Newbie 1067 - Game over - Town Win!

[dysorder]

Inspira: That can be answered pretty easily if you think about it. The last thing two maf want is to be seen as two people working together, right? Kcda starts the wagon, and with enough people still left in the game, it makes sense for Mist to stay the hell away from that, and make sure people notice she's distancing herself from it and Kcda.

As was shown, there was more than enough of us gullible fools to bandwagon the lazy Hazard.

[Mist7676]

Sorry inspire when I post I can I can't see gender when posting and I don't look. Also I'm going to go through a few ISO's today. Might post hours later because I have a lot of games to check.

Also

A question back to you: Do you still think Inspira is a great player? You did D2, how about now?

Sort of null with

Him

now.

[Mist7676]

EBWOP- Null in a good player not scum or town.

[inspiratieloos]

So... you're not sure whether I'm a good player or a bad player pretending to be a good player?

Question: (Dysorder) Did you

honestly

expect Les to hammer Hazard?
Because the other players in the game (Nacho, Zach and Hazard himself) were all opposed to the Hazard lynch. With Mist and Les that makes 5. After that comment from Mist the Hazard lynch was a fluke (from Mist's point of view). If I made that comment in that situation I'd be fully aware that it would probably lead to Kcda getting lynched (with a small chance of no-lynch or Hazard lynch) and I prefer to assume that everyone is at least somewhat competent (and that Mist wouldn't take such a low gain-high risk gamble).

Or is it just that I'm the only one who really didn't see that hammer coming...

[Mist7676]

Going through KCD's ISO and the only time he talked about dysorder was in his reads. Distancing much?

[jasonT1981]

Short V/LA for myself, Back up Mod Sotty will be taking care of vote counts etc until I return Friday, sorry going out of town to a WWE Raw show tomorrow evening but leaving town early

[dysorder]

Going through KCD's ISO and the only time he talked about dysorder was in his reads. Distancing much?

I don't have a problem with you using the same "distancing" argument I used against you in my last post, but can I draw your attention to these gems? For most of Day 2, all Kcda contributed was pages of reads, and answered other player's questions about the previous day. He had no time nor care for his weak case against me.

Do you want to try and explain any of my points in my case against you, instead of trying to be like your scum partner and have some weak shots?

Inspira: I don't think anybody could have predicted any move by Les. The man had his own style of thought and play and... Well, what else can I say, he did what he did. I think that's basically what the scum team were hoping for: the craziest, most unpredictable player in the game making the craziest move possible.
I see where you're coming from and it makes sense, it doesn't seem logical for Mist to keep her anti-Hazard lynch stance, but I really think this is part of her play: to keep as far away from Kcda as possible. If things had have switched, and the Kcda bandwagon did get going on Day 1, I'm sure she would have played exactly how she did Day 2. Quietly warmed, then threaten to hammer, and then wait and wait... Then as soon as it looked bad for her waiting so much, hammer. That's if it got to that stage of her being one of the votes needed.

[Sotty7]

Day 3 vote count 1

Mist - 1 (Dysorder)

Not voting

Uncle Pain, Stefunny, Mist, inspiratieloos

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch. Deadline Sunday 1st May 7pm EST

[Stefunny]

Inspira,
I am not letting dysorder off the hook yet. I am still mostly suspicious of Mist and him, but he is at least taking the time to reasonably defend himself. I'm not ruling him out, but to me it feels like he is being pretty levelheaded.

Mist on the other had has not responded to one bit of the accusations against her. Yesterday she said she might post after she checks all her games and all we ended up getting was

Going through KCD's ISO and the only time he talked about dysorder was in his reads. Distancing much?

You would think she would be trying harder to defend herself. Instead she's ignoring pretty much everything going on.

[Mist7676]

Sorry my mom dragged me to the store after that. Going through some

Right now.

[Stefunny]

uh huh...
Maybe this isnt serious enough for you yet mist.
VOTE: Mist

Uncle, do you care to weigh in?

[Uncle Pain]

Uncle, do you care to weigh in?

Not yet. I’d like Mist7676 to reply to our allegations first. Besides, why the hurry? We’re two weeks from the deadline and nothing from this Day is carved in stone yet.

What does speak strongly for her is, again D1, she said she wouldn't hammer Hazard, this would have been very stupid for mafia.

I first thought that you have a point that Mist7676’s hesitance to lynch Hazard with a Glove may look townie because bussing the scum partner on Day 1 already is too helpful for town to be considered by the mafia. But the argument doesn’t convince me because of two reasons. First, the actual situation on Day 1, where Kcdaspot was already looking odd due to his enormous pushing of the Hazard with a Glove bandwagon, could have led the mafia to believe that Kcdaspot and Mist7676-scum saw bussing as a necessary means to distance from each other. Second, I’ve just isolation-read Mist7676 and found no evidence about her stating hesitance to vote Hazard with a Glove. She actually had him on 50/50 in her last Day 1 read, only slightly behind Nachomamma8 (although, as I said, I don’t give much about her reads due to assumed arbitrariness). To be honest, her Day 1 reads are a mess to me.

tl;dr version:

I don’t find Mist7676’s Day 1 play particularly townie.

Uncle Pain, you noticed Kcda's compliment on Mist's reads. I did too. He doesn't compliment the content, just the way she presented it. This compliment really wasn't going to mean anything to the rest of us, but I'd think that if Kcda was scum he'd want to get into Mist's good graces because she seems to have an inclination to think he is scum. More likely to be buddying to a townie than scumpartner doing... what exactly?

An interesting question. I have an answer for that but actually I’d like Mist7676 to reply to this first.

Or is it just that I'm the only one who really didn't see that hammer coming...

Although I wasn’t in the game back then, during my first thread read I found Les Guilelesser’s hammer sudden as well.

Stefunny: Regarding your case against dysorder (#515), I’m not sure if Kcdaspot’s #487 is really proof for dysorder-scum. Kcdaspot might by then have realized that he’s about to get lynched so he tries to pull townies into the scum boat for Day 3. Yes, this is WIFOM but so is your argument. I find it hard to decide what is more plausible but I tend to think dysorder-town.

Mist7676: Aside from inspiratieloos’ question above: reads, please!

By the way, what Beatles reference? o_O

[inspiratieloos]

Stefunny: You put a vote on Mist implying that it is a pressure vote. You do realise that you're putting her at L-1 right?

UP: You make a fair point, I think the thing with her reads is that she changes her opinion on people very quickly, making the differences between the reads themselves seem arbitrary. Let's see what Mist has to say.

Mist, everyone is waiting for you now

Also, I thought that distancing was attacking your partner, not ignoring them?

[Mist7676]

Stefunny I'm 13 I have chores and school.

Inspire seems null to me now. Going through his ISO says a lot. He only has done reads 2 but scumhunts a lot. He asks a lot of questions and he doesn't just focus on one person. So right now im thinking a 40/60 right now. Of course that could still change.

Also all those accustations are correct. I did do those things but does that

confirm

me as scum? I'm barely learning mafia So I make a few scummy moves.

[inspiratieloos]

I had exams the last weeks

Then please explain to us why you can't be scum. What did you do that you wouldn't have done if you were mafia. Why are there those differences in your reads? How were they not arbitrary, or if they were why should we think that you are not scum because of it? I really shouldn't have to explain this to you...

These accusations are good enough reason to lynch you so I'm going to repeat what I told Hazard D1:

If you are scum self-hammering is a viable tactic you know... If you are town, at least try to defend yourself.

Okay, not so much the self-hammering being viable (although it would save all of us a lot of trouble ), but at least post a semblance of a defence.

Also who do you think is the most likely to be scum and why? I'm apparently null, did you think I was scum or town before?

[Mist7676]

Well for day 2 i was thinking you were null. The beginning of day 3 i thought you were scum but now I think you are more townish. Honestly I really think dysorder is scum.

If I was mafia I would have killed Uncle Pain last night because he seems as more of a threat. Of course that is just WIFOM bullshit. GMan was also a good target but I would have gotten rid of the IC first just in case of he does better the next day. I have many different thoughts on subjects (DID) so many different changes in reads. Sometimes my thoughts combine with my gut and I change my reads to tweak what is turning me off of that person. Sometimes I guess I could make a drastic change. What is arbitary?

[dysorder]

Also all those accustations are correct. I did do those things but does that

confirm

me as scum? I'm barely learning mafia So I make a few scummy moves.

#20 you tell us you're SE and have played more than a few games around here. With over 1000 posts under your belt to add to this, one thinks you're trying to pull a newb card here. Somehow, I'm not buying it.

Once again, claiming that you make scummy moves, but we shouldn't view you as scum... Why?

[dysorder]

EBWOP - Uncle Pain: In my three hour long ramble in #517

Then as soon as you're questioned, down comes Maxwell's silver hammer.

[Mist7676]

I'm a slow learner. Also you shouldn't view me as scum because I got a townie win condition (not gonna claim role just yet)

[inspiratieloos]

You imply that you are not VT? Claim now!

[Mist7676]

Meh well doesnt really matter now since

I am

at L-1

Vanilla Townie.

[Stefunny]

Uncle Pain;
At this point you state you believe Dysorder is town. So who is scum? I know you were waiting for Mist to respond to our allegations but apparently she is not going to. I'd like to know where you stand.

And Mist, I don't mean to sound rude, but I'm 25, work 45 hours a week, cook dinner about 5 nights a week, do laundry, dishes, yardwork, and work out twice a week.. I wish I had the time I did when I was 13. I understand you are busy but if you are going to play the game then please actually make an attempt to defend yourself.

It really looked like you were trying to imply you were a PR, which irks me as well.

[Mist7676]

Well for day 2 i was thinking you were null. The beginning of day 3 i thought you were scum but now I think you are more townish. Honestly I really think dysorder is scum.

If I was mafia I would have killed Uncle Pain last night because he seems as more of a threat. Of course that is just WIFOM bullshit. GMan was also a good target but I would have gotten rid of the IC first just in case of he does better the next day. I have many different thoughts on subjects (DID) so many different changes in reads. Sometimes my thoughts combine with my gut and I change my reads to tweak what is turning me off of that person. Sometimes I guess I could make a drastic change. What is arbitary?

[inspiratieloos]

To me this looks like you have given up, I'm still not entirely decided if this makes you more town or scum. I'd like to know what the others think about this.

[Uncle Pain]

Full ack with dysorder, trying to look like a newbie in spite of the number of posts and games really is the wrong way to convince someone of townieness. And why the sudden breadcrumbing and yet claiming vanilla?! I’m sorry, I don’t buy anything from you anymore. Let’s get this over with.

VOTE: Mist7676

Stefunny: I still don’t get why you urge me so much to vote. I stated my reads above, I think they pretty much say where I stand; if anything is unclear, you can just ask?