Newbie 1055 (Game over)

[MrBump]

He kept saying "I hope the Doc is on me" and reminding us about the setup, that it could have a Cop. Was a bit too quick though.

UNVOTE: Vittorio

Still not sure on Vittorio. I wonder if there was any breadcrumbing...

[Stefunny]

Okay, I have something to say.
Haylen, I really hope you don't take offense to this, because it is not a personal attack by any means, just how I feel.
I really hope you aren't scum Haylen. I don't

think

you are, but at this point I really am clueless. I'm a little frustrated with the lack of activity from the IC. You have the fewest posts of anybody left alive. I understand you may have gone through something traumatic, and you are V/LA on the weekends, but even during the week you have really not been active. I see that you come online and post in other threads and seem to ignore this one and it really irks me. Especially as an IC, where I feel like you are supposed to be an example of how the game is played to the newer players. I know everybody can't post all the time, but this game has been pretty active with no replacements other than those at the very beginning of the game. I almost wonder if you are scum and figure you can just glide through the game by not being active. I suppose this could be teaching the newbies one way of playing, but I'd really like to ask that you help everyone play the game. Perhaps you have taken on too much responsibility at this time? I understand the Newbie queue frequently needs Mods and ICs but is it worth it if you take on too much and can't fully participate in all of them? Whether you are town or scum I really hope I get to see your input into the game this week.

And I say this with the utmost respect.

[Haylen]

@ Stefunny - There is a reason I have been inactive, but I would appreciate it if we didn't discuss it, despite it being game related.

So, I like visuals:


I don't think that pie chart really shows anything, because it doesn't take into account the lengths of my posts. I either post loads of small posts and ask or a lesser amount of large posts. I am intrigued as to how many of the other players posts are fluff rather than content. And then I will do
more graphs for them!

Despite Stefunny commenting on my lack of posts, I find it interesting that she is ignoring her lack of posts too and it would be interesting whether
or not she has noticed the severe lack of content that have been in Sxybeasts posts. I think I can remember her mentioning it but I haven't
come to her iso yet.

Sxybeast

The first few of her posts don't really matter as they are in the RVS, they were fluff and non-game related. It's very interesting that she took her vote off so quickly, though. Most people keep their RVS votes on their chosen player until the game is out of the random voting stage. I find it a little bit suspicious that she found a load of people not posting in the beginning suspicious, because not everybody can be scum!

Then she answers my questions after a load of fluff. Answering questions = good, fluff = bad.

anyone still awake and want to just talk? im bored

Suggests posting fluff??? O_O Definately anti-town.

She does, however, have a point with MrBump attacking her for defending herself.

She doesn't explain clearly why she votes for Gapoc. In fact, she votes him because other people have unvoted him. It just seems weird that she voted him when everybody else unvoted, seemingly scared that he would be hammered. Distancing and concern for a scumbuddy being lynched?

If he turns up scum I wouldn't be sure who his partner is except I would be pretty sure it isn't DP. Mainly because no matter how new a person is maf tends not to buddy so that if one is caught the other isn't.

Wrong. Mafia have been known to buddy townies rather than their own team-mates. It isn't exclusively a scumtell either, I've used it repeatedly as a town tactic and there are a few others who do to - but you need to know how to do it properly before you try.

Gets defensive over Stefunny mentioning her RVS vote. As SE, Stef would know not to put very much faith in RVS and thus would have just been fishing for a reaction...which she obviously got. Distancing Gapoc with RVS vote?

Defends Gapoc in post I#34.

Can't find anything else that's wrong. Would be tempted to vote based on this evidence.

Vittorio

I don't like that he voted for Gapoc without giving any reasoning for it. He said that there 'may be many tell', but why not expand on that? Smells a bit like distancing.

Expresses that he finds everyone suspicious. As I said, not everybody can be scum, I mean yeh, have a few suspects but wow. He seems to be fence-sitting quite a bit, which is scummy.

Tries to calm Gapoc down, this is good. But also establishes a connection between the two.

He seems to be votehopping all over the place, with none or very little reasoning for his votes. His vote for David Parker, for example, contained no comment on him at all, let alone the reasons why he was voting for him. Scummy...theeeen a couple of posts later, he votes for Mr Bump and then unvotes him again with no reasoning.

------ENDING AT I#33--------
Will do some more tomorrow.

[SxyBeast]

Wow i am amazed at how off that chart is, on me at least. I have posted 48 times more than both u and stefunny.

The first few of her posts don't really matter as they are in the RVS, they were fluff and non-game related. It's very interesting that she took her vote off so quickly, though. Most people keep their RVS votes on their chosen player until the game is out of the random voting stage. I find it a little bit suspicious that she found a load of people not posting in the beginning suspicious, because not everybody can be scum!

first of all just cause ppl keep their vote up doesn't mean I do. U cant go apply other peoples playing styles to me. Second of all just cause I find someone suspicious doesn't mean I think they r maf. It means i will keep my eye on them.

[quote='Haylen"]

anyone still awake and want to just talk? im bored

Suggests posting fluff??? O_O Definitely anti-town.[/quote]

Wow ur such a great detective. U can find a person just wanting to talk on page 3 as scummy wen the majority of the ppl in the game hadn't even talked. Yup u got me.

She doesn't explain clearly why she votes for Gapoc. In fact, she votes him because other people have unvoted him. It just seems weird that she voted him when everybody else unvoted, seemingly scared that he would be hammered. Distancing and concern for a scumbuddy being lynched?

i said in the post that i voted him in y i voted him. im srry that it wasn't clear to u. And yes I voted him because he wasn't at L-1. I don't want to be the killing vote in my very first game unless i have to. Wat o u have a problem with being cautious of lynching a townie?

If he turns up scum I wouldn't be sure who his partner is except I would be pretty sure it isn't DP. Mainly because no matter how new a person is maf tends not to buddy so that if one is caught the other isn't.

Wrong. Mafia have been known to buddy townies rather than their own team-mates.

Wow u just repeated me. I was saying that DP probably isn't maf if gapoc is because maf doesn't buddy maf. Did u just not understand me or r u trying to frame me?

Defends Gapoc in post I#34.

I have already explained the so called defense. I was just trying to stop a misunderstanding that could have gotten a townie lynched. I have also said that ,because ppl see stopping a miss communication as scummy, I will just shut my mouth if someone makes a silly mistake. That could result in a townie lynch.

[Haylen]

Ooops! Sorry, I didn't notice the second page on your iso.

[Vittorio Salamdien]

What some consider as me wanting people to role claim or fishing for roles:
I hate to go on about this, but my first, unchanging vote was for Gapoc. Would I have voted straight off for my scumbuddy and held my vote there until he was lynched? I feel that this should remove people's doubts about my alignment. So, given that, I was hoping that the relevant roles would signal some hint or something to me, once they trusted I was town, so that I, together with them, could focus on other players. I was speaking in code, but, alas, that just made me seem suspicious.

And I am now afraid that with the loss of Parker, we will struggle. So, now I appeal: if you are town, trust me or eat silly pie (which I hope you will do at the end of the game if you still don't trust me.)

@Haylen

your misrepresentation of me is so wild and fantastical, and you know it; I'm not even going to bother to counter it point by point. I am with Stefunny, you smell scummy.

VOTE: Haylen [/Unvote]

[Vittorio Salamdien]

Oops

VOTE: Haylen

[MrBump]

I hate hate HATE your "I'm town, you know I am" thing. It seems like you're trying to manipulate us.

So we've gotten to the stage where I think basically everyone except maybe Stefunny has a chance of being scum. Superb.

[MrBump]

I mean Stefunny has a chance to, you know what I mean

[Vittorio Salamdien]

I hate hate HATE your "I'm town, you know I am" thing. It seems like you're trying to manipulate us.

I understand Mr. Bump.

But

you

still have to decide: am I manipulative scum or a townie appealing for trust from other townies?

[Haylen]

Anyone who looks at your iso for themselves will see what I mean.

Answering people later.

[Vittorio Salamdien]

Anyone who looks at your iso for themselves will see what I mean.

Answering people later.

Sure Haylen, if you look at my posts in isolation from others' posts. But if you look at my posts and votes in the context of others' posts and changing behaviours, then I am responding to those contexts, to accusations against people and how they defend, and so on. In this regard, my vote-jumping/fence-sitting are tactics to see how people respond. As an IC you should know that.

On to your previous post:

Vittorio

I don't like that he voted for Gapoc

without giving any reasoning

for it. He said that there 'may be many tell', but why not expand on that? Smells a bit like

distancing

.

Expresses that he finds

everyone suspicious

. As I said, not everybody can be scum, I mean yeh, have a few suspects but wow. He seems to be fence-sitting quite a bit, which is scummy.

Tries to calm Gapoc down, this is good. But also

establishes a connection between the two

.

He seems to be

votehopping

all over the place, with none or very little reasoning for his votes.

His vote for David Parker

, for example, contained no comment on him at all, let alone the reasons why he was voting for him. Scummy...theeeen a couple of posts later, he votes for Mr Bump and then unvotes him again with no reasoning.

First, I gave reasons why I voted for Gapoc. I find it ironic that you use 'distancing' as an argument against me, since I was the one who used that to analyse SxyBeast's posts with Gapoc. Of course I don't own copyright on the word or the argument, but I find it ironic that you then use it against me, as if you've picked up the term after going through my posts, thought it a good one to use, and then use it against me - all this while you cannot really find fault with me for sniffing out Gapoc.

Suspicious of everyone:

who here can say with any certainty that X or Y is town? How is it strange to be suspicious of everyone, as a default approach? It's the nature of the game. And, it's a misnomer to call it fence-sitting. A fence-sitter is someone who doesn't have any convictions or lacks the courage to follow through on convictions, like abstaining from voting.

If you're not suspicious of everyone on whom you can't get clear reads, then you're failing at Mafia. So, Haylen, who do you have clear town reads on if you're not suspicious of everyone?

Establishes connection

with Gapoc: my argument again, in reading SxyBeast, which you have now just conveniently adopted as your own analysis of me.

Haylen, instead of trying to manufacture evidence against me, look at my posts and votes again. If you find the several posts between me and Parker before I vote for Parker, you will find my reasons for the vote. If you can't, well, what can I say about your detective skills?

My vote stays on you.

[MrBump]

You shouldn't have to manipulate people if you're town. You should have to CONVINCE them.

[MrBump]

Needs moar posts.

[Vittorio Salamdien]

MrBump:

"It seems like you're trying to manipulate us."

"You shouldn't have to manipulate people if you're town."

You have now moved on from "it seems" to acceptance that I am manipulating.

Again, I'm not manipulating anyone. If I am/was scum, then, yes, what I'm doing would be manipulative. If I am/was town, I'm appealing to other townies. The point is still that it is up to others to decide whether I am being manipulative (and therefore scum), or whether I am genuine (and therefore town).

I have been trying to establish rapport with people because I think rapport is one of the ways in which one can gain trust and through which one can measure someone else's trustworthiness. Alas, either there's too much ego involved for posters and they want to maintain some form of frosty distance (understandingly as well, for who can we trust in this game?) or posters are too enamoured with their own analytical skills and read too quickly, thereby not picking up on my hints and cajoling. I was hoping that others would respond with repartee and thus establish levels of trust and, hopefully, ultimately unspoken understanding.

Alas, it is one big fail because, now that I have to talk about it to explain my behaviour, it is out in the open so scum will want to watch me more closely, so that they can pick up on unspoken alliances and sow confusion.

In any event, I remain suspicious, for now, of Haylen. She seems to want to put me under pressure so that I have to respond to that and not scum hunt (so that she won't be a target). I also find it odd that she initially explained her absence due to illness, yet remains quite active on other threads. It cannot be continuing illness that keeps her from this thread...

[MrBump]

It seems like you're going that, but you shouldn't have to. I don't like the way those posts are made. If you tell a lie enough, it becomes reality...

Even still, I have no idea on who the scum is in this game. Did anyone get anything from David's posts on Day 2? Come to think of it the kills have been rather silly. Vinoth was killed Night 1- the scummiest player by far. Then David was killed Night 2- the NEXT scummiest player. The scum is playing badly from what I can see yet he/she's playing well enough to not be caught.

From the "he" slip it's 100% Vittorio FMPOV, but I'm doubting the legitimacy of that slip. I don't think Vitorio's 100% town by any stretch of the imagination. Atm I'll be honest, I'm thinking Sxy, then Vittorio, then Haylen and finally Stefunny. But I'm not confident enough for a lynch in anyone =/

[Vittorio Salamdien]

It seems like you're going that, but you shouldn't have to. I don't like the way those posts are made. If you tell a lie enough, it becomes reality...

Even still, I have no idea on who the scum is in this game. Did anyone get anything from David's posts on Day 2? Come to think of it the kills have been rather silly. Vinoth was killed Night 1- the scummiest player by far. Then David was killed Night 2- the NEXT scummiest player. The scum is playing badly from what I can see yet he/she's playing well enough to not be caught.

From the "he" slip it's 100% Vittorio FMPOV, but I'm doubting the legitimacy of that slip. I don't think Vitorio's 100% town by any stretch of the imagination. Atm I'll be honest, I'm thinking Sxy, then Vittorio, then Haylen and finally Stefunny. But I'm not confident enough for a lynch in anyone =/

Please explain FMPOV.

As to the scummiest players being nightkilled: are you sure that they appeared the scummiest? Perhaps to you. If they were genuinely giving off scum whiffs, don't you think the mafia would leave them to be lynched rather than waste a nightkill on them? This makes me doubt your spidey senses...

[MrBump]

Exactly. If they were scummy, why kill them? Red herrings. It doesn't make sense

FMPOV = From My Point of View. IF the 'he' slip is genuine then you're the scum FMPOV, right?

[Vittorio Salamdien]

Exactly. If they were scummy, why kill them? Red herrings. It doesn't make sense

FMPOV = From My Point of View. IF the 'he' slip is genuine then you're the scum FMPOV, right?

Thanks. You mean if Gapoc slipped and the 'he' pronoun was therefore revealing of who his scum buddy might be, then, from your POV, yes, I could be scum.

I'm assuming you're male (Mr.), so, just as easily it could be you. We now know that it isn't Parker or Vinoth.

[MrBump]

Well, MrBump was a Mr Man character so I couldn't have been Little Miss Bump, but yeah I'm male
FMPOV anyway it's you if the slip is real, and FYPOV it's me.

[Vittorio Salamdien]

I mean your character is male, like mine is. What your real gender is is immaterial. Likewise, I think of Doros as female because the name is feminine. What Doros's real gender is, who knows and who cares. It's the internets, people pretend all the time.

[MrBump]

Rule 14 and all that jazz. Rule 14 can go die.

Anyway, does anyone have any ideas on where to go from here?

[Vittorio Salamdien]

MrBump, why do I feel like I am getting played by you?

And why is everyone else so quiet. Not a peep from Stef and Sxy?

[MrBump]

Getting played? How so?

Needs moar people

[SxyBeast]

And why is everyone else so quiet. Not a peep from Stef and Sxy?

How come everytime I talk and ask questions ppl dont notice? I asked Haylen questions and brought up points. She posts after that even commenting on one part of it but disregards the rest. Srry I cant talk as much as I would like. I am super busy with the new term as I have already stated. Also, Mr Bump could u elaborate on y u find me as scum?