Newbie 1116 -- Game Over

[VisceraEyes]

Okay, back everyone!

@Fonz
I play on the Team Liquid forums...I'm a SC2 nerd. There are some HARDCORE vets there, so I got to learn from the best, fast. This is literally my 2nd or 3rd game ever...just picked up some good habits I guess ^^

I agree that Workdawg appears questionable, but just so you know, I've been pushing for a blue vs cymru lynch today. My reasoning is thus: blue AND cymru have been posting in a very erratic and scummy in their own ways. Yes, it's obvious that blue is young. Yes, it's obvious that cymru is new. But that doesn't lessen the chances of either one of them being scum. But your thoughts on Workdawg intrigue me. I just did an ISO of Workdawg's contributions. They're pretty sporadic, and hit or miss, but they at least sound town. It's the intensity of his defense that rubs me the wrong way.

[VisceraEyes]

I don't think it's impatience when I say that it's sad when I have to bump an active game because a [Game Over] game is on top of it. We aren't learning anything about anyone when no one posts. This is the PERFECT environment for scum to hide in.

I encourage everyone to consider the following:

1) Mafia CAN NOT hide in active conversation about who to lynch and why. If everyone is forced to give their opinions, then we are far less in the dark about who is scum the following day.

2) Mafia CAN hide in arguments between other townies. Player A says Player B is scummy. Player B loudly and spammily disagrees. Player C (who is Mafia) can: Side with A, Side with B, Side with no one, vaguely agree with both sides, call Player D out for chainsaw defending Player B, talk about the weather because everyone is talking about Players A and B...you get the idea.

3) Mafia CAN lurk all the way to the end of the game. Especially in a dead thread.

To conclude:
While I don't necessarily MIND people being able to accurately assess my motives and intentions, I'm one of the only players in town you can say this about. All that's going to happen if this trend continues is I'm going to die to either a lynch for appearing 'scummy' because I'm 'trying to lead town' or some nonsense, or I'm going to die to Mafia because in my attempts to scum-hunt, I got too close.

[bluepokemon1234]

The mod warning killed it man.

[The Fonz]

Okay, back everyone!

@Fonz
I play on the Team Liquid forums...I'm a SC2 nerd. There are some HARDCORE vets there, so I got to learn from the best, fast. This is literally my 2nd or 3rd game ever...just picked up some good habits I guess ^^

I agree that Workdawg appears questionable, but just so you know, I've been pushing for a blue vs cymru lynch today. My reasoning is thus: blue AND cymru have been posting in a very erratic and scummy in their own ways. Yes, it's obvious that blue is young. Yes, it's obvious that cymru is new. But that doesn't lessen the chances of either one of them being scum. But your thoughts on Workdawg intrigue me. I just did an ISO of Workdawg's contributions. They're pretty sporadic, and hit or miss, but they at least sound town. It's the intensity of his defense that rubs me the wrong way.

Ooh, wasn't teamliquid where Furcolow came from?

I'd agree they're playing

erratically.

I don't as of yet see anything that comes across as obviously scum-motivated. My read on Cymru to date is certainly that he feels like that newbie you get in every game whose playstyle can basically be described as 'Waving a big flag saying "Lynch Me" over his head.'

Workdawg concerns me because in addition to the thread padding, he's voted you- who I think is pretty obvtown - plus the two 'playstyle' wagons. That doesn't overly suggest to me a player who's really making an effort to identify town and scum. I think his partner is probably CF or Tomie, although BigAl is creeping up in my suspicions lately. I'll explain why when I get back from the

36 hrs V/LA

which begins as of now.

[Workdawg]

Oh FFS, thread padding, really? If I had known I was just going to get shit for trying to save the game from a replacement right out of the gate, I wouldn't have bothered. Like I've said many times before. I was hardly even reading the first few days, I posted up just to make sure I didn't get replaced.

As for being scum because I voted for someone you feel is town, that's a terrible reason. Also, NONE of my votes have been for "playstyle" issues. I've cited viable reasons for all of them. You replaced into the SE slot and that's what you've got against me?

The Fonz

He comes in with a lot of reads on people.
His first in-depth read is Grimm, who he calls out on two specific things. He gives reasonable arguments for why Grimm is suspicious.
Yonzy (Tomie) is really pinging his scumdar, but he doesn't know why.
Then he gets to me and I'm just straight up scummy because of post 99, again. I post too much IIOA and am "non-committal".
The IIOA thing I've addressed many times, so yeah...
I guess he claims this after only reading to page 17, so maybe he missed the parts where I posted a case against VE and argued back and forth a couple times. I know that SCREAMS non-committal... wait... no, that's pretty much the opposite.

In his latest post, he sticks to his guns that I'm scum, but for the reasons above this time... which I think I've already established are "bullshit"... to quote Grimm.

Work has been picking up recently, so I don't know how much I'll be able to post during the day today and tomorrow, but I should be able to check in at night at least.

[Cobblerfone]

Workdawg concerns me because in addition to the thread padding, he's voted you- who I think is pretty obvtown - plus the two 'playstyle' wagons. That doesn't overly suggest to me a player who's really making an effort to identify town and scum.

Agreed.

I think his partner is probably CF or Tomie, although BigAl is creeping up in my suspicions lately.

This bugs me. Particularly the part about bigAl. Not sure why. It's kind of off. I'll read your meta while you're away. Just to get a feel for your style.

Oh wow, CF is me. I've never seen my screenname abreviated like that. lol.

[Workdawg]

Workdawg concerns me because in addition to the thread padding, he's voted you- who I think is pretty obvtown - plus the two 'playstyle' wagons. That doesn't overly suggest to me a player who's really making an effort to identify town and scum.

Agreed.

Wait, you agree with this? That I'm "padding" the thread, or about my votes? Examples please.

[Cobblerfone]

This bugs me. Particularly the part about bigAl. Not sure why. It's kind of off.

I realize why it bugs me now. The Fonz doesn't give any

reasons

for why he think Tomie or I are Workdawg's partners or

why

he's starting to think bigAl is suspicious.

Wait, you agree with this? That I'm "padding" the thread, or about my votes? Examples please.

Sorry, I agree that you don't seem to be making much of an effort to identify town or scum. (I disagree about the padding.)

[Workdawg]

But his reasons for saying that were because I'm "padding" (which you disagree with) and my votes (which he is wrong about).

Do you have a different reason for thinking that, or ... ?

[Workdawg]

Also, I guess the reason I'm not going too crazy on the scum hunting is because I tend to tunnel on people pretty hard, and I have also been accused of being a "loose cannon." See Newbie 1052 (my first game) for reference on that. I was completely wrong on everyone I thought was scum, but I got so focused on my one target at a time that I was able to convince others they were guilty as well. I ended up in LYLO with two SEs and I chose wrong for a town loss pretty much because I was there with someone who I had always had suspicions of. I ignored obvious signs of scumminess by the other player. I'm trying to avoid that this game.

[Tomie Uzumaki]

Also: For Cymru~

Iso showed Cymru has yet to respond to it. Please do so.

[Grimmjow]

I was just noting that he had no responded to your questions or mine. This could possibly be newbiness. However, I'm about to loose my patience with the newbie card with cy and blue.

With a quick read, Viscera... didn't look good... I can post my analysis of Viscera and Grimmjow as well.

So... why doesn't VE look good? I think most of the town would agree that he's the towniest here. Unless you're playing the "too town to be town" card, which I don't necessarily agree with. Analysis/reasons plz.

Newb question here: Can anyone explain what this "padding" issue is about? What is padding? Checked the wiki but didn't come across anything.

Another side note:

@Mod: How about that game extension now? We have less than a week left and several people who have replaced in, and the activity level has certainly shifted drastically recently, so could we please have at least a 1 week extension?

More later but coffee commands me currently (oooo, fun with alliteration).

[Tomie Uzumaki]

I'm writing my catch up post now >.< I'll try my best to have my analysis on Viscera ready by tomorrow.

[Tomie Uzumaki]

First, I think that you and Workdawg might just be rubbing each other the wrong way. You're both asking the right questions, but you're asking each other instead of asking everyone else. I think it's worth noting that Work has been pretty forthcoming with his reads, at least in their primitive "town read on X, null on Y" form early on...and he was onboard with Grimm lynching me for good reasons. Pushing the idea that he isn't giving his opinions seems...unfair?

Are you talking about my point about Workdawg not scumhunting during his early posts? Because this point counts till he started to join the discussion between you and Grimmjow. Before that, it was only opinions on events. Not on players.

Now, as far as Tomie's posts go, I don't really have anything to say. The logic is reasonable, but all I'm really seeing is a recap of what has happened and opinions on it. No real suspicions or anything like that, unless I missed something. So I'm getting null from Tomie.

Yeah, most of it is a recap as I'm reading what has happened and am analysing that. I've stated my suspicions though (Workdawg, Cymru and Viscera) and will decide who gets my vote after I've posted the anamysis on Viscera.

So Viscera unvoted Cymru, because?

Ok, Grimmjow brought something up about Cobbler that he wanted to please the IC or something like that. I didn't take much notice of it as I didn't feel the same about it. But now (post 472)? Seems there's another player who wants to keep players happy. Add Blue to that player group as well >.<

@Blue
Unless you want me to have no sleep and see this game as more important than my RL businesses, then you can see me post at 3 am. In other words, not happening.

Ugh, this game needs a different approach for me to keep my sanity. That should also help to get the last two analyses up quicklier.

[Workdawg]

Newb question here: Can anyone explain what this "padding" issue is about? What is padding? Checked the wiki but didn't come across anything.

I can't say for sure I guess, but my interpretation based on how Fonz was using it to accuse me, was that he's saying I'm posting a bunch of irrelevant information to try and look like I'm helping. I've heard it called "posting fluff" or even "active lurking" I suppose. I'm "padding" my posts with irrelevant stuff to make it look like I'm posting more information than I really am.

[cymru96]

I can't link the game because the website got remodelled and the archives are gone. The game was a few months ago.

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.10

bluepokemon1234 - 2 - Workdawg, bluepokemon1234
cymru96 - 1 - bigAl
bigAl - 1 - Grimmjow
Workdawg - 1 - The Fonz

Not Voting: Cobblerfone, Tomie Uzumaki, VisceraEyes, cymru96

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline: June 30 -- (expired on 2011-06-30 11:00:00)

V/LA: The Fonz, until (expired on 2011-06-24 14:30:00)

As a note, please try not to include votes in ANY tags other than VOTE: or

. It just makes it a bit easier on me. Thanks!

[Nobody Special]

As for the deadline extension, at this time I have to say no. Everyone in the game has posted within the last ~40 hours. If activity suddenly stops for whatever reason, I'll consider it. If an extension is granted, it will be prior to 72 hours before the current deadline.

[Cobblerfone]

Workdawg's #634 doesn't sound good to me. But I'm not pushing him today, maybe tomorrow.

Since we're running lower on time I guess I'll vote now and if his meta change's my mind I'll unvote:

VOTE: The Fonz

[Workdawg]

@cobbler

My meta or Fonz's meta? I cited my meta as a reason for my less aggressive scumhunting, Fonz didn't even mention his.

But I have some questions now.

You agree with things Fonz has said against me (609 AND 630).
Fonz says you might be my scum partner without any reasoning (630).
You agree with Fonz that I'm not trying to scumhunt very much (632, clarification from 630)
I say things to further arouse your suspicions. (my 634, your 643)

And then you vote for Fonz? What is your reasoning for this? Based on the above outlined information, I would think you'd most certainly be voting for me instead of him.

The only reason I can think of is that you are OMGUSing him because he said you might be scumbuddies with me (someone you both agreed might be scum).

/boggle

[Cobblerfone]

And then you vote for Fonz? What is your reasoning for this? Based on the above outlined information, I would think you'd most certainly be voting for me instead of him.

Not being aggressive isn't always a scum tell.

[Workdawg]

Okay, so if we strike out that one part...

@cobbler

You agree with things Fonz has said against me (609 AND 630).
Fonz says you might be my scum partner without any reasoning (630).

You agree with Fonz that I'm not trying to scumhunt very much (632, clarification from 630)

I say things to further arouse your suspicions. (my 634, your 643)

You still agree with Fonz and think I'm suspicious.

I looked back to make sure I'm not missing something... but I don't see ANY mention of you thinking Fonz is suspicious other than the aforementioned scumbuddy accusations that he didn't provide reasons for.

[Cobblerfone]

You still agree with Fonz and think I'm suspicious.

I looked back to make sure I'm not missing something... but I don't see ANY mention of you thinking Fonz is suspicious other than the aforementioned scumbuddy accusations that he didn't provide reasons for.

He replaced Miss JJ remember? I agree you were suspicious. But now I'm less sure, I agree with him that you are doing what he says you are doing, not that you are scum. Though you might be and I might vote for you tomorrow. It depends.

[Cobblerfone]

I'll explain why when I get back from the 36 hrs V/LA which begins as of now.

Woops missed this.

UNVOTE: The Fonz

Fixed quote tag. ~~NS

[Grimmjow]

I'll explain why when I get back from the 36 hrs V/LA which begins as of now.

Woops missed this.

What does this have anything to do with you? He mentioned you as a potential scumbuddy, but his reference was as to his "I'll explain" was towards why bigAl has been creeping up in his suspicions.