Newbie 1081: Showdown in Newbtown (Game Over, Mafia win)
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alnkpa Townie
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Well hello there,
I'd like to shortly introduce myself:
My name is alnkpa, but if that name is too difficult for you, you may call aln or alki aswell. As most of us, I am a newbie to MafiaScum. Though I am not really oblivious about the game (I just lost it btw). I already played some games on EM and on #mafia@globalgamers. I am in GMT+1, just so you know.
Although I don't really get the concept of RVS or why it is so important, I do:
VOTE: Zdenek, just because he took away my first option for RVS.
I wish everyone good luck and much fun.-
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alnkpa Townie
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1. As I stated before, I was playing on EM for about a year with some pauses in the middle. And I started playing on #mafia@globalgamers about a month ago. So I don't think I am really new to this game but I am to this site.startransmission wrote:1. What's your Mafia experience?
2. What's your favorite band?
3. What role/alignment do you prefer?
4. Do you find it harder finding scum, or convincing other people that you've found scum (the latter assuming you correctly identified someone as scum)?
2. Oh that's kind of a hard question, as I am not such a big fan of music. Though I like german rock/pop like "Sportfreunde Stiller" and "Wir sind Helden". You probably never heard of those, so I'm naming "Lenka" too, although she's just a singer-songwriter and not a band.
3. I prefer scum, to be honest. I like tricking people, setting them traps and generally seeing them run into those. So be cautious . Though it is possible, that I just like that more because my scum-finding skills are not the best. Which leads me to question 4:
4. I am good at stating facts and showing people how they come together to form a big solution but I am sometimes to oblivious to see some scumtells.
One question to the SEs/IC:
How do you vote in RVS? Rather one vote to stick to it or switching ones?-
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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I have the feeling, that Fatso's not really understanding the reasoning behind the accusations on him so let me rephrase and concentrate, mostly for me to have a resumé but for everyone to use:
Mainly, there are two things that may be scumtell-ish:
At first, Fatso was insisting on not to RVS. After Bulvious was mostly RVS-ing him he backed off quite hard reacting a little oversensitive. That could be seen as a scumtell. One could argue that Fatso was trying not to attract attention which he would if he would have been possibly the only one not voting. So he tried to make up a RV fast.
On the other hand, I wouldn't be to centered on Fatso only.
Why didn't you vote then? Until the end of RVS you didn't say one word. As startransmission phrased it 'flying under the radar'.Banana Stickers wrote:I certainly agree that sitting back and coasting through the RVS / RQS is bad news, since less input means less information we have to go on,
lynchking did almost the same but then hopped on the wagon for Fatso without any further explanation at first. Could you please explain that because I personally think RVS was over at that time.-
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alnkpa Townie
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To answer Bulvious' question: I think if I'd need to hammer, I'd go with a lurker aswell. Lurking seems much more scummy to me than a nolynch. Lurking is quite antitown as it withholds possibly important information for us. The nolynch wouldn't be so bad as we are not in a mylo/lylo-situation and me virtually hammering would render that nolynch void.-
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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True, although I personally think that you over-interpret it a little bit. Maybe he meant that with info we allotted over the course of this day to the next we may be able to have a clearer understanding of what was going on today. (Hopefully my crazy thoughts weren't to confusing for you as I see that the preceding sentence is a little bit confusing)-
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alnkpa Townie
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I don't think so. The question was the following:Zdenek wrote:Alnkpa, I think you misunderstood Bulvious' question. No lynch means voting for a no lynch. Of course I might have misunderstood your post.
And I think you mean the part of my answer in which I say that me hammering would render the vote for a no lynch void. I mean that if I hammered the vote for a no lynch wouldn't mean anything as this hypothetical situation would enable me to kill one of those two.Bulvious wrote:Sarah, obviously it's early in the day and making a choice based on three pages of info is difficult, but - if you had to place a hammering vote right now - where would it be? On a lurker? No lynch?
Everyone else is free to answer this, also.-
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alnkpa Townie
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Well Fatso, until now I didn't have you on my personal scum list, but now as you being quite sensitive about some accusations made against you I do. Although you were rather talkative the whole game you now seem to exaggerate. So many consecutive posts seem rather scummy to me. Why did you need to have 3 posts in a row to answer some questions?
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Fatso
Zdenek, could you please consider reasoning your votes as such seemingly random voting seems rather scummy to me.-
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alnkpa Townie
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For my accusation of Fatso:
I call something like that being sensitive though you may still correct me.Fatso wrote:Are you in a time warp or something?
This quote seems to me as if you were backing up to not attract attention. Two quite different emotions shortly one after another. I should clarify what I meant by "exaggerating": I talked about this backing up.Fatso wrote:Let me look back at the post, I haven't seen it in a while, and maybe I'm remembering in wrong. I don't think so though.
Maybe I wasn't giving examples, which is—and I don't want to conceal that—not good if you are voting someone. But I won't back up from my vote until I see someone who is attracting my scum-radar more than Fatso. Which is—and I am honest here—not sooo good.
Concerning the case of the triple post: Here you are right and I didn't think about it that we are not able to edit our posts. I personally just use the draft function so I can write a post and reread it. Especially for those big posts it's quite helpful.
I always feel a little bit irritated if someone just flashes up a vote with only a minimal explanation.Fatso wrote:
(I didn't really look at this before, seeing as it wasn't addressing me personally).alnkpa wrote: Zdenek, could you please consider reasoning your votes as such seemingly random voting seems rather scummy to me.
Seriously, what are you talking about? Not making much sense at all here.-
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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I think that it is a good move if we have any valid other reason to lynch the lurker and not another player who is more suspicious. I mean, if we somehow clearly or almost clearly know that somehow is scum it would be quite silly to lynch another one, right?Zdenek wrote:What are people's opinions of lynching the scummiest lurker?-
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alnkpa Townie
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Concerning Fatso's question to me:
Yes indeed you are still number one on my personal 'may-be-scum-list' although someone else got my attention too. Nevertheless it is still too vague to post my suspicion, so I'll try to find some more indications about that someone. Eventually I either will or will not state who it is based on my opinion.
Further, I am now a little concerned by your last posts that hadn't much content. Your arguing with Bulvious seemed over-the-top to me, especially as you were disputing over some dates which seemed rather unimportant to me. Could you explain why you had to clarify your date of posts more than one site?
About the thing about me being actively lurking:
I don't really see me actively lurking that much. Maybe I even did it in the last few days a bit but I'm going to answer all the thing in one.
Let me quote some things for you:Bulvious wrote:He has provided no original content.
And my post where I voted Fatso. Both of the time I posed questions in order to find scum. Both of the time I waited some time for answers as I am not that kind of person who bases his opinions about people on facts they hadn't the possibility to answer to and clarify it. The first time there did not come any response or even a slight reaction. Second, Fatso answered sufficiently detailed while Zdenek gave a one line answer that is still not thoroughly describing enough for me.alnkpa wrote:
Why didn't you vote then? Until the end of RVS you didn't say one word. As startransmission phrased it 'flying under the radar'.Banana Stickers wrote:I certainly agree that sitting back and coasting through the RVS / RQS is bad news, since less input means less information we have to go on,
lynchking did almost the same but then hopped on the wagon for Fatso without any further explanation at first. Could you please explain that because I personally think RVS was over at that time.
I know that I shouldn't feel personally attacked by people not answering my question and I normally don't. I felt like some people weren't taking me seriously. So I took a step back and tried to analyse in the background still waiting maybe someone would answer. I understand your case to some extend but I won't let myself be accused of having no original content whatsoever.-
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alnkpa Townie
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I take original content to be content that may be either a question or some kind of other contribution that nobody has brought up before. Apparently, I consider all my questions to be original.Bulvious wrote:Additionally, my only response for Aln are two questions:
What original content do you believe you have contributed specifically?
Are you implying that Zdenek is the secondary person with your attention in the end of your post?
Concerning the second question, I already stated that I won't say anything unless I have enough evidence.-
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alnkpa Townie
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Well as some stated that I am going along with it though I personally feel that someone who won't give out any motives just has none that would mark him pro-town.Zdenek wrote:
Succinctness is pro-town. People will read my one line reasons, and if they don't understand them, they can ask about them. Bulking up a post with unnecessary ramblings is useless at best and anti-town at worst.Alnkpa wrote: Zdenek gave a one line answer that is still not thoroughly describing enough for me.
I twice asked you to clarify the following:
Twice I got no answer. Anything to say to that?Zdenek wrote:Startransmission is scum for active lurking.
Oh and Fatso, could you please rephrase:
I am sorry, but I don't get the meaning.Fatso wrote:Oh, and alnkpa, do you have anything else to say in reference to my last post answering questions put forth in your last post in reference to me being scummy?-
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alnkpa Townie
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I fully agree with about active lurking being a scumtell. Nevertheless you could have outlined his lurking in one or two sentences.Zdenek wrote:I've always thought that active lurking is a pretty good reason to vote someone. What more do you want, an essay about why active lurking is scummy, a wall quoting startransmission's posts that show him not contributing? I can do both, but I fail to see the point. You can go look at his ISO and judge for yourself.-
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alnkpa Townie
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Seeing this conversation almost came to a halt, I'd like to pose some questions in order to let it stay alive.
Fatso, do you really think that you can project from a real world game of mafia to this board? In which way?
H3llo, do you agree with Fatso that one of the three mentioned by him (which includes you) might be scum? Who? Why?
Zdenek, would you like to defense against Fatso's arguments? How?-
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alnkpa Townie
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In the moment I don't have any new evidence against you. Though I don't have any new scumreads on anyone either (I confessed in my first post that I'm bad at scumreading) so I'll just let my vote linger on you considering there doesn't seem to be a wagon on you.Fatso wrote:alnkpa, do you still find me scummy (I know I've asked this before)? If so, why? Because there's really no reason voting for me if you don't have a case.
Welcome to the replacements chkflip and workdawg, I got a question for you: Do you already have things that catched your eye? Maybe even things that none of us noticed yet?-
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alnkpa Townie
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Although it might seem omgus-sy I'm gonna post this now considering I already had it as a draft and I just hadn't time anymore to complete it yesterday.
I myself think that Zdenek is quite sensitive now. He didn't wrote more than two lines of text most of the time as you can check all by yourself since it's quite obvious. And now he's so antsy to react with a big fat wall to some minor questions? That now aroused suspicion at me. First he is very concise and now he just won't stop talking?
As some of you already saw, I stated I have a suspect and it is indeed Zdenek. So I'm going to change my vote to him:
VOTE: Zdenek
A question apart from this to chkflip: How do those of my posts make me so town?-
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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I'll let people accuse me of many things, but not of being opportunistic. For that thing I'd like to see a thorough explanation 'cause that is IMHO a very harsh incrimination.Bulvious wrote:And if anyone is opportunistic, it's him[, aln].
Concerning your case about me being actively lurking: Did you missed my previous explanation?-
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alnkpa
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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I only feel stronger about him being jumpy as he wasn't a great talker all the time and now seems so talkative. For me it's interesting.
I did look at your town-meta. But is it really a meta? It's just analysing my posts, isn't it? Meta is imho more looking at posts from other games which I don't have any yet apparently.
Fatso is a null-tell at the moment for me. Don't have a strong opinion on him anymore.-
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alnkpa
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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Well, I'd like to quote those of my posts that were in my eyes scumhunting and hopefully we can work it out. I'd like to excuse already for the length of this post.
First, I agree that it took me a time to get in the game.
Here's my 4th post:
I both asked and pressured BS and lynchking. Do you need further explanation?alnkpa wrote:On the other hand, I wouldn't be to centered on Fatso only.
Why didn't you vote then? Until the end of RVS you didn't say one word. As startransmission phrased it 'flying under the radar'.Banana Stickers wrote:I certainly agree that sitting back and coasting through the RVS / RQS is bad news, since less input means less information we have to go on,
lynchking did almost the same but then hopped on the wagon for Fatso without any further explanation at first. Could you please explain that because I personally think RVS was over at that time.
Here I was asking someone for clarification. But it was a try to pressure on him/her (sorry, read in ISO so I don't know whom) as they could've been plain lying as well.alnkpa wrote:While agreeing to your aversion against quick-lynching, where did he say that?
Not as scumhunting as a regular question but nevertheless in anticipation of a response.alnkpa wrote:True, although I personally think that you over-interpret it a little bit. Maybe he meant that with info we allotted over the course of this day to the next we may be able to have a clearer understanding of what was going on today. (Hopefully my crazy thoughts weren't to confusing for you as I see that the preceding sentence is a little bit confusing)
Pressuring Fatso as well as posing a question to Zdenek.alnkpa wrote:Well Fatso, until now I didn't have you on my personal scum list, but now as you being quite sensitive about some accusations made against you I do. Although you were rather talkative the whole game you now seem to exaggerate. So many consecutive posts seem rather scummy to me. Why did you need to have 3 posts in a row to answer some questions?
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Fatso
Zdenek, could you please consider reasoning your votes as such seemingly random voting seems rather scummy to me.
My 9th post, that I don't want to quote as this post is already far too long: I take this as a expansion of my post before.
Post 12: Still pressuring on Fatso as well as a explanation to your accusations.
Post 14: Pressuring on Zdenek with post 15 expanding it.
Post 16: Nothing except scumhunting.
Post 17: Posing questions to chkflip and workdawg.
Post 18: Pressuring Zdenek in lieu with the following posts (I already said sorry about them).
Post 24: Getting chkflip back on track.
Post 26: Still pressuring on Zdenek. Still no answer btw.
I skipped about 10 posts that were either introduction or had something to do with my scumhunting posts. Any questions?-
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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alnkpa Townie
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Ok, sorry for my procrastination.
But I see not much has changed. I now have two very good reason to vote Zdenek. First and foremost, I still think he's scum. Still sensible, even ad hominem. I don't think I need to explain all of it, as either I or some other already did it and considering we don't have much time. Second, we don't have much time and there is no other wagon that seems possible for a lynch now.
That should explain enough now. Any questions?-
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alnkpa Townie
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One remark first: I was making this post before the day began, so don't be irritated if I don't go into posts that came in the new day. Furthermore I want to excuse myself for me being not active till the deadline, but it was early in the morning over here at about 7am. And I really didn't want to get up at 5am.
I'm sorry for the following wall, I'm just catching up. I marked the areas in which I was talking about one person for more than a quote for your convenience.
So you find it scummy that WD says he's bad at scumhunting though you aren't sure because as you say you are bad at scumhunting? You are contradicting yourself.Kard wrote:Re-reading all of his posts for the second time, and I can't find anything that stick out too scummy to me, except for his "i'm bad a scum hunting" and that's just a gut feeling, and there's a large chance it could be incredibly wrong, as I'm not experienced with scumhunting.
Why did you do that? Why weren't you bringing hard facts rather than softly attacking him?Workdawg wrote:To recap what Zd says about me that's ACTUALLY true:
I've taken a wishy-washy stance on HIM (because I didn't want to think he was scum just because his play rubs me the wrong way.)
I haven't been scum hunting that much, except for him. (Though I have prodded at a few others)
I "bulked up" my case against him with things that aren't scum tells (but they DO help establish context for my reads)
I can not really quote anything from st, but here I quite agree with Bulvious—which is rather exceptional. He didn't provide much content in the last days to the deadline.
Well h3llo seems to be the same. Not really providing anything. At least I had some sort of excuse.
Phew, some big wall. Did quite some catching up. Analysis of the current day coming soon.-
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alnkpa Townie
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@drmyshottyizsik:I don't think your tunneling on WD isn't very helpful so early in the day. I personally think it is the opposite. You're not even anwering any questions. I don't like it that you don't help town in any way. For instance, open up or atleast start talking to us as well.
You are going a way that is commonly referred to as WIFOM. You could just say that scum had that idea in mind when they didn't kill Bulvious just to let him look scummy … And so on. I don't think that is a good reason. Sorry.Kard wrote:Also, let me just say this, and I'll be waiting for someone to accuse me doing this because of your long post against me. Though, to be fair, I've had this theory since before N1 began. I personally think you're scum. Why? This might sound like a flawed reason, but you survived N1. Let's face it, you're the strongest person in the game, would scum really profit from letting you slide? I don't think so.
I think you can neither call that a scumtell nor a towntell. It was just the only option he had.Workdawg wrote:Lynching the cop D1 is obviously about as bad as it gets. The hammer by Kard, is curious at best. I *think* he was just waiting until the last possible second to do it to make sure Zd had a chance to claim, or to make sure we got a lynch in instead of a no-lynch with 4 votes against one player. I think both of those are pretty town plays, but at the same time, it'd take a pretty dumb scum to jump on the bandwagon at the end and NOT wait as long as possible.-
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alnkpa Townie
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