Mafia MetaMafia ~ Game Over!

[Faraday]

Nope @ Plum. want to lynch you.

[Magua]

town vig. posibillily of sk but hito shot makes much more sense from vig, but that's pro anyway who cares let's get him to kill scum we can lynch him later if game's not over. oh yeah, plum's ahead of ray. moi as scum is not something I see. how would you rank the 3 of them?

Opposite of you. Magna > Ray > Plum.

Why are my reads backwards of yours? I see lots of mudslinging from everyone involved (Ray's bugs me the most), but I see a *lot* from MoI. MoI, who I can usually rely on to be analytical, seems to not be analytical now. Plum strikes me as towniest, one most interested in actually finding and lynching scum, and I really want to know why you disagree.

[Faraday]

the MOI thing is mostly meta. but he's not like this as scum, I don't even know how to explain it properly. i'm confident I can read him though. the mudslining thing is something I see MOI doing under pressure regardless as he really doesn't like being attacked.

plum's lack of anything townie all game is fairly amazing. like at least rayfrost has dropped some minute towntells, plum? not one, nowhere. she's gotta be scum. teehing around quadz. interactions with singer seem off too. yeah.

plus despite me thinking moi not voting quadz is off I don't see him *not* bussing such a weak scumpartner day 1. god that's such a shitty reason. let's just leave it at meta + gut.

[ooba]

Vote: MoI

And in the worship plan, change solism to will for team VP - humor me.

[Nobody Special]

Hi. Reality surfaced, and kidnapped me for a few days. My apologies. I'm on page 40; with almost 20 pages to read I'll be updating as I go.

On page 39, ooba voted me: I just want to say that my absence from this game has no connection to the game. Check my posting history since middle of last week, if you care to. I've been modding and posting a (very) few nonposts in non-game threads.

Anyway, more soon.

[VP Baltar]

I expect good content or I'm going to consider shooting you, NS. No pressure!

[MagnaofIllusion]

This post is a perfect example of why you're not town.

You know what this post lacks – any concrete reason why I’m not Town. You once again simply say “This shows he’s not Town” but don’t bother to explain why.

Also, not only did you completely sidestep the question, but you also tried to turn it into an attack.

Go die.

How quaint. My observation is completely within the realm of what’s reasonable. My ISO is littered with game relevant posts. Making an observation about the Liten game and my bussing there is hardly any less relevant than your “he bussed like a champ in Liten” post that I responded to.

Once again you live for rhetoric instead of trying to determine scum motivations for my actions.

--

I don't know about scum partners but it certainly indicates something regarding your desperation.

Actually you just contradicted your own point there. If I was desperate to survive I’d be jumping on the next viable wagon – Plum. Pushing that hard would be the only logical course of action if I was worried about survival. There is a small but solid group that advocates her lynch over mine.

Maybe if you were actually trying to lynch scum rather than trying to buy town cred by being the big SK hunter, there would be something to your argument.

1. So pushing a Serial Killer who I’ve thought was scum isn’t scum-hunting? Ok, nice to see the thought process I’m dealing with here.
2. I’ve already listed others I consider scum – DA, Rayfrost and AGM. Feel free to continue to ignore that simply because I’m pushing my top suspect.

Something else I've thought of: why would he use this clock-draining ability to gain faith instead of making a kill which would be more in line with his win condition?

Who says he didn’t lie about killing N1? You know it is quite possible for a Serial Killer to use an ability and make a Factional kill the same Night. Your response that it’s ‘just conjecture’ is telling. If you don’t want to consider logical possibilities that’s fine.

--

Same goes for you MoI. The reason why I'm bashing your play so hard is because I find it completely ridiculous that you ignore all logic if you're town. It's completely ludicrous and you're standing there with a straight face going 'Gee VP, why don't you want to debate the merits if this monstrosity of lunacy I'm unable to let go of?'

What logic of yours am I ignoring? I haven’t seen anything out of you that is more than rhetoric. Period. Your attempt to have me ignore you by saying “I can’t win” isn’t logic.

You continue to avoid the crux of my problem with you – you began the day claiming to be a driving force in the Quadz lynch. In 987 I put together a rather comprehensive post showing your behavior towards Quadz Day 1 and Day 2. You’ve called it wrong but never actually shown me why my thoughts are incorrect.

How is your vote on Quadz Day 1 not suspect given how little you spoke about him in that post?

Did you actually push him Day 1? If so show me the ISO posts where you did so.

But you aren’t going to do this. I know I’m likewise wasting my time talking to you.

UNVOTE: VPBaltar

Town obviously isn’t going to lynch you and as much as I want to stand by my thoughts that you are obv-SK it's become unproductive. I’m going to go dig through DA and AGM since they are my other top suspects.

You want to be right because you think I'm an asshole or because you're scared I'm going to shoot you?

Sigh. I’m hardly scared of you shooting me. Because that would work out great given your “Hang me if I don’t shoot a Tiger” promise.

--

I see lots of mudslinging from everyone involved (Ray's bugs me the most), but I see a *lot* from MoI. MoI, who I can usually rely on to be analytical, seems to not be analytical now.

See this is the sort of hypocritical crap that just pisses me off.

I’ve been getting crap rhetoric and mudslinging from VPB and DA. Dare I respond in kind? No sir … I’m scum if I do so.

And how the FUCK am I not being analytical. I’ve used the information AVAILABLE to me regarding my Night actions to assess claims made.

Magua

– What is your stance on VPB and DA mudslining? Hmmmm? Are they scum for doing it? If your answer is No and involves “it’s in their nature not yours” that’s bullshit.

[RayFrost]

Wat.

Where did the suspicion of me go, MoI? DOES NOT COMPUTE.

Anyway, I had internet troubles that led to my not being able to catch up as much as I waned. I'll give you a full notes after I'm done reading, but I feel that giving partial notes any further will only lead to confusion. I'm heading off for the night, as I need to do stuff related to the reality at some point tonight, and I've procrastinated long enough.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Wat.

Where did the suspicion of me go, MoI? DOES NOT COMPUTE.

Who said I didn't still have suspicions of you? This is the sort of knee-jerk 'gotcha' kind of posting I would expect from scum.

DA has been my solid number 2.
You must not be reading my posts if you missed where I said AGM lurking is a scum-tell for him and I'd likely be moving him way up my list.

Don't worry ... I'll ISO you also!

[RayFrost]

Wat.

Where did the suspicion of me go, MoI? DOES NOT COMPUTE.

Who said I didn't still have suspicions of you? This is the sort of knee-jerk 'gotcha' kind of posting I would expect from scum.

DA has been my solid number 2.
You must not be reading my posts if you missed where I said AGM lurking is a scum-tell for him and I'd likely be moving him way up my list.

Don't worry ... I'll ISO you also!

T'was my understanding (that I apparently got wrong) that your order of suspicion was VP as conf-scum, Ray as almost certainly scum and then other people (DA / AGM) as possible scum. Probably due to the amount of posts you spend focusing on us and ignoring DA / AGM.

My bod on the... misunderstanding.

Oh thanks. I was feeling left out to be honest. <3

[AlmasterGM]

Ok .. AGM gets thrown in the scum pool also.

Because VPB is a Serial Killer and scum would have every reason to not power them up.

Meanwhile the fence-sitting on me "is obv-Fake, yet if it isn't I worry" is bad.

If I was scum and VPB was SK, why would I want to power him up so he could shoot all my buddies?

Also meanwhile note that AGM didn't blink an eye at VPB's claim which is so much more powerful than mine yet mine is obv-fake claim. Scum worried about their Top end powers being comprimised.

Because VPB is shooting scum whereas you are scum.

It's ok VPB - when I flip Town you are going to hang as scum. Don't fight it .. the noose is coming sooner or later for you.

This isn't even true. Even if you are town, your power didn't go through because RayFrost was able to activate, right? So it's highly possible you were roleblocked.

While I agree with the character trait bit being most likely - I'd like to get this checked - Does any other player have "Solism" as one of their domains?

No.

Also, as a general note, my domains seem to be more indicitave of my character and alignment than my alliegance.
VOTE: VP Baltar

VOTE: VP Baltar[/b]
This is definitely a scummy vote. Frankly, who cares if VPB is SK? If he is, he's not going to shoot the three most protown people and go TROLOLOLOL, CYA GUYS and then get lynched. He's going to try to win the whole thing, which means shooting scumz. And so long as he's shooting scum, why not power him up?

[We lynch the SK insted of scum] because I'm pretty damn sure he's the SK, he's confident, and people are interested in boosting him heavily tonight. I'm quite a bit less sure that RayFrost is scum than that VPB is SK. And hell, if it gets people to take notice of my analysis of his claim even after I'm dead so that you are less likely to go along with whatever plan he devises, it's worth focusing on him.

Town want to lynch scum. Scum want to lynch SK. Bada bing bada bing.

scotty's opinion on this is right and town.

Do either Furcolow or Yosarian seem like players with likely Hider / Weak Doctor roles to you? I’ve been mulling over the jump from 3 kills to 4 last Night and that’s the one element I can come up with to answer the swing.

I could see Yosarian as weak doctor. I think I remember him talking about it in MD once. Furcolow...maybe hider? Not really.

meh, so I messed up with my N0 action. Regardless, I still killed scum and I'm still town. If another person vigged hito, I'm sure they would have countered me, yeah?

...yeah. This is definitely SK. WHOOPS.

We're still not lynching him right now, though. Scotty's got it right.

[quote="MoI']Speking of Liten and its players - where exactly is AGM? I know from other games he's done with his Semester or something. Move him up my lynch list to right under VPB if he doesn't make any solid posts today. He loves to lurk as scum.

[/quote][/quote]
Did I post anywhere on site yesterday? No? Could that possibly mean I was away from a computer yesterday and not that I am scum? This is why you are scum - You stretch to make everything your scumreads do scummy.

tl;dr - Scum: MoI, Plum. SK: Prob-VPB.

[AlmasterGM]

FFFFFFF fucked up the quote tags....

Ok .. AGM gets thrown in the scum pool also.

Because VPB is a Serial Killer and scum would have every reason to not power them up.

Meanwhile the fence-sitting on me "is obv-Fake, yet if it isn't I worry" is bad.

If I was scum and VPB was SK, why would I want to power him up so he could shoot all my buddies?

Also meanwhile note that AGM didn't blink an eye at VPB's claim which is so much more powerful than mine yet mine is obv-fake claim. Scum worried about their Top end powers being comprimised.

Because VPB is shooting scum whereas you are scum.

It's ok VPB - when I flip Town you are going to hang as scum. Don't fight it .. the noose is coming sooner or later for you.

This isn't even true. Even if you are town, your power didn't go through because RayFrost was able to activate, right? So it's highly possible you were roleblocked.

While I agree with the character trait bit being most likely - I'd like to get this checked - Does any other player have "Solism" as one of their domains?

No.

Also, as a general note, my domains seem to be more indicitave of my character and alignment than my alliegance.
VOTE: VP Baltar

VOTE: VP Baltar

This is definitely a scummy vote. Frankly, who cares if VPB is SK? If he is, he's not going to shoot the three most protown people and go TROLOLOLOL, CYA GUYS and then get lynched. He's going to try to win the whole thing, which means shooting scumz. And so long as he's shooting scum, why not power him up?

[We lynch the SK insted of scum] because I'm pretty damn sure he's the SK, he's confident, and people are interested in boosting him heavily tonight. I'm quite a bit less sure that RayFrost is scum than that VPB is SK. And hell, if it gets people to take notice of my analysis of his claim even after I'm dead so that you are less likely to go along with whatever plan he devises, it's worth focusing on him.

Town want to lynch scum. Scum want to lynch SK. Bada bing bada bing.

scotty's opinion on this is right and town.

Do either Furcolow or Yosarian seem like players with likely Hider / Weak Doctor roles to you? I’ve been mulling over the jump from 3 kills to 4 last Night and that’s the one element I can come up with to answer the swing.

I could see Yosarian as weak doctor. I think I remember him talking about it in MD once. Furcolow...maybe hider? Not really.

meh, so I messed up with my N0 action. Regardless, I still killed scum and I'm still town. If another person vigged hito, I'm sure they would have countered me, yeah?

...yeah. This is definitely SK. WHOOPS.

We're still not lynching him right now, though. Scotty's got it right.

Speking of Liten and its players - where exactly is AGM? I know from other games he's done with his Semester or something. Move him up my lynch list to right under VPB if he doesn't make any solid posts today. He loves to lurk as scum.

Did I post anywhere on site yesterday? No? Could that possibly mean I was away from a computer yesterday and not that I am scum? This is why you are scum - You stretch to make everything your scumreads do scummy.

tl;dr - Scum: MoI, Plum. SK: Prob-VPB.

[VP Baltar]

Also, once I get my vig powers I plan to be using one bullet to shoot the SK. I think I have a good idea of who it is.

[AlmasterGM]

Ok, good.

[AlmasterGM]

Wait, in a setup with this many kills, wouldn't they be BP?

[VP Baltar]

Well, if one of my kills goes through and the other doesn't, I guess we'll have pretty good info on who the SK is then, yeah?

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

MoI and Plum’s comments just remind me of don_johnson at his most paranoid and crazy; when everything is going wrong he’ll say anything. We get it, VPB might be a SK but that’s a big assumption in and of itself and his survival either way depends on listening to the town and/or killing scum. I think MoI needs to die first because he seems willing and able to screw things up at night.

Other scum is probably one of the sides of RayFrost/Parama with a decent side chance of NS depending on what he shows since showing up again.

Can we get our night action plan posted again to make sure everyone sees it?

[RayFrost]

I don't remember it precisely, but it's approximately...

People worship will when they're going to worship VPB (I believe it was 5 people, don't remember who)

Rest of people worship one of justice / balance to power up ooba (I'd prefer justice and I remember being in this list: worshiping justice gives me a way to actually remove myself from the game without costing an extra kill on me, provided certain contigencies)

[ooba]

Rest of people worship one of justice / balance to power up ooba (I'd prefer justice and I remember being in this list: worshiping justice gives me a way to actually remove myself from the game without costing an extra kill on me, provided certain contigencies)

What do you think of the fact that scotty said singer worshiped Justice on N2?

[Parama]

Why isn't there a huge RayFrost wagon after my beautiful case?

[VP Baltar]

Magua can post the final night plan. As I said before, I'd prefer two very town players to be on my worship team (Sottyrulez and Faraday?) and the rest to be slightly or highly suspicious people. This will most likely either give us an idea of scum worshiping each other tonight or force their hand into powering me up.

@ooba - can you point that post out to me specifically, I believe I missed whatever you're talking about. Thank you.

[VP Baltar]

Parama - who do you think is the SK?

[RayFrost]

Rest of people worship one of justice / balance to power up ooba (I'd prefer justice and I remember being in this list: worshiping justice gives me a way to actually remove myself from the game without costing an extra kill on me, provided certain contigencies)

What do you think of the fact that scotty said singer worshiped Justice on N2?

1) there are three scum dead, it is possible that hito was the person they were powering up

2) Knowing that singer worshiped justice n2 is nice and all, but we have no idea what it was going

toward

. For what we know, it's going to be used n3 and there's nothing we can do about it.

3) Let's say there is a tiger that benefits from these worhips. Would the relative return of the tiger's ability outweigh the benefit of both of us getting our 6 faith casts? Naturally, this assumes you believe me to be honest town for analysis, but it immediately becomes unimportant to see my answer if I'm scum. Suffice to say I believe that you are town and that you are honest in saying your cast is awesome. I'm going to come out and say my cast is also awesome. Let's double our awesome.

Suffice to say I can remove myself from the game while benefiting town assuming nobody tries to kill me. I'd rather not get into more depth on this for the time being. If at least six people claim justice or syncretism worship D4, I'll spill the beans. Until then, it's not worthwhile.

I'm actually following what I've dubbed as the MoCo Strategem. Instead of trying to minimize the gains of scum, simply maximize the gains of town. VPB / other MoCo people might be able to follow me on this one, but I'll explain for the rest of you. In MoCo, both scum and town seraphs gain(ed) faith proportional to the percentage of the battery remaining, town seraphs just got more out of it. Town lynched quickly to make sure the battery was high, giving town seraphs the edge faith-wise despite the fact scum also benefited in terms of faith. This was mostly overpowered by good scum play, but that's beside the point.

Point is, worrying about what possible gains this could be giving to scum is not really the best way to go about it: think instead about the maximization of town's power. Town benefits with two roles getting beastly casts, scum benefits from possibly getting one (and at an unlikely possibility of two, making it at worst even). In the totals, town comes out ahead.

On the other hand, consider the possibility that scum also have a good role that has the balance domain. Too many possibilities: I'd rather take the for sure route of two town boosts with a risk of a scum boost over one town boost with the risk of a scum boost. (actually just thought of this right now, so yeah_

God, I wrote too much here.

[RayFrost]

Why'd you Worship one of your own Domains N0?

We worshiped our own domains on N0 and N1. We didn't even realize until recent discussions that it was even possible to worship outside of your own domain. (Which is something we are now willing to do now that it's being proposed... I guess.)

Solism isn't one of our domains for the record.

Also, we have been debating disclosing this, and we're going to do it now because it makes me uneasy about worshiping Justice, and without disclosing this it's hard to explain why.

Singer worshiped Justice the night she was killed, which leads us to believe that worshiping Justice as we're planning to may net scum some kind of benefit.

This post, VPB

[RayFrost]

In case it wasn't obvious before, I'm actually pointing a lot of thought into this game. I'm just not trying that hard to scumhunt because I was wrong before and everybody else seems to have that under control. I'd rather duck my head down to the chopping block post-cast, get beheaded, and then enjoy the music.

Going to confirm something with the mod about this, as I just realized a potential flaw in my thinking.