The Mafia with the Hydras - Game Over!

[DaSpotthatkillsu]

SKIMMING SCUM!!!

MY CASE WRITES IT SELF!

I'M NOT VOTING YOU FOR YOUR FOS ON GUMMY.

HELL NO.

YOUR TUNNEL ON MR IS WHERE MY SCRUTINY LIES.

NOW? YOU CAN'T TELL WHY I VOTED YOU?

LOL

JUST.... WOW...

[Greymarble]

Yos
Gummy

Unicorn Brethren

FONZI

AND THEN WE'RE ON THE SAME PAGE

[YosFlavouredCayke]

Spot: On that note, I want you to give a full case on YFC.

YFC: I'd like you to do the same for Daspot.

I've been pointing out scummy behavior on the part of DaSpot since literally my second post, back in February.

I'm going to bed now, but I'll be glad to put it all into one massive post tomorrow if you want. Until then, I'd recommend you just read my posts in ISO. or just read his posts in ISO, try to find any that make sense from a pro-town point of view.

[YosFlavouredCayke]

SKIMMING SCUM!!!

MY CASE WRITES IT SELF!

I'M NOT VOTING YOU FOR YOUR FOS ON GUMMY.

HELL NO.

YOUR TUNNEL ON MR IS WHERE MY SCRUTINY LIES.

So, you're voting me because I'm "tunneling on you"?

Nice.

Care to explain how me voting for you is a scumtell?

[DaSpotthatkillsu]

ME*

YOUR TUNNEL ON ME

THIS IS SCUMMY.

YOU HAVE NOT BACKED UP YOU TUNNEL

NOT ONE BIT

THERE IS NO ONE.

NO ONE

THAT SEES ME AS SCUM LIKE YOU. APPARENTLY IT'S OBVIOUS. WELP CLASS?

MAYBE YOU CAN EXPLAIN IT. ANYONE? FD? GUMMY? BALAM?

THEY SEE ME AS OBVIOUS SCUM... DO YOU ALL KNOW WHY?

IF NOT.. MAYBE IT'S NOT OBVIOUS THEN...

HRRRMMMMM

[DaSpotthatkillsu]

clarify:

if balam or FD or greymarble and the rest can't see your "obvious" case?

what case DO you have then?

[DaSpotthatkillsu]

pushing a crap case on us since the first posts...

get rid of it.

LYNCH IT WITH FIRE

[Greymarble]

Really, I've seen more reactions to the gummybear wagon in six hours than I saw to FES and DaSpot in the three centuries this day has lasted.

This means something.

[Lord Fonzi]

Past couple of pages:
Re: Copper question about UB's points we agree with...will go back and check in a few hours.

Oh look Lord's talking about animosity between heads...gofuckingfigure he'd allow that to waffle over his reads.

How are we waffling over our reads, exactly?

We're voting you, and stating that you are very scummy.

We have expressed a strong town read on UB. Since we're different people, it's obvious that there are going to be some issues we're not in unison over. The two reads to whom that really applies are FD and FES.

THIS

THIS ENORMOUS CHANGE IN READ

IT IS VERY SCUMMY

I give up

Now I may be missing something, but I don't see an inconsistency here. I'm pretty confused about what you're trying to get at.

At any rate, starting with the conclusion that we're scummy and only being able to find one thing to articulate this point is pretty pathetic. Surely you can trump something up like FD or Spot can.

Thanks for saying what I just said in your latest post. Do you just not want to agree with me?

[Greymarble]

Uh can we get a votecount? Immediately?

I'm not liking the change in DaSpot's play. Makes me think we're onto something with the gummybear wagon.

YosCake is town, stop trying to lynch them. It won't happen. I'm suspicious of everyone trying to line them up to die tomorrow if gummybear flips scum.

Incidentally, FD seems to have pulled a 180 here, without any thought given to it. I guess that's the benefit of playing like you're insane, no one gives it a second thought. Anyway, I did notice it, so there you go.

This post?

You mean the one where you FOS DaSpot for the Gummybear wagon, FOS everyone whose suspicious of Yos, and FOS FinalDestination?

I agree it's pretty scummy.

Outside of that, what the hell was

agreeable

about it?

[GummyBear]

Really, I've seen more reactions to the gummybear wagon in six hours than I saw to FES and DaSpot in the three centuries this day has lasted.

This means something.

... Which is? This post is useless.

Spot, you're reacting really, really poorly right now. I'm actually thinking whichever head is posting may be intoxicated.

[Lord Fonzi]

Uh can we get a votecount? Immediately?

I'm not liking the change in DaSpot's play. Makes me think we're onto something with the gummybear wagon.

YosCake is town, stop trying to lynch them. It won't happen. I'm suspicious of everyone trying to line them up to die tomorrow if gummybear flips scum.

Incidentally, FD seems to have pulled a 180 here, without any thought given to it. I guess that's the benefit of playing like you're insane, no one gives it a second thought. Anyway, I did notice it, so there you go.

This post?

You mean the one where you FOS DaSpot for the Gummybear wagon, FOS everyone whose suspicious of Yos, and FOS FinalDestination?

I agree it's pretty scummy.

Outside of that, what the hell was

agreeable

about it?

No that post was made after my question... So you can safely guess I wasn't referring to the future. There's a difference between a FOS, which is basically meaningless, and expressing suspicion. Learn it, it'll do you good.

[YosFlavouredCayke]

ME*

YOUR TUNNEL ON ME

THIS IS SCUMMY.

YOU HAVE NOT BACKED UP YOU TUNNEL

NOT ONE BIT

Even the claim that I've been "tunneling" on you is just horrible. I was actually pushing the Beaver wagon for much of the day, until you acted so utterly scummy that I just had to vote for you. You've been acting in a scummy way all game, of course, but for most of the game you were #2 on my suspect list. That's not what "tunnel" means. Also, "tunneling" isn't scummy anyway; 'OMG Yos has been attacking the same person for a while" isn't a case.

It's especally bad since earlier this game you were attacking US for moving his vote, and now you're attacking me for keeping my vote in the same place for a while.

Anyway; are you really going to try to claim I haven't explained the reasons that you're suspicious this game?

THERE IS NO ONE.

NO ONE

THAT SEES ME AS SCUM LIKE YOU. APPARENTLY IT'S OBVIOUS. WELP CLASS?

Do I have to go through and make a list of everyone who's found you scummy during the course of this game?

And, hey, even if I was the only one who thought you are scummy, that would also not be a case against me. It's not unusual for me to be way out in front of the rest of the town. It feels like your whole case is "YOS IS VOTING FOR ME AND I DON'T LIKE IT SO I'M GOING TO SPEND THE REST OF ETERNITY SPAMMING IN ALL CAPS THAT HE IS SCUM AND HOPE SOMEONE LISTENS TO ME."

THEY SEE ME AS OBVIOUS SCUM... DO YOU ALL KNOW WHY?

IF NOT.. MAYBE IT'S NOT OBVIOUS THEN...

So, your defense is that you don't think it's obvious that you're scum?

[Greymarble]

A few spot towntells:
Saying he wouldn't shut up unless instructed by Dana to do so
Being loud and excited about the game
Asking silly rules questions like "do scum have daytalk?" (town wondering is a bit more likely than scum pretending)

Spotscum in Lovers Multiball (ongoing but his faction's gone) got constantly chewed out by his lover for sinking their team and spent a lot of time profusely apologizing. So I do not see spotscum coming out headfirst and carefree to the degree he has here at all.

He's my strongest townread (and I think Grey's as well) and I remember noticing other things that make him town that I'll go back for if people are actually considering lynching him.

[Greymarble]

Of course, you're not going to explain yourself, either. At this point, you're just going to try to spam and clog up the thread with garbage until deadline to try to get the town to no-lynch. Well, it's not going to work.

Also this is comically reminiscent of how you tried to get me mislynched in Dilemma mafia.

[TheButtonmen]

The "Tick-tock" Vote Count:

Gummybear (4): LordFonzi, Balam, Greymarble, Final Destination
DaSpot (3): YosFlavouredCayke, SuperVanillaTownie, FrogErgoSum
FrogErgoSum (2): Copper, Gummybear
YosFlavouredCayke (1): DaSpot

Not Voting (1): Unicorn

With eleven alive it's six to lynch.

Still looking a re-replacment for SVT.
Smargaret is still offering to replace in if she can get another head, so should you know anyone interested please contact her.

Tentative replacement found!

DEADLINE: Day Two ends Saturday April 9th at 19:00 EST.

[DaSpotthatkillsu]

I STILL WANT AN ANSWER.

A CASE.

NOT JUST "lolreadthieriso"

I
WANT
UNDENIABLE
PROOF
THAT
GUMMY
IS
SCUM

THAT IS FINAL.

IF NONE OF YOU MORONS CAN PROVIDE SATISFACTORY RESULTS THE STOP TRYING TO ALL "LOLIAMAVETWATCHMEGETTHENOTSOOBVISCUMLYNCHED" AND LETS GO AFTER OBVI SCUM YOSCAYKESCUMBAGNEEDSTODIENOW.

this still stands.

that bit we quoted from yos came from when we were defending against the BW/SVT lynch.

honestly yoscayke, i'm SO honored. You want me dead so bad that you'll commit such a slip just for me...



i'm blushing! no really! I am!

[Final Destination]

Daspot, stop fucking posting.

As your top #1 town read in this thread, please listen to me and stop posting.

YosCayke is scum, yes, that fact will not go ignored by me. I'm not likely to die tonight anyway, so you can bet your ass I'll be on him in the morning. If not, well YOU certainly won't die and you can push him then.

In the meantime GummyBear is ALSO scum. Look now how she appeals to AGM "When's he coming back so you can move your vote off us!?? SRSLY"

AGM's already approved this vote, and all the posts I have made so far. Course it was retroactive approval since we haven't been on the same time lately, but its good enough. Our reads are in SYNCMODE and we are loving this Gummy lynch.

And yes I'd like to replace UB with Lord Fonzi now if I could, AGM talked about him awhile back but it isn't something I'll go into detail about today.

[YosFlavouredCayke]

Also this is comically reminiscent of how you tried to get me mislynched in Dilemma mafia.

You do realize that when I'm scum, i do my best to play exactally as I do when I'm town, including using the same type of arguments, right? That's an especially bad example, since in Dilemma mafia, my only goal for most of the game was to find and lynch the other scum group; I knew they were the only real threat to me. So that was all real scumhunting done by me in that game.

[Final Destination]

Wait...

You REALLY thought Marble was on the Blue scumteam? And that I was his buddy?

LOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOLOLOLO
LOLOLO
OLOLOOL
LOL
L

OLOLO

LOLO

That deserves a policy lynch right there. Hell DASPOTS reads are better than that.

Admit it, you were just tunneled and pissed your pants when I called you and DBE out as scum immediately.

[GummyBear]

In the meantime GummyBear is ALSO scum. Look now how she appeals to AGM "When's he coming back so you can move your vote off us!?? SRSLY"

AGM's already approved this vote, and all the posts I have made so far. Course it was retroactive approval since we haven't been on the same time lately, but its good enough. Our reads are in SYNCMODE and we are loving this Gummy lynch.

It's not about the vote, Fate, it's the total lack of reasoning (unless maniacal laughter counts as reasoning now). When you and AGM post together, your responses are measured, logical, readable, and pro-town.

[Final Destination]

Aw so you're mad that our vote was reasonless?

Why do you need REASONS? TO defend against?

Because... you're SCUM who wants to defend themselves?

Its certainly not because you want to get a READ on our alignment, you've already called us town and tried to buddy. So THATS not why you want to here the reasons.

BTW the reasons are in this post, and it isn't an elaborate breadcrumb, its as clear as day.

You've cared only about defending yourself, and you've shown no interest in finding scum. You've taken "stances" on issues so that things can move forward and townies can be lynched, but you've never given this game the TIME or INTEREST that a Town hydra would approach it with. You even have the gall to say "This game fucking blows" when your hydra itself is nearly 30% of the reason there's no content or nothing to debate.

Then you SCUM IT UP in here and say "let's only have these two wagons to completion. I think ONE of them is on scum, so yeah, let's lynch them both back to back pl0x."

"Oh wait, you guys are voting me? Thats STUPID! We haven't had a wagon on us all day!"

NO SHIT BECUASEY OU HAVENT POSTED A GODDAMN THING OF INTEREST IN MONTHS

"WHAaaaa SCUMPLAININGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG"


HEHEHAHAHAH DIE SCUM DIE.

[GummyBear]

Lynch away. Like I said, at least it will give us some information and get the game moving.

[Final Destination]

OH JOY.

THEY CLAIMED VANILLA TOWNIE!!!

NOW THE GAME WONT STALL

HAMMER ==========[ ]


(Btw Yoscayke is online right now... Oh he better ninja me with a vote on Gummy to salvage his town points. LYNCH ALL VANILLAS AINT THAT RIGHT YOS?

YOU INVENTED IT. YOUR OWN META HAS YOU IN A CORNER. YOU HAVE TO BUS! LOLOLOLOLOL)

[YosFlavouredCayke]

Anyway, since I promised to make a full case against DaSpot today, here it is. This is going to be a LONG post, because of the sheer volume and bredth of the scum tells DaSpot has committed so far this game is incredible, and the amount of evidence against him is overwhelming. Even with the length of this post, I'm still summerising some points of it, and I'm also going to skip some arguments that I find convincing but that aren't worth the effor of trying to convey. (Primarily, the process of elimination/ limited number of plausible scumtems argument, and the links to other scummy players argument.) I could talk about that stuff, but frankly I don't think I need to, the direct evidence is so large.

The fundumental thing about DaSpot is this.

He's not looking for scum

. Not at all. He pushes wagons, in what looks like various attempts to push through mislynches, but he's not consistant in his logic, he constantly misrepresents or lies about facts and the game state, he is completly lacking in townie curiosity. He combines this with massive posting, attempts to use emotion, volume, ALL CAPS, and whatever else he can to push various wagons, but he dons't ask questions, or if he does he dosn't care about the answers. At no point does he actually seem to be honestly thinking in order to try to figure out who the scum is. All this adds up to someone who is scum, who is trying to attack and mislynch various pro-town people, but who has absolutly zero interest in trying to find the scum, because he already knows.

Some specifics:

He is entirely careless about the facts. He consistently lies and misrepresents fairly obvious facts to push whatever argument he is currently on. This has been a running trend throughout the game; he tries to push wagons, generally on pro-town people, using false or badly misrepresented facts.

SOme examples:

His early case on Unicorn for "contradicting himself" was obviously very deeply logically flawed. I normally wouldn't make a big deal about an early-game case, but it's part of a pattern here.

His early case on Ether was entirely based on misrepresentations or logical errors:

Here are our scum reads. Kc and dana approved.

Pathetric

Posts 0-14
Says little of importance, posts a lot of fluff, and says that meta has value.
Post 15
Hypocritically tells someone else to post who the scum are.
Post 16
Puts some quotes together and votes without reasoning. It would help to know what the quoted posts do.
Post 25
Brushes off what Fate says and tells him to elaborate, something that they haven't done themselves. Yet another hypocritical command.
Post 29
Is wary of putting vote on their own scum read. "Feeling weird focusing on one person" has never happened to me as town.
Post 30
Takes pains to make sure everyone knows they are "obvtown", which obvtown wouldn't need to do.

Most of those points are either just factually incorect, or, at best, based on highly flawed logic. The claim that Ether "was wary of putting vote on her own scum read" is quite bizzare, considering she was voting for FD her own scum read at this point. Also, note that in this case through, he attacks Ether for not wanting to tunnel (""Feeling weird focuing on one person" has never happened to me as town") even though he's now claiming that tunneling is a scum tell. These kinds of logical consistancy errors are what I expect to see when a scum is just trying to ram bad cases through.

His case on FES here wasn't much better, with gems like this:

Post 18
Tries to explain why meta works here, and doesn't succeed, since Fate would normally be going crazy as scum, too.

All you have to do is look at FES' post that Spot links to here, and you'll see that this is a pretty horrible misrepresentation. FES's point was't that "fate is going crazy"; just the opposite. The point was that Fate is usually active and aggressive as town, and that he was not being active and aggressive this game. That seems like a valid and logical point to me, but what's relevent here isn't if you agree or disagree with it, it's that DaSpot misrepresents it (probably delibratly so) in order to make an attack against someone. Again, this is entierly consistant with "DaSpot is scum who is trying to fake scumhunting", but not at all consistant with "DaSpot is town who's honestly trying to figure out who the town is".


quote="DaSpotthatkillsu"]...Yos where the fuck are your scum reads???

...forget FES, the only person you found scummy thus far was a mislynch[/quote]

Another obviously untrue statment, where he claims that the only person I found scummy all game was US. Not only is this untrue, there's no chance that this could possibly be an honest mistake, considering how he was arguing with me about my suspicion of FD on day 1.

ISO 14
Says suspicion on us is reasonable because he disagrees with us, after just telling us that we were wrong to call UB scummy for disagreeing with them.

Partial misrepresentation. What I actually said was "I disgree with basically everything DaSpot's said and done all game".

ISO 36
Tries to place the blame on us for US being lynched because we "never really tried to defend him or argue against the wagon", as if arguing FOR another wagon does not accomplish the same thing in a better way.

Complete misrepresentation. I never "tried to blame him for US being lynched". I did make a case against DaSpot based on the discrepency between his comments after US's lynch and the comments before, but I never "blamed him for the lynch" or anything like that. I'll explain the US scumtell of DaSpot's again a little later in this post, but sufice to say this is another example of DaSpot not being especally interested in the truth, and only interested in what he can pretend the truth is in order to win an argument.

Also, in a bunch of recent posts, he keeps saying I "committed a scum slip" but seem completly incapable of explaining what it is (and if you think "tunneling on Spot" is "a scum slip", then you don't know what words mean.)

-Along with the lies and misrepresentations, there is a distinct lack of townie curiosity in the thread. For example, he asks me what I think about FES, and yet clearly doesn't care about the answer (dismissing it as "lame" and attacking me for using the word "obvious".) When I call him on that, he goes back and pretends to care, and he actually asks a decent question about my defense of FES:

... I just checked...

yos: please point it out?

when did he NOT openly vote beaver? I'd expect some kind of defense of beaver if he didn't like instead of saying why beaver was town he called the wagon scum.

But then, when I answered that, he dosn't seem to care about that answer either. He never responds to it, never comments on it, I don't even know if he read the answer to his own question. Again, if he was town, I'd expect him to be trying to get a stronger read on FES at this point; or, if he was town who was totally tunnelng on FES and convinced he was scum, I'd have expected him to question me to try to get a read on me and to figure out why I was defending him. He did neither. Again, all sings here point to "dosn't need to figure out who the scum are, dosn't care, because he already knows."

Speaking of already knowing who the scum are, let me get back to this point. I've talked about this before, but it bears repeating.

When US was slowly being wagoned towards a lynch, DaSpot never bothered to argue against it, even though he was around at the time. And yet, after he was lynched, but before the flip, he said:

.... you all are idiots.

Implying that he already knew US was going to flip town. Now, he had included US in a list of people he thought was pro-town earlier, but if he was town who was that confident of it, I'd have expected him to actually try to argue against the wagon. He didn't seem at all interested in stopping the wagon, but once it was done, he seemed to already know that US was going to flip town.

There is a wide variety of other scummy behavior from US; he self-contradictory defensive statements about Beaver, for example ("He wasn't lurking!") just seems like more blatent lying for tactical reasons. His whole illogical defense of Beaver, followed by his OMGUS attack on me to try to avoid admitting that he had been defending Beaver, just smacks of bad scum play.

All in all, DaSpot's play is a mess. Nothing he's done really makes sense from a pro-town standpoint. Beyond that, despite his high level of activity, he seems to have absolutly no interest in actually finding scum with facts, with logic, with reasoning, or with gut, or even with basic stuff like "reading the answers to questions you ask". All he seems to be interested in, all game, is a consistent desire to secure mislynches, with a few odd and illogical defenses of really scummy looking people mixed in.