ASOIAF: Test of Faith Mafia (Game Over!)

[Magua]

What would you have concluded if my wagon had gotten sails?
What have you concluded given that the MoI wagon has swollen?
And how does not reading MoI's posts fit into that scheme?

In general, the faster a wagon grows in size, the less likely I believe that the person being wagoned is scum. You, especially, tend to gain a small wagon D1, and I wanted to see if that would happen again.

Not reading MoI's posts is because I couldn't be arsed once him/LMP/LB degenerated into noise.

[ooba]

Vote Count

LynchMePls (3)

- Nexus, Locke Lamora, MagnaofIllusion

MagnaofIllusion (6)

- DrippingGoofball, LynchMePls, Hinduragi, SpyreX, Kast, Bilbo Baggins

SaintKerrigan (6)

- Empking, Lost Butterfly, AlmasterGM, vezokpiraka, Benmage, Maemuki

Lost Butterfly (2)

- hasdgfas, SaintKerrigan

Maemuki (3)

- Setael, Magua, Thor665

Not Voting (0)

-

Nil

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to lynch!

[DrippingGoofball]

In general, the faster a wagon grows in size, the less likely I believe that the person being wagoned is scum.

Nah. The fastest D1 wagon I've ever seen had 3 scumpals bus'ing zwet like there was no tomorrow.

And how do you define "fast?" Maybe the scum is really obvscum. Maybe there is a lot of activity in the thread. These are things that make it hard to define "fast." And how about the current STALL on the MoI wagon? Where does a stall fit in? It goes fast (by your definition) then it sputters. Does your belief that the person being wagon is more or less scum, after a stall (let's not inject in the particulars of current wagonees, I'm just trying to show that the theory behind your position is untenable).

[hasdgfas]

*points at LB*
*Points at cow*
*Brings hands together*
*Does the hokie-pokie*

*spreads arms wide*

[Magua]

Nah. The fastest D1 wagon I've ever seen had 3 scumpals bus'ing zwet like there was no tomorrow.

Yeah. And busses like that tend to fool me, and I end up looking like crap because I defend the person and then they get lynched and D2 everyone's like "lolpartner." But I tend to not care because a D1 scum lynch and a D2 me lynch is really good for town regardless.

And how do you define "fast?" Maybe the scum is really obvscum. Maybe there is a lot of activity in the thread. These are things that make it hard to define "fast." And how about the current STALL on the MoI wagon? Where does a stall fit in? It goes fast (by your definition) then it sputters. Does your belief that the person being wagon is more or less scum, after a stall (let's not inject in the particulars of current wagonees, I'm just trying to show that the theory behind your position is untenable).

Seriously, where have you been with this ability to put forth an articulate argument? This is the exact sort of thing I wanted to get out of you in ASoS, and there all I get is "hasdgfas, please get yourself modkilled" and "town list/scum list".

Of the three of MoI/LB/LMP, I find LMP to be the most suspect and the one I would most want to lynch.
However, I don't want a lynch yet.
As for the rest of it: I'm done talking about what I get out of what I do.

I think Maemuki is scummy. Do you think she's town, scummy, or null?

[DrippingGoofball]

Seriously, where have you been with this ability to put forth an articulate argument? This is the exact sort of thing I wanted to get out of you in ASoS, and there all I get is "hasdgfas, please get yourself modkilled" and "town list/scum list".

Was I not right???? My argument was clearly beyond your diminutive comprehension, that is all.

I think Maemuki is scummy. Do you think she's town, scummy, or null?

Lemme check.

[DrippingGoofball]

Yes. Maemuki is scum. As are MoI and vezok.

[Magua]

Was I not right???? My argument was clearly beyond your diminutive comprehension, that is all.

I never questioned you being right in ASoS. What I'm questioning is why your well-reasoned, cogent argument was beyond my diminutive comprehension in ASoS, and yet why you are so selfless to step through the baby steps so that my unworthy mind can understand your will in this game.

[DrippingGoofball]

I dunno. Hascow was so obv. The "restriction" had no head or tail. I was wondering, how would a mod even phrase the rules of so stupid a restriction? Why this wasn't obv to everyone, I'll never understand. But I came under heavy challenge for trying to out him. Crazy isn't it.

Usually I like to leave room for other people to figure things out. The best way to convince people is to suggest, and let them convince themselves. When I feel like, though, I can fill in the gaps.

[Maemuki]

Whoa, amazing how I managed to gather 3 votes with...yeah, one post. I have a gift for this. Anyway, the only thing I find defendable in the cases of the people who voted for me is this: ...uh, nope, can't find a thing other than "obv scum is scum". Amazing.

However, I can't help but notice that everybody has me on their scumlist somewhere. While this is not scummy for the most part, it is when people ignore the rest of the game. So, Magua. What's your opinion on the top 2 wagons?

About the MoI/LB argument, quite frankly...it sucks. Maybe I'm being tainted by my "hate-meta-with-a-passion", but logic dictates MoI should be scummy, yet my gut says that he isn't. I mean, the LMP vote is dodgy for being (self-admitted) sheeping (*cue the cries of hypocrisy*) and for sounding like a pretty poor excuse for an OMGUS, but overall my gut says town.

And I never won a game with logic, so screw that and put him on my most-likely-town list.

Locke Lamora's vote also sounds hella sketchy, mostly because he's arguing a way of phrasing something, not the actual argument.

As for my current vote, SK? Sorry, but even with that post, you're still my main suspect. Why? Well...to be completely fair, you do bring a couple of points I agree on, like LL. And I'm not as sure. I don't know...I don't find anything overly scummy about it, nor overly townie. It's just a post.

I'd like to have something a bit more in-depth for my first real post, but my back says I cannot. I don't promise anything, but I'll probrably have something better before Sunday.

[Lost Butterfly]

i'm not arguing with MOI. you mean LMP?

[Magua]

Whoa, amazing how I managed to gather 3 votes with...yeah, one post. I have a gift for this. Anyway, the only thing I find defendable in the cases of the people who voted for me is this: ...uh, nope, can't find a thing other than "obv scum is scum". Amazing.

This is fluff.

However, I can't help but notice that everybody has me on their scumlist somewhere. While this is not scummy for the most part, it is when people ignore the rest of the game. So, Magua. What's your opinion on the top 2 wagons?

I have no opinion on SaintKerrigan; total nullread.
I would prefer to lynch LMP than MoI; it's not that MoI looks townier, it's that LMP looks scummier.

[DrippingGoofball]

I would prefer to lynch LMP than MoI; it's not that MoI looks townier, it's that LMP looks scummier.

Really? How?

[SpyreX]

Man the vibes in here are going to make for one of those games. Lets hang each other civilly, k?

As per sig I'm on a garbage laptop and thus hampered some but the following I can do off the cuff?

MOI's activity yesterday: Chunks. Around 3 pm is the end of the first wave (ending on this one). MoI is then a talking point for the rest of the day. Hops on, checks the other games and nay a word here. Couple that with indignant rage for an awesome sandwich.

And as for "why am I not a good vig shot?" Ohh, you're a good vig shot. You're a much better lynch. Because Sk doesn't have ardent meta defenders and teeth pulling every step of the way to get it done. That wagon, especially in a cult game, if it turns up scum on you (it will) turns into liquid gold.

[DrippingGoofball]

I ate the cookies, now back to my intended vote. I did notice that incriminating posting pattern from MoI.

VOTE: MoI

[Bilbo Baggins]

What do you think about AlmasterGM?

I think AGM is town.

Okay, well at least you went into my answer a bit later, so I won't mock you totally on this one. But, seriously, there are a handful of players I just really don't consider solid Day 1 lynch options. If he's scum, look for a buddy and let's lynch the buddy. If he's alive Day 2 I'll be willing to start considering him. At the moment he is doing...well, his usual hyper logic with a few leaps I think are silly, but which overall looks like scumhunting, and I'd rather donk him around and make him explain some of the odd logic than run a serious wagon on him in any way, shape, or form. If you want to run a "lol, bad logic" wagon let's at least run up vezo or DGB or something because at least i could probably accept that as a good idea. This isn't.

So, let me get this straight.
1) You think he's scum.
2) You don't want to lynch scum_Magna.
3) You think that keeping him around will help us find his buddies?
4) The Magna lynch is bad logic.

Because I fail to see how a scumlynch is not a desireable lynch D1. What kinda' Norse weed you smoking?

I actually like Maemuki as scum better than MoI at this point.

Why, for Mae's one bad vote in his only post? Surely we can do better.
OH WAIT.
MAGNA_SCUM.
SERIOUSLY, SET.
REVOTE.

Making assumptions about who's scum and trying to find buddies based off that Day 1 is a shot in the dark

This.

THOR: Magna will just bus/distance do whatever he can to confuse the shit out of us after we label him obvscum and tomorrow's lynch.
Something I attempted to do in SAIII after being outed as scum- buddy/do whatever I could to murk up the waters. Failed miserably though.

Yeah, but non eof you dill donkeys suspect him yet

We do. Set and Spy do. Votecounts are for reading, Thor.

Check out the people in bold. Notice the correlation - they are all sketchy people, and they are all avoiding the top two wagons. Why is this?

Because Magua is the CR and trying to stay under the radar?

I'm sure this isn't Blackest Night.

GTFO

Tootown4lynch is not a default state - especially with the conditional "ohh TOMORROW would be fine".

Still confused as to how lynching scum_Magna today is not optimal play.

I honestly do not remember you being so dense in any of the other games I've seen you in.

*cough* He's playing dumb and thick because he's CR. *cough*

Do you mind pointing this out to a blind cow who has no idea what you're seeing?

So now you're blind too?

What do YOU think of Lost Butterfly, Magna, and Magua?

Also: If you think I'm scummy, or my posts are scummy, vote for me.

Or explode. One of the two.

No.

But, this is definitely scum talking. The whole forced "either vote for me or stop talking about me" thing. I can call you scum just fine without the vote. And you should like being under the magnifying glass, no?

Definitely CR talking, AGM. Look at him in ISO. His weaksauce play. He's not doing much of anything.
For example:

'Can you get on with dayvigging scum so I can get on with sheeping you?'

This is not good town behaviour. Hell, we weren't even voting with him, and he's still voting DGB for loljoke reasons and getting away with it? AGM you're calling him scummy alot and who are you voting? Kerrigan?

All I'm saying is he's a good enough player that he's not worth lynching on this weak as sin wagon you guys are cobbling together.

So apparently being "good" at this mafia thing is enough to spare you from a lynch? Good to know.
OH WAIT.
That's shit reasoning, sorry Thor.
OH WAIT. I'm not sorry.

".

And... if this wagon is weak as sin and made from nothing why in the name of everything holy would it be open to debate tomorrow?

To: Thor
From: Spy and Andy

The only think I agree with from vezok is that AGM is town.

Faraday is scum attempting to set off LMP. I'll let Plum frost this cake since its already baked in-QT but Faraday is one burnt cupcake in the batch.

Page 9 is scum_faraday pushing town_LMP and aggravating him for the ends. Again, Plum'll frost this one.

The last page or two reinforces why I'm happy with an LB vote. Absolutely ludicrous behavior(from both involved, but instigated by LB)

This. Faraday is clearly egging LMP on into a downward spiral. Also, since Faraday hates bussing as scum, him and Magna fit perfectly together. CLEARLY attempting to divert from a leading wagon.
Also, what do you think the chances are of Faraday/Magna buddies?

Nexus, Locke: Would either of you be willing to shift away from LMP onto, say, Faraday or Magna?

Setael, please consider moving your vote onto Magna again. Also, what do you think of Faraday?

Honestly I'm not even concerned with vezok. Magna is still scum whether vezok is a buddy or not.


Magna votehops to LMP after saying DGB-wagon isn't going anywhere (Hint: DGB = town) and he's going to sheep onto LMP.

Faraday: Do you think LMP is scum? If so, why SK over LMP?
Also, what do you think of Magua?

If you think you see me calling Hind (or anyone) Cult then you aren’t seeing it correctly. I’ll respond if you wish to elaborate on what you think you see.

I saw it.

Now, tell me who the cult recruiter is.

You obviously.

Yes I saw it.
Yes you said it.

ABSOLUTE CRAP OF THE HIGHEST ORDER. FUCKING BULLSHIT THAT I WILL NOT FUCKING STAND FOR!!

ELABORATE MOTEHRFUCKER! SAY WHAT YOU MEAN.

I WANT TO SEE WHAT BULLSHIT YOU ARE COMING UP WITH BASED ON MY ACTIVITY HISTORY.

NEXT FUCKING POST!!!

*facepalm*

Magua is addressing AGM again. Seems like that's the only thing he's doing at the moment.

- I still like my LB vote.
- Maemuki and MoI are still on my list.

Drop Mae and you're golden.

MoI's post is one giant outrage at being caught for the wrong reasons.

Concur.

hasdgfas: what does 'off' mean and off compared to where?? what games of mine are you referring to. we've never played together and you've modded me in one game. what games of mine have you read? you can feel free to keep waiting for mina, i'm sure she'll be much more pleasant but for the moment i'm posting and your case on me amounts to using rhetoric (which makes me think you don't have meta on me), me being difficult (once again, makes me think that your calling me 'off' is wrong) and...I don't remember the other point? sheeping? w/e.

hey hasdgfas and saintkerrigan, what do you think of LMP's 199 and then his #212 how well do they work together for you?

Quick Faraday, meta defend more. Don't bother explaining your actions.
Also, quickly shove LMP in our faces.
He's town.
You're not.
End of story.

...but you're being overly difficult[...].
You also seem to be taking little snipes at people. It's like you're trying to be annoying.

That would be the dumbest, most counterproductive scum strategy EVA, don't you think?

Unless that's what he WANTS you to think!

This, obviously.

Also, just for the SkypeMafia crowd (you know what I'm doing):

Vote: MagnaofIllusion.

Yes. Magna is scum. As are Faraday and Magua.

FTFY

Vote Count

LynchMePls (3)

- Nexus, Locke Lamora, MagnaofIllusion

MagnaofIllusion (6)

- DrippingGoofball, LynchMePls, Hinduragi, SpyreX, Kast, Bilbo Baggins

SaintKerrigan (6)

- Empking, Lost Butterfly, AlmasterGM, vezokpiraka, Benmage, Maemuki

Lost Butterfly (2)

- hasdgfas, SaintKerrigan

Maemuki (3)

- Setael, Magua, Thor665

Not Voting (0)

-

Nil

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to lynch!

Ok, something Plum wanted done:
Look at our amazing townbloc on Magna.
Then look at the other wagons.
Yeeaaahhhhhh.
Vote Magna please.

(Probably wasn't quite what you wanted there Plum so I'll let you fix it/whatever when you get time. <3)

Magna is attacking LMP with lots of words and walls and "prettifying".
Faraday is being deliberately provocative towards LMP.
Magua is CR.

-A

[vezokpiraka]

@MOD – I’ll be V/LA from today at 3pm EST until Wedensday for an actual Vacation. I will likely only have very limited Internet access via Phone during that time.

--

In regards to the ‘case’ on me I'm going to address it in this post as opposed to breaking it up into mutlple responses as it keeps this post short.

The ‘case’ on me started with DGB’s rhetoric heavy post where she lays out that I can’t be possibly believe the following premise –

“If Vezok is scum the initial LMP wagon is likely to have a higher than normal concentration of scum”. Yes, that’s the premise I made. It wasn’t in those words but that is the core of what I was trying to communicate.

DGB also threw on some weak other elements that I was

A. Pre-bussing Vezok my partner before he even posted.
B. Scum for responding in any way shape or form to her tired and boring usual fake-Vig claim.

I refuted those points and DGB has chosen not to respond.

If you want to take a crack at saying the statement above is clearly a scum statement and is far more likely to come from scum than Town have at it. I know it’s not true as I know what my Role-pm says.

Most of the rest of the points being made revolve around ‘things’ I people think I should believe based on the first point. Plum and Spyrex are the two doing this that come to my mind.

Pro-Tip Kids – I’m not you. If you want to claim that not thinking like you is a scum-tell have at it. It’s a stupid argument but go ahead.

In any regard whatever the outcome of today I think this questionable wagon on me is going to pay dividends for Town down the road. We have a great chuck of VC Analysis and behavioral analysis data to mine from the thread.

--

Hi again all. LMP is scum for the bolded. Please vote accordingly.

Well since DGB is obviously not getting traction I’ll sheep this until I see Saint K’s response.

UNVOTE: DGB
VOTE: LMP

--

How many fucking scum reads does MOI have?

Lulz this makes me laugh. I’m sorry, am I not allowed to form the opinion that there are possibly multiple scum players in a Large Theme Game?

--

But the focus on connections which are vague enough now and dependent on something happening in the future which MoI did not support with his vote even as he insinuated that it would be useful is a lot of hypothetical talk and no initiative taken, nor responsibility.

So I make an observation that I think will pay dividends if a certain condition is met. And then, since I have at that point no evidence that said condition is likely (Vezok hasn’t even posted) I’m scum for having an observation. Yeah, that’s crap.

Guess what's also a classic Wiki Tell for scum to use? It's the old classic 'that guy's using a Wiki Tell that scumbag!'. That's not a rebuttal.

It doesn’t have to be a fucking rebuttal because the premise that I was lining up lynches is absurd. And yeah, it's as tired as the '3rd Scum on the Wagon' tell. This isn't 2006.

Magna: Hinduragi can't be cult because they can't recruit until N2, as per the rules. I suddenly see what you're saying. What if they started out with more than one member?

If you think you see me calling Hind (or anyone) Cult then you aren’t seeing it correctly. I’ll respond if you wish to elaborate on what you think you see.

--

I'm saying if you believed what you said as an additive part you would have clearly stated the connection you yourself were drawing through:

1.) If vezok is scum, the LMP wagon is filled with scum protecting vezok.
2.) DGB is scum because of lol, reactions.
3.) DGB was one that made the LMP wagon.
4.) Therefore, 1 & 2 support each other.

There's no 4. Not even a pretend 4.

You are damn right there isn’t a 4 in my train of thought. Because 1 and 2 are completely independent lines of thinking. DGB can be scum in absolute without it having any direct correlation to Vezok’s alignment.

You are floating links 3 spots down the line before there is even confirmation of DGB or Vezok’s alignment. Sorry, not part of your “Moonbeam Patrol”.

We get a DGB flip of scum or a Vezok flip as scum and it strengthens the possibility. But since I don’t know for certain their alignments I’m not going to go down the Crazy Brick Road.

I asked for the word all. ALL.

So pretty sure there is a whole lineup of townies there. Unless we're arguing the word whole means all but only means butterflies when you say it.

Good for fucking you. I showed you a quote from DGB that asserted that wagon was full of Townies. Your stubborn insistent on DGB not using a specific word doesn’t mean it can’t be inferred. Way to avoid the point I was making to be Captain Grammar!

So again how many scum are there? Its a cult game afterall.

Depending on Town Power, the number of UnCultable players of all alignments and looking at the 20 person starting group I say 5 to 6 scum.

So, lets rap. SK is a nice easy read filled with waffling and the stuff that bullets are made for. MoI has a much harder shell but is filled with creamy, creamy nugat.

Classic stupid argument. LULZ, PLAYER X IS AN EASY SCUM READ JUST LOOK SO LET’S LYNCH SOMEONE ELSE VIGS ARE MEANT FOR EASY SCUM READS.

Why wouldn’t I be just as useful a Vig shot? Explain it Captain Moonbeams!

And I'll enter into V/LA with this little humdinger:

Check MoI's activity onsite. Its pretty awesome.

ABSOLUTE CRAP OF THE HIGHEST ORDER. FUCKING BULLSHIT THAT I WILL NOT FUCKING STAND FOR!!

ELABORATE MOTEHRFUCKER! SAY WHAT YOU MEAN.

I WANT TO SEE WHAT BULLSHIT YOU ARE COMING UP WITH BASED ON MY ACTIVITY HISTORY.

NEXT FUCKING POST!!!

--

@MoI - I have a question, mostly I just skim over your walls anyway so maybe I'm missing something, but here;

1. You believe that if Vezok is scum, that the LMP wagon has a disproportionate amount of scum on it.
2. DGB calls you out for lining up a bunch of town mislynches.
3. You vote DGB and she is scummy because she's aware that there is a lot of town on the LMP wagon.

3 isn’t correct, or more correctly complete. I’m voting DGB for her virulent reaction to my post and the outsided “LULZ OBV-SCUMCLAIM” of it in full.

Her attempting to say I was scum for taking her obv-fake Vig comment.

Her attempting to say I was lining up lynches (which is false and a classic scummy attack).

The whole kit and caboodle.

This is the rage post.

The underlined part. You say you wouldn't have bussed if I never posted. That's fake and you know it. I can get lynched very quickly and you know that. You would've bussed even as a PL.

The bolded part in which you rage at SpyreX is faked. The curse words you're using have been there calmly , knowingly, It's not that you are raging. It's that you are trying to show a raging townie.

unvote
vote MoI

[Setael]

Magua is scum. States he might vote MOI because he hasn't liked what he's read, then says he's not reading the LMP/LB/MOI posts because it's all noise but then chooses LMP as scummiest of the three. If he's not reading the LMP/LB/MOI interaction he'd have no real reason to switch his suspicion from MOI to LMP. (The only reason he's given for this is the speed at which MOI's wagon grew. Not good enough.) So either he's lying about not reading, or he's manufacturing reads.

His Maemuki vote is also suspect. All he's said about her is a general statement that he thinks she's scummy after asking AGM all these questions about why he was voting SK over Mae.

It's possible he's buddies with MOI or Mae or both. The *pressure* he's put on either of them could easily be soft bussing. There's also a chance he's trying to link himself to TownMOI to get cred when MOI flips.

unvote, vote: Magua

@Andy: Whether scum or town, in the games I've played with Faraday he was for the most part charming and light hearted and I don't recall him ever antagonizing a specific player, or allowing another player to get to him. I don't know what to make of his play here. Do you have meta reasons to see this as more scum Faraday than town Faraday?

I'm not confident that MOI is scum. I hate Kast's vote. Partly because it's purely based on the assumption he and vezok are buddies and partly because it's the only thing he's bothered to post all game. I don't get the impression it's scum bussing a partner, more like scum watching a strong townie go down in flames and content to just sit back and let it happen. I don't like MOI as the lynch today. Though I was voting him for more than Thor repped me as, it still was never strong enough to justify this kind of wagon.

[Magua]

Magua is scum. States he might vote MOI because he hasn't liked what he's read,

The amazing thing, that I've found, about this game, is that I change my mind as things happen. When I said I might vote MoI, that was before the herpderpfest that was pages 8 through 11. When I said I'm not reading Magna's, LMP's, or LB's posts, that was during the herpderpfest of pages 8 through 11.

Though now that I'm here, I'll add that I'm not reading Andrius' wallpost either.

Your post, Setael, I read, because it was not a back and forth quote-striping contest, which I appreciate. You're wrong on me, but that's a forgivable thing -- at least you can post your stance in less than encyclopedic form.

[Lost Butterfly]

I'm going to ignore Andy's post, because since they're wrong about me they're probably wrong about everything else.

[Lost Butterfly]

Oh wow, Andy asked if I think LMP is scum. Jeez that's an alignment piercing question and a half! It's almost like reading the thread you'd be unable to tell what I think.

[Lost Butterfly]

Making assumptions about who's scum and trying to find buddies based off that Day 1 is a shot in the dark

This. Faraday is clearly egging LMP on into a downward spiral. Also, since Faraday hates bussing as scum, him and Magna fit perfectly together. CLEARLY attempting to divert from a leading wagon.
Also, what do you think the chances are of Faraday/Magna buddies?

[Lost Butterfly]

I'm *really* curious as to why the 'cult recruiter' isn't the person Bilbo Baggins is voting too.

[AlmasterGM]

Guys, let's all compromise and lynch Magua.

Unvote, Vote: Magua

[Empking]

Guys, let's all compromise and lynch Magua.

Unvote, Vote: Magua

I can agree with that. I'd also say that he's more likely to be the CR which I presume is the biggest threat.

Unvote, Vote: Magua