Newbie 1067 - Game over - Town Win!

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Post Post #500 (ISO) » Thu Apr 07, 2011 1:45 pm

Post by Mist7676 »

GMan wrote:Mist is pretty much asking permission to hammer and it doesn't sit well with my gut.
I am. I just want to make sure if the want to unvote or not.
Mist7676 wrote:Hmmm... KCD is seeming slightly less scum with all those reads. Still scum but just less.

@rest of town. Should I hammer? How do you guys feel about his reads
. I dont want to hammer on him when everyone starts thinking he is town.
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Post Post #501 (ISO) » Thu Apr 07, 2011 9:23 pm

Post by Uncle Pain »

Kcdaspot:
Kcdaspot wrote:I had a dream last night where i had a mustache..... a weird one... :|
In my imagination, you do have one!
Kcdaspot wrote:okay then on the subject of Gman and perry: Are they scum? if not... WHY IN THE WORLD DO YOU HAVE YOUR VOTE ON THEM? If so.. why? and you better have a damned good reason
Please rephrase this, I don’t understand what you’re referring to. Who are “they”? GMan and Stefunny have their votes on you.

inspiratieloos:
OMG, thank you for pointing out the night start thing in the wiki article, I failed to see it… this turns the whole thing around indeed. I therefore retract my statement to have supported a Day 1 No Lynch. Also, this was completely un-IC-ish and I want to apologize for that.
Question is, what would I have done instead when the deadline came nearer… I think it would still have been very similar to what I wrote in #489.
inspiratieloos wrote:(I did read somewhere that you should always keep a vote up starting D2 unless in M/LYLO)
This sounds very odd to me. Keeping up a vote, no matter your suspicions? I’m sorry but this sounds a tad too convenient for your current vote. You say in #441 that your vote stands because GMan has a lot to make up for – is this still valid? You’re right that GMan is currently in no position to be lynched quickly but the reason “yeah I vote him because I want to keep up
some
vote” just isn’t good enough.

On a side note, I don’t like the fact that Kcdaspot, our major target today, seems to be the only one who finds me townie. I smell he’s implying me scum once he’s lynched and flips scum.
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Post Post #502 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:33 am

Post by Kcdaspot »

ispira has not taken their vote off of gman.

i made a mistake
A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or are the others crazy?
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Post Post #503 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:08 pm

Post by inspiratieloos »

I looked it up, I read that in newbie 1035, it was said by Debonair Danny DePietro (the IC), he was town. I thought what he said was only about D2 and further, but it was actually about the whole game. I agree with his arguments. Kcda is the person I'd vote if unvoting GMan, I think it's obvious why I'm not doing that at this moment.

UP: retraction accepted. I do wonder what the world has come to when a first time player of a game has to explain the math of said game to the player that is supposed to show him the ropes :P.
On your side note, I thought Nacho was probably town and you have done nothing to disabuse me of that notion, I find it very hard to imagine you as kcda's scumbuddy.

Kcda: The original thing we all wanted to know was why you lynched Hazard, did I miss something or have you been avoiding that question? You attacked me for my reads (okay, miscommunication, plausible), when I explained you kept attacking me. Did you notice the fact that Mist uses 9 gradations and that her reads are basically the same on the amount of "nulls"? I already thought that your attacks in post 487 were grasping at straws, this reinforces it.
Another thing, in your D1 reads you said on me little voting activity going on, now you accuse me of vote hopping and following wagons... I was on one wagon,
yours
, under pressure of deadline.
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Post Post #504 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:41 pm

Post by Stefunny »

Hmm, apparently my post didn't make it on here somehow...
Mist, you are the only person I have seen who has really made any sort of comment on changing their mind about KC. I still think we have found scum, and I think the fact that there hasn't been a hammer yet confirms that. In my experience Mislynchs are EASY, because you have 1-2 scum who are looking for somewhere to put their vote that will save them another night. The actual scum are hard to lynch, especially in newbie games where bussing is at a minimum, because you have to get more of the townies on the lynch.
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Post Post #505 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:02 pm

Post by Mist7676 »

Enough time has passed for any disaggrements.
Vote: Kcdaspot
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Post Post #506 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:08 pm

Post by dysorder »

Wow. I had a big post typed up and I was about to post and just decided to refresh the page to see if there were any new posts and bam, there's the hammer.

Not sure if it's still worthwhile putting up my wall of text +9000 post now. :P
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Post Post #507 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:11 pm

Post by jasonT1981 »

Day 2 vote count 7


Kdcaspot 4 - Uncle Pain, GMan, Stefunny, Mist
(Lynch )

inspira 1 - KDCA
GMan 1 - inspiratieloos

Not voting

Dysorder


You argue for the best part of the day, and KDCA has hung by a thread, the majority was needed and it was finally reached... you take him to the noose and hang him, his neck snaps and his lifeless body hangs.

was he scum?

damn right baby!

kdcaspot was the Mafia Role-blocker, lynched day 2


you now have 72 hours to get me your night actions, however game will open no earlier than 48 hours from now (10pm EST 11th April night deadline)
Last edited by jasonT1981 on Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #508 (ISO) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:13 pm

Post by Mist7676 »

SHORTEST TWILIGHT EVAH
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Post Post #509 (ISO) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:34 pm

Post by jasonT1981 »

And so after a sleepless night you all return to the town square only to find the blood splattered remains of yet another member of the town. It was GMan


GMan was a Townie, Killed Night 2


With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Deadline Sunday 1st May 7pm EST
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Post Post #510 (ISO) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:55 pm

Post by Mist7676 »

So anyone want to comment on the death. Currently I suspect Inspire. She had her vote on GMan. But I don't know what to think. Asking questions to start on the day.

SteFunny: Based on Yesterday, who do you think is mafia?

Inspire: Why were you voting GMan? (i forgot)

Uncle: Do you still FOS Inspire like you stated yesterday?

Dysorder: Who do you think was KCD's Partner?
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Post Post #511 (ISO) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 10:31 pm

Post by Uncle Pain »

[IC]Since Kcdaspot was a role blocker, this narrows our setup to either no power roles or two power roles (cop and doc). Since no one has yet outed himself as the cop, we can assume that the town only consists of vanilla townies.
Since only one mafia member is left, we’re only in scummy hammer danger when we get to L-1. Although it’s quite dangerous for scum to hammer in this day’s situation, it’s not totally impossible to talk oneself out of it on Day 4 so please consider the hammer danger when you’re about to vote someone to L-1.
Since we got one scum pinned down, it’s a good idea to re-read the important parts of the game with the new information in mind. Looking for connections to Kcdaspot can be meaningful to finding the second scum.[/IC]

GMan was a townie so Les Guilelesser was indeed a VI… I will probably find that interesting when re-reading the bandwagon on him.

Everyone: I’d like to see some reads. I’m currently preparing mine as well but I’d like to have Mist7676 and inspiratieloos post first. (not implying hard suspicions, just a feeling)

dysorder: Is the huge post you were about to write still valid for the current situation? If so, please post it, I’m interested in it.

Mist7676: Actually I would have said FoS if I had meant FoS. I found inspiratieloos’s vote odd enough to enquire but it provides no reasonable ground for a major scum suspicion. I was and am collecting information; whenever I find something worth of pressure, I will show my FoS or vote.

Stefunny: Small reminder to reply to my questions in #489/#490 (as far as they still apply). :)
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Post Post #512 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:31 am

Post by inspiratieloos »

Now that Kcda has flipped scum I have two strong town reads, Mist and Uncle Pain.
UP replaced Nacho, Nacho was pushing for lynching kcda D1, I don't think it would have been wise to attack his partner like that in that situation. We were close to deadline which means that not much would've needed to happen for the wagon to change to him (I basically said as much before), with not much town credit to be had for the people on the wagon. Then D2 Nacho continued attacking kcda, when UP replaced Nacho he immediately continued this attack, it seems unlikely to me that he would follow the exact same strategy without hesitation (mafia can only talk at night so he couldn't have agreed to this beforehand because he replaced during the day) , which really doesn't seem necessary. Besides that, both of them read town to me the entire game.

I think Mist is town for mostly the same reason, her play isn't as clearly town as Uncle Pain's. Hammering kcda doesn't really say much, because if she hadn't I would have a few days later, it didn't look like any of the others were unvoting anytime soon. What does speak strongly for her is, again D1, she said she wouldn't hammer Hazard, this would have been very stupid for mafia. Nacho's lynch wasn't going to go anywhere, so the only one left was kcda, at that point Hazard had 4 votes, kcda 2 and Nacho 1. With Mist, Nacho and Zach saying they weren't going to hammer Hazard the only one left was Les, who looking at his past play shouldn't have been expected to hammer anyone. Thus the Hazard BW would have failed, making the kcda one the most likely. This could have happened in a very short time, thus, due that one comment, kcda might have gotten lynched with almost no credit at all going to Mist for it.
Incidentally the situation above is why I found Les' hammer so incredibly scummy, especially with kcda calling him town and then flipping scum himself.

Stefunny and Dysorder are left, Stefunny came in and immediately went for kcda, he needed 2 more votes at that time, Stefunny voting certainly sped up the process, but I think that kcda would have died anyway. Then we have Dysorder, he looks good for it just by process of elimination. He was the least active during the kcda wagon and looking at kcda's behaviour his response to Dysorder was the most unique. He consistently attacked Hazard and Perry (but not Stefunny), me and Mist were null-town until he came under pressure and we became scum, Escho/Zach and Nacho/UP were town and LEs/Gman was town-but-he-is-so-scummy-I-might-vote-him (but we now know he was town). On Dysorder he was going between slight-scum and slight-town the whole time, this could very well be scum not wanting to speak out on their partner too much in case either of them goes down. His vote on Dys D2 didn't really do anything. What I don't see is why Dys would kill GMan, had Stefunny or Uncle Pain died it would have been pretty easy to predict what I would have done, Dys could have just followed me citing inexperience as his reason to follow which would mean only 1 more vote would be needed (Mist?), after GMan flipped town he could just watch how whoever was left would immediately go for me for getting Gman lynched and then hammer for the win. Stefunny couldn't have done this thus would have more reason to kill Gman.

I think it's either of these two, but I'm not sure which one, Dys looks better for it, but I see no reason why he would kill GMan. Then again the N1 kill showed that these scum don't fear mind-games.
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Post Post #513 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:37 am

Post by inspiratieloos »

EBWOP
@Mist: I voted Les, when GMan replaced I saw no immediate reason to unvote, I was considering switching to Kcda, but then Stefunny put him at L-1 so I kept my vote on him.

@UP: Dys and Stef haven't posted yet so
theoretically
it might still be possible to get a non-fake copclaim for a instant town win
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Post Post #514 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:02 am

Post by Stefunny »

Thank you for reminding me! Bolded is my responses.
Uncle Pain wrote:
  • Don’t you think you’re exaggerating the EM part about Mist7676? I mean, I don’t know EM and I don’t know Mist7676 but it seems a bit easy how you kind of clear her by saying “ah, it’s okay, she’s just an EM noob”.
    I don't think I was exaggerating the point, simply pointing out how I felt about her. I have played with people from EM before and I tend to get the feeling that a lot of them bring experiences from EM with them. I had a strong town read on her at the time, and a lot of it WAS gut and having played with her and other EM people before. Also, I have made the mistake of thinking she was scum before and it lost me the game, so I am overly cautious with my read on her.

  • What do you think about Les Guilelesser’s hammer? It kind of felt sudden and unexpected from him, in spite of the approaching deadline.
    I felt the hammer was in character, at this point we know he really was just a goofball. Plus, I agreed with it.

  • I
    never
    acknowledged a Day 2 No Lynch. I was only talking about a Day 1 No Lynch. I find such a means a sensible strategy to potentially strengthen town if there is no clearly scummy target when the deadline comes into sight. You may disagree with this but I think this is a bit off-topic here. If this point matters to your in-game opinion about me, please elaborate on why you find a Day 1 No Lynch unhelpful.
    It reduces our number of days to find scum. I don't like how the odds fall and it seems like an easy way for scum to get a free kill AND it halts D1 discussion that could be very important later in the game

  • Would you like to point out who stated his/her security about the existence of a doc/cop, other than Les Guilelesser? It was him who brought this on the table. I’ll reread the thread as soon as I have some spare time, I’m just asking you for convenience.
    Mist pointed out discussion on the cop, and it inspired an argument about the cop and doc keeping their mouths shut. I found it odd that everyone automatically assumed there was a cop and doc. I have played in very few newbie games where this was true, so my M.O. is to assume there is NO cop/doc until you find out otherwise. You can't rely on someone you don't even know is there.
More to come, just didn't want to wall post...
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Post Post #515 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:33 am

Post by Stefunny »

I would like to point out that KC was ALL over Perry, and I replaced Perry. So unless you think KC was doing some serious bussing I am unlikely to be his partner. When I went back and read the WHOLE thread after I replaced in I found KCs references to Nacho to be scummy. If you ISO KC he refers to Nacho a LOT but I am starting to think that he was just buddying up with the IC. I do not find Uncle Pain to be scummy either, I have a strong town read on him, so therefore I don't think the IC is KCs buddy.

Based solely on KCs posts I think dysorder is the second scum. In Post #204 He gives his read on dys, and it is severely lacking, especially since he is so adamant about there only being 3 possible reads on people (Scum, Town, or Null). He calls Dys null to slight scum. Which I think is an attempt to distance himself from Dys. And then in post #487 his read on Dys was
kcdaspot wrote: Finally: Dys

...... what is there to comment on? i've been thinking this guy is lurkyscum.. what got me on him was his lack of posting and his vote hop from nacho to Hwag... but reading over everything, his posts arn't as fluffy as say mist's or inspria... reads look fine. gives out detail with them.

Yeah.. with a "my bad" I'm going to do a 180 and say he's town-to-null. the null is there because a don't see him actively pursuing scum rather just defending himself...

and with those three done. i'll do the others later on tonite.

but think today is a inspria or mist lynch.
So, he was thinking he was scum because of his vote hop to HWaG (which was KCs suggestion in the first place) and then he changes his mind because his posts aren't AS fluffy as others, but he's still null because he isn't doing any active scum hunting. Wow. I really feel like this reads says it all. Once again he gives a mixed read, which he got onto other people for doing, about someone who he admits did no active scum hunting but spent the entire time defending himself.
KC did briefly vote Dys, but he did not push his vote on others like he did with his other votes and he gave little to no reasoning, pretty funny for someone who is a mostly null read for him.

So after reading this I went back and reread Dys...
He does go after KC a bit more, but still no reads and he seems to insist he is town until the last minute. He says he sees a little scum coming through but isn't convinced enough to vote. In the end he was the only one not voting KC. There is also the fact that as KC legitimately said, there really hasn't been much scum hunting or reads of his own coming from Dys.

I'm aware this is not an airtight case but the only other viable option I can see KC being scum buddies with (From KCs posts) Is Inspira or Mist. I get town reads on both of them, so for now this is where my vote lies.

VOTE: Dysorder
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Post Post #516 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:16 pm

Post by Mist7676 »

Ok I'm sorry but my internet is being shitty. I can only make a few one-liners before it refreshes the page. Currently I think Dys and Inspire are scum.

Dys for the reason stated above by Stefunny and Inspire.

Inspire because he says he didnt want to lynch KCD just yet ao he kept his vote on GMan. Why didn't you just unvote. And I think I remember you still stating reasons GMan is scum even after KCD was on L-1. You said you kept it on GMan because you didn't want to lynch KCD just yet. And then he dies!! Coincidence, I THINK NOT!!
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Post Post #517 (ISO) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:03 pm

Post by dysorder »

First off, wow.

Second of all, I'll answer questions then get onto my thoughts.

Uncle Pain: Not all of it, no. Basically, it was my thoughts on Kcda being maf, hammering, and half of the two reasons I had for not hammering before. The next two paragraphs are excerpts that would be somewhat related.:

"I've also thought about my theory that the scum were setting Kcda up for a fall with NKing one of the players who had a vote on him during D1 and come up with an alternate view. Potentially, it could be a WIFOM argument, that he did it just to look so newb-scum that nobody could possibly think it was him. If accused of being scum and NKing his target, all it would take would be his buddy or even himself to point out that the Maf would want to get rid of an experienced player, somebody who was incredibly more active than our established IC in Nacho.

Another side to this potential argument, is the scum team being a mixture of Kcda and a new or rushing player, somebody who wouldn't quite think of the ramifications of killing Zachrulez. I won't put a name out at this stage, I think we should be more focused on one than a team at the moment."

One of the reasons I didn't want to hammer is for the usual reason, fear of looking scum if by some strange happening Kcda flipped town. The other reason I was going to leave out of my wall of text was that I wanted to see how Mist reacted to hammering. She says she'll do it blatantly within 24 hours, then 24 hours passes and no Kcda, an easy cop out. Then Kcda finally comes out of the woodwork, posts a barrage of reads that are so ridiculous it's not funny, to which Mist says he seems less scum and wants other people's opinions on that. As soon as GMan questions her on that, boom, 24 hours later, he's hammered.

Which brings me to my next question, from Mist: I think you are Kcda's partner, my dear. Re-reading you over the past couple of days, some things which appear innocent and joking seem to lead to a pretty good case. #5, RVS for Kcda, because he's always scum in your games. I'll let that slide, it's RVS and shenanigans occur. No, the real point here is something that was brought up by Escho earlier on. You claim you're always scummy. The point was raised by Escho, why say this? Are you trying to get everyone to think your play is typically scum, so even though you look scum you're just an innocent townie who can't help how she plays? Very odd.

For the rest of day 1, your banter between yourself and Kcda is off. You both post reads on each other that are all fluff, without questioning each others moves at all.

Day 2. Zach's NK, Mist is shocked. After calling for IC blood all Day 1, an extremely competent player comes into the game and you think a newbie player is going to be killed over one of the more experienced players? Come on. You wanted to get rid of the great players that were capable of figuring you out, it's completely understandable. Then Kcda calls you out for that, places a vote on you. Trying to distract us from who was killed that night, I'm assuming. The vote is so easily taken off you with barely an answer from you, no explanation from Kcda, just straight on to me. I call into question Zach's killing and his relationship with Kcda, and he votes me straight away. It's not even meant to be a serious vote, it's to draw the attention away again from any relationship between Kcda and Mist.

Immediately following Nacho's vote of Kcda, Mist throws up the same idea (re-reading, Inspira posts the same thing before either of us) that Kcda could be being used as a scapegoat. Inspira less so, maybe he was just planting the seed, but Mist literally uses it to defend Kcda from Nacho's vote. At this point, I have to concede that this sort of reasoning could also be used against me, I wrongly bought into his innocence. As Inspira elaborates more on the potential that Kcda could have done it in WIFOM-mode, Mist continues defending Kcda, "I have played with KCD before and I know he would never be that stupid to do that." in #376. Very defensive. Post #421 has her defending Kcda and trying to throw Nacho into the spotlight again. Struggling to save your buddy there, Mist?

Which brings me back to my second reason for not hammering, watching Mist hover over the hammer of Kcda. It looks fairly innocent, wanting to hold off, waiting for Kcda to defend himself... Then as soon as you're questioned, down comes Maxwell's silver hammer.

Who is night killed Night 2? GMan. The very same person who questioned your motives. Really, Mist? You're playing that same card again? Then in subsequent Day 3 posts, you bring the attention to Inspira's GMan vote and then eventual kill. You claim that Kcda couldn't possibly be that stupid to pull that card, but Inspira, who by your own words say is a great player, is stupid enough to do that? That is so incredibly inconsistent, it's shocking.

tl;dr - Mist had shady public dealings with Kcda and is using the "I'm killing the obvious targets against me so I couldn't be Maf" card.

VOTE: Mist7676

P.S. Apologies for massive wall of text. I like to ramble. :(
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Post Post #518 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:24 am

Post by Uncle Pain »

Whoa whoa whoa, serious business going on here. Let me join the party! In fact, my re-reads have been very fruitful as well…

General reads:
  • Mist7676: Her iso is the most striking one. Although she posts a lot, she doesn’t actually contribute much to scumhunting, fluff is a major part of her posts. In retrospect, her scummy ratios look random/arbitrary: inspiratieloos goes up from 20% to 50% scummy with only two unremarkable posts, me goes down from 50% to 30% only by recapping the game, Kcdaspot goes up from 20% to 50% “because of the zach and hazard business” (a business which has been there long before her percentage raise). In short, the whole picture of her makes the impression of an artificial opinion instead of real thoughts. And
    really
    , going for dysorder now is very convenient after the (arbitrary) percentage raise on Day 2.
    FoS: Mist7676

  • dysorder: Don’t like the fact he lurked most of Day 2, and the few posts he did write involved a lot of undecisiveness. His current case against Mist7676 has valid points though. My gut says he couldn’t make his mind up on Day 2 and now has a better view on things. Leaning town.
  • inspiratieloos: Can’t say much about him other than: town. I like #512.
  • Stefunny: I have a hard time to read her, she made good points in her recap post #461 but provides an arguable reason to vote dysorder. Nullish.
Connection analyses and hypotheses:
  • Kcdaspot & Mist7676: Kcdaspot never tried to attack her properly; he once complimented her reads, he votes her at the start of Day 2 and immediately takes the vote off again. Finally he has Mist7676 and inspiratieloos as his top suspects, with an obvious negative tendency towards Mist7676 – but still he sets his vote on inspiratieloos instead. I call that protection and I only see two reasons for this: either Mist7676 is his scumbuddy or she was set up by him to detract from the real one.
  • Kcdaspot & dysorder: dysorder jumps on Kcdaspot’s bandwagon on Day 1 and keeps quiet for the rest of the day. And then #347/#348: immediately after Kcdaspot votes dysorder for a proveably flawed reason (“his entire D1 is defend and votehopping”), dysorder defends himself strongly, going as far as arguing that Kcdaspot may well be scum but he gives him the benefit of a doubt. Is this genuine or a planned distancing attempt because Kcdaspot and dysorder realized that Kcdaspot was going to die on Day 2?
  • Kcdaspot & inspiratieloos: Until his final vote, Kcdaspot left inspiratieloos alone for the whole game; there were null-town reads, at one point Kcdaspot gave out an insensible IGMEOY but that’s it. Kcdaspot may have thought that inspiratieloos looked too townie to be a realistic lynch candidate. But then came that vote on Day 2 and I wonder why. Was he struggling for
    any
    reads that could distract town away from himself? I doubt it, he was already a certain lynch at that time. Was he implying inspiratieloos in order to get him lynched Day 3? A risky WIFOM game. The idea of a scummy connection between these two gives me headaches.
  • Kcdaspot & Stefunny/PeRrY-_-: Kcdaspot finds PeRrY-_- rather scummy but never votes him; PeRrY-_- on the other hand hardly attacks Kcdaspot at all. They’re almost as avoiding as with Kcdaspot & inspiratieloos… About Kcdaspot’s relation to Stefunny, she votes him, yet he considers her as “nully null” so no OMGUS. This is just too little ground to base
    any
    conclusions on.
So yeah, only a FoS. I have no interest in rushing a decision here, we need to discuss this properly and a scum hammer is the last thing we need.
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Post Post #519 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 9:52 am

Post by Mist7676 »

Dysorder wrote:Who is night killed Night 2? GMan. The very same person who questioned your motives. Really, Mist? You're playing that same card again? Then in subsequent Day 3 posts, you bring the attention to Inspira's GMan vote and then eventual kill. You claim that Kcda couldn't possibly be that stupid to pull that card, but Inspira, who by your own words say is a great player, is stupid enough to do that? That is so incredibly inconsistent, it's shocking.
I have never played with inspire. I don't know if she would be willing to do this. KCD on the other hand I have played with before and doubted that he would do that. I was quite surprised to find out he had done that.

A question to you. Why were you so quiet during KCD's BW?
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Post Post #520 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:27 pm

Post by Stefunny »

I really liked dysorder's self defense post actually. Not only did he point out WHY he couldn't be scum, but he offered his opinions and gave reasoning's on who IS scum. Like I said before, I am a little paranoid of Mist because I have read her as scum before and it cost me the game. At this point I'm going to reread Mist AND Inspire just to be sure. I still have a feeling about Dys, but he really does have a decent case against Mist. Plus this:
Mist7676 wrote: Dys for the reason stated above by Stefunny and Inspire.
I'm convinced the final scum is in one of these three though, with my vote leaning towards Dysorder/Mist.

For now
Unvote: Dysorder


I will be doing a few ISO's when I get back from my bike ride.
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Post Post #521 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:29 pm

Post by Stefunny »

Pssst... Dysorder, love the Beatles reference.

The one thing that keeps bugging me about this whole situation is the Zachrulez thing.
dysorder wrote: "I've also thought about my theory that the scum were setting Kcda up for a fall with NKing one of the players who had a vote on him during D1 and come up with an alternate view. Potentially, it could be a WIFOM argument, that he did it just to look so newb-scum that nobody could possibly think it was him.
Honestly this is something that boggles my mind. It was a VERY smart play on KCs part in my opinion. Honestly this was my biggest reservation on voting him (Even though I tried to tell myself it was WIFOM) I kept thinking that it would be stupid to be that blatantly obvious with your NK, and it was just someone setting him up to get the lynch. But HE HAD to have been thinking he could use that to his advantage. SO, I'm feeling like a lot of the top suspects are almost too easy. I think KC was smarter than that and I think he would have put SOME pressure on his buddy to try and seem town.

But that could still be a giant WIFOM argument.

Dys also, however, pointed out Mists post, #376
Mist7676 wrote:I have played with KCD before and I know he would never be that stupid to do that. Also why is oir IC lurking?
If you go back and read this in context it is DIRECTLY a response to Inspira saying KC could have killed Zachrulez so it would make him look innocent. THIS IS SO FLASHING BIG RED LIGHTS at me now that I think about it.
She's implying only someone stupid would have done that.
Saying KC is not that stupid.
But it WASN'T stupid.
It was genius, especially when you have someone pointing out how stupid it would be.

This stuck out to me as well.
Mist7676 wrote:Hmmm... KCD is seeming slightly less scum with all those reads. Still scum but just less.

@rest of town. Should I hammer? How do you guys feel about his reads. I dont want to hammer on him when everyone starts thinking he is town.
At this point KCD had JUST posted the second half of his reads and Mist was the
only
person who said anything about KC seeming more town, but the way she said it sounds to me like she's implying "See, he gave reads, so you all should think he's town with me, right?" She could have been trying to make it seem like others thought he was more town and so she didn't have to hammer any more.

And then going back a little farther. I though it was odd in KCs first post after the first lynch he said
Kcdaspot wrote:... and to start off day 2 I WOULD vote Les here. For providing a hammer like that eyes are and will be cast to you.
but moreover...
VOTE: mist
interesting way to start the day there mind explaining that post?
WHY did he pick Mist to pick on? Yea, her post was a little odd, but he was really grasping for a reason there. He wanted to be able to point back at a vote for Mist if he had to. Especially since she gave like a half response and his very next post he changed his vote.

In his first list of reads all he says about Mist is "null". In his second list of reads he gives a decent scum read on her, noting her fluffy posts, her vote then revote, then REvote of nacho, and her lack of activity D2. But then he votes Inspira based on HIS fluffy posts. I felt his argument FOR mist seemed similar if not stronger, so I'm not sure what caused him to vote Inspira vs. Mist.

I'm feeling pretty good about this case. I still think if it's NOT mist it could possibly be Dys, but after reading ISOs, and noticing things other people had pointed out, I started thinking, and I think this is the more likely situation.
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Post Post #522 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:37 pm

Post by Stefunny »

>.> I didn't vote, I needed to check where we were at vote wise...
It looks like Mist is at L-2 so if I vote we could have a quick hammer, which would be bad, but sending us into lylo it sure would make the hammer vote awful suspicious.

I want to see how Mist responds to the suspicions about her. Especially since she is the only one of the five left that has not really taken the time to build a case on anyone (except, "Yea, what they said") And is attempting to use the same trick on us again. (Thanks for pointing that out too dys)

See what I'm saying btw, all four of the rest of us have BUILT cases.
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dysorder
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dysorder
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Post Post #523 (ISO) » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:40 pm

Post by dysorder »

Mist7676 wrote: A question to you. Why were you so quiet during KCD's BW?
A few reasons. First, I've been busy. Second, when I did get a moment to look at the thread, I was reading and reading and reading till my eyes bled. Third, I wanted to watch you, like I stated in my wall of text of doom.

I did post during the whole scenario, explaining that I saw everybody's points that they were raising, and that I'd read Kcda again. Post #478 has that, if you're interested. When I finally got a day off, my Saturday morning, so Friday when you hammered, I had my post all ready to go and typed up. You hammered, with the brevity of your post showing more than you could have possibly wanted, and my post and hammer made entirely redundant.

A question back to you: Do you still think Inspira is a great player? You did D2, how about now?


Stefunny: Glad someone picked it up. :) All the mentions of hammers and I started humming and... Voila.

I agree, I think holding off on your vote is a safe move at the moment. Can always see how the next few posts progress.
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inspiratieloos
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Post Post #524 (ISO) » Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:41 am

Post by inspiratieloos »

Dysorder, Uncle Pain and Stefunny, you all say you think that Mist might be the scum, what explanation do you have for this post?
Mist7676 wrote:Nah i was just messing around but to me he is really scummy I don't see any point in lynching Hwag. I don't think he is scum but meh thats ur problem.
But for sure im not hammering.
For me, this is the most important reason that Mist is town, I see no reason for Maf!Mist to post this.
The rest of your points are valid I think.

Stefunny, I think you are letting Dysorder off the hook way too easily. His attack on Mist is valid, but I don't see how his defence in any way clears him.

Mist, look at peoples profiles before calling them female, thank you.

Uncle Pain, you noticed Kcda's compliment on Mist's reads. I did too. He doesn't compliment the content, just the way she presented it. This compliment really wasn't going to mean anything to the rest of us, but I'd think that if Kcda was scum he'd want to get into Mist's good graces because she seems to have an inclination to think he is scum. More likely to be buddying to a townie than scumpartner doing... what exactly?

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