Mini 1195: The Beehive Mystery (GAME OVER)

[Greymarble]

Lynching someone I KNOW is town is worse than lynching someone I THINK is town.
My wagon was the only one other than Acro's with a reasonable chance of lynching. (2 already on me and others expressing interest)
In 1v1, you vote the other guy. End of story.
See Dilemma mafia for another game where I lynched somebody I was convinced was town because they weren't me.

[Tommy]

I don't get why SK defended acro, as town it makes no sense to defend somebody you don't know the alliance to.

I agree that it's poor play, but it's conceivable that a town player would want to steer the town away from what he believes is a red herring.

That's why I'm on Kool now, he has yet to make a scum read on anyone and he isn't even attempting to scum hunt.

I have some sympathy for this, though I do think the infamous hammer-attempt post contained genuine scum-hunting. I realise that's controversial. More damning, in my opinion, is this:

I was using the vote as a harsh lesson, that I AM willing to lynch someone who so thoroughly and effectively negates the town's primary means of finding scum. Scum or not, they need to go.

Yuck. And note that he's backtracked since discovering that was unpopular:

I am unsure of policy lynches, but I do believe in attacking someone for hindering the town.

Right, next Beck question:

Explain why each is suspicious to you

Sure. Da Koolzzy I've covered. I discussed my problem with ConfidAnon (his revisionism) in posts 145 and 218, though this has been tempered with some quite pro-town play. Ivan has started chucking dirt about to see whether it will stick. People who challenge him on it get scorn but not answers.

Speaking of which: Ivan, please answer the question I asked you in post 568. I'm also looking forward to seeing your answer to rblinker's question.

Now, Greymarble.

My wagon was the only one other than Acro's with a reasonable chance of lynching.

This is simply untrue. You had six days till the deadline. That's plenty of time to launch a case against one of your suspects. I've been wondering why you didn't do that, which is why I asked you about it in post 539 and reminded you of the question in post 568. You've ignored the question three times, along with the question of why you were willing to go into the night phase without giving evidence for any of your reads. You and ICEninja will be thrilled to hear that I'm finally prepared to dust off my vote.

Vote: Greymarble

[Tommy]

I miscounted. You ignored my questions twice, not three times. Still twice too many, of course.

[jilynne1991]

*scrunches up forehead*

This was one super confusing read.

Ok, everything I though of and many things I didn't think of have already been pointed out...so assuming by lily, you actually meant me, Beck, what would you like me to do?

Questions anyone?

[Tommy]

Questions anyone?

Who do you think is most likely to be a member of the Mafia and why?

[jilynne1991]

Grey. Bad content and bad logic.

[Tommy]

Please could you point to some specific examples?

[Beck]

*scrunches up forehead*

This was one super confusing read.

Ok, everything I though of and many things I didn't think of have already been pointed out...so assuming by lily, you actually meant me, Beck, what would you like me to do?

Questions anyone?

I asked you to provide your thoughts on day 1. Your slot is on the hot seat so saying "everything has been pointed out by others" isn't going to cut it.

[Greymarble]

Just look at the end of D1.
I say "we shouldn't lynch Acro" and the next 4 posts are "maybe we wagon marble instead" and then I'm like WELL FUCK THAT and hammer.
I did not have enough townleaderpoints to make a new wagon happen on somebody I actually wanted to lynch.

[Beck]

Just look at the end of D1.
I say "we shouldn't lynch Acro" and the next 4 posts are "maybe we wagon marble instead" and then I'm like WELL FUCK THAT and hammer.
I did not have enough townleaderpoints to make a new wagon happen on somebody I actually wanted to lynch.

That actually makes sense but the town points, was your own doing. Get a reliable hydra partner next time.

The pushing on grey really makes no sense, the SK slot, Koolzy, and possibly Tommy are who we need to focus on, especially SK, now acro flipped town

[rblinker123]

It doesnt matter about lynching someone you know is town being worse than lynching someone you think is town. Lynching town doesnt help.

I still dont think that your explanation for a wagon building on you is that good. You werent in that much danger, you probably could of fort off opposition. It would be far more likely for one other person to hammer Acro than 5 more turning against you. If you think someone is town, you shouldnt lynch them.

[Tommy]

I did not have enough townleaderpoints to make a new wagon happen on somebody I actually wanted to lynch.

I don't accept that. You had six days: that's enough time to turn people around. And did you feel that there wasn't even five minutes left to give the outline of the reasons for your reads before you did it? And did you feel that an Acronach lynch was preferable to no lynch at all?

[Tommy]

Ooh, I just thought of another question (this really is magnificent whisky): how about twilight? You could have taken the time to give some reasons for your reads after the hammer. Why did you let the night come without having your say? I think it's because you knew you'd survive the night. Certainly you were bright-eyed and bushy-tailed with your cases come morning.

[Klazam]

Day Two: Vote Count Two

Da Koolzzy (2)- Captain Spoon, Beck,
Greymarble (2)-, Subgenius, Tommy,
Tommy (2)- Greymarble, Ivan the Pleasant,

Not voting: (5) – Da Koolzzy, ConfidAnon, ICEninja, rblinker123, jilynne1991,

With 11 alive, it’s 6 to lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2011-07-19 17:00:00). (5 PM EST on July 19.)

[jilynne1991]

Also, just so you guys know, my playstyle is that I'll have a wall of posts instead of one post. It helps me.

[jilynne1991]

1/3 of Grey's posts look like he's active lurking...and he's only posted 15x.

10 useful posts, Grey. Way to go.

Also, feel free to make as many excuses as you want, but I still don't see an appropriate reason for you to vote someone you don't think is scum. When you play as town, you're not going for self-preservation.

[Beck]

I clicked this thread with high hopes, I leave utterly disappointed

[Da Koolzzy]

Hello all, Head #2 popping in at last to get involved while we work on a larger post, including a small case *gasp*.

Grey's behaviour has been questionable this game, but I agree with Beck in that maybe he shouldn't be the focus at this point. Definitely worth a revisit in the future though.

I also would like to hear jilynne's take on D1, as her slot is, at this point, my main suspect. SK will be the main focus of my piece of the upcoming post, but if his play can be tempered by Jilynne's input, I'm open to that.

@ Beck:
First off, everything you're saying is fair. We have been a bit low on the activity scale, but I (head#2) take the blame for that.

On the site that our heads met on, third parties are almost a standard in the very convoluted games we play. As such, we might have been a bit biased in our approach to something we saw as unusual

This is not enough, and I know that, more is coming, but I thought I'd start to be a bit more proactive now that I actually can.

[Beck]

What site please ?

[ICEninja]

Alright in reviewing day 1, I feel like I've got a stronger sense of who is probably scum right now.

Da Koolzzy hasn't impressed me at all. Let's take a look at some of his posts in more detail.
post 213, which was his second post of the game, has some preliminary reads on people. Unfortunately they're almost all useless. Here's a simplified rundown on his reads on everyone:
Sleepy - town, for meta reasons.
Beck - lurker but not scummy/third party.
Spoon - leaning town, but slightly scummy.
Ivan - no actual read, just a strange comment.
Me - too quiet to read (fair enough, at that point in the game).
Rblinker - lurker with reasoned posting, but wait it's just mafia discussion.
Tommy - a lot of weird comments that involves no read.
Yank - "something fishy going on".
Acro - the only true scum read given by Koolzzy's post.
Confid - lurker, no read.

All I see are a lot of weak opinions, statements that don't really make sense or contribute, and little or no direction. This post is a prime example of appearing to scum hunt without actually doing it.

In post 288, Koolzzy puts down a weird vote for Spoon. While it is definitely a good policy to not answer questions directed at others, what Spoon did wasn't exactly scummy. The vehemence with which the vote was placed simply doesn't track with the reason for voting, which leads me to believe that he was looking for a place to park his vote without actually having scum hunted much.

Then he does the weird "wait don't hammer yet!" then tries to hammer Yank in post 386. He seems to have a good case, but hardly even addresses the mason claim. It really looks like an attempt to look town while having hammered a mason.

The rest of the day he doesn't really do anything else. As Tommy pointed out earlier in the page, Koolzzy advocates then backtracks on policy lynching.

That all being said, head #2 seems to have just popped in and is promising some content. I've decided that ultimately I'll hold off on any Koolzzy votes until after this promised content. If I don't see the content coming, or the content provided isn't solid scum hunting, I'll definitely move forward on voting here.

[jilynne1991]

Just so you guys don't think I'm lurking, I'll post back in a few hours when I feel like it.

[Captain Spoon]

Sleepy - town, for meta reasons.

explain your meat case on SK. thanks

[Captain Spoon]

that's meant to say meta; not meat ¬_¬

[Beck]

Just so you guys don't think I'm lurking, I'll post back in a few hours when I feel like it.

It's times like these I wish we could lynch 2 people

[rblinker123]

Ice: You have Beck down as lurker, he's been the most active? Where you just joking?