Mini Normal 1187: Game Over

[Barry Allen]

The only thing that I can confirm here is that I DID track Foilist last night. I didn't reveal who I had tracked because I didn't want to risk outing a doc. Instead, we get a roleclaim of something completely different. I've played mafia on different sites since 2009 (mainly vendetta-strada.com, with a little faster pace with 48 hour day phases and 24 hour night phases, if you want to try that pace give it a try sometime). However, I had never played a round with either a sensor or a friendly neighbor, so I looked them up in the wiki to get more info. I don't know that I fully get the idea of foilist setting up the QT with Bob, as being able to do that is NOT listed in the wiki for that role. However, if Foilist is the neighbor, that WOULD explain why Bob KNOWS I'm the tracker. He would know that he was visited if the GM sent him the Neighbor message from Foilist.

This would also explain why Bob is so hyper about "there can't be that many roles in the game." He knows we had a roleblocker and two masons, along with a neighbor. That's why he can't accept the town also having both a tracker and sensor, as that would mean we have 6 roles minimum for the town. That doesn't mean we DON'T have a role-heavy round, but it DOES make Bob's reactions make more sense.

@scumhunter - I didn't have a specific reason for a bad vibe on you D1, it was more of a gut feeling that I couldn't put my finger on. You WERE on my short list for tracking yesterday, along with Giitah and foilist. My criteria for picking a target was as follows:

1. People no one would expect me to track - in case they really were town. I didn't want to have a tracker report on a dead player on D2, and if there were a player who showed up as a potential tracker target that was town, the maf would likely target them to give me a useless report D2.
2. People who could potentially be maf, but not people I had openly suspected D1. The first criteria crossed off any names of folks I had openly suspected D1, as they could simply not vote for a hit in order to look inno.

So, scumhunter, bottom line is I only have two things regarding you - a gut feeling that I couldn't put into words D1, and the potential that if nintendo was telling the truth about being sensor you would be in that 2/3 scum group from the votes on Pine that I talked about at the start of the day.


TLDR: foilist was my tracker target, which I would never have confirmed today without him outing himself. Believe what you will about me, but if you lynch me please take another look at hiplop, as I hope you will when I flip town. Further, take a look at folks who have jumped on this BW. I don't know how to defend myself more than I have, and I think it is frankly insane to lynch a tracker on D2, as there could be more info I could provide the town every day that I live.

[archaebob]

Alright people forget everything I've said today so far, I've been way off.

confirm vote ace

HoS: Foilist

In my Neighborhood QT with foililst, he told me that he, DH, and ace were all

masons

.

More importantly, he said the other masons were

told

I was going to be neighborized last night.

Sorry to break it to you ace, but you've been outed by someone else's blunder.

[nintendoaddict1]

Ignoring all reads and looking at this from a completely neutral 50/50 of each lynch being scum:

However, BA is also the one out of the three I have the town read on.

Wait... what? Everyone: read that quote slowly and get back to me.


Foil why the hell did you claim?

Vote: ace

foil and ace are scum. Well there's our two scum on the Pine wagon.

[Giitah]

...what? This is a mess.

Ace is at L-2, Barry Allen is at L-3. Leaving this out since Ace wagon seems to be gaining steam fast.

[nintendoaddict1]

Ignoring all reads

and looking at this from a completely neutral 50/50 of each lynch being scum:

However, BA is also the one out of the three I have the

town read

on.

Bolded for emphasis.

[Giitah]

Alright people forget everything I've said today so far, I've been way off.

confirm vote ace

HoS: Foilist

In my Neighborhood QT with foililst, he told me that he, DH, and ace were all

masons

.

More importantly, he said the other masons were

told

I was going to be neighborized last night.

Sorry to break it to you ace, but you've been outed by someone else's blunder.

Archaebob, what the hell is this? D'you mean you're calling bullshit on Ace because he apparently didn't know?

Archaebob, is Foil confirmed town to you or not?

Erm. One observation at this point: I noticed this at first, but there's potential that Foil could be a Mafia Mason recruiter/leader, whatever you want to call it. I mean, this works against the sensor role quite well... but this is really only speculation; I don't even know who to believe at this point.

@Nintendo
So he contradicted himself, is there anything else you wanted to say?

[nintendoaddict1]

@Nintendo
So he contradicted himself, is there anything else you wanted to say?

Contradiction =/= scum.

[archaebob]

@ everyone -

Foilist is

not

confirmed town to me. I've asked the mod.

I had a scumread on Ace and on foilist going into Night 1, but immediately ruled out both of them when I was sent the Neighborhood QT. Foilist told me that ace was the "other mason," and that made a lot of sense to me. My scum read on them was based on their inexplicable support for DemonHybrid yesterday, and their duel tunneling on nintendo for a case that I didn't really buy from either of them. I kept mostly quiet about it because my policy is usually to keep quiet about smart scum, avoid the NK, and then nail them later on when there are less players. However, the support for DH made perfect sense if they were all masons together, as did the coordinated efforts against nintendo, and at the time I assumed incorrectly that foilist was confirmed.

In our QT, foilist told me that ace knows I've been neighborized. Obviously, he didn't also tell him that I was going to be told that. This leaves us with three possibilities:

1) Foilist is really what he has claimed to be, which is a Mason-Friendly Neighbor, and Ace is a town-aligned mason:

Ace has tried very hard today to get me outed, and his entire argument about why I'm looking more like scum to him makes no sense if he's town who knew beforehand that I was going to be neighborized by foilist.

2) Foilist is actually what he claims he is, and Ace is a traitor:

This is what foilist is now pretending, as evidenced by his ace vote, and a recent post he made in the QT.

But this doesn't make any sense either. Why on earth would Ace be playing this way if he was partnered with someone he knew was town? Foil

told

him that I was neighborized. Ace knows this. By going after me like this today, he is confirming himself as scum. Why?

3) They are both scum.

This makes *perfect* sense. Foilist is a scum neighborizer, who targeted me and pretended that ace, who is actually his scumbuddy, was a mason. He told ace that I was going to be neighborized, but neglected to warn him about the full scope of his gambit. Ace didn't know foilist was going to tell me all this, and scum evidently don't have daytalk, and so ace unwittingly picked a strategy that contradicted foilist's ploy.

This is the only scenario that makes sense. Foilist wouldn't have picked a random townie and declared them to be a mason, because that's a confirmable lie that would have come out at the first massclaim, and foilist's whole ploy was obviously to have me believe that two of the scum were masons.

They are

both

scum. And it was a stupid gambit to begin with. When has there ever been a three man mason team with one of

them

also being a friendly neighbor?

Get out of here.

Now I need to decide if their nintendoaddict case yesterday was a bus/distance, or a mislynch attempt. I'm forced to admit that Barry Allen's wall post earlier actually looked fairly town to me, despite being a poor defense, and that I may have been wrong about everything today. Especially with two confirmed scum on his wagon, he's likely our tracker.

@ Heliman -

I don't think you are scum anymore, and lost motivation to respond to you when I tried to make my case and realized that you probably were town. Your arguments against me are stupid as shit though, just go look at them. If you are really going to insist, I'll still respond to your "case", but I don't have a scumread on you at this point and would prefer not to waste my time. I can't imagine why you think I would be doing

any

of this as scum.

[hiplop]

great job bob <3

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ace

[archaebob]

@ the REAL mason(s) -

Foilist has explicitly claimed to be a mason partnered with DemonHybrid, so if things start to go south, all you have to do get ace and foilist lynched is come forward with your claim, and hopefully your breadcrumb.

Don't do it just yet though. I'm confident we can get these two scumbags lynched without you outing yourself, which is vastly preferable.

[pappums rat]

Vote Count 2.4

ace5993 - 4 (archaebob, foilist13, nintendoaddict1, hiplop)
Barry Allen - 1 (ace5993)
archaebob - 1 (xvart)
nintendoaddict1 - 1 (Heliman)
hiplop - 1 (Barry Allen)

Not Voting - Valern, Scumhunter, Giitah


With 11 alive it takes 6 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 2 is 7 P.M. EST on July 11, 2011.

[xvart]

Okay. I'll have a full response tonight with an explanation for the archaebob questioning but I am reluctantly moving archaebob down on my scum list. I see the Barry Allen case and I see hiplop being scum with him as well. I still have about 4 pages I think and I see something about a neighborizor... the claims in this game...

I promise a full monty of post will be up tonight. It's going to take me a while to type it all up once I finish.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: hiplop

[hiplop]

lmao, dont vote until you've read the entire thread, last 4 pages are the most important in the game

DH's death makes so much sense now. Them killing him to "confirm them"

[ace5993]

What the hell is going on here? I can confirm I'm not a mason but bob's reasoning is HIGHLY flawed. Bob, if there was a massclaim, do you think that foil would want TWO OF THE SCUM TO CC THE REAL MASON. Especially when DH referred repeatedly to his "partner", CONFIRMING A TWO MAN MASON TEAM? That's completely absurd. The best explanation I can think of is what actually happened, he picked a VT in the hopes that when he was outed, he'd get a townie to fall with him, with the same sort of case you're presenting now. It just doesn't make sense for him to pick his scumbuddy.

Unvote, Vote: foilist13

[Scumhunter]

Whoa, just whoa.

Foilist, are the things bob is saying about your QT true?

[Scumhunter]

Please, lets not lynch til foilist has a chance to confirm/deny the accusations bob is bringing against him here. It is imperative that he is given a chance to explicitly give his version of events. Foilist, did you tell bob that ace is in fact a mason? Yes/no?

At this point, I'd say DH's REAL mason partner needs to claim. This is getting pretty damn convoluted and confusing here.

[Giitah]

Tell me about it...

No one put another vote on Ace. And someone needs to unvote, nao.

[archaebob]

@ Ace - Why did he claim then? He had no reason to claim like that, except as a desperate measure to redirect you from your mistaken path.

Also, Foilist obviously forgot that DH had talked about having just one "partner", or he wouldn't have tried to pull this stunt at all. So that doesn't exonerate you.

but

unvote

[foilist13]

Ok, I don't know what the hell is happening. Ace and I ARE masons. I have no idea why he would try to deny that. If DH had partners he planned on not outing, do you really think it would be beyond him to intentionally confuse the numbers?

Archaebob pretty much blew up in the QT. He haven't discussed much of anything really. I told him the mason situation then he was silent for probably a week, then he comes back and says YOU ARE BOTH SCUMZZZZZ and attacks me in thread without me responding in the QT. Personally I think everyone is high at the moment.

[archaebob]

@ the real mason -

DO NOT counter claim.

Foil is already going down.

Don't out yourself. We still need you for later in the game.

vote foilist

[archaebob]

And Foilist is lying about the QT.

mod

-

Am I allowed to quote the QT in thread?

[pappums rat]

Directly quoting from a QT is against the rules, but paraphrasing is not.

[hiplop]

^^ no you're not. As you 'could' be lying. Quoting QT's are never allowed iirc

[xvart]

I'm forced to agree with archaebob here. It doesn't make sense how there could be that many power roles.

You say this knowing you are not only a neighborizer but a

mason

neighborizer? Scum neighborizer isn't unlikely.

VOTE: foilist13

I am all caught up. Whoever said it was right. Those last four pages were a doozy. Full comments coming after work. It is possible that foilist was setting up Ace to be the fall guy if he ever got busted and lynched since it is unlikely that mass claim would come before they could kill off the person that could counter claim the plan. But we can worry about that tomorrow. hiplop is still scum.

[hiplop]

how am i scum? please actually say why.