Mini 1126 - Game over - Was Averagely Suspicious saved?

[AGar]

Rob's reactions haven't been kosher with me, and his worry about Pod Person putting him as scummy, citing his claim, isn't coming from a town mindset. He shouldn't care unless he's being run up again, at which point he can show concern, but right now there's no reason to be like "You can put me in town and move along." It's like he doesn't want any attention.

[RobCapone]

Getting ready to get on a plane, sorry bout the V/LA Ill try to check in when I can


Agar - you don't see the town motivation of the tracker not wanting people to waste the week leading up to the deadline, talking about lynching him when town needs to focus on catching scum?

Yeah I don't want attention on me cause I am town tracker and debating if I am scum or not is wasting time. I'm sorry you don't beleive me but I'm telling the truth.

Plus you have seen me play as scum AGAR (and if you were part of that hydra with Weird which I think you were) you have seen me as town.

I suck at changing my meta, I'm obvious town. So deal with it.

[Papa Zito]

^^ This is exactly the kind of overdefensiveness he's trying to highlight.

Apparently overdefensiveness isn't a word.

[AGar]

Dear RobCapone,

First - see Papa Zito's #1027.

Second, I don't believe in meta. It's garbage. So a self-meta defense does nothing but make me want to lynch you for stupidity.

-AGar

[RobCapone]

Dear Agar and Ziti,

being defensive is an emotional reaction to a perceived attack or challenge against a person when said person beleives the information to be inaccurate.

I know I am town and anyone who continues to call me scum or doesn't beleive me is attacking me, being defensive is a normal human emotion, over-defensive behavior is common among people who are often challenged or attacked.

You Wang to lynch me? Like I said go ahead and do it, I won't care if town doesn't have a tracker anymore, you clearly have nothing better to do if you'd rather lynch a town power role so that would prove you aren't interested in catching scum.


Agar - meta is what it is, you don't beleive in it than you are using stupidity cause meta is a powerful tool.

I am defensive cause I know what I am. I didn't start looking scummy to people (othere than hiraki) til GreyIce started in that me explaining why I should not be on zito's list was some sort of admission of guilt and than I got to L-2 (iirc) in like half a day. Ever since I have been forced to defend myself and I'm tired of it.

I'm done defending myself, lynch me or stfu. Those are your 2 options.

Sincerly,

RobCapone

[subgenius]

[sarcasm]Guys, don't you understand? He says he's a town PR, and we know he's telling the truth, because a town PR would never lie. It makes total sense and isn't at all circular. [/sarcasm]

I'm done defending myself

Thank goodness, because your defense sucks.

[RobCapone]

If someone wants to put together a case on why I am scum, maybe I can defend that but right now I'm being accused of being scummy for defending myself against accusations that I'm scummy which started because grey felt me explaining why I voted EA and Subs was an admission of guilt or something. WTF ?

Btw if speed of wagons really mean anything

pod and hiraki should be confirmed scum based on that, cause those wagons are deadlocked right now.

And pod looks especially bad for essentially only having Zito and EA as his town reads.


Off to the hotel, thank god for my phone, maybey LA won't be so limited afterall.

[bvoigt]

I don't really buy the case on Rob.

[AGar]

Dear Agar and Ziti,

being defensive is an emotional reaction to a perceived attack or challenge against a person when said person beleives the information to be inaccurate.

I know I am town and anyone who continues to call me scum or doesn't beleive me is attacking me, being defensive is a normal human emotion, over-defensive behavior is common among people who are often challenged or attacked.

You Wang to lynch me? Like I said go ahead and do it, I won't care if town doesn't have a tracker anymore, you clearly have nothing better to do if you'd rather lynch a town power role so that would prove you aren't interested in catching scum.

^ This is bad.

Agar - meta is what it is, you don't beleive in it than you are using stupidity cause meta is a powerful tool.

Can you believe I've won a significant number of games as town and

never used meta

? So I must be doing something right, because y'know, I'm calling scum out properly in games.

I am defensive cause I know what I am. I didn't start looking scummy to people (othere than hiraki) til GreyIce started in that me explaining why I should not be on zito's list was some sort of admission of guilt and than I got to L-2 (iirc) in like half a day. Ever since I have been forced to defend myself and I'm tired of it.

I'm done defending myself, lynch me or stfu. Those are your 2 options.

Sincerly,

RobCapone

Is this a threat? I think it might be.

Like I said, luckily for you, Hiraki is a bigger issue at hand right now.

I don't really buy the case on Rob.

So you're saying that him telling another player, in all seriousness, "Put me as town and ignore me, because I claimed tracker" is a town-motivated thing to do?

[pod person]

@Hiraki
So you've concluded that Bill replaced himself, and you have no theories about why or how it might be worth thinking about? That seems extremely implausible to me.
For the record, the idea of Bill replacing himself seems absurd to me, but if it were proven to be true, I'd want him lynched asap.

Do you have any reasoning why someone would randomly start an account in Feb. and join this game, randomly?
Not to mention, he replaced. Do you see newbies replace? How often do alts. replace?
Thinking about it more, I do believe you make a valid point. I was thinking of a different reason for secrecy, but I'm becoming ever so increasingly doubtful of it.

Unvote, Vote: Pod

wow. you're scum. i can't wait to read the second half of the thread. which i will be doing after reading all recent posts.

i apologize but something came up and i no longer have time to post tonight. i most definitely will post something tomorrow.

That, right there, is a classic Bill move.

it is called "having a life" which means things come up that are more important than a game on an internet forum.

I suck at changing my meta, I'm obvious town. So deal with it.

this is pathetic. let me try:
"i am obvious town, screw you."
i'm now confirmed town as well by your logic.

Btw if speed of wagons really mean anything

which it really doesn't.

pod and hiraki should be confirmed scum based on that, cause those wagons are deadlocked right now.

which is false.

And pod looks especially bad for essentially only having Zito and EA as his town reads.

town can vote town. do you think everyone on the greyice wagon was scum?

I don't really buy the case on Rob.

you didn't read the case on rob, then.

off to read this thread, starting from the top of page 21.

[RobCapone]

Misrep much? Cause that's not what I'm saying.

Pod asked why I'm not dead yet, when you have a PR claim you have to choose do I beleive him or not

if you do - move on

if you don't than you have 2 choices

Lynch me or let the "real" pr figure it out

Town chose to let the "real PR" figure me out

if you don't want to wait, like I said lynch me but I'm honestly telling you the truth that my claim is real. If I could prove it somehow I would.

So again if you want to lynch me, do it and live with the consequences or let me do my job the best I can.

Speed of a wagon question = town clarification question

EA got to 4 votes in an hour and a half and got to L-2 in 2 hours and 52 minutes - so this makes him town according to Zito.

I got to 4 votes in 26 minutes and L-2 in an hour and 9 minutes - but I am scum yet my wagon was faster than EA's

can somebody please clarify the whole speed of a wagon theory to me because this post by AGAR who by his own admission has SO MANY GAMES ON THIS SITE SO HE MUST BE RIGHT seems to make sense for EA but not for me and I want to know why

I think you're one of the few getting confused here.

well yeah when someone can declare EA as town for no reason other than the speed of his d1 wagon, and than gets mad when people vote him, that is confusing.

speed of a wagon means jack shit. I have seen scum wagons develop fast just like town wagons.

And I've seen scum action A happen just as many times as town action A.

I have 45+ games onsite.
You don't.

I'm pulling an experience card here. Wagons like that don't just "happen" on scum.

Tell me, do you have a legitimate reason for suspecting EA?

If speed of a wagon clears EA than it motherfucking clears me because my wagon was faster and I got to L-2 super fast which is why I felt the need to claim.

[RobCapone]

damn meant to bold the following by Agar

I have 45+ games onsite.
You don't.

I'm pulling an experience card here. Wagons like that don't just "happen" on scum.

[subgenius]

it is called "having a life" which means things come up that are more important than a game on an internet forum.

Yeah, I understand that. Take it easy.

[RobCapone]

L-3 in 23 minutes.

Off of what? Explaining that I started the EA wagon and I didn't sheep with my vote on subs.

Yeah that's a convincing reason to get someone to L-2 in an hour

[RobCapone]

Ebwop : 26. Would not want to be callied a liar over 3 minutes

[mozamis]

if rob is scum, he's making a pretty damn good defence. I don't really see why we are getting so worked up about rob.

[pod person]

rob's 502 is a perfect example of why he's scum.

You advocate always lynching a claimed power role day 1?
Learn better theory

warning: theory discussion, skip if not interested
theory says that scum can claim a power role and then claim to be roleblocked every night following. it puts town in a tough situation: if the player is town, they're outed and most likely useless (likely to either bite a nightkill or a roleblock), and if they're scum, their claim will make town more hesitant to lynch them. plus they can just claim the roleblock every night following without raising eyebrows for at least a couple of days.
i personally believe that a claim should not have any impact on a player's perception of another player unless the claim is provable (for example, a vigilante; but that can also be a serial killer claiming vig.)
end theory discussion
penpen 527 deserves a few facepalms.

yeah I don't want town to vote me but I am trying to point out your behavior over the last 2 or 3 pages is sketchy

the phrasing here is how a scum would say this, not a townie. "i don't want town to vote me" because "i'm scum" is what he means here.

I read Barry, reading bill now. Ill say that so far ash is spot on about Barry

Vote:Barry Allen

Pie is OK - but not cake.....the cake is a lie...

this is actually an awfully good case for penpen-scum.
subgenius has gradually found his way off my scumlist over the course of the past few pages. i read his posts and i think "that's a good catch" or "like that post". can't really cite a specific post but he's probably not scum if my list of suspects is any testimony to that.
rob 607 - has barely mentioned grey all game, and as soon as a wagon forms, rob jumps right on the first chance he gets. tell me the town motivation. i don't see it.

Dude, lynch chaining?
That a scum tactic through and through. "Well look at these two people! If one of them is town, the other MUST be scum! So we should lynch one to see if they're scum, then lynch the other!"

quoted for truth.

Vote: Papa Zito

For convincing me to vote to lynch a townie.

welcome back to the scumlist. you hammered of your own will, with no warning. probably to set up this exact vote.

Anyway, on GreyIce obvious suspect seems to be PenPen for dropping the hammer.

And dropping the hammer is suspicious how?

Thats why i said it was obvious. Maybe too obvious. But surely the last person to vote has to be a bit suspect? If I were scum, i know i would be quite keen to make sure a townie was lynched ASAP.
You don't find it suspicious then?

hammering is not, never has been, and never will be a scumtell. quickhammering on the other hand...
okay it's been bugging me now. barry, either use vote tags or type the vote up itself. seeing "vote: vote: <player>" so many times is just annoying.

Another reason to blame him, only scum purposely messes up quotes;)

it sounds like you're using this as a serious reason to vote him. why would town actually think this is legit? they wouldn't.

hmm... i want to take this time to post something that came to mind just now.
let's compare/contrast the two replacees on super-lurker slots.
bvoigt is one of the few people who actually sounds like he believes every word he says... he's town.
mozamis, on the other hand, hasn't done anything to improve the hayker slot. posting more, yes. but there's so many logical leaps and stretches that it's hard to take anything he's posting seriously. it looks like fake-scumhunting, and i've never seen town that fake-scumhunts.

Look at that wagon D1. They don't build that fast on scum, almost ever. Wagons on scum take time to get up to speed.

they can and have. bad.

Mozami - Stop with the BS reads, start posting real suspicions or die. Die quickly, too.

i endorse the above statement. but why didn't you vote mozamis?

And we're at full strength again as pod person replaces Bill McQuill.

best post in the game so far.
reached my first wall, skipping to new posts...
1039 is a good example of scum paranoia.

and that's it. got a bit lazy with the second half oh well it wasn't much of importance anyways.
i've read the entire thread now but am confused as to why he's being voted. frankly the only scummy thing i've seen is his terrible reason for voting me, but that was post-hiraki wagon forming, so i must not get it.
or maybe because i started skimming some near the end. still.
i didn't see any particularly town things either though so.

scum (ranked):
rob
agar
mozamis
barry

town:
zito
erratus
bvoigt
subgenius

that one loner in the null group:
hiraki

vote: rob

[Hiraki]

How am I null? You just called me scum a moment ago.

Mozamis: There's a defense? This is the classic bull that I've attempted to put up with during this game.

[mozamis]

Sorry mr. Sensitive

say somebody said you stole his baseball card, would you go hang out at the arcade with him?

I claimed to not waste town's time anymore, you are wasting discussion time

ooh I said I'd self vote, I have done it 3 times as town, probably more

look

Unvote, vote RobCapone

I did it again

unvote

vote scum hiraki

So thats Rob's post 502. I don't see anything scummy there, just a guy who is annoyed at being under suspicion.Why is that scummy to you?

[mozamis]

Mozamis: There's a defense? This is the classic bull that I've attempted to put up with during this game.

Sorry, not being rude but i genuinely don't understand your point

[subgenius]

How am I null? You just called me scum a moment ago.

I agree with this point

Also, answer these questions from last page, please:

Also, do you think pod person is a gimmick, or do you still think he is Bill in disguise? If he is a gimmick, why do you find this to be scummy?

Also, what was the reason for secrecy you had in mind when you wrote:

I was thinking of a different reason for secrecy, but I'm becoming ever so increasingly doubtful of it.

Also,

I think it's pretty obvious that Bill is pod. But here's my question. What's the point.

Why did you dismiss the importance of Bill subbing in for himself if you had a theory that he was being secretive for a reason?

[subgenius]

@Pod Person
I consider your catch-up a pretty good summary of the game, but:

1)I'd like to hear why we should lynch Rob today rather than waiting another day to see if something useful comes out of him.
2)Am I correct in assuming that Agar makes the second slot due to penpen's actions, or do you also think Agar has been acting scummy?
3)I'm not clear on why Barry is on your list (although I'm glad to see him there).

[Hiraki]

I'm asking what defense Rob is presenting. The only thing I see is, "lmao. im town tracka. no more defending from this point forward because im town."

[bvoigt]

I'm asking what defense Rob is presenting. The only thing I see is, "lmao. im town tracka. no more defending from this point forward because im town."

He's also drawn attention to the speed of his wagon.

[subgenius]

@Hiraki
If you don't answer my questions, I'll be forced to assume that you have no reason to think that pod person is scummy and are voting him anyway in an obvious attempt to bolster the competing wagon. I would hope that anybody watching would arrive at the same conclusion.