Fall of the Matrix: Game Over!

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Dammit Llama, you're supposed to be better than this.

Unvote, vote: ®_©

[Ranmaru]

That's a lie. I

pretty much

questioned Llama too immediately, before you did. So did Brian. Others half questioned it and half went along with it. Never said you voted DN. I said you seemed like you would have gone along with him. This is what I mean v

I mean people that may be suspicious. I wanted your thoughts on Porochaz, MBL, and Primate; and you didn't really have any. Look at Primate, pretty much has less posts then Kison, and hasn't posted as much as Kison has. MBL I'm null on, and Poro I'm suspicious of.

IS and ABR are your town reads. ML is a town read of mine. I would like to hear your thoughts on Hez, Zindy and Ces again, though. Agar was replaced by Nobody Special. (Therefore there isn't much to be said but "replace him/prod him"). Furc was just replaced, so hopefully we'll get a better read on the slot.

Of course I know you have spoken of RC, TF, and Kison, but I have heard alot about them. More pressure needs to be directed towards Poro and Primate. MBL I just wanted thoughts on.

I have a guilty/track/etc on DeathNote.

...

Seriously?

I mean, ok, I'm inclined to just believe you and go along with this, but i find it kind of bizzare that you're claiming like this, especally after all that wierd "amnesiac cop told me Kison is a CR" stuff early in the day.

Of course, after other's responses, you then made sure to "MAKE SURE" llama is not doing stupid shit. But I'm telling you my thoughts from when I saw this post.

[Zindaras]

Blech, schedules never work out the way you think they will.

Skimmed the thread. Hate the Llama-gambit and wish I could slap some sanity in him. So horribly useless. Smells like stupid town.

[Kison]

Not voting Death Ninja.

@LlamaFluff: You supported a Toon Fighter wagon earlier in the day. Is his 'pro town machine' claim the only thing that has changed your mind?

[LlamaFluff]

You guys are cute. Everything I do

always

has multiple levels of reasoning attached to it, its what I basically do in these games, farside said it best in that "I slant everything regardless of alignment". The gambit had a very specific goal in mind, and im pretty sure at least the secondary ones were achieved here. Trust me here, even without the DN lynch, the wagon was exactly something the game needed for tomorrow and beyond.

@Kison - He claimed pro-town program, not machine. Like I said, there are two programs that were protagonists that I immediately think of when I think of this theme. And due to the wincondition, there nearly HAS to be either a pro-town program/machine or a anti-town human. Its too ambiguous for anything else to be the setup.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Nonsense. There's nothing wrong with keeping your win conditions non-specific as a Mod. The WC tells us very little.

[Internet Stranger]

Hey Llama, there wont be "multiple levels of reasoning" attached to the bullet that some crazy ass nut like ABR uses when he shoots you in the face.

[LlamaFluff]

Nonsense. There's nothing wrong with keeping your win conditions non-specific as a Mod. The WC tells us very little.

As I said, this win-con is much vauger then most games, and when the theme suggests that role types A/B are bad, and the win-condition doesnt mention them, something tends to be off. As I already said, I saw this and immediately thought of a recent game that had a "bad character" miller due to the wincondition. "Dinos vs Humans" had a dino detector cop and a pro-town dino. I would lay a massive bet that there is at least one pro-town program or anti-town human in this game.

@IS - Im not interested in doing anything to pander to him, im trying to effect the play of a couple players in particular with that gambit, and reactions say that I probably accomplished that goal. Either way, all information I know that is important has already been said.

[Internet Stranger]

Llama. Considering the fact that I would love to shoot you right now for acting condescending to us feeble minds and pulling bullshit stunts, its quite likely that others (like Albert) just might as well. Wouldnt it make more sense to just spit out what information you have instead of lording it over us like free cheese before you turn up dead tomorrow?

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'm not going to shoot Llama, rest assured my friend.

[LlamaFluff]

Llama. Considering the fact that I would love to shoot you right now for acting condescending to us feeble minds and pulling bullshit stunts, its quite likely that others (like Albert) just might as well. Wouldnt it make more sense to just spit out what information you have instead of lording it over us like free cheese before you turn up dead tomorrow?

My gambit did what it was supposed to do, not going to say what it was supposed to do right now since that would eliminate all of the gain it created. As I said, it was ment to accomplish multiple things, and it succeeded in a few of those.

[Internet Stranger]

Now that Albert has blessed Llama, Llama clearly must now be in danger of getting killed by the scum, right? He has precious information that must be heard!

Oh great Llama, your gambits are so wily and so fruitful, please share with us your unbound knowledge!

[Ranmaru]

I'm not going to shoot Llama, rest assured my friend.

Sup Bro. Why you still on Deathnote?

[LlamaFluff]

Oh great Llama, your gambits are so wily and so fruitful, please share with us your unbound knowledge!

Carrots are good for your eyes.

[Ranmaru]

Now that Albert has blessed Llama,

Llama clearly must now be in danger of getting killed by the scum

, right? He has precious information that must be heard!

[Yosarian2]

I have a guilty/track/etc on DeathNote.

...

Seriously?

I mean, ok, I'm inclined to just believe you and go along with this, but i find it kind of bizzare that you're claiming like this, especally after all that wierd "amnesiac cop told me Kison is a CR" stuff early in the day.

Of course, after other's responses, you then made sure to "MAKE SURE" llama is not doing stupid shit. But I'm telling you my thoughts from when I saw this post.

So...you did notice that there was no vote for deathnote in that post, and that I called the claim "bizarre" and pointed out problems with it, right?

[Medicated Lain]

Sorry for the lacking of quotes here, if requested I will supply... but probably not today, I think this is all the energy I can muster up right now.
s.
@yos: You weren't really against the idea of the vez wagon at first, yet you were calling IS town-like for being against the vez and furc wagons, what's up with that? I dislike contradictions.

@ran, I disagree with Hez in quite a lot of places, but the top very few scum folk are also near the top of my list. After that, our lists of who we think is scum is pretty much opposite each other... based on his stance, I guess that means he thinks I'm scum. I'm more inclined to believe that we all pick up on different things in players. I certainly think it is interesting and worth noting that our lists are so different, but there's nothing that stands out massively as a case of scumminess with him, when I looked through. Two things that really stood out were the case against Sens, and the trusting of Yos. These two things make no sense to me at all.

Zindy is one of the few players in this game that actually seems to use a similar thought process to mine. For that, I just don't really find anything scummy.

Ces's posts honestly don't make sense to me. There are many very short, and often useless posts... although today felt like there was a lot less of that. I don't really like/understand this style of play... I remember someone said a while ago that this is similar to how he plays in other games, but somehow felt a little more scummy than usual this time around. I'm interested in hearing from who that was, and other folk about Ces, because he's hard for me to read.

[Porochaz]

mod Im voting RC.

[Yosarian2]

@yos: You weren't really against the idea of the vez wagon at first, yet you were calling IS town-like for being against the vez and furc wagons, what's up with that? I dislike contradictions.

What does that have to do with anything? Do you really think that, just because I'm town, that everyone who agrees with me is town and everyone who disagrees with me is scum? That's not how it works. You have to look at motive. Beyond that, you have to try to get into the head of the person making the post.

Think about it. Can you see yourself, as a pro-town person, making that post based just on frustration towards both of those wagons? It wasn't even that he had a strong pro-town read on Furc, he said himself that Furc could be scum, but he was just sick and tired of the frankly excessive amount of hatred being leveled at Furc especally, which seemed really out of proportion to the facts.

Use your mind. Use your guts. Read the posts, and try to get a feel for if you would think like that as scum, or if you would think like that as town, or both. Weather he agreed with me or not isn't what's important, what's important is if what his alignment is, and what his mindest was when he was making those posts.

[ReaperCharlie]

#203 (LlamaFluff): "Love how Yos showing that he pushed for 'kill the VT' shows that it normally ends up in a lynch of... VT" == Yep. Ouch. You'd think he'd learn his lesson, wouldn't ya?... Wait a second *shifty eyes* ... *glares at Yos*

#211 (Albert B. Rampage): "Only an idiot of a cop would ever investigate vezok" == This is truth.

#221 (Zindaras): "I'd rather have the doc survive until endgame because he's far more likely to to do something useful in between. If LyLo comes a day later because the doc protected a kill, that's a free lynch." == Not necessarily true if there are multiple scum teams, which there probably are (well, you never know, because it's MoS and he's been gone a while, but current site meta dictates that the majority of larges are multiscum games. Also, flavor implies that the Machines/Agents would be a team, and Smith would be a cult of some kind). However, I'm not sure if this statement is a scumslip because Zindy has inside knowledge, or just careless thinking.

#223 (DeathNote): "@Llama- at what point would you be willing to lynch Vez then? You can't allow someone to get to lylo just because they claimed VT right off. That would make an easy game for scum." >> Something about this post strikes me as "off", in a way I can't describe. Maybe it's the way he's eager to refer to "scum" in the third person. It feels semi-forced.

#237 (AGar): AGar attacks BrianMcQueso in this post, mainly because he's either "braindead or scum, which is it?" and provides his rationale for thinking what he thinks. Let's see if AGar continues to push on BMQ later in the game.

#245 (Medicated Lain): Has no idea about vezok either. Insert sigh + facepalm here.

#246 (Porochaz): This vote is terrible, and

scummy

. (-1 for Porochaz)

#247 (AGar): 100%

:goodposting:

(+1 for AGar)

#262 (BrianMcQueso): This guy definitely doesn't understand what the new site meta is. He's living in the past. Unfortunately for him, that's not going to cut it this game. Even though there is a decent mix of new-vs-old in this game, I'd still like to see the "oldbies" try to adapt to the new players' way of reading the other new players. i.e. AGar reading vezok. Being stubborn and trying to "teach them a lesson" is going to accomplish less than nothing, as shown in previous games (which you also haven't seen). Ask anyone who's been active on the site, and they'll tell you (i.e. Porochaz, ABR, etc).

#270 (Medicated Lain): "@Surye wagon: Seriously, what? I have looked through, and can't find a reason posted why he is being voted for. IS, Agar, Vez, Zin, this addresses all of you, let me know what's happening there." >>

Big town points

to ML for this post. At the time, Surye hadn't flipped town yet, and even if Surye had flipped scum, it'd still be a good post. (+2 for Medicated Lain)

#270 (Medicated Lain): "We should be voting for Vez, not because of policy, or because people don't like him, we should be voting for him because we have no way to verify what he has said, and made a post that doesn't match what the moderator said at all! Looking back at all this however, I really advocate that both vez and AGAR should be lynched." == While in principle I agree with you, it's obvious you don't know vezok or AGar too well. By this point of the game, vezok was blindingly obviously town, and AGar was just pointing that out. It's perfectly characteristic of AGar to be aggressive and demanding of other players in the game, and when he sees other people doing stupid things, he is not politically correct when he points it out. It's a quality I like in players like him and ABR. I tend to do it as well but probably not as often or as harshly as those two.

Also, what do you think of AGar now that vezok has flipped town just AGar predicted?

#273 (vezokpiraka): "Those suspecting AGar and me as scum: Because we all know that scums protect each other so hard that is the best way to go. Seriously if oyu are town and thikning that please go back and say it louder a few times." == It hurts my brain to read this post, but it makes sense. If he wasn't dead, vezok would be getting even more town points than he already had, which would have been a considerable amount.

#278 (mozamis (now CES)): "If the guy isn't scum, we dont lynch him. I totally disagree with all that "bad for town"stuff -its normally just a way of saying " I don't like this person". I do not care if he is the worst or best player in the world, if we don't think he is scum, we don't lynch him." >> Huzzah for

pro-town posting

! mozamis (and by way of replacing, Cogito Ergo Sum) gives me good warm fuzzy town vibes with this post. (+1 for moz/CES)

#280 (SensFan): "Yes, it would actually be a really really good thing if Vezok is alive in a 3p endgame. We're all just saying we want him dead because we're really mean." == Useless, sarcastic, and antagonistic. It's

scummy

to want to lynch someone on Day 1 because you don't want them in LYLO... especially when they're town. (-1 for SensFan)

#283 (Yosarian2): "(Votes vezokpiraka)". LOLWUT.

Scummy

as all hell. (-1 for Yosarian2)

#288 (Amrun): Agreed, and I like the attitude. Stick it to 'em.

Also: "I'll make a case on TF when I am good and ready to. I want to see him and others post more before I do so." == Perhaps she was killed because Toon Fighter never wanted anyone to see that case. Wink Wink Nudge Nudge. (I know this is why *I* kill people at night, for what it's worth).

(Hint: Amrun was also killed because she was so pro-town, but it's probably more likely that it was the "case on Toon Fighter" thing).

#289 (Yosarian2): I don't like this post. Not one bit. (Another hint: If Yos is scum, look for him to completely flip-flop on this later. He'll do it, Guaranteed).

#294 (Porochaz): "I wouldn't lead a policy lynch on him though, that's too easy, regardless of alignment. Im not sure Id even join one, in general I don't agree with policy lynches." - Ummm... then why are you VOTING VEZOK? That's quite the

scummy contradiction

there, sir. Additionally, I haven't liked your play thus far and you aren't being pro-town in any way. I have actively watched you, and you're mostly just trying to stay in the middle of the road and agree with the majority of people over any given issue. (-2 for Porochaz)

#294 (SensFan): (replying to mozamis' "vezok wagon looks like cyber-bullying"): "Then grow some thicker skin. Seriously, this is a competitive team game. I'm not insulting vezok as a person in any way, but it is entirely relevant to the conversation if I think that his ability as a (hypothetical) Townie would be negligible at best. If I think he's not a very good player, then it absolutely should affect my decision about lynching him, and so it's well within the bounds of the game to bring up." == OH REALLY. So you're saying that vezok has done nothing pro-town and should be lynched for starting a bunch of discussion and kicking the game off with a good discussion wagon, leaving us to deal with little to no RVS bulls**t (and lets face it, RVS might as well be called R'BS'), but when you sit back and make random comments, fail to scumhunt, be an asshat in general, and actively act anti-town by refusing to post, that you should be given a free pass? HA. Nope, not buying it. You sir, are either scum or anti-town enough that I'd want you lynched in a hot second. And after just coming out of a game in which one of the scum did exactly what you're doing (C-Worl in Dynasty Warriors Mafia), I'm perfectly fine with lynching you. He got off scot-free because everyone thought it was way too scummy to be scum, but when the game was over, he was the one laughing. (-3 for SensFan)

#298 (Amrun): Another clue that she's going to make a case on Toon Fighter. Toon Fighter-scum wouldn't want this, surely. I'm really leaning heavily towards Toon Fighter, pending the result of this read-through.

#305 (MrBuddyLee): "[Day 1 lynches often being mislynches are] More likely due to lazy fuckface scum hiding out and not posting while town eats their own." == Dat Irony. This from the guy whose first non-confirm post in the game is on page 13 and a week after he confirmed.

Scummy

. (-1 for MrBuddyLee)

#322 (LlamaFluff): States to MrBuddyLee that he hasn't found DeathNote scummy for some time now. Let's see how consistent this is with his later play in-thread.

#323 (Internet Stranger): "There are so many scum on that Vezo wagon that its bordering ridiculousness. If nothing materializes on Surye or someone else on that wagon soon though, ill vote Vezo myself just to keep things moving and hopefully go after the other bandwagoners tomorrow." == HAHAHAHAHAHA.

Scumgasm

, much? LOL (-2 for Internet Stranger)

#324 (Porochaz): (mocking IS's #323) ""I find you all scummy for voting vezok, I hate this wagon, I HATE, HATE HATE it. But... as noone is going for my Surye wagon and I can't be assed looking elsewhere I'll hop on and berate you all for it later"" == Pure gold. Poro wins

town cred

back for this. (+1 for Porochaz)

#325 (BrianMcQueso): "@Porochaz You haven't played with Internet Stranger before, have you?" == What a cop out. You can't just give people free passes to be scummy just because it's their meta. Unless it's a blatant town-tell based on past games (hint: it's not in this case, whereas it WAS with vezok), then this is

scummy

. (-1 for BrianMcQueso)

#333 (Internet Stranger): "The most obvious [scum on the vezok wagon] is clearly Surye. His arguments are invalid and he is now stuck having to continue to press on Vezo when the initial easy lynch stalled. Its amazing how its being kickstarted again. He is calling for cops already on Day 1. But the opportunistic early bandwagoning is the easiest tell of all.

Since when do I need to answer to you anyways? Start listening to what im saying, look at the people on the Vezo wagon, put some big boy underwear on and start checking people out for yourself.Dont look to me to make a case for you Zindaras. Do you need me to hold your hand? If you do, then shut up and vote Surye."

1.

Amazing the wagon is being kickstarted again, when guys like YOU are saying "I'll vote vezok just to keep things moving"? Right. (check post #323 if you don't remember saying that). So you're complaining about something that you're saying you'll contribute to? LOL

2.

They asked for

multiple

scum on the wagon, since you said there were "so many scum that it's bordering ridiculousness" (another direct quote). You responded with the name of one person, who you were already tunneling on. LOL

3.

You, hold his hand? You, telling him to shut up and vote Surye? Again, I am gonna have to say: LOL

This post is either full of fail, or is

incredibly scumtastic

, and I'm definitely leaning scumtastic. (-3 for Internet Stranger)

#334 (Zindaras): More

goodposting

from Zindy. I am beginning to like this kissing kitten person. (+1 for Zindaras)

#336 (Internet Stranger): "So youre asking me to suddenly make declaration on all the scum on day 1? Should I consult my crystal ball, tarot cards or fuzzywuzzy, my favorite stuffed bunny?" >> Nice backtrack, champ. If there's a "ridiculous amount" of scum, you should be able to name at LEAST two.

#338 (Death Note): "I would love to see something from Bamboo. I know he is not eligible for a prod yet but I still am looking forward to his next post." == Ignoring current conflict between IS and others? Check. Picking on lurkers who haven't even lurked long enough for a prod yet? Check.

Ignoring

lurkers like MrBuddyLee who went over a week between posts? Check. == Hi,

scumDeathNote

. Your hearse is waiting. (-3 DeathNote)

#342 (Yosarian2): "IS is basically the guy who invented the archtype of the hyper-agressive bloodthirsty lynch pusher who makes short, to the point posts. Both Fritzler and Baby Jesus's playstyle was heavily influenced on IS's. He's also very effective, for either side." == Why this "defense" of IS? Do you really think he needs it? Or are you trying to nip any suspicion of him in the bud before it has a chance to blossom?

"IS feels townish to me so far this game, but that's based on a meta of him that's about 6 years out of date at this point." >> And not only that, but your defense on him is based on a SIX YEAR OLD meta? I must say: Out of all the people in the game, Yosarian has the posts which most consistently ring as scum to me. Nothing too crazy big, and he certainly does a lot in the way of damage control, but I'd consider that as actually being a hallmark of experienced scum. Which it is.

A little context: I consistently harped on the fact that Yosarian2 was scum in Succession Mafia (he was). Nobody else would believe me. Soon after, I was culted into his scumgroup. We won, because nobody suspected Yosarian2 except me, and now I was on his scum team. Just for reference. Either way, Yos is ringing

all kinds of scummy

to me in this game. This defense of IS is also terribad, and links you as a possible scumbuddy. (-2 for Yosarian2)

#349 (Zindaras): Your overlaid scolding to the side, I am pretty disappointed in the amount you backed off of IS. It actually feels scummy that you backed off this much. No lie, bro. Like, as in, I'm getting a

scumbuddy

vibe, just like I was with Yos. (-1 for Zindaras)

Up to page 15. This is quite informative and interesting. I recommend you all do this.

[Death Ninja]

That post should be on this account, sorry. -RC

[BrianMcQueso]

Dear Death Ninja (mostly the Battousai head, who is focusing on me, instead of the RC head, who is going through a "glorious" re-read),

I acknowledge one of my faults as a player is that I tunnel-vision. I've found that playstyle works for me because it draws reactions (not just from my target, but everyone has to agree, defend, or post other reactions). If I'm not playing that way, I second-guess myself on every suspicion and don't be productive in any sense, so I'm fine with it.

But for all my zeal, I can't lynch you by myself:

ReaperCharlie (8) - (BrianMcQueso, SensFan, Internet Stranger, Furcolow, Yosarian2, Ranmaru, Toon Fighter, Medicated Lain)

You need to look at the other seven people who are willing to string you up today as well. They have reasons for voting you. You need to address them, not just me.

Love,
BMQ

[Ranmaru]

Again, ABR. Why you still voting Death Note?

Also, anyone remember Nobody Special is in this game? Whats up with that guy.

[MrBuddyLee]

Up to page 15. This is quite informative and interesting. I recommend you all do this.

Congratulations on making it to page 15 three and a half weeks after you replaced in. At this pace, you'll catch up to the rest of us in October.

You seem to think ToonFighter is scum, yet it seems you haven't read, or at least commented upon, a single one of his posts. You've only commented on other people's posts about ToonFighter. Why haven't you broken off your epic PBPA to at least read your top suspect in isolation? Have you discussed your top suspect with your hydra partner?

[Ranmaru]

Death Ninja/Reaper: I suggest after you hit Page 20, you do some ISO's and some summaries to important things that have happened. Read my Replace in PBPA and feel free to comment on things I may have missed.