Mafia 126 - Lovers Mafia! [Game Over]

[Kise]

mod: i believe u may want 2 read praypiot's very last post in the kise/implosion qt.

*whistlewhistlewhistle*

[Purple Orange]

I'll take that as a "haha, not answering"?

What about the "Were you referring to other people's reads" part? Can I at least have that?

I already shut down every reason you had for "suspecting" me.

You wound me with your scarequotes.

And no you didn't. But I haz new stuff anyway. And a cohesive metanarrative to boot. (And I think you may have missed a post back there where I talked about some stuff that tipped the balance for me, so maybe it has even more new stuff!) I just wanted to clarify the above point with you before finishing. :/

[SensFan]

Espeonage - 7 (Mariyta, Nero Cain, Kise, Dram, Ashblade, Llamarble, Tragedy)
Tragedy - 2 (Espeonage, GreyICE)
Kise - 1 (Purple Orange)

Not Voting - 6 (xRECKONERx, EmpTyger, PrayPiotr, Hiraki, werewolf555, antihero)

9 to lynch.

---

Maryita and werewolf555 have requested replacement. They will be replaced as soon as possible, in that order. At the moment, no other slots have a pending replacement.

[Kise]

Okay.. so ur supposed to be sold on me as scum, right? If so, why are you still questioning me / trying to figure me out? Your continued q&a method comes across more as you trying desperately to find SOMETHING to use against me. I'm tempted to completely ignore you because ur dragging me in circles.

[Kise]

I Need A Lover That Actually Works Without Batteries.

[xRECKONERx]

So Mariyta/werewolf have requested replacement.

This is... interesting. Mariyta has been vaguely scummy all game, and a replacement might give us new perspective... but it also gives the replacement the excuse of "Lol, I'm not Mariyta!" in order to completely erase the scumminess of that slot. werewolf, on the other hand, has been essentially nonexistent, but luckily we know that that slot is already town, due to dram being obvtown, due to meta. Or at least, to me.

[GreyICE]

Is there seriously 16 people in this game? It feels like 5 or 6.

[Purple Orange]

If anything, I've found I hate doing things indirectly. :p I actually wanted to lay things out as cleanly and straight as I could today, as soon as possible. Because I suck at subtlety, and because it's the fastest and best and fairest way to get to the bottom of things, and because if you're town, I want to get this cleaned up and over with. (And yeah. You still make posts that makes me go "town????" and "maybe I'm wrong.") Ended up asking you questions again today, however, because I didn't want to misrep you, or be subject to that accusation. And because I thought there was some ambiguity that you could wiggle out of if I didn't nail you down to an answer.

[xRECKONERx]

TIME FOR A CLAIM TO SPICE THINGS UP

I'M A DOCTOR

/s

[Tragedy]

I'M A FUCKING MASON-LOVING ENCRYPTOR. FEAR ME.

[Espeonage]

TIME FOR A CLAIM TO SPICE THINGS UP

I'M A DOCTOR

/s

CCed

[xRECKONERx]

VOTE: ESPEONAGE

LYING SCUM

[Purple Orange]

Anyhoo. Not something to die on a hill over. So. Quick things first.
* You really don't seem to grasp the idea of day-bound/circumstance-bound lists. I'm reading Grey as fine lynching everyone but Reck and dram if push comes to shove, but certainly not seeing it as the ideal plan. Also, even assuming your premise...

at least he bit the bullet and named the people he wanted to lynch

.
* Yes, I considered the possibility that you really are just obstinate town with a philosophical objection to giving townreads. Now at least I know that's what you're claiming.
* The fact that you meant "everyone else's townreads"

is precisely part of why I have a problem with you.

(Um...see below).
===========
Straight up as I can.

Kise is scum because he's been quite adeptly avoiding risk, reads, and responsibility for lynches the entire thread. A pattern to which the quicklynch proposal serves as a fitting capstone

.

Kise's tunneling on me/Espy is null, and he can be as uncharitable in his interp of Espy and myself he'd like. What's NOT null is a pattern of risk-avoidance, read-avoidance, and responsibility-avoidance. And THAT is what Grey noticed (through all his misfires), that's what Espy noticed (though he sucked at putting it into words), and that's what makes Kise's quicklynch-in-a-row proposal so darn problematic.

Kise hasn't given a townread all thread. Why? It's damn risky. (And by his "if they flip scum, you'll be next because you defended them" threat to Grey, he's well aware of this).

For the same reason, he's stuck with just a couple targets all thread. Reck/Nero/Espy/me. With a dash of Emp, and a salvo at wolf and Traj. (He's added a salvo at Ashblade recently.)

And it's why he's been offwagon, not-voting, late-voting, and/or late-to-give-an-opinion so many times. Only the llama-pair looks worse than him. (Which is part of why my llama townread threw me for a loop).

I think it's also why he proposed the quicklynch-in-a-row thing. It's a way of avoiding direct responsibility for the lynches that would occur over the next three to four days. One can blame the lynches on community consensus -- and chalk up any participation in them to just "helping out the town by cleaning up the deadwood everyone wants to get rid of." And the bonus of minimizing connections/associations doesn't hurt. (I give a longer treatise on the thing underneath the spoiler in that one post. But that's the gist of it).

And it's why he dodged my question about WHO exactly the people were that he thought should be lynched, and WHO the "highest rated townreads" were that should be exempt from the lynch. He doesn't want to name them yourself. He wants to ride along with the sweep of the town.

And, yeah, a bit of this: "Am also giving an uncharitable interpretation to the CAPSRAGE post (which I feel was a planned and forced attempt to distract from what I was asking him) and the followup in which he tries to blame me for making him do it. "

tl;dr

- vote kise, he's scum

[Purple Orange]

VOTE: ESPEONAGE

LYING SCUM

Reck. We're like at L-1 now, and probably gonna die...soon. Mind giving a reason why you think we're actually scum? And, meh - why you want to probably get us killed before Akira has a chance to vote/comment in here after completing the thread?

[Espeonage]

That last one is the least of the problems.

ONE QUESTION FOR EVERYONE:

Which are we going to lynch first, Kise or Tragedy? Answer with a vote please.

[Hiraki]

Y'know. I'm 3 Quaters done with the thread. But I really want to hammer it.

[xRECKONERx]

oh shit

unvote

holy fuck I was kidding

[xRECKONERx]

I'd rather lynch Tragedy over Kise.

Vote: Tragedy

I'll park my vote here for now. Not voting for Kise today, and tbqh, PO's towniness weighs out Esp's lack of towniness.

Though the pain that the Esp wagon is having in actually getting pushed through is worrisome, as either that means Esp is scum and his scumbuddies are trying to stop the lynch, or he's town and scum is already on the wagon.

[Tragedy]

@RECK: Why so~? So basically, you're calling me town, but you're voting me as scum.
...Huh?~

[xRECKONERx]

Espeonage - 7 (Mariyta, Nero Cain, Kise, Dram, Ashblade, Llamarble, Tragedy)

Tragedy - 2 (Espeonage, GreyICE)
Kise - 1 (Purple Orange)

Not Voting - 6 (xRECKONERx, EmpTyger, PrayPiotr, Hiraki, werewolf555, antihero)

9 to lynch.

So out of those seven:

My lover is obviously town. Dram is town. Which leaves:
Kise (not voting for him).
Mariyta/Tragedy
Llamarble/Ashblade (right? didn't Ashblade replace DBE?)

If Esp isn't scum, then there is almost certainly scum in Maritya/Tragedy or Llamarble/Ash.
If Esp

is

scum, then his scumlovers would have to be somewhere in (GreyIce/Antihero; EmpTyger/Hiraki).

The only other option is that Esp isn't scum, and Kise is actually scum, and his lover just isn't here to help him push the wagon through.

[xRECKONERx]

If we lynch Mariyta/Tragedy first and get a scumflip, then Espeonage and PO are confirmed town IMO which helps us narrow it down quite a lot. If I were able to add Esp/PO to the townlist, then that would mean:

me/Nero
Dram/replacement
Espeonage/PO

Are all pretty much conftown (at least in my eyes), which would narrow down the lynch pool to: GreyICE/Antihero, Llamarble/Ashblade, Kise/PrayPiotr, EmpTyger/Thingyman.

Though, like I said, I consider Kise fairly townish, so in reality I'd only be looking at lynching one of the other three pairs.

[Espeonage]

Kise's partner is mia so that adds kise to the list. I know you think kise is town but just saying.

I do believe the town pool should be extended to have Grey/Anti and Emp/Thingy(replacement) as a subset in the probably town pool. That leaves Llama/Ash and Kise/PP as the next lynches. If somehow they are both town then we can move to the other two.

I'm just prioritising lynches here seeing as we're discussing this.

[Tragedy]

If Tragedy/Mariyta is lynched and a confirmed town-flip occurs..

I still suggest lynching...

PO/ESP <- PRAY/KISE <- DRAM/WW <- EMPTYGER/HIRAKI <- RECK/NERO <- LLAMARBLE/ASHBLADE <-GI/ANTIHERO

[Espeonage]

I can't tell if that that is a soft bus on kise/pp or trying to take partner's llama/ash out of the mix.

[xRECKONERx]

Kise's partner is mia so that adds kise to the list. I know you think kise is town but just saying.

I do believe the town pool should be extended to have Grey/Anti and Emp/Thingy(replacement) as a subset in the probably town pool. That leaves Llama/Ash and Kise/PP as the next lynches. If somehow they are both town then we can move to the other two.

I'm just prioritising lynches here seeing as we're discussing this.

Um, no way am I putting Emp/lover in that mix.

I can't tell if that that is a soft bus on kise/pp or trying to take partner's llama/ash out of the mix.

read: IN THE EVENT THEY FLIP TOWN