Mafia MetaMafia ~ Game Over!

[Parama]

You signed up for a large theme and didn't expect walls of text?

[Gammagooey]

Gamma I don't get it

This avatar is how I'm looking at you when I read your posts.

Don't really think Parama is that scummy anymore. His admitance to his hypocrisy is very odd. But then again, this is Parama we are talking about, hence I asked someone to look through the argument.

I haven't even posted since the last time you called me obvscum
And I admitted to the hypocrisy BEFORE anybody called it out.
And yo only just figured that out with you "o crap" moment there

See if you'd actually READ HIS POSTS you'd notice he HASN'T called you obvscum.
He has called you a hypocritical sack of shit but personally I think that's pretty fair right now.

[Plum]

It certainly says Parama-scum because the suspicions and Parama's reactions to his suspects does not match Parama-Town scumhunting. Independently I'd say VV's initial stances are lazy-scummy enough for my taste, but I can't fully access the context, so that may change when I have full access. It's reasonably possible that Parama's vote on Magua over VV given what Parama has said is related to wanting to be seen as attacking VV, but I'd actually be inclined to think he'd bus hard in this sort of situation instead. It seems much more related to excusing/trying to fit with/strengthening his mutated stance on Magua, which reinforces my impression that it's scummy of Parama. VV connections are tantalizing but inconclusive (I tend to think such things on Day 1 are best treated, generally, as inconclusive until we get a flip down; I don't like searching for connections Day 1 much because confirmation bias, need twice as much luck as skill, &c.).

Oooh, correction: "equivocal responses of any sort to this question are highly worth noting and much more likely

scum than Town

". Wrote it the wrong way around but you get the idea.

yo Plum, I really think you're not reading into things enough.

Sorry, I was fairly sure I was reading into things pretty well. What do you think I'm missing?

[Seraphim]

I still maintain quadz is more likely to be scum, hence my vote on him. A skim say his play is par for the course but I'll reread and see what else I can dig up.

[sottyrulez]

I understand 'big wall focusing entirely on attacks on someone I'm getting a townread off'.

I don't understand 'all wallposts are bed'.

There were about 7 pages between my two posts, and I had plenty I wanted to comment on. My question is where/why you switched from 'Plum is uneasy-making but not worth switching my vote' to 'Plum is worth my vote' (especially given that you said you needed to see it - I assume the me/Nicki Minaj interaction, and I assume you meant you needed to see more to judge whether your uneasiness with me was worth acting on).

The bold is something I never said. I will wall from time to time so.... No.

It boils down to me agreeing with Gamma and what he posted in his assessment of you. On page three of a Vi game with lots of great players, you come right in, balls to the wall with a case on Niki. No random vote, no joking with whoever, no nothing, not even a hello before you get right down to business. Considering the point of the game your post read as total overkill.

Scums ultimate goal is to look town. How do they look town? One great way is by making cases. I think you saw something in Niki that you could twist and push and just jumped all over it. Your post doesn't read like you are trying to figure out their alignment. It's more like you had locked in on your lynch target. The tone didn't feel town at all.

At the time Niki was somewhat the focus of the game and since then that has shifted. Not surprising your vote has jumped off them and over to another soft easy place. Parama isn't endearing himself to the town at all, it's a comfy landing for you outside the major wagons.

Overall I don't like it one bit.

I moved our vote because placing it on you to see your reaction was better than keeping it on Seraphim at that point. I made the right choice.

~Sotty

[Plum]

Wanting to see my reaction is perfectly reasonable. I'd wanted to see if the pieces lined up or not and they seem to do so reasonably well.

Regarding wallposting, if mine was a misinterpretation it was based on this:

Following it up with another huge wall isn't doing you any favors.

I didn't know how else to take it but that you found the very fact that i wallposted at least mildly scummy.

Regarding why I made that case, I've explained as best I could. I would like to make sure you've read the case I made on Parama and evaluate it for sincerity beyond whether or not he's an easy target.

[Nicki Minaj]

The Minaj half is back from work and catching up. Briefly:

It's a cop inspect, Magua. I'm just naive toward chaos and paranoid toward evil. If I inspect someone who is neither chaotic nor evil, I get a sane result.
I dunno how this ability is useful as scum could just fakeclaim neutral as chaotic. If it were useful I wouldn't be claiming it. :\

Actually, our inspect targets would have just claimed their real alignment had we asked them to claim out of the blue (framing it as though we'd found something incriminating), because scum would've had no way whatsoever of knowing that Chaotic players give us naive results...had you...um...not just revealed that to the town right now.

>_>

Well, now that the cat's out of the bag, I asked town-aligned evil players to claim primarily because I wanted to know whom not to waste an investigation on. To be honest, I would have rather we'd sat on that piece of information until at least D3-4.

So I don't suppose there's any town-aligned evil player whose role PM DOESN'T call him a miller?

[singersigner]

Thoughts so far:
Why does Gamma feel the need to soft-claim, claim pre-maturely, claim at all, etc? Seems like a preemptive thought...

Seraphim got a little defensive over Mina's push about pronouns. Jack done fucked up one time because of pronouns. No way is that not a tell.

Fuuuck Sotty. Claiming Miller is pro-town, but quadz and I just encountered a scum-miller claim. Let's see how this pans out. (next post: damnit quadz you blind fuck-Mina, this might answer your question)

OMG, Equinox+quadz duo? Blatant buddying ftw! Oh wait, I forgot those aren't legitimate scum tells anymore. Or are they?

vote: Equinox

Oh Plum, I love it when you're probstown.

OMG AGM WHEN YOU HAVE A POLICY LYNCH USE IT ON NOBODY SPECIAL. ALL. THE. TIME.
(but seriously...WUT...you're gunna have to explain that one)

Oh look, Mothrax hops on the biggest wagon as soon as AGM wants to policy lynch him, herp derp.

Hito, how does that make AGM scum? If anything, it's only incriminating if we follow him and it doesn't work. 1-1 is waaay better for us than scum.
(Oh, I see...hmm...)
I DID NOT ALMOST REFUSE A FREE WIN HITO YOU LIAR--I really thought he was toying with me.

AGM, I like you much better when you play without Fate. You're town, and I'd like to keep my read on you that way (i.e. if Fate DOES replace into this game, don't start sucking because I hate it when people fuck with my reads)

MINA THIS IS WHY I HATE HYDRAS WHO DISAGREE AND CLAIM THEY DISAGREE (see: your point on Seraphim). You know this about me. You and MoI were effectively wishy-washy at certain points in Mordor, and allowed to you switch your reads on people at any moments glace. Pleasepleaseplease don't do that here because that's just the scummiest of all things if I do say so myself. (SAME FOR ALL THREE HYDRAS IN THIS GAME)

@Duplicity...in response to your take on a N0 vig shot, do you think all players are of equal use? Do you think there's any benefit for town to have a policy lynch so early in the game?

@VPB...from my experience (and I can read quadz like a book), he's just not a very good player (haha, ironic, I know). His play is very inquisitive and passive, regardless of alignment. He literally posts like he would converse in real life, which makes him that much easier for me to read. Right now, my read on him is scum, but I'd like to see him incriminate himself more, considering he'll lend well to finding his partners.

Gamma (and others) points out about there being no reason why the policy lynch couldn't be a scum role. I don't understand the hito-hate in him trying to figure out scumvtown on that one, especially without having understood the reason for the PL on Mothrax yet (AGM hadn't explained yet).

Miller claims are special. I'm not sure what to think about multiple millers in this game, as I'm not familiar with them. The idea that it's to counter cop investigations makes sense, though.

I'M ABOUT TO GET NINJA'D A LOT RIGHT NOW BUT THESE THOUGHTS ARE ONLY THROUGH PAGE 6.

FUCKFUCKFUCK STOP POSTING.

[singersigner]

Oh, and

unvote

I'm probably gunna end up going back to my policy on NS.

[VP Baltar]

What do you think of VV?

If you're comparing him to quadz, quadz is far worse. I don't have a strong read on VV either way at this point. He does tend to OMGUS a lot, so that's not really a surprise.

also, I hope this game doesn't turn into the VV-MoI show that happened in SAIII, because I'm really not interested in reading all of that.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

I'm not interested in reading a lot of

anything

so some people need to pipe down until it's their turn to hold the feather.

[AlmasterGM]

I have a paper due tomorrow so I don't have time to post tonight, but for those who asked: my ability does NOT cause the battery to reset - the day just keeps going with the current battery.

[Katsuki]

That's quite different from the double lynch mechanic seen in MACO...

Speaking of battery, who wants to bet that Vi threw in some twisted SK role like always that's based on battery/faith-powered abilities?

[Katsuki]

You signed up for a large theme and didn't expect walls of text?

My large theme games don't usually contain a giant wall post every other post...

[Parama]

He has called you a hypocritical sack of shit but personally I think that's pretty fair right now.

Oh, so he's just complementing me? Awwright d(''d)
I don't think I'm reading that block of text in Plum's post
sotty you're insulting me. I have the best cases, I just don't make them.
singer's kinda ignoring everything to do with scum vs. me. Bad.
Kat you need to play more large themes thanks

[singersigner]

singer's kinda ignoring everything to do with scum vs. me. Bad.

Huh? I haven't even read the whole game yet...

[singersigner]

EBWOP: You made two posts through page 6...neither of which were special enough to comment on...

[Nobody Special]

Also, this isn't a Night 0 vig, so don't say that it is.

Assuming AlmasterGM is telling the truth, which I am currently doing, it *is* a Night 0 vig *that requires the consent of the town*. That is *exactly* what it is. In fact, it's even *better* because we get to see mothrax's play before we decide to go through with it or not.

Bear with me for a bit: Suppose in one hand, I'm holding an apple, and in the other, an orange. Got it so far? Good.

Now, I show you the apple, and I say, "This is an apple. And it's

good.

" Now, when I show you the orange, I tell you "This apple is

better,

though, because it has Vitamin C!"

This is precisely what you're saying. You're trying, albeit cleverly, to twist the game circumstances for (I assume) your own purposes. Stop it.

VasudeVa: Don't give me this 'essentially' bullshit. You're trying to rename something into something else it isn't, and that's not pro-town.


That said, I am not thrilled with AGMs supposed power, nor his request, nor his tunneling of mothrax.

Equinox is behaving in a very Town manner (but I'm not sure if I've ever seen Scum!Equinox in a large game. I have in smaller ones. I'll have to look into this).

MoI is being MoI. Null-to-town so far.

Sottyrulez: Without getting into your specific Role PM, do you think that perhaps every player's Role PM would share certain similarities? Why or why not?:

I'll just put you on my "to-be-ignored-all-game" list now

This is no anti-town it hurts.

Your case on me: lol I voted twice in the same post
Uh okay.
That's not a case. I'll just put you on my "to-be-ignored-all-game" list now.

Again, defensiveness trying to be passed off as casual. Liking my vote more.

@Equinox:

Your opinion on Parama, please.

this is one huge slander campaign. great.

unvote, vote: magua

I don't care that VV has basically claimed scum. Magua basically just posted

his

role PM for us.

"his" = VV or Magua? Sorry, you know how dumb I can be about these things.

Parama: Scumhunting. What do I win?

Stretching crappy reasoning too far. ("Basicially just posted his role PM for us?") Also keenly aware that if Magua is lynched and I'm nk'd town is down on most of it's setup speculators in a fairly complex setup.

Hmmm .. not sure what to make of this. Why would you bother to specifically go out of your way to say this

Are you legitimately asking, or do you know and you're trying not to be obvious about it? I am pretty sure of the answer.

I still need to come back to: Gamma, Plum (not much), AGM, and more! Also, page 9 onward.

[Parama]

singer: I didn't read your post, I skimmed it. You expect me to know how far you are in the thread? <_<
NS: his = maguaaa
and you win the prize of having common sense. Feel proud, for you are among the few.

[singersigner]

GAWDDAMNIT PARAMA I'M IMPORTANT TOO.

[Parama]

I'm not reading any walls. Don't worry, nobody's important.

[Magua]

Bear with me for a bit: Suppose in one hand, I'm holding an apple, and in the other, an orange. Got it so far? Good.

Now, I show you the apple, and I say, "This is an apple. And it's good." Now, when I show you the orange, I tell you "This apple is better, though, because it has Vitamin C!"

This is precisely what you're saying. You're trying, albeit cleverly, to twist the game circumstances for (I assume) your own purposes. Stop it.

Look. I don't care about your semantics. Town can lynch mothrax for free today. The only question worth asking is, "Is mothrax a good lynch?"

Q1. Given the opportunity, would you vig a player N0?
Q2. Do you think mothrax is town?

[Nobody Special]

I'm not reading any walls. Don't worry, Nobody's important.

FTFY.

[Parama]

*headdesk*
I meant nobody as in
not nobody special
not singersinger
not parama
not vi

etc.

[Nobody Special]

(I knew what you meant. But I fixed it anyway. Work with me here.)