TV Mafia Game Over - Scum Win

[David Xanatos]

Ah, strike that. Found it under "Vi's Unique Roles". Interesting.. although what I find strange is that they haven't stepped forward to say who they are, confirm themselves as Town.. assuming it's single-shot that is.

Preview Edit: Aye, found it just afterwards.. does the Neighbourhood become a third faction, or is it purely like the Wiki says, a mason-group?

[David Xanatos]

What flavour/mechanics did they give you for it? Even if you don't name them, the differences might hint towards the non-town, assuming they aren't both Town..

[Nero Cain]

My other head has been mia for awhile. Dunno why and if you don't believe me that's fine. I'll ask him to post about his vote and all that good stuff whenever he revives and shows up again.

I find this hard to believe given that he's currently active in mismash.

and beyond that. My questioning of the drummers vote on vifam was in post 383, the CJ head of the hydra last posted in 416. So he coulda easily answeared then...but he didn't so he's ignoring this game b/c?

[silverdrummer]

MOI and this one @ Nero Cain rest for MOI

Because regardless of whether you are a hydra or not you are one player – Player A. You as a slot are judged by the same standards as any other slot. You don’t get special dispensation to post in a dissonant manner in thread just because you are a Hydra.

You have conflicts between the heads? Resolve them in QT.

Well my other head has gone silent, and we haven't had much chatter in QT. I did send him a message and he did read it but apparently it's done nothing. I have no idea why he's ignoring the game but that does seem to be the case. Unfortantely i'm as lost as anyone else because I don't think I've played any games with cj and don't know him in real life.

I love that you don’t even concede the possibility that I correctly read the situation and am right.

well after recent posts... what you should be doing according to volkan is seing if he does replace when pressured and is scum in other games. Find a game or two where he does that and you win my heart for the day. I personally still think it's null and sheer luck if your right (or inside info).

Ah the truth comes out. Guess what … I don’t give a rats ass if you don’t like Pine or not. Your little personal vendetta is quaint but stupid.

You can either replace out now or continue to try to get him lynched. Do so with your grudge as justification and you’ll probably eat rope sooner than later.

The truth came out in much earlier posts than this. But no seriously not even just because of that (I mean that MAY be why he's my #1) but only 2 posts... 1 prod... he takes the prod yet still does nothing? He definetly doesn't have a post restriction again as someone suggested or else he wouldn't have been prodded. This is a serious lurkier atm that needs to either be lynched or vigged.

Explain the bolded because in context of ZingTroll’s claim it makes absolutely no sense.

For all we know zing could be lieing and he's a thirdparty that has the potential to turn mafia similar to the one guy that posted a third party lyncher role in this game from another game. I still believed him to be thirdparty... and now just vi town.

Um weren’t you the head that has been championing Vifam / Junpei’s slot as Town the whole time? How the hell can you possibly believe this theory if you think that slot is Town?

I never said he's 100% town. But he claimed a pr... no use in lynching a pr day 1 and as I stated i didn't really see vifam as scummy.

Ok ... more food for thought ...

I've been Neighborized by two seperate players today. Both have claimed the same mechanics behind how they Neighborize.

I've come to the conclusion that it is unlikely as heck that both are Town. One may be Third Party. One may be Scum. Both might be Scum.

Discuss the ramifications ...

Scum neighborizers are common, I was one in an old game, you said you were neighborized twice... were there any other people in the neighborhoods? More than likely a neighborizer or a neighbor is scum at the least.

[silverdrummer]

Also for Pine Case

What I stated above and he's made posts as recent as today. He's ignoring this game for some reason and I dislike it heavily.

[Junpei]

I agree that Pine has been active in other areas of the site yet refuses to post in here even when given a prod.

I want to pressure him however I can't see us lynching him over Zinger (not that I'd want to). Although I think he should be vigmeat for tonight.

[Rodion]

But.... he's probably town. And he's a good vig shot

Can you explain those 2 different thoughts?


Regarding the neighbourizers, I've never seen such a role. I guess I like the possibility of the neighbour PR having the neighbourizer "represent him" in a possible counterclaim (so the PR is not outed). I'm thinking here and it seems like this could work even if the neighbourizer is mafia. I have no idea on the likelihood of their alignment being town, mafia ord 3rd-party.

[silverdrummer]

Actually in my post regarding cjdrummer I lied by accident, I only posted in QT to get him back on when I though I pmed him. I pmed him now though and hopefully he'll read it and be like oh yeah! and come back.

[Junpei]

I use these forums to do all the stupid things I would never consider doing on the other forums where I play mafia so that I can see first hand why doing that is a bad idea without screwing with my rep on the site that I take the game seriously.

I have to point this out.

Here's the thing, in all of his other games, he doesn't act mean and snarky, he scumhunts and gives reads even. He isn't even selfish or arrogant or antagonizing. I think that what he is doing could be a ploy, although he may just be mad his claim idea didn't work out. I still stand on the side that says lynch zinger, I'm just pointing out an interesting lie.

[Meransiel]

And also, are you willing to tell us the names of the people who've neighbourized you? I'm inclined to agree that both aren't likely to be town, so by having the two names we can analyse who's more likely to be non-town..

I don't like this at all.

Vote: david Xanatos

[chkballin]

It's so sad how many personal shots are taken in these games, and I've done it before too but I really wish we'd all just come off of our pedestals and stop being so aggressive.

More onto the game, I've never played with a neighborizer but I somehow don't see it as a bad thing regardless of the alignment. All it does is open communication right? So you would just have to watch what you say? I mean it could help your reads I suppose. I don't know the details and the wiki says the restrictions are up to the mod so this is just some speculation. Unless I am missing something,I don't think it matters...

Also, are we going to get everyone up to L-1 day one? I mean these bandwagons have proven virtually unsuccessful IMO. These aggressive pressure sessions have just outed 2 PRs if you believe what Vifam and Zinger have said. ZeL1nK just decided to out himself earlier so it's obvious that we've got the aggressive playstyle from probably on both alignments which is pushing this game in a bad direction...All I ask is that if we go pushing another person up to L-1 that we intend to lynch one of those people who have already claimed. It's time for a flip and a bandwagon analysis.

~

BALLIN

[David Xanatos]

Might I ask how so? I believe it's already been stated that Scum neighbourisers are common (I think it was Silver who said it?) so if one of the two is already high on people's suspect lists, it may lend even more weight to a lynch.

You'll also note I asked later for simply the details he was given, to see if we can spot any inconsistencies that might imply changed/hidden details.

[killerjester]

I am more than content with lynching Zinger today.

[Junpei]

Chkballin, my claim was not at all the same as Zingers' claim, I think that much is obvious. Classifying it as the same thing is ridiculous. Zingers' claim wasn't the result of the votes, the votes were the result of Zinger's claim.

[chkballin]

Chkballin, my claim was not at all the same as Zingers' claim, I think that much is obvious. Classifying it as the same thing is ridiculous. Zingers' claim wasn't the result of the votes, the votes were the result of Zinger's claim.

Claims are claims. That is all I am saying, and Zinger was catching heat earlier anyway. The point that I think you are missing is that if you and he are telling the truth then there are town PRs outed. Ideally I don't like any PRs outed, but since we've already got 3 out I'd like to try and keep that number low. Do you disagree?

~

BALLIN

[Junpei]

Chkballin, my claim was not at all the same as Zingers' claim, I think that much is obvious. Classifying it as the same thing is ridiculous. Zingers' claim wasn't the result of the votes, the votes were the result of Zinger's claim.

Claims are claims. That is all I am saying, and Zinger was catching heat earlier anyway. The point that I think you are missing is that if you and he are telling the truth then there are town PRs outed. Ideally I don't like any PRs outed, but since we've already got 3 out I'd like to try and keep that number low. Do you disagree?

~

BALLIN

I take it you haven't seen my vote on Zinger yet?

[Zinger2099]

unvote

[Leonshade]

@izakthegoomba:

I asked you a question in this post, would you mind answering it?

@zinger:

Now that you've lied about your claim at least once, I doubt I'll be moving my vote off you today.

[Zinger2099]

@Leonshade, it's all good. I wouldn't expect you to.

[Junpei]

@Leonshade, it's all good. I wouldn't expect you to.

Now I have to ask

If you would expect someone to vote you after lying about your claim, when why would you do what you did?

[jasonT1981]

Mod Announcement.

A few issues right now I would like to address as Mod to the entire player base of TV Mafia Large theme. I have noticed quite a few things that quite frankly are pushing my mod tempers to the limit.

First off, last night while there was no direct accusations of cheating, it was mentioned of the possibility of someone cheating. As a Mod I have to take ANY and ALL talk, no matter how small of cheating seriously and WILL follow it up with an investigation or request for information from those accusing and/or those accused.

Second, I find it in severe bad taste to be

A) Asking/Looking for a Mod Kill
B) Asking/Looking for another player to be replaced.

So far there is nothing in this game that has made me consider Mod Killing or Replacing anyone except for those who directly asked to be replaced, or failed to respond to prods within the correct time frame

I would ask that you trust me as Mod to make decissions based on my discretion and modding experience as to what warrents replacement/mod-killing and what doesn't. As players, it is not your call to make.

If I see anymore unsporting behaviour of what seems to be forcing someone out of the game via these means I will take one of the following actions as I see fit based on the situation.

A) Mod Kill you
B) Replace you with no hesitation right away

This is the last I will be mentioning this, and I ask that no more discussion of wanting others replaced is made However, it is Ok to discuss about someone who has asked directly for replacement.

Jason

[Zinger2099]

@Leonshade, it's all good. I wouldn't expect you to.

Now I have to ask

If you would expect someone to vote you after lying about your claim, when why would you do what you did?

I didn't think the truth behind my lie would come out until I had already done my service towards helping the town at least 3 or 4 nights in a row (thus, perhaps justifying the lie), and by that point it wouldn't have mattered if I died (as I would have hopefully severely set back the scum team).

Of course that didn't pan out at all like I planned. Oh well, these things happen. When you make a gambit, you have to be prepared to have it blow up in your face.

[Pinky and the Brain]

'Kay.

So.

I agree with this post... to an extent.

Spoiler: ZeL1nK #648

We believe Zinger should be the lynch for today for several reasons.

1. He has claimed third party, which is clearly anti-town and therefore he has no reason to help town.
2. His claimed ability of jailkeeping is bad for town. He is anti-town, and therefore his JK's will not be with the intention of helping the town. Our PRs may get blocked, and he has no reason to try to avoid blocking them because his only intention will be to fulfill his wincon.
3. His roleclaim does not make sense. He claims that the person he JK's that is his target will be roleblocked for the rest of the game, when he is supposedly a jailkeeper. Also, as has been mentioned, the chances of him completing his wincon are very slim if he is what he says he is.

1 and 2 aren't necessarily true. He does have a reason to help town (to avoid getting lynched or vigged) and his claimed ability isn't necessarily bad for town, if he's directed. Of course, it's impossible to tell (short of tracking him) whether he'd doing what we tell him to do, so it's not necessarily a good idea to keep him alive, but like... if I am mysteriously roleblocked tonight, I'm sure as hell going to be pushing for his lynch tomorrow, regardless of whether it was actually him that roleblocked me. It's actually in his best interests to work with town, because it doesn't really hinder his claimed win-con, and it means he's more likely to be kept alive.

Of course, that's assuming he's telling the truth about his role. Which I don't think he is. He's not scum, that much I'm confident about. If he is third party, I don't consider him a threat. There's the possibility he's town and this was some gambit he thought was a really smart idea, and considering it's Zinger, this is something I think is a very real possibility.

In any case, he is not a good lynch today.

While it is (imho) sound logic (about Zinger theoretically willing to work with town if third-party), I only agree 'to an extent' though - not enough to deter me from the Zinger lynch. Why?

I'm not taking this game seriously

anyway. If you think I am upset because half the town is voting me, well... I'm not even really upset at all. I just think certain players here (a lot of them) are assholes and need a reality check. And I am entitled to my opinion.

I use these forums to do all the stupid things I would never consider doing on the other forums where I play mafia

so that I can see first hand why doing that is a bad idea without screwing with my rep on the site that I take the game seriously.

The above quotations mean I find it very, very doubtful that we can trust Zinger to play to his win-con, regardless of alignment, and the best solution is to lynch him now.

If he's town, clearly he can't be trusted, and I'm expecting him to jail anybody but the person we direct him to because he can: "TROLOLOL STUPID MS.NET IS STUPID THEY'RE ALL IDIOTS ANYWAY TROLOLOOOL SERVES DEM RITE FOR BEING OVERCONFIDENT AND ARROGANT AND RUDE". So let's just lynch him already.

If he's third-party, he still pretty clearly can't be trusted. So let's just lynch him already.

If he's Mafia, he's mafia.

So let's just lynch him already.

Ok ... more food for thought ...

I've been Neighborized by two seperate players today. Both have claimed the same mechanics behind how they Neighborize.

I've come to the conclusion that it is unlikely as heck that both are Town. One may be Third Party. One may be Scum. Both might be Scum.

Discuss the ramifications ...

Disagree. It's null imo (for both, having said, I find it unlikely that both would be scum

together

).

See recently-finished Les Misérables Mafia for a fine example of why Out-Guessing Mod is bad.

Having said that, I don't know the mechanics they're claiming and it may be that the mechanics are such that it's unlikely both are town (although I struggle to think of an example which would fit this).

I don't like this post. It feels like a "HEY LOOK AT ME I'M UNINFORMED MAJORITY LOOK AT ME ASK ABOUT JESTERS"-post.

The above argument is just weak. Jester speculation is ALWAYS dumb but rarely is it scummy - for it to be a scumtell, you have to do the sort of WIFOM acrobatics that Pinky is doing where you suppose that the person is scum deliberately acting dumb to appear town.

(This is from a while back now but) I disagree and I think you're totally mis-interpreting here.

The Jester-spec looked like a joke to me about how scummy Vifam was (LOL SO SCUMMY COULD BE JESTER), but the kind of joke that scum would make thinking it would look like a town-joke (if that makes sense).

I'm not supposing "that the person is scum deliberately acting dumb to appear town".

~ Hoppster

[Pappums Leather Jacket]

We believe Zinger should be the lynch for today for several reasons.

Let’s rewind a bit Pappums.

What happened to “Zinger Townslipped”? Please point to the exact post where he did such slip that justified your original statement.

This is the post where we thought Zinger had townslipped:

Chevre's wall post strikes me as the kind of wall post a lurker scum would make after her scumbuddies prodded her and said "hey, you're lurking too much!"

vote: Chevre

In this post he suggested this post might have been the result of prodding from a scumbuddy, implying that the scum have daytalk. We believe that this is a mistake commonly made by newbie TOWN who haven't been scum, but not by newbie scum who would know that scum don't have daytalk. Jason's previous games have not had daytalk. This was before his claims and before his meltdown.

Oh god, just when I thought it couldn't get any worse. Why, Zinger? WHY? You are playing the worst game I have ever seen, by a LONG way. The third-party claim. The lies. The attempt to make us all uncertain.

We lynch you today. Worst-case scenario, we lynch a Townie who was playing a really awful strategy and who would have been a serious hinderance if left alive. Best-case scenario, we lynch a scum who went on the stupidest gambit ever.

But whatever happens, I'm blacklisting you, and I hope others will do the same.

Hey izak dont you have some comments/questions to respond to from someone? (I think it was Zelink) Your avoidance of him is really shady.

[Rodion]

Just checked all games Zinger played here. They were 4, 3 as town (vig twice and VT once) and 1 as mafia (but he was allowed to daytalk), so your explanation makes sense.

I wonder if every other player that mentioned the town slip also had this in mind.