Wizards at the Sorcerers' Den - Endgame

[Albert B. Rampage]

What are the interesting interactions?

[Beefster]

I am starting to doubt a little and have Beefster as possibly bad town.

Bingo.

[Beefster]

unvote, vote: Amrun

Had about enough of her attention-seeking and dropping Beefster's name every 5 posts. We're Day 1, dear. You don't have a guilty on him. Let it go. But I think you're scum anyway, because you try too hard and there's a dark cloud following every post you make.

Finally. Someone sees what I'm getting at, here.

Unvote

VOTE: Amrun

@Baby_Spice: Sheeping/BWing. Same thing really in my book. You've been sheeping the primary wagons with little more than BS explanations.

[Katy]

@WrathChild

Fair enough.

Unvote

VOTE: Baby Spice
Not liking the nitpicking and misrep. You've been sheeping a lot, too. (Like right now)

This is not inconsistent with BabySpice town, unfortunately. I don't know how she is as scum, so she might be like this as scum too, but these points in itself don't prove anything about BabySpice.

I've been wavering on Amrun but at this point in time I don't get a huge scum vibe from her or Beef despite each constantly picking at the other. If I were to change my vote it would go to LMP, or there is one other person I don't like the look of:

Would really like to hear more from SnakePlissken, not liking his contribution so far.

This coming from a person who has three posts in the entire game.

[Albert B. Rampage]

I've been wavering on Amrun

In what instances did you favor her as scum and what changed your mind?

[Beefster]

It wasn't reaction fishing, it was reaction fishing, it wasn't reaction fishing. Pick one.

It wasn't initially reaction fishing, but it turned out to elicit a useful response. As go early cases. Bluntly said, some of the earlier reasons are crap.

I also think he's making up scumtells to suit who he wants to vote for. (Voting twice in a post, reading/not reading the thread)

Nah. I was pointing out tendencies. I thought it was interesting. I wasn't really planning on using it legitimately against her. (Once again, I told you it was a stretch.) Also, note where my vote is right now... Right. It's not currently on Amrun.

Tell me again who has to fake scum hunting and make up cases on people? I forget.

I don't see your point. I have told you it wasn't intended to be used for an attack. It was meant to be food for thought. Take it as you will.

About voting twice: I forgot to unvote. What's so scummy about that?

You tell me, you're the one who seemed to vote someone for it.

I've been doing it quite a bit in this game. I thought it was an awesome way to FoS.

Don't see a pro-town person behind these actions.

Sure. I play in a somewhat anti-town manner, even though I have town intentions. I'm still town.

We can only judge you by your actions, not your claimed intentions, and if you play in an anti-town manner then your anti-town.

Doesn't make me scum, though. There's quite a difference.

[Beefster]

14- Beefster [Healthy] (5) - Amrun, LynchMePls, ManaKu, BabySpice, gandalf5166

:snapshot:

I see what you're getting at. There's gotta be at least 2 scum on that wagon. In fact, there's a good chance that all but ManaKu are scum... I haven't exactly liked the way gandalf has been playing, at least lately. We shall see what happens, then.

[Amrun]

What are the interesting interactions?

Initially, Pine/Beefster was the first one to spark my interest. Chesskid/ManaKu I noted but it wasn't particularly interesting.

Soben/town has been interesting because the heads are different and independently wrong.

WrathChild/CK was fairly interesting, too.

p-edit: I give up on Beefster. He seriously thinks that throwing out "food for thought" is less scummy than outright attacking and that a whole scumteam would be on his wagon at this point.

I'm tired of explaining why that's scummy. He's PROUD of being a bad player. It's the definition of a VI.

He could be scum, though, and dismissing him as a VI would be a bad move. I'm done with him for now, though. It's making my head hurt.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Beefster is not a VI, you are being insulting for no reason. One minute your interest is sparked, the next your head hurts. Pine is dead. You keep on harping about the same circular logic thing that nobody quite gets. We are tired and we want a conclusion to this.

Amrun, dear, who is scum if not Beefster? How do you feel about Baby Spice?

[Amrun]

He says he's bad town, he's proud of it, and he's not interested in changing or improving. That's what a VI means to me.

But perhaps it was a little too far. My apologies, Beefster. You are not playing well, though, and I make no apologies for stating that.

My interest was sparked, but I've been beating the same horse for awhile now and now my interest is waning. That is the natural progression of such things.

Baby Spice is leaning town to me at the moment, but is close to null.

My picks for scum if not Beefster are implosion and gandalf, with an outside chance of LMP.

Clearly even if those are all right, there are more scum. I need to re-read and/or do ISOs while thinking about some new things and looking for some new angles, which I will do when I get the chance.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Beefster, do you agree with Amrun's assessments of your play?

[IceyCupcake]

Amrun annoys me too. I endorse this lynch.

/hop

Unvote, Vote: Amrun

Dammit Katsuki, we were already voting for Amrun because it's an AWESOME lynch. And I'm the Jester?

Like... at least check the VC or something QQ

[Amrun]

What are the points of these questions? They don't seem to have one.

[Albert B. Rampage]

What are the points of these questions? They don't seem to have one.

You don't make any actual good points against Beefster. If anything it feels like you're bullying someone 3 years your junior. It's ugly.

As for Beefster, he keeps proclaiming that he's town. Like saying it makes it so. I don't like that. I have yet to determine where he's going with his overall strategy.

[IceyCupcake]

What are the points of these questions? They don't seem to have one.

You don't make any actual good points against Beefster. If anything it feels like you're bullying someone 3 years your junior. It's ugly.

As for Beefster, he keeps proclaiming that he's town. Like saying it makes it so. I don't like that. I have yet to determine where he's going with his overall strategy.

What you mean like Pine was doing like 10 pages ago? Are you scum, ABR? Null tell is fucking null.

[Bunnylover]

This whole talk about mod kill and etc should really stop. It makes my reading slower and makes me not want to read the thread so I'll miss something that I should have picked up on >_<.
Anyways I'm getting a town read on SGR.
Chesskid is chesskid, therefore null.
I haven't really seen anything that I can question, attack, defend against or anything in this thread mainly because 20 of these pages are focusing on if Pine was MK or not.
Although if we are going to go after a lurker, I wouldn't pick RBT to go after. If memory calls correct, the last game with her she did the exact same thing (lurk hard) and still flipped town. I would at least let some kinda damage role take her out.
And I don't remember the other lurkers. Where is ABR by the way?

No I've explained why this RBT is scummy as hell. Also if you don't think the fact you DON'T FUCKING REMEMBER anyone on my lurker list for people we should kill the hell out is a bad sign, I am HIGHLY dissapointed.

The claimed mason is null? Are you like... high?

Bunny, this post was bad. I take back my town read and Katsuki's too, just for this. Even if I have to argue with Katsuki over it.

lol, sorry. I will redeem myself by making you call me town v_v.
Claim mason from chesskid = WIFOM. If anyone else had hinted at them been mason, I probably would have taken it more seriously, but since its chesskid......can you take a lot of what he says seriously? Basically im not sure if he was serious or not, which it doesn't matter as I probably wouldn't lynch CK3 today regardless if he is a mason or not.
But your reasoning for RBT been scum was, "RBT HAS DONE SO IN A HORRIBLY SCUMMY WAY.". Now you could probably go to RBT ISO and find something scummy about her 3 or 4 post or something, but I rather have you stop trying to kill of the easy day 1 people (i.e. the lurkers) who should be left for the damaging roles to take care of them (as damage role = vig in a sense). Although I guess since this game is a different kinda of game where one killing role might not kill their target, it makes sense to go after lurkers somewhat.
Snake, I've played two games with him. Both, he lurked in. Don't give a damn what we do about him.
I didn't even know that last guy was in this game o.o.
These people are all good choices to die from. But not by a lynch. I feel that the information that would be gather from killing a lurker off from a lynch would be nothing, therefore a kill is better.

Interesting.
Mod- Snow_Bunny [Healthy] (1) - Bunnylover
If their is an ability that is killing off people if they claim, it would obviously belong to the mod. Reason of this thinking is because in OoT mafia, the mods were able to auto hammer masons if they were put at L-1. I really think we should lynch Snow_Bunny and therefore have a chance at claiming. Although this is all

Amrum wagon picking up speed. Gonna have to ISO him to see my stance on him.

[Amrun]

Not my intent to bully, instead trying to determine motivation. Sometimes my potty mouth can get me into trouble with twisting how I come across, though. Do you agree that his attacks on me are bad?

Does making a bad attack, being called on it, going "lolreaction fishing," being called on THAT, and saying it wasn't really reaction fishing seem town to you, though? Really?

In general, he throws very broad, unspecific suspicion on people, including me, like he's waiting to see how people react before making a real accusation, and that's a pretty reliable scumtell for me.

When each new attack he makes on me is debunked, he reaches further to find a reason to keep his vote on me, which is also a fairly reliable scumtell imo.

I do believe him that he's often lynched d1, but using that as a defense really strikes me off. He could easily be trying to abuse his own meta.

Those are the things that make me think he is scum.

But still, there's something niggling in the back of my mind that he really believes the attacks he's making are okay and is lazy town that doesn't read properly, which he admits to. This is a more recent development, and why I'm rethinking a little bit.

[Albert B. Rampage]

What you mean like Pine was doing like 10 pages ago? Are you scum, ABR? Null tell is fucking null.

Don't speak out of turn, you insolent upstart. Pine was in the midst of claiming when he said he was town. Gigantic difference.

[IceyCupcake]

What you mean like Pine was doing like 10 pages ago? Are you scum, ABR? Null tell is fucking null.

Don't speak out of turn, you insolent upstart. Pine was in the midst of claiming when he said he was town. Gigantic difference.

Do you want me to link to a few townies in previous games repeatedly declaring they're town? Frankly, it's always been a big temptation. "Why aren't you scum?" "Because my role PM says town, you damn derp."

Beefster feels town to me. I explained why several pages back. Pine was also declaring he'd be lynched so he'd be confirmed town and we could all trust his reads (because somehow alignment confirmation is read confirmation I dunno).

/ICE

[Albert B. Rampage]

Read it in context.

Amrun et al: You are scummy for xyz
Beefster: You are wrong. I am town.
Others: What about abc
Beefster: I am town though.

Doesn't explain his thought process or nothing, expects us to take it at face value.

[Amrun]

Read it in context.

Amrun et al: You are scummy for xyz
Beefster: You are wrong. I am town.
Others: What about abc
Beefster: I am town though.

Doesn't explain his thought process or nothing, expects us to take it at face value.

Yes, exactly. So why do you have a townread on him?

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'll unvote you on the spot if you can tell me where I said I had a townread on him.

[Amrun]

unvote, vote: Amrun

Had about enough of her attention-seeking and dropping Beefster's name every 5 posts. We're Day 1, dear. You don't have a guilty on him. Let it go. But I think you're scum anyway, because you try too hard and there's a dark cloud following every post you make.

I thought you were implying it with this post and subsequent posts.

Unless you think we're bussing each other?

[Amrun]

To clarify, I don't understand how you can both find me scummy and agree with me that Beefster is scummy. It seems incongruous.

[Baby Spice]

It wasn't reaction fishing, it was reaction fishing, it wasn't reaction fishing. Pick one.

It wasn't initially reaction fishing, but it turned out to elicit a useful response. As go early cases. Bluntly said, some of the earlier reasons are crap.

I like how you ignore the fact that when your reasons were called crap, you said that you were reaction fishing, then when called on your supposed "reaction fishing" you again changed.
Backtracking like that is scummy.

I also think he's making up scumtells to suit who he wants to vote for. (Voting twice in a post, reading/not reading the thread)

Nah. I was pointing out tendencies. I thought it was interesting. I wasn't really planning on using it legitimately against her. (Once again, I told you it was a stretch.) Also, note where my vote is right now... Right. It's not currently on Amrun.

Tell me again who has to fake scum hunting and make up cases on people? I forget.

I don't see your point. I have told you it wasn't intended to be used for an attack. It was meant to be food for thought. Take it as you will.

I'm sure you do.

Scum have to fake scum hunting, obviously.

About voting twice: I forgot to unvote. What's so scummy about that?

You tell me, you're the one who seemed to vote someone for it.

I've been doing it quite a bit in this game. I thought it was an awesome way to FoS.

What, voting for people who voted twice?

Don't see a pro-town person behind these actions.

Sure. I play in a somewhat anti-town manner, even though I have town intentions. I'm still town.

We can only judge you by your actions, not your claimed intentions, and if you play in an anti-town manner then your anti-town.

Doesn't make me scum, though. There's quite a difference.

You want to walk like a duck, and quack like a duck, then pardon me for calling you a duck.