwise, is so "I tried to kill that guy, and he didn't die" does not automatically mean the target must be the Serial Killer.

Thoughts?

[Herodotus]

If someone is targeted by more than one kill on the same night, who gets the bodies?
If two cannibals kill each other, what happens to the bodies?

You could add a minor protective role or a protown role that has a way to avoid nightkills if you want to give the SK a way out.

[Magua]

If someone is targeted by more than one kill on the same night, who gets the bodies?

If two cannibals kill each other, what happens to the bodies?

Good questions!

For both of these, I'm in favor of a theory that there should be more information available rather than less, so I'd say:

1) If someone is NK'ed by more than one person, they both "get" the body. This leads to two ways that the alignment/role could be revealed. If the person NK'ed was a cannibal, they both "get" all those bodies as well.

2) If two cannibals NK eachother (and neither is NK'ed by a third cannibal), they and their bodies are all revealed.

You could add a minor protective role or a protown role that has a way to avoid nightkills if you want to give the SK a way out.

I'm leery of adding a doctor or similar pr role because of interaction with the gunsmith. Maybe replace one of the VTs with a roleblocker, and add a 1-shot roleblocker immunity to the serial killer?

[Empking]

Homage to Adel and Guardian

2 Mafia

2-4 Vigs
0-2 Townies

[drmyshottyizsik]

^^Mini texas justice?

[Empking]

^^Mini texas justice?

Perhaps.

[drmyshottyizsik]

I would play.