Open 296: MAFIA WINS GONNA TEACH YOU TO BURN

[Iecerint]

^ lol

mozamis is defending Kingpin more than I have ever seen one player defend another player EVER. especially D1.

Votecount
Mozamis (2): Hero764, MrTrow

The_Kingpin (5): Nachomamma8, ThAdmiral, Iecerint, Stefunny, RangeroftheNorth

Stefunny (3): lynchking, Bella, The_Kingpin
lane0168 (1): Mozamis
not voting: lane0168

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline: April 17th
Empking replaces lynchking

[mozamis]

LOL TO THE ADMIRAL

[mozamis]

@iCERINT well, what of it? I dont see ANY CASE on the guy at all. The BW on him is based on, at best, a couple of comments he made in RVS. Ludicrous that he is L-2 cos of that.

[Iecerint]

That, and his reaction to pressure. His play is inconsistent with someone who wants to find scum while being consistent with someone who wants to survive. Ergo, scum.

The pattern starts with RVS, but it does not end there.

[lane0168]

well as far as i'm concerned, scum is not going to be that attimate defending ANYBODY, whether its town or a scumbud..

unvote

Why'd you vote for kingpin twice?

Are you suggesting this is a scumtell?

No i'm suggesting he voted twice, and was concerned about his unvote... just as king voted twice and was concerned with adding something.... what's the difference?i don't think either is scummy so it shouldnt be added in a case against them.

however, if king's crappy case has done anything, it has put pressure on him and made him look increasingly scummy. his defense blows. I'm glad he voted someone else to make ranger happy.

like IEC "the pattern starts with RVS, but it does not end there."

I will also be defending people who i think are being misrepresented along with mozamis. I feel the same way he does. misreps do nothing but make town people look scummy, and are unnecessarry on real scum. (specifically talking about calling his defense complaining... he's l-2, and we want to call him selfish for not having his thoughts on scumhunting?) shame be to the person who tries to stay alive.

[Iecerint]

I actually disagree. The only players who have reason to defend anyone strongly D1, unless there are masons or something, are scum. They defend scumfriends to defend scumfriends and defend town given adequate pressure to get Cassandra points. Town doesn't know what's up, and town behavior D1 reflects that.

The only other explanation I can come up with for moz's extreme behavior is that he feels strongly about sticking to his guns even when he starts to realize that it's irrational. Cuz that used to happen to me as town sometimes when I was first starting to play the game.

[The_Kingpin]

Question for Iecerint: Will it still be "irrational" when I flip Town (assuming I get 2 more votes)?

[The_Kingpin]

EBWOP: Will it still be

considered

irrational

[Iecerint]

Well, yeah. It's not as if mozTown knows your alignment.

To be clear -- his behavior is only irrational if he is town. It's rational -- for scumdefense or Cassandra -- if he's scum. That's why I think it's a likely scumtell.

[The_Kingpin]

So, by your logic, it's rational to think I'm scum even though I'm town because my behavior fits some general pattern you've grown accustomed to seeing in scum, and you are willing to risk losing a pro-town player instead of exploring other options?

[MrTrow]

I will also be defending people who i think are being misrepresented along with mozamis. I feel the same way he does. misreps do nothing but make town people look scummy, and are unnecessarry on real scum. (specifically talking about calling his defense complaining... he's l-2, and we want to call him selfish for not having his thoughts on scumhunting?) shame be to the person who tries to stay alive.

I believe the main thing is the difference between:
- defending a player of (un)known allignment
- attacking fake cases/ pointing out logical flaws in actual scumhunting

Voting bloc?
Icerint, Nacho, Trow, and myself.

care to explain?

Do not claim anything else.

I asked you for the bare minimum, but you could respond in multiple ways. Your choice, for whatever reason, was to respond minimalistically. It is not trivial.

Seems somewhat off.

i'm pretty sure everyone has a right to defend themselves

Bit too eager to be defensive?

UNVOTE: mozamisVOTE: lane0168

[RangeroftheNorth]

So, by your logic, it's rational to think I'm scum even though I'm town because my behavior fits some general pattern you've grown accustomed to seeing in scum, and you are willing to risk losing a pro-town player instead of exploring other options?

Thinking someone is scum because they act like scum seems completely rational to me. Why explore other options once you think you've found scum? Its best to remain focused on one player until either you think they aren't scum anymore or you lynch them.

[Empking]

Vote: No Lynch

and the Cop should claim. Fun has nothing to do with it.

[The_Kingpin]

So, by your logic, it's rational to think I'm scum even though I'm town because my behavior fits some general pattern you've grown accustomed to seeing in scum, and you are willing to risk losing a pro-town player instead of exploring other options?

Thinking someone is scum because they act like scum seems completely rational to me. Why explore other options once you think you've found scum? Its best to remain focused on one player until either you think they aren't scum anymore or you lynch them.

If that's so, it'll suck to be you once this day is over and you realized you lynched a pro-town player with a crappy case.

[Iecerint]

Of course. That's how the game works.

Other option exploration is a possibility, but those apparently most interested in doing so -- you and moz -- seem more interested in defending you than in finding a viable altwagon sooo.

[Iecerint]

Your "omg I am pro-town you will be sorry lol" ATE isn't convincing anyone, btw.

[The_Kingpin]

k. I'm Cop.

[RangeroftheNorth]

Unvote

[Empking]

No Lynch.
No Lynch.
No Lynch.

[RangeroftheNorth]

If cop is already outed, no reason not to play follow the cop

Vote: No Lynch

[Iecerint]

<_<

Unvote

[Iecerint]

@ MrTrow -- The intent was that people not claim that they "used to be Cop" or whatever. Variations in that kind of wording could let scum know who was unlikely to be a PR post-redistribution.

I thought he'd come out and say "my scumfriends were A&B" after I asked "were they CDE," but he chose not to. That's what I was referring to. I don't think he explained his choice in terms of letter-of-the-request as you intimate afterward, but that would be relevant if it were.

Cop CC is certainly welcome, especially because immediate reactions to the claim've already narrowed it down.

[mozamis]

Well, yeah. It's not as if mozTown knows your alignment.

To be clear -- his behavior is only irrational if he is town. It's rational -- for scumdefense or Cassandra -- if he's scum. That's why I think it's a likely scumtell.

So, by your logic, its ok to be confident in scumhunting (vote so-and -so -he looks scum to me!), but not be confident in who you think is town?
And -although this is a different point,its more relevant to the Kingpin case -people may not be confident that he's town. But they maybe confident that the accusations against him are unfounded.
My position is the second one. Although if people look pro-town, i will say so. Process of elimation is a useful tool as well.

[mozamis]

hang on, looks like i am out of date.

[mozamis]

UNVOTE
VOTE NO LYNCH