Mini 1126 - Game over - Was Averagely Suspicious saved?

[Papa Zito]

I don't see penpen active lurking.

You didn't answer this, here it is again:

so really, try and come at me again bro because your response to my case just got disproven.

Not really, I'm going to ignore you. I don't seem to have six others game for lynching you today, and I'd rather find your buddies then sit around and get baited. I admire running cover for them in this circumstance, I really do, but I don't feel like playing.

This is a bad answer.

subgenius (L-2): GreyICE, Ashblade, RobCapone, Barry Allen, Bill McQuill

Please explain where this came from and why it was sufficient to answer Rob's point.

[Ashblade]

I'm not dumb enough to out a PR

sorry you don't beleive me but I AM the tracker and I am not mafia.

Hell, even if you were mafia the only thing you'd do unless you were insanely lucky is telling us that the mafia already knows another role exists.

[GreyICE]

I don't see penpen active lurking.

You didn't answer this, here it is again:

so really, try and come at me again bro because your response to my case just got disproven.

Not really, I'm going to ignore you. I don't seem to have six others game for lynching you today, and I'd rather find your buddies then sit around and get baited. I admire running cover for them in this circumstance, I really do, but I don't feel like playing.

This is a bad answer.

subgenius (L-2): GreyICE, Ashblade, RobCapone, Barry Allen, Bill McQuill

Please explain where this came from and why it was sufficient to answer Rob's point.

Because Rob's point is really stupid. I'm tired of the fact that most of this town seems content to sheep me (and I guess EA, although that looks like just Rob) or nitpick/cheerlead from the sidelines, rather than doing anything that resembles proactive scumhunting. It's gotten a little better since I posted that, but I really don't see the big deal in noting it.

He blows that up into that huge liar case? I can't tell if that's fucking stupid or fucking scum, and at this point I don't care, since no one is lynching him with me today, so I'll just ignore him.

[GreyICE]

Going on record now if Bill is town, ice is confirmed scum

ice voted bill earlier (claims to have started the wagon on him based on his own statement he has started the 3 wagons in this game) and now bill is L-2 and he thinks he is going to flip town

And then there's quality idiocy like this.

I'm sure I don't have to walk you through why this is such a fucking scum post, Zito?

[RobCapone]

Going on record now if Bill is town, ice is confirmed scum

ice voted bill earlier (claims to have started the wagon on him based on his own statement he has started the 3 wagons in this game) and now bill is L-2 and he thinks he is going to flip town

And then there's quality idiocy like this.

I'm sure I don't have to walk you through why this is such a fucking scum post, Zito?

Problem it is a town member posting it so it can't possibly be a scum post

to support the wagon early and now say you think he will flip town is a contradiction that needs explaining

what has he done between the time you thought he was scum til now when you think he is town

it's funny cause I can point to a game where I had scum in this very same situation and his response didn't make sense so I am expecting you to answer this please

point out what excatly had you change your scum to town read on bill.

Thanks

[GreyICE]

Dude, lynch chaining?

That a scum tactic through and through. "Well look at these two people! If one of them is town, the other MUST be scum! So we should lynch one to see if they're scum, then lynch the other!"

If you're truly town and you made that argument, go out back for a bit, and think about what you have done.

[Papa Zito]

I'm tired of the fact that most of this town seems content to sheep me

Well this is the bone of contention, isn't it?

Here's my view of events:

1. You say you're tired of being the one to start wagons.
2. Rob says no wait you're not the one doing it.
3. You say yeah see look at EXHIBIT A boom case closed.
4. Rob says EXHIBIT A is BS because EA unvoted to make you the wagon leader check out EXHIBIT B
5. You do... things?

My problem with this exchange is that instead of just proving Rob wrong (which would fit your Rob-as-scum agenda amirite?) you have chosen instead to dodge this by calling it stupid. If it was stupid then I don't see why you couldn't just prove it was stupid and make it go away. So help me understand why you're taking this stance here.

[RobCapone]

I don't see penpen active lurking.

You didn't answer this, here it is again:

so really, try and come at me again bro because your response to my case just got disproven.

Not really, I'm going to ignore you. I don't seem to have six others game for lynching you today, and I'd rather find your buddies then sit around and get baited. I admire running cover for them in this circumstance, I really do, but I don't feel like playing.

This is a bad answer.

subgenius (L-2): GreyICE, Ashblade, RobCapone, Barry Allen, Bill McQuill

Please explain where this came from and why it was sufficient to answer Rob's point.

Because Rob's point is really stupid. I'm tired of the fact that most of this town seems content to sheep me (and I guess EA, although that looks like just Rob) or nitpick/cheerlead from the sidelines, rather than doing anything that resembles proactive scumhunting. It's gotten a little better since I posted that, but I really don't see the big deal in noting it.

He blows that up into that huge liar case? I can't tell if that's fucking stupid or fucking scum, and at this point I don't care, since no one is lynching him with me today, so I'll just ignore him.

My post disproved your response to my case, you have not disproven my case

your pre-game post =/= starting a wagon
you being 2nd on subs until the 4th count PROVES YOU WERE LYING
I pointed out you quickly voted someone after somebody else did, your only true first vote was the subs counter wagon on me cause you knew you were guilty of sheeping and instead of trying to clear your name off the list you think anyone else who wants to clear their name can easily attacked, which you did.

That is scummy play. Like I said EVERYONE on that list should be trying to explain how their votes were not sheeping. Contrary to your self inflated opinion I started the terribad EA wagon not you.

[RobCapone]

Dude, lynch chaining?

That a scum tactic through and through. "Well look at these two people! If one of them is town, the other MUST be scum! So we should lynch one to see if they're scum, then lynch the other!"

If you're truly town and you made that argument, go out back for a bit, and think about what you have done.

Well Im going to add lynch chaining to my list of things that most people consider a scum tell that I have done as town. I think I have proven every scum tell wrong in the game.
I use reactions and reasonings and don't rely on "scum tells" written by someone else

[RobCapone]

And Ice, please answer my question

what made you change your read from scum to town on bill

[RobCapone]

@ ice, couple more questions

1. If you are so sure I'm scum why did you change your vote to the same person subs is voting for in the very post right after subs
2. If you are winning to lynch pen first, why are you not voting him
3. Earlier you said you think bill will flip town, but later you say you will bw him after pen
A. Why bill if you said you think he will flip town?
B. Why not me since you are convinced I'm scum

These answers will give the rest of the players in this game a better indication of your allignment so please don't ignore them

[RobCapone]

Ebwop

willing not winning

[GreyICE]

@ ice, couple more questions

1. If you are so sure I'm scum why did you change your vote to the same person subs is voting for in the very post right after subs
2. If you are winning to lynch pen first, why are you not voting him
3. Earlier you said you think bill will flip town, but later you say you will bw him after pen
A. Why bill if you said you think he will flip town?
B. Why not me since you are convinced I'm scum

These answers will give the rest of the players in this game a better indication of your allignment so please don't ignore them

1) Because no one wants to lynch you to day, so what good is my vote lying on a piece of scum that no one is going to lynch?
2) Because I don't think pen is the best lynch. I don't think bill is either. Bvoight is being entirely evasive and worthless, and his sheep vote was based on straight up not even reading what I wrote. How is Bill doing worse than Bvoight? He's not.
3) When did I say this?
3A) What does this even mean?
3B) Gimme six votes and I'll hammer. Or I'll tell you what. Gimme five, I'll vote, and you can hammer yourself like you asked. I'm not getting those votes, I've laid out the arguments, since then you've gotten scummier and scummier. So what the fuck ever, no one is interested in lynching scum here.

P.S. Bonus section, why I've started to like BMQ:

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p2806824 - feels townie to me, some solid questions and analysis.
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p2809880 - following the game, has a solid reason for his beliefs
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 7#p2811417 - continued pressure.

I see no real acts of distancing, no random FOS, no one trying to help him out, no obvious signs that he's scum. He responds well to pressure.

P.P.S. Rob, you're terrible.

[GreyICE]

@Zito: Will you be one of my five people I need if he's scum? We can get him to L-1 and watch that glorious scum self-hammer.

[RobCapone]

@ ice you said this

[quote]Bill hasn't done anything pro-town. The problem is, I have a suspicion he will flip town.[/b]

yet later you say you will still wagon him after you wagon pen

so if you suspect bill is gong to flip town, why are you still willing to wagon him?

The purpose is wagon the people you think are going to flip scum, not people you think will flip town

[RobCapone]

Fucking fml I can't even quote right

[subgenius]

I really, really wish we could have waited for Bill to defend himself rather than pressuring Grey to do it for him.

[RobCapone]

EA mentioned this already, but I do not like this post at all. You totally ignored his actual case, and basically used self-meta to clear yourself. What's your response to his point about Ashblade? Why did you call him scum in one post and obvtown in another?

So not only are you posting garbage, you're not even reading the damn thread and blatantly sheeping others cases?

Vote:bvoight

Maybe if you put one lick of effort into the thread you'd have done one single thing this thread that wasn't scummy. But you haven't. If we don't lynch you someday, you're still going to be alive at LyLo, because either you're scum, or you're town so dumb that you CAN'T EVEN READ THE THREAD.

Call me naive but when is not reading the thread is a scumtell? I'd imagine scum would benefit from reading actually

Can you point out how you know he isn't reading, I'm not sure what his post is even talking about to begin with , I'd like to re-read what you both are discussing but cand find it quickly on my phone

[GreyICE]

Rob, what are you even talking about at this point? I'm going to wagon bill after I wagon someone I'm not even voting for?

You want there to be a case so badly you're making shit up.

As for bvoight voting for someone without even having a decent reason for his vote to be there, yes. Scumtell. Town needs to lynch scum, they need to have reasons for their vote. Scum know who all the town are, they're just looking to toss down votes and make it through the day.

[Papa Zito]

@ ice you said this

Bill hasn't done anything pro-town. The problem is, I have a suspicion he will flip town.

yet later you say you will still wagon him after you wagon pen

so if you suspect bill is gong to flip town, why are you still willing to wagon him?

The purpose is wagon the people you think are going to flip scum, not people you think will flip town

I went back to find this and you took his sarcasm literally. He was comparing Bill to penpen and saying there was virtually no difference. He didn't say he was actually going to wagon Bill.


@Grey, you're

still

avoiding the question and now I'm really concerned.

I really, really wish we could have waited for Bill to defend himself rather than pressuring Grey to do it for him.

Eh?

[RobCapone]

^ hmm I think you may be right, i'll re-read again when I get to a PC

[GreyICE]

@Zito:

Are you talking about why I am not making the case to lynch Rob today? I want five townies who tell me they'll lynch a claimed power role day 1 before I bother. Otherwise it fills up this thread and adds nothing. If I could argue until I'm blue in the face, and there aren't five other people willing to give him that lovely opportunity to self-hammer, it just runs cover for all the other scum. I'd rather track down one of his partners, convince y'all that the partner is scum, and let Rob be. Not like he won't be under attention and pressure for the rest of the game as a claimed power role.

Fuck, I'm not even sure he is the best lynch today, because of exactly that. He is NEVER going to be under the radar. Never.

[Papa Zito]

Flaking is not Rob's MO, sure.

What I'm talking about is:

1. You say you're tired of being the one to start wagons.
2. Rob says no wait you're not the one doing it.
3. You say yeah see look at EXHIBIT A boom case closed.
4. Rob says EXHIBIT A is BS because EA unvoted to make you the wagon leader check out EXHIBIT B
5. You do... things?

My problem with this exchange is that instead of just proving Rob wrong (which would fit your Rob-as-scum agenda amirite?) you have chosen instead to dodge this by calling it stupid. If it was stupid then I don't see why you couldn't just prove it was stupid and make it go away. So help me understand why you're taking this stance here.

I still don't understand why you refuse to answer this point unless you just simply can't and you've been caught.


Gawd this is gonna hit 27 pages soon on Day 1 of a Mini Normal harf.

[subgenius]

Eh?

We've all been waiting for Bill to reappear and address his wagon. I'd personally prefer him to do it from scratch rather than building on points Grey has made. Maybe I'm overreacting. All I can say is that I'm really interested in Bill's next post.

[Papa Zito]

I am too. I feel like Rob/Zito/Grey is dominating the thread far too much.

Really missing Snake Eyes atm.