New York 131: Tricycle Mafia (Day 5)

[jmurph3]

UNVOTE:

Silver lynch appears not to be happening today. Silver, if you are town, please, and I do mean this is all sincerity, either drastically change your attitude, or request replacement.

As far as other lynches at this point, I need to reread and figure out where I stand on some people. At the moment I have a gut scumread on Mr.Zepher (and I apologize, because I personally hate when people use gutreads as justification because it's impossible to defend against as town or scum), and a bunch of other jumbled reads that need to be sorted out.

One thing that really struck me, however, when I was going back through the lead-up to the D1 lynch, is that Maxous really wavered on amor. Kept going back and forth, had a vote on him only for a moment and then very quickly took it off

when he realized that it might be possible with plurality voting that amor not be lynched

. I dunno, it just seems hella scummy to me. Enough for me to VOTE: Maxous

[silverbullet999]

-jmurph

Silver, if you are town, please, and I do mean this is all sincerity, either drastically change your attitude, or request replacement.

How does my attitude affect my alignment? (Explanation so you can't feign ignorance: You are asking me to either replace or change my attitude if and only if i'm town. I don't see the relationship between my attitude and my alignment so please do explain.)

[silverbullet999]

Also thanks for your responses...

[Pine]

If you're scum and playing THIS BADLY, then by all means stay. [/translation]

Seriously, if you're Town you need to step up your game. You are not currently playing to Town wincon, and haven't been for a while.

[silverbullet999]

-Pine
I have been. Well was until for whatever reason you guys decided to not lynch me,
I've stated these reasons already...

[jmurph3]

Apparently you and I have drastically different opinions of what constitutes playing to a town win-con. Basically, your attitude = anti-town. Therefore, if you are town, something needs to change. If you are scum, you're absolutely free to continue being anti-town.

[Pine]

Explain how advocating your own lynch was pro-Town.

I've been in situations where I felt that the oppositional way I'd been arguing with scum warranted my lynch, as a Town flip from me would prove my intentions and take scum with me. You've shown nothing of the kind.

The only Town role I can think of that might benefit from being lynched is Oracle. Is that in the normal guidelines? Explain yourself, Silver

[Maxous]

I'll admit my reasoning was terribad, but it would have been worse if I had put my vote on a townie no?

This really makes it sound like you were bussing.

Besides, I don't think there was enough suspicion on Amor at the point to warrant a bus from any one of his scum buddies.

Tis why I thought you were town earlier.
However you only stated gut reads on Amor early on.
Your vote on Amor only came

after

the Silverbullet wagon had dissapted and Subzero had claimed mason. So Amor was a very realistic target at that time and it was

only then

that you came with your wall detailing how scummy Amor was.

One thing that really struck me, however, when I was going back through the lead-up to the D1 lynch, is that Maxous really wavered on amor. Kept going back and forth, had a vote on him only for a moment and then very quickly took it off when he realized that it might be possible with plurality voting that amor not be lynched. I dunno, it just seems hella scummy to me. Enough for me to VOTE: Maxous

Meh, I was unsure about Amor for all of day 1 and only voted him because I did'nt think there was enough support for 9 votes on Toon. He was a compromise wagon.
When I learned that we did'nt need 9 votes I went with my preferred lynch.
This was all explained on Day 1

[quadz08]

Votehalla

With 10 players alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

jmurph3 (0) –
silverbullet999 (2) – mastin2, nhammen
mastin2 (1) – Pine
nhammen (1) – silverbullet999
Pine (1) – Nobody Special
MrZepher (1) – Maxous
Nobody Special (0) -
Uite (0) -
Toon Fighter (1) – Uite
Maxous (2) –Toon Fighter, jmurph3

Not Voting (1) – MrZepher

Please step up the activity, guys. We’ve had less than a page worth of posts in the past 2 days. Thanks!

Deadline is in (expired on 2011-06-09 23:00:00)

[Nobody Special]

Yes, more Pine votes, please.

[Maxous]

And if a Pine lynch does'nt happen who would you choose Nobody Special?

[mastin2]

Actually, I've changed my mind.

Unvote, Vote: Maxous

. Maxous vs Zepher is not town-on-town. There's one scum in there.

[Maxous]

How convienent...

You mind explaining why Mastin?

[Nobody Special]

And if a Pine lynch does'nt happen who would you choose Nobody Special?

Either you or Mastin. But I'd have a lot of reading to do.

[mastin2]

You mind explaining why Mastin?

Have you READ the interaction between you and Zepher? No way is it town-on-town. Heck, it's possible (albeit highly improbable) that it's scum-on-scum.

[Uite]

Mastin, you're talking out of your ass. Two scum as the top wagons definitely happens. And let's take a look at TF's Day 1 wagons, which is all that was available when you made that statement:

1. 2nd on nhammen
   
2. 3rd on SubzeroSith
   
3. 1st on mastin2
   
4. 3rd on SubzeroSith
   
5. 8th on silverbullet999
   
6. 3rd on SubzeroSith
   
7. 6th on Amor

Most of those are exactly in the "sweet spot" you've claimed for scum. So really, I want to see your reasoning, instead of you just declaring stuff.

Also, what is this scumhunting you speak of? Really, you've got to back up your claims if they're to be believeable, and you've already shown that you're a liar with your fakeclaim.

Answer my questions, Mastin!

[Maxous]

Have you READ the interaction between you and Zepher? No way is it town-on-town. Heck, it's possible (albeit highly improbable) that it's scum-on-scum.

This explains nothing and you have committed one of my personal top scumtells.
Why is it not town-on-town?

[mastin2]

I've never seen two scum as the top wagons.

Ever.

In 34 games.

Plus the countless I've read.

Sure, double-faction games have plenty. I'd quite frankly EXPECT both lead wagons to be on scum. (You're conveniently ignoring the fact that I've acknowledged it happens...in double-faction games. And could theoretically also happen in a single-faction game if one of the scum being wagoned was an SK. But short of that...)

But never, EVER in a single-faction game have I seen both lead wagons be on scum. Not in all my time playing.

I haven't used the Sweet Spot in VCA for a while. I concluded there was no need to do so, since at best it'd catch a single scum. Rather than catch the whole scumteam. In other words, I stopped thinking smallscale with my VCA and took it up to a larger approach. In that larger approach, Toon looks to be confirmed town.

Toon's the classic definition of "scummy, but not scum". He's by-the-book a VI, but he's still town. Read the tone in his posts. Read the intention in his posts. Read his motivation. Read him the way I do, and you'll see pure town voting, rather than scum. His actions admittedly are scummy. A blind man could see that Toon looks bad. But he's still town, no matter how bad he looks, still is the classic scum mislynch just waiting to happen. But Toon's been scumhunting. It's obvious if you look at his posts in context, and also observe the whole votecount my style rather than yours.

Toon is a mislynch. Toon is a misvig. Toon is not scum.

Don't force me to waste my time building a case as to why. Just refer to my shiney new sig.

[mastin2]

Have you READ the interaction between you and Zepher? No way is it town-on-town. Heck, it's possible (albeit highly improbable) that it's scum-on-scum.

This explains nothing and you have committed one of my personal top scumtells.
Why is it not town-on-town?

Because it isn't. Interactions between people is something I do quite well. I pick up these sorts of things. I know them instinctively. You versus Zepher is not town-on-town.

You ASKING why it's not town-on-town actually solidifies you as scum, too. Since if it WERE town-on-town, then your attacks on Zepher would be attacks on someone you were thinking is town.

In other words, from your perspective as town, it wouldn't BE town-on-town, and I'd be right. Just wrong about which one, in your town-eyes.

Since you DID ask, however, I know now for sure that you're scum, and a lynch on you will keep us three-for-three.

[mastin2]

So, yeah. Maxous just did a huge scumslip for asking why it's not town-on-town.

I might not be explaining it in the best way possible, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who can think this way. I've pointed it out, so when others see it, they'll realize I'm right.

[Maxous]

Give me a break.
You said it's 'not town-on-town.'
I asked you to explain why it is not town-on-town. Twice.

[mastin2]

EXACTLY! And that's why it's a scumslip! From your perspective, attacking Zepher, you already should think it's not town-on-town. Asking me to explain why is a scumslip!

I'll see if I can give quotes to back it up.

[Uite]

@Mastin:

Off the top of my head I remember the two top wagons being on Mafia in ReBoot, so yeah.

Toon is not town. There is no town intention behind his posts. Read my sig and answer the fucking questions.

[Maxous]

It's asking somebody to explain a baseless accusation.

I'm not so arrogant as to not consider the possibility I am wrong about Zepher.

[mastin2]

(I'm viewing from ISOs, so right now, I'm not looking at context, sorry.)

Zepher suspicion begins. Before that, Zepher was solidly town.

Zepher vote, through "process of elimination".

@Zepher - So have you concluded if I am scummy or not yet?

I'll need to check the context on this. Since from here in ISOs, it doesn't look like a question a town-Maxous would be asking someone they're voting at the time (which is a statement of "I think you're scum"). It does look like scum, however. (Like I said, I need to check the context to make sure.)

Zepher or Uite.
Zepher, and ONLY Zepher. "Everyone else seems town..." Effectively. He listed pretty much the whole town as being town, except for Zepher. No #2 suspect. At all.

Zepher or Toon. "Let's start compromising on who to lynch." Actually. I seem to recall Maxous defending his play as going AGAINST Compromise lynches. What quote was that, again?

Meh, I was unsure about Amor for all of day 1 and only voted him because I did'nt think there was enough support for 9 votes on Toon. He was a compromise wagon.
When I learned that we did'nt need 9 votes I went with my preferred lynch.

So, on Day One, he supported Compromise Lynches...until he learned that they weren't necessary.
And today, he goes for Compromise Lynches...despite knowing they're not necessary.

See the issue?

Furthers the Zepher suspicion.

(NOTE: Switching from ISOs to Context as of ISO 55/Post 887)

Unvote, Vote: Maxous. Maxous vs Zepher is

not

town-on-town

. There's one scum in there.

"Maxous-Zepher is not townVtown".

How convienent...

You mind explaining why Mastin?

"Why isn't it townVtown?" When Maxous's vote is on Zepher. When Maxous has been calling Zepher scum for days. In other words, "Why isn't one of Zepher or myself town?" When voting Zepher. I can't be the only one who sees this as an issue.

This explains nothing and you have committed one of my personal top scumtells.
Why is it not town-on-town?

Why is it not town-on-town. In Maxous's exact words. Why aren't both he and Zepher town. When he's voting Zepher. When he's been calling Zepher scum for quite some time. Why is one of them scum? He shouldn't be asking this as town.

Come on. Someone else has to see it, has to understand this BLATANT contradiction.

It's asking somebody to explain a baseless accusation.

I'm not so arrogant as to not consider the possibility I am wrong about Zepher.

And this? Saying that he could be wrong about Zepher? Only makes it worse. I'm saying it's not town-on-town, and now Maxous is beginning to try and make it look like he's not convinced it's not town-on-town, either. If that makes sense. Admittedly, this is my weakest point against Maxous, because I'm not sure anyone else will understand it. I wish I could explain how this point is personally my strongest, even though to others it's the weakest.