A Storm of Swords - Lay your swords down!

[Kast]

Lol

[zoraster]

Kast: Don't flatter yourself. You didn't remotely "pressure me" into voting LL. You didn't even apply pressure to my knowledge. LL is still scummy, but so is Raivann. I'd be happy with either's lynch.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I don't want to die at night because I have an awesome PR
that's why the VI act

Serious question Chess - have you ever been Nightkilled in a game that wasn't in Newbie / Open?

[Feysal]

@Feysal: What do you make of Zoraster?

Good question... I was about to answer this last night, but decided to sleep on it and do an ISO read first. All I had was a vaguely scummy gut read, and after doing that ISO read I can't be sure where that came from. The only thing worth mentioning is that for someone who suspects Shadow for not scumhunting, zoraster has few posts about scumhunting and more about other discussions. Also, it is a bit odd that he remains suspicious of both players he voted at the start of the game, as if he was tunneling. I find myself agreeing with most of his reads and arguments, except Shadow and Locke (FFVI, anyone?), and I no longer feel that scummy read was as justified as I thought. My read now is null, leaning scummy.

I'm not reluctant to vote, I just happen to like my vote on Thor (Song).

Why would you like that vote?

GreyICE, can you please show where xvart claims to have a townread on you? diddin's 252 is in reply to me and *my* townread on you.

Seems I should've waited before commending GreyICE for making a good point... Checking xvart in ISO, he never did claim to have a town read on GreyICE.

Quick question – why so quick to assume Locke is town? Couldn't he possibly be scum of a faction different from DGB / Zoraster? Do you have reason to think we only have a single scum faction in a game this size?

I simply don't see where the scum reads on him are coming from. I'm leaning town on Locke, though it is not a strong read, his ISO is too short for that. If he belongs to any scum faction at all, I've not seen indication of that yet. I have no reason to believe there would be only one scum team either, in fact I find two more likely.

Let's have some more Zoraster votes everyone!

Whatever for? You seem to believe zoraster and Raivann are scum partners. Maybe they are, but Raivann looks far more suspicious than zoraster at the moment. Why would we want to vote the one who looked less likely to be scum?

[hasdgfas]

@ Mod: can i get a dayvig plz?

*waves*

*ties an invisible rope to nearest tree branch*
*points at Raivann*
*points at zoraster*
*points at MoI*

[Nexus]

Who do we want to lynch? Or who does Chesskid want to lynch? Raivann, zoraster or MoI?

Helpful hascow.

[Magua]

Ooops. You're right. I got you and Magua mixed up in this case. My bad.

What is your opinion of Magna now?

[Zdenek]

@Zdenek-
-Yes, that's kinda the point behind asking for it. I didn't expect him to provide anything, but if he did, that would have been nice.

I don't think that your question was genuine.

-Mudslinging as a general term refers to discrediting a person or position by attacking negative characteristics the subject. However, in the context of a mafia game, it more specifically refers to malicious attacks aimed at negative aspects of a person/position instead of attacks aimed at legitimate problems with the person/position. This is frequently used to falsely implicate someone as scum by attacking negative aspects of the person's character, even though those aspects don't actually indicate affiliation.
--In our context, I discredited GreyIce's weak attacks by legitimately pointing out that they are overreactions. To call that "mudslinging" AND claim it is a scum-tell, is inconsistent with your own behavior which similarly called the same posts "exaggerations" etc, and inconsistent with not attacking others who posted similarly to GreyIce and others.
--Also in our context, you are claiming the italicized portion, despite the fact that I did not and am not pushing GreyIce as probable scum, and to the contrary, pointed out his overreactions as neutral/null.

But you said

I didn't only mean your paranoia about governor power; you're overreacting to almost everyone on almost everything. It rubs me wrong. Do you have any links to past games where you similarly go crazy over nothing?

Saying that something rubs you the wrong way is not calling it null or neutral. To me, it indicates that you think that something is scummy or at least that you want others to think of it as scummy; hence, the mudslinging accusation.

These

You attacked GreyICE for things that don't have an obvious bearing on his alignment. The scum motivation for it is that it allows scum to paint someone as scummy for no real reason, simply because it is easy for others to conflate negative aspects of a person with scummy ones.

-I tried push GreyIce's "negative but not scummy behavior" as if it was scummy behavior

are not equivalent statements. The first one only requires that one attack someone for things that have no bearing on their alignment and then allows others to construe that the negative behaviour is scummy, but in the second, the person making the initial attack has to push the person's behaviour as though it is scummy.

Your claim that dismissing GreyIce's bad cases are "attacks" on GreyIce is a pretty big misrepresentation.

I haven't done that. My problem is not with you dismissing GreyICE's bad cases, it's with you asking him a question that I don't think that you ever intended him to answer, and saying that his behaviour rubbed you the wrong way.

[Twilight Sparkle]

Hey Cow, you saying that you're a dayvig?

@Twilight Sparkle – Hito edition : I don’t think you ever responded to my question regarding Newb scum’s motivation to draw attention to themselves in a Large Theme game with many experienced players (in relation to Shadow). Did I miss that explanation?

It's not about "motivation", it's about psychological priming. Neither side really wants to be cheeky for no reason; but given that someone was, it's more likely to be coming from someone who knows they're a different alignment than the person they're slighting.

Regardless, that was a weak early tell more than anything, and it's been drowned out by shadows chattiness (which, as I said last time, gives me a town vibe.) Maybe you noticed this and the question died in transit - sorry it took so long for me to field the ball.

I've only skimmed the last ten or so pages; I'll re-read and respond to points as I see them.

-hito

[LimMePls]

@LMP, 587-
How does it not make sense? Zoraster tried to distance on LL while coasting along. I engaged his throwaway comments, he tried to appease me by buddying and bussing LL.

"Doesn't make sense" was an inaccurate statement on my part. "Makes less sense to me than Zor-Raivann" would be more accurate. It is certainly plausible.

[Raivann]

unvote. Vote:Thor

Oops on xvart

I dont like the raivann wagon. He's Lannister i'm 100%sure.

[LimMePls]

Cow, if you're a dayvig you should shoot Raivann. Or Zoraster. You'd be a hero. Since you tied a noose though, I'm going to take that to mean you are indicating that those are the lynches you are considering. Is this correct? if so nod your head.

[Feysal]

Hey Cow, you saying that you're a dayvig?

I think he is. I just looked up who and what this Ser Ilyn Payne character is. He is the King's Justice, aka headsman, aka executioner. Him being a dayvig would fit the character perfectly.

I think he is asking us if we would want Raivann, zoraster or MoI executed. My vote would be on Raivann. I believe he is scum, I care not if he is lynched or dayvigged. zoraster I'm less certain about, and MoI I have a null read on.

If we're ever going to make sense of hasdgfas, we should at least try to make sense of what he is saying. I just read through his ISO, and I think I get the gist of most of his posts. I'm not getting the idea of post #467 though. What was the point of pointing at Shadow's and Twilight Sparkle's hands? Was it just that they should ask questions if they don't understand something?

I dont like the Raivann wagon. He's Lannister i'm 100% sure.

Excuse us if we don't take your word for it. Can you explain what is your fascination with Thor/Song?

[chesskid3]

I don't want to die at night because I have an awesome PR
that's why the VI act

Serious question Chess - have you ever been Nightkilled in a game that wasn't in Newbie / Open?

Yes.

[chesskid3]

Shit I got nked night 1 in Resurgence.
It's ongoing though soooooooooo

[chesskid3]

@ Mod: can i get a dayvig plz?

*waves*

*ties an invisible rope to nearest tree branch*
*points at Raivann*
*points at zoraster*
*points at MoI*

waitwaitwait
blatant rolefish time
Ser Ilyn Payne, do you have executioner powerz?
If so can I get some delicious yummy head-of-MoI?

[chesskid3]

Cow, if you're a dayvig you should shoot Raivann. Or Zoraster. You'd be a hero. Since you tied a noose though, I'm going to take that to mean you are indicating that those are the lynches you are considering. Is this correct? if so nod your head.

NO
THEY ARE LYNCHABLE
MoI is for some reason impossible to lynch
KILL

[Raivann]

So you want me dayvigged before I could even claim? Feysal.is so scum

[chesskid3]

you shut up

[hasdgfas]

Who do we want to lynch?

*nods*

Raivann, zoraster or MoI?

Hey Cow, you saying that you're a dayvig?

*nods head*

Cow, if you're a dayvig you should shoot Raivann. Or Zoraster. You'd be a hero. Since you tied a noose though, I'm going to take that to mean you are indicating that those are the lynches you are considering. Is this correct? if so nod your head.

*looks hesitantly at LMP*
*nods slowly*
*holds up one finger*
*looks at vote count*
*points to LMP's mouth*
*spreads arms wide*

If we're ever going to make sense of hasdgfas, we should at least try to make sense of what he is saying. I just read through his ISO, and I think I get the gist of most of his posts. I'm not getting the idea of post #467 though. What was the point of pointing at Shadow's and Twilight Sparkle's hands? Was it just that they should ask questions if they don't understand something?

*raises hands in the air excitedly*

So you want me dayvigged before I could even claim? Feysal.is so scum

*cackles*
*shakes head*

[chesskid3]

SHOOTTTTTTTTT MOIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
tell you what
if he's not scum
I'll go like "whoops, my bad"
if he is scum, i'll post this:

[hasdgfas]

SHOOTTTTTTTTT MOIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

*points at chesskid's mouth*
*spreads arms wide*

[Shadow1psc]

SHOOTTTTTTTTT MOIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

*points at chesskid's mouth*
*spreads arms wide*

This is gonna sound stupid, but what does it mean when you spread your aaaaaaaaarms?!

I'm pretty sure you're not asking for a hug, but is there a way to get more descriptive with your actions?

[chesskid3]

I think he's sayig I have a big mouth >_>

[Shadow1psc]

He did the same thing to LMP's question which is what makes me question it.