Newbie 1116 -- Game Over

[cymru96]

Oh yeah, I forgot that I havent unvoted yet-

Unvote

Vote: Wordawg

- for reasons above.

[Zachrulez]

I'm more inclined to suspect you, Wordawg because I think that most of your long posts don't have much content in them and I think that you are doing this to look active when you don't suspect anyone cause you know the scum is.

In iso, I'm not seeing this lack of content you're vaguely alluding to in Workdawg's posts.

What's your opinion of Cobbler?

[Workdawg]

No content?

I have to say that I think you're just sheeping other peoples previous reads on me. Original thoughts or examples to support your argument please. And if you bring up post 99, I'm gunna pull a VE on you guys. (<3 VE)

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.18

Cobblerfone - 3 - Grimmjow, Workdawg, bigAl
Workdawg - 3 - The Fonz, VisceraEyes, cymru96
cymru96 - 1 - Tomie Uzumaki
VisceraEyes - 1 - Zachrulez

Not Voting: Cobblerfone

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline: July 5 -- (expired on 2011-07-05 11:00:00)

V/LA: ...

I have noticed that the countdown is slightly off by two hours from my original intent. If this game

really

gets down to the last minute, y'all get a two-hour extension. And I've gotten a lesson in server time-zones.

[VisceraEyes]

Okay, I'm not going to apologize again for the meltdown I had twenty-something (exaggeration) pages ago. It was a misunderstanding, I explained myself as best I could (which I see you did NOT comment on, in spite of being VERY observant indeed...) and everyone who has BEEN in the game since then has moved past it. I understand that for lack of anything better in the thread, that's going to come back and haunt me...but here's my problem with bringing it up now. We're in the eleventh hour of d1, we have 2 strong suspects here and your first act in the game is NOT to try and figure out which of these two is the better lynch, but rather to introduce another candidate to the mix using an argument that's not only been brought up, but ANSWERED FOR in-thread. I find this highly opportunistic, and I'm certainly keeping that in mind for tomorrow (assuming I live through the night). Also, the point you make regarding me trying to end the game before you get an opinion in...you caught me. I was trying to end the day by putting the SECOND to last vote on Cobbler. Oh...no, that wouldn't have ended the day at all actually. What that would have done was open the door for whomever WANTS to end the day without you giving an opinion to DO SO. Thanks...you caught me trying to lay a scum trap...and said it was scummy. WTG. I was asking town's permission not because I'm wishywashy, but because it was a bold move and I didn't want it to be mistaken (unsuccessful, apparently) for a scum-switch.

As for being manipulative, obviously I can't answer for that because it's subjective. I certainly wasn't TRYING to manipulate Grimmjow into taking his vote off me, merely pointing out the logic behind it all. From what he was saying, he didn't feel strongly about his vote on me and I was just pointing out that there's probably a reason for that. But obviously, we're going to see what we want to see in a situation like that.

Overall, I find Zach's posts against me to be A) Subjective, B) Opportunistic and C) Intentionally distracting town.

I hope no one buys what he's selling. It smells like scum. Good for us though! Since there's a good chance we're about to hit scum with the targets we have on the docket already, that gives us a good jumping-point tomorrow! ^^

UNVOTE: Workdawg
VOTE: Cobblerfone

There...was that less scummy than asking permission first?

[bigAl]

I have never seen a game with so many divided opinions. Like I said before, I see the page 8 stuff as VE pro-town.

Any last words Cobbler?

[Cobblerfone]

I find this highly

opportunistic

, and I'm certainly keeping that in mind for tomorrow (assuming I live through the night). Also, the point you make regarding me trying to end the game before you get an opinion in...

I don't think that word means what you think it means. Also, OMGUS much?

Any last words Cobbler?

I'm assuming you're offering to hammer so I'll claim: I'm just a townie.

@cymru: Workdawg and I could theoretically both be town. I don't know though.

[bigAl]

I'm already voting, so can't hammer.

[The Fonz]

^^

UNVOTE: Workdawg
VOTE: Cobblerfone

There...was that less scummy than asking permission first?

Not really. It looks like a player who's worried he might be the target of a counterwagon trying to rush through the leading wagon to stop his own building.

I thought Zach's points were decent, and Viscera's reaction is OMGUS. However, pretty much every argument he made can be better applied to Cobblerfone than Visc.

[Cobblerfone]

I'm already voting, so can't hammer.

Then why make it sound like you were going to hammer? You know what:

VOTE: bigAl

Even if I'm at L-1 I can't just act like there isn't a chance at catching scum today.

[The Fonz]

What that would have done was open the door for whomever WANTS to end the day without you giving an opinion to DO SO. Thanks...you caught me trying to lay a scum trap...and said it was scummy. WTG. I was asking town's permission not because I'm wishywashy, but because it was a bold move and I didn't want it to be mistaken (unsuccessful, apparently) for a scum-switch.

Also 'Not wanting to be [mistaken/accurately seen] as a scum switch' is a scum motivation. Town don't care nearly as much about how things are SEEN. IF you thought it were the right thing to do for town, you'd just do it and explain later.

[cymru96]

Question to the IC.
When someone is on L-1, what usually happens because if someone hammers down, wouldn't that be suspicious?

[Workdawg]

@VE

I have to say, I disagree with your analysis of Zach. I think if he were opportunistic scum, he would have just hopped on one of the current bandwagons and gone with the flow. With the deadline very close, it would be extremely easy for him to slip through D1 without arising any suspicion. The fact that he chose a separate player entirely rings town to me. Your reaction smells a lot like scum though. The Fonz's suggestion that your trying to end the day more quickly by switching wagons seems dead-on to me.

I think I'd actually be okay with lynching VE today if the cobbler wagon manages to implode somehow. Cobblers recently play seems more town, but the evidence against him from before still outweighs it for me.

@cym

The hammering vote is always going to be thoroughly scrutinized, but if it's genuine, then there shouldn't be a problem. If someone comes from out of no where and hammers with a lot of time left, or without having voice any suspicion of their own, then that usually looks bad.

Someone has to hammer though and as long as their intentions are town motivated, that should be fairly clear.

[cymru96]

oh right. I'm open to a hammer because even though I thought that Wordawg was the scummier I haven't ruled cobbler out. That doesn't mean that he's number one priority though.
Before I do any voting though I want to know what Fonz, Tommie and Zach think.

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.19

L-1 Cobblerfone - 4 - Grimmjow, Workdawg, bigAl, VisceraEyes
Workdawg - 2 - The Fonz, cymru96
bigAl - 1 - Cobblerfone
cymru96 - 1 - Tomie Uzumaki
VisceraEyes - 1 - Zachrulez

Not Voting: ...

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch

Deadline: July 5 -- (expired on 2011-07-05 11:00:00)

V/LA: ...

[bigAl]

Then why make it sound like you were going to hammer?

Because I didn't want someone else to hammer first without your last chance.

@cy Basically what workdawg said.

Someone

has to do it eventually, there's no avoiding that. I actually often find the third or fourth vote more suspicious than the fifth one precisely because scum try to avoid the "suspicious" hammer vote. Of course, scum also know that, so it's all WYFOM. Shrug.

[Cobblerfone]

Because I didn't want someone else to hammer first without your last chance.

Okay then.

@cymru: Another thing is that usually the person that wants to hammer asks for a claim before hammering, but I claimed because I wasn't paying attention to who was voting for me.

[cymru96]

ok, cobbler. Let's say I'm about to hammer you, what would your very last defence be?

[Grimmjow]

but I claimed

I'm assuming you're offering to hammer so I'll claim: I'm just a townie.

This isn't exactly a claim. The way you said it, it makes it sound like you're VT, but I'd just like the clarification. Mostly because claiming "townie" is a great way to play it safe and stay neutral.

You know what:

VOTE: bigAl

Even if I'm at L-1 I can't just act like there isn't a chance at catching scum today.

So, in order to "catch scum," you jump on the only wagon that.... oh... wait... there's 2 days left in the D1 and there wasn't a wagon for him at all... Great job in the scumhunting, buddy...

oh right. I'm open to a hammer ... Before I do any voting though I want to know what Fonz, Tommie and Zach think.

Why are you so interested in others' thoughts and opinions? You have been asking about others' opinions the entire game. This is a great way for scum to say "I want to see what others say that was I don't have to offer an actual opinion and I can still seem like I'm being active." Just sayin'. If you're willing to hammer, then hammer. He's offered his "claim" already... However, if you are going to hammer (or anyone for that matter), I would ask that you wait until Cobbler clarifies his "claim."

[cymru96]

I was asking those guys because there was 4 of us and 4guys voting cobbler so I was wondering if I should hammer but I thought I should ask why they havent voted cobbler.
I'm not gonna hammer untill I hear from cobbler no worries.

[Cobblerfone]

Tomorrow on Day 2, look back at this page, everyone. Please just in case.

I was asking those guys because there was 4 of us and 4guys voting cobbler so I was wondering if I should hammer but I thought I should ask why they havent voted cobbler.
I'm not gonna hammer untill I hear from cobbler no worries.

My last defense would be: I'm not scum. I'm just an ordinary Townie. I have no idea why people think giving my opinion on what the power roles should do in a newbie game is scummy. I kind of forget why everyone thinks I'm scummy actually. The only reason that I could see as being okay is Fonz's "giving a stance without voting" which I don't think applied to the situation since I was waiting for people to respond and he isn't even voting me. (I think)

[Grimmjow]

I have no idea why people think giving my opinion on what the power roles should do in a newbie game is scummy.

Though I think I see now how it can look scummy.

[Cobblerfone]

Yes I can see why it can look scummy, but I don't know how so many people think so.

[Grimmjow]

Sir, you are full of contradictions.

[Cobblerfone]

I guess I'm not out of the VI woods quite yet.