TV Mafia Game Over - Scum Win

[Pinky and the Brain]

I don't know if

[my tracker report]

is something I should out or not, it could be -EV town.

Junpei:

Why did we have prod you to say this? Why didn't you bring this up at the beginning of the day ("Hey, guys, help me out - should I reveal my tracker report or not?")?

Given the state of things righ now, I'd be fine with a Silver lynch, though I want to look into it a bit more before I place my vote.

However, Junpei's reasoning for the track target is flimsy at best. Plus, from what I've heard, Vezok is a regular VI.

@Vezok I know this has been said already, but do you know if Junpei is lying?

Also, I'm waiting on this whole neiborizing thing MoI has going on.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, izak:

Spoiler: izak's scum-post paraphrased

Hmm, I'd better avoid taking any clear stances - don't want to get caught up in any scummy contradictions I might make!

I've got a feeling that both silver and Junpei could potentially both have large wagons, so I'd better give myself a way to wriggle onto them at a later date - I don't want to commit now, otherwise I could get caught up in a scummy contradiction! I'd better see how things play out.

So how should I give myself a way onto their wagon without overcommitting myself? Hey, I know! I'll make vague attacks which don't actually provide any analysis or reasoning!

"Given the state of things right now"

- heh, I'm a genius! That makes it look like I know what's going on without me actually having to provide any analysis!

"reasoning... is flimsy"

- oh, man, that is bulletproof. Rock solid. There's no arguing with that. I've used an adjective that is very indicative of scum, therefore I don't need to provide the logic or thought process behind it!


Huh, but that post is too short. Let me fluff it up a little more.

I know, I'll pretend I'm scum-hunting by parroting other people!

Oh, but they might realise that I'm doing that... I KNOW! If I acknowledge that I'm parroting other people, I can't possible be called out on it! GENIUS!


I'll end with a reminder that I know just as little as everybody else

(*wink*)

. Heh heh heh. I'M JUST SO GOOD AS SCUM!

VOTE: silver

Read these posts:

Simply going to say this.

1. I'd rather me than zinger
2. Why are people aiming for a lynch... with 3 weeks still being left before deadline...

-To why u > zinger people
Zinger would be more beneficial then me in a few ways and I still think he's a VI to

Then read through the rest of his ISO from that post, paying paticular attention to how he

doesn't protest

as the Zinger wagon builds up.

Alright Pine is dropped from the list, I initially assumed (seeing him posting in marathons and such) that he was purposely avoiding this game and solely this game. Obviously I was incorrect to say the least. Though I still fully believe it was productive in some ways.

Diddin's vote puts Zinger at L-2.

Stop ninjaing me!

This post is of paticular note - he notes the Zinger wagon is at L-2, yet despite previously expressing views that he is a better lynch than Zinger, he doesn't put up any resistance as Zinger is lynched.

Between ISOs #63 and #64, Zinger was placed to L-1 very clearly, but silver neither acknowledges nor fights against it.

His main account ISO also lacks any vehement protests.

Spoiler: tl;dr (copy + paste)

Code: Select all

[unvote][/unvote]
[vote]silver[/vote]

Obvious scum "lynch me!"-gambit yesterday is obvious.

@MoI well, now that you've outed him, I can totally see what you mean. I am still leaning towards silver more, but is there anything in particular that makes Andrew very scummy?

HEY MOAI I AGREE THAT ANDREW IS SCUMMY

WHY IS HE SCUMMY THOUGH

/fence-sit


izak, scum-reads please, pronto.

~ Hoppster
(spoilers, duh)

[Meransiel]

ZELINK MUST POST FASTER. AND IF HE WASNT ROLEBLOCKED I WILL MAKE HIM EAT SHIT

[David Xanatos]

@DavidXanatos:

Why did you defend Junpei before he had a chance to defend himself? He's nowhere near a lynch and he is a capable player, so I see no reason for you to jump to his defense.

@shotty:

You don't have to wait for anyone to ask before you say things, I just wondered why you said that.

Because I was online and the points Nero made were those of someone who looked like they were blatantly ignoring the obvious reasons. Asking questions that the answer is apparent to doesn't help anyone.

[chkballin]

VOTE: Silver

He should have been lynched yesterday. Also, on a separate note given the amount of activity we've decided to keep things brief. If we are tired of reading crap, we are sure there are others who are tired of reading it too.

[David Xanatos]

E. The second recruit to the Neighborhood was a scum-read of the Neighborizor. After he talked about ‘keepeing the integrity’.

Are you willing to tell us who the second recruit was?

If you aren't, can you give us your own opinion on the one he recruited? Do you think they're scummy?

[Junpei]

VOTE: Silver

He should have been lynched yesterday. Also, on a separate note given the amount of activity we've decided to keep things brief. If we are tired of reading crap, we are sure there are others who are tired of reading it too.

I read this as "We are lazy so I'm sure everyone else is and yeah basically we don't want to give reasoning or any other thoughts than our vote so yeah ok?" Nice excuse but no.

Pinky, I had forgotten about the track report after I read responses, I was just answering and responding to them. Then you brought it up and I said what I would have said anyway.

Also I've explained why Andrew is scummy multiple times and andrew still hasn't responded.

[Junpei]

Ugh, fuck sorry for double post.

But david I would also like to know if he feels that it was scummy for andrew to recruit that person or not. Try not to go into detail if you aren't going to announce who it is but give us your general opinion on the matter.

[Nero Cain]

First part: I don't really see Junpei distancing. He points out his other opinions but he still makes it clear that he's fully behind the Zinger lynch.

Second part: Yes, you do. He's making the point that people seem to be simply bandwagon hopping without providing their own reasons.. and frankly that'd concern me too. In my opinion, he's basically saying "I think Silver is scum, but there's no sense in a quick-lynch if we can get more information out of this".

Third part: I read that as including yesterday too.. Silver had 8-9 votes on him.

1.You so didn't read that well or are intentionly misreading. Either way, Junpei made it clear that HE felt Zinger was scum and that there was no chance in hell that Zinger would flip town. When Zinger was near lynched he changed his stance that Zinger was no longer 100% scum but only the best chance to lynch scum. He can say I'm taking things out of context all he wants but the posts are there.

2. To bandwagon hop someone has to be on a[nother] wagon to hop from. lol He throws out Andrew and Ze1. Tells town not to tunnel. Wants us to look at other possibilities. Says he wants to explore other possibilities while not doing so himself. Afirms that he thinks Silver is scum but is afraid of putting a vote down.

3. Thats BS of the smelliest kind. He was talking about today and the three votes on Silver.

+++What do you have to do with Jun? Why are you defending him?

1) Nero when I said confirmed I didn't mean literally confirmed. Zinger said "OH, how am I LITERALLY confirmed scum?" to which I basically said " you aren't confirmed you scum you're most likely scum". How doesn't that make sense to you?

You yelled at screamed that YOU BELIEVED Zinger was 100% confirmed scum. Therefore in your mind you did not believe that he was town...at all. When he was nearly lynched your statement "I don't believe you're guaranteed thirdparty/mafia just the most likely out of all our options." contridicts your earlier statements.

Ugh @ Jun 1527-I really don't understand why you're defending Silver.

This shows conflict of interest (not trying to lynch scum just trying to lynch silver who may or may not be scum)

So I think that Silver is most likely scum.

Once again, I think silver is scum but I want to explore other options so I won't be voting.

YOU think Silver is scum but you get upset when others think Silver is scum?

Are you willing to tell us who the second recruit was?

Never knew you were a fisherman.

[Junpei]

Holy shit. Nero I don't know if you are this dense or you're faking but I am going to go through and explain to you for one LAST time why you're wrong and I am right.

1) I was saying that he was confirmed non-town in that imo there was no way he'd flip town. That's from a scumhunting standpoint, obviously I cannot literally know that there is a 100% chance unless I was daycop which I wasn't as shown by my TRACKER claim. Stop taking things literally when they weren't meant that way.

2)

@Zinger:

If Junpei is wrong for being "allknowing" and incessantly insisting that you are scum, is ZeL1nk wrong for incessantly insisting that you are town?

I didn't notice that ZeL1nK was so incessantly insisting that I was town. I believe he thinks I am town, but I do not think he is as '100% sure' as JLunpei seems to be about my scum status.

However, if ZeL1nK did indeed insist that I am guaranteed town, this would be equally erroneous because he has no way of knowing that for sure.

I am town though.

Here is where Zinger implies that there is no way that I could be "100% sure" that he is scum unless I was scum. This is what prompted me to go on about how I wasn't really 100% sure just that I was using that figuratively. I never meant it was literally 100%, I'm not god jesus christ this is the third time I have told you this, hopefully this quote will persuade you to my point.

3) I wasn't defending Silver, I was pointing out how killerjester didn't properly evaluate the situation at all and hid information to make his point.

4) I don't give a fuck if you think Silver is scum if you can't back it up with reasoning. I don't like people swooping in and going "ok yea so silver was #2 yestaday so GOGOGOOGOGOGOGO".

5) THE DAY HAD JUST STARTED HOLY SHIT HOW AM I EXPECTED TO EXPLORE OTHER OPTIONS WHEN MOST PEOPLE HAVEN'T POSTED YET? I was pointing out that instead of hastling to vote yesterdays' number 2 that we should calm the fuck down and take a step back and look at everything as a whole. And

continue to scumhunt instead of living in what happened yesterday without being aware of what is being said today

.

[Nero Cain]

*sigh*

[drmyshottyizsik]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: silver

Obvious scum "lynch me!"-gambit yesterday is obvious.

[killerjester]

I think town-silver would have gotten more and more adamant about his martyr suggestion as the Zinger wagon progressed, and literally be typing in ALL CAPS at L-1 before the hammer dropped. The whole part where he just puts the idea out there but never really follows up on it leads me to believe it's a likely scum gambit. That's why my vote is on him, at least. I evaluated the situation clearly, and simply felt that beating the dead horse doesn't really help anyone.

So yea Junpei, I could have explained my vote a little better. But I didn't. So shoot me (vig humor, lol. Don't take this seriously, Zelink.)

[Rodion]

Responding to Rodion from before the lynch.

2 - You misunderstood the aforementioned "newbie defense". It wasn't really a defense on the grounds that "I don't know how to play mafia and thus am prone to crack under pressure even if I am town", it was actually a warning to MoI and Vifam that their attacks on me could look scummy because they were grasping at straws against someone that had a join date that was below 1 week, so it sounded like an easy lynch. It didn't really matter whether I was/am a newbie or whether I'm the greatest mafia player in the world: what mattered was the perception of my experience/skills by those that decided to accuse me with so little and they didn't have a lot to base their perception from other than "he joined the site less than a week ago". Leather Jacket's ensuing attack/vote on MoI only confirmed the risk of attacking the "newbie", meaning my warning was spot on.

Why would you warn people not to do things that might be perceived as scummy? What if they ARE scum? Why would you be so certain that they are not?

3 - Do not worry, you will not see me using the newbie defense in the way I described it in "2" (I'm too proud to imply that I suck and thus should be treated differently). The problem is that I don't yet know the

mores

of this site and that could lead to people reading "scumtells" where there shouldn't be.

Everyone has their own way of finding scum and will detect different scumtells, so this shouldn't be your concern if you're town. Town doesn't have to worry about giving off scumtells.

5 - Mind explaining how I reacted oddly to both Zinger and Zelink's claims?

3 - How common are mafia busdrivers here? Zelink said he'd vig Zinger, should we be worried that a mafia busdriver redirects the kill into someone else? I'm still confused as to whether Zelink made a joke when he claimed vig or not and his "sarcasm" was only present when he replied to Oversoul's weird post (Oversoul asked the claimed vig to protect someone - I think it was simply a poor phrasing and he actually asked the doc to protect the vig - or the person the vig promised to kill). Also, if the vig claim is serious, Zelink, would you also name claim so we test the theory on the randomness of roles (a theory you mentioned yourself in #122)?

Zinger claimed 3rd-party, I don't see the harm in wanting to know more about his claim: it's not like we're outing a town PR. I'm also curious about the logic behind people claiming Zinger "townslipped".

There you go.

6 - Please show where I asked for as many details as possible on those claims.

See above.

9 - Furthermore, I don't see how being new (either "new to mafia" or "new to this site") makes me unable to correct the misunderstandings I see. It just takes reading comprehension, not leet mafia experience. Do you disagree?

No, I agree, being able to correct misunderstandings has nothing to do with experience anywhere. I think that CHOOSING to correct those misunderstandings and trying to smooth things over is characteristic of someone who is either new to Mafia or new to this site. Why would you dismiss things as misunderstandings rather than allowing whatever discussion comes from those things to continue? It looks rather like scum directing the play of their buddies, and that's why I mentioned it.

10 - Hydra - yes, I did. I don't see a pro-town reason to make yourself "unmetable" after you already claimed. If you've got nothing to hide, you should be willing to be read as an open book.

There are plenty of reasons for people to conceal their identities, some of which have nothing to do with this particular game. It's not revealing of the role of the concealed hydra, so it's not a scumtell. It's something that irritates you. There's a difference. Additionally, you claim not to know anyone here anyway, so I don't see how it could affect your play significantly unless you plan to meta each and every one of the players in this game.

@ThAdmiral

: Why are you so convinced that Rodion is town? You've defended him at least twice; I'm curious to know why.

I'm assuming you concede you were wrong regarding "1", "4" and "7"? You still didn't explain what you specifically disliked in the way I asked those questions (regarding "7").

On to the points which you replied to.

2 - You make a good point here. Considering I did not have town reads on them, perhaps I should have allowed them to dig themselves into holes.

3 - I disagree. Town needs to make sure they are seen as town because they don't want to be mislynched. They also don't want town PRs to "waste" night actions investigating them. I could go on about this, but trying to "appear town" is something that is done by both town and mafia. So, yes, I always worry about not dropping scumtells: it is bad for my winning condition regardless of my alignment (except Jester).

5 - By quoting me, you showed how I reacted. What you didn't do was show what was "odd" in my reaction. I'm still waiting on that.

6 - You said I asked about as many details as possible regarding Zelink's and Zinger's claim. Let's see.

Zelink: I said I didn't know whether he was telling the truth or not. If truthful, I asked him to tell his name so we got more info regarding roles fitting flavour or being random. Is that your definition of "asking as many details as possible"?

Zinger: my statement that getting more information on his 3rd-party claim was harmless to town stands corrected.

9 - Because I don't think a discussion that is originated from a misunderstanding will be fruitful. If both parties can't understand each other, they will both bash straw men and think they are correct. Waste of energy/time. If you have a theoretical point that recommends you not to clear misunderstandings while playing town I'd like to read it.

10 - Yes, I do not know anyone here. Luckily, this being a game of mafia I'm not the only one with the town winning condition. That means that, while I'm not able to meta someone, there are people on the town's side that can. Why not let them do it?

I've also checked and Zelink is also alive in another mafia game (Neon Genesis). It's possible that he wants his identity concealed because he is scum there. Time will tell.

You also mentioned there are plenty of reasons for someone to conceal their identities. I'm new to the hydra concept. I'll appreciate if you expand on that.

[jasonT1981]

Day 2 Vote Count 2

Silver 6 - Nero, Hipaddict, Leon, Shotty, Pinky, CHKBallin
Pappums 1 - MOI
Andrew 1 - THAdmiral
Mera 1 - Rodion
Cherve 1 - Pappums
Peregrine 1 - Rainbowdash
Nero 1 - Silver
Rodion 1 - Castle

With 25 alive, it takes 13 to lynch

[Banshee]

I'm assuming you concede you were wrong regarding "1", "4" and "7"? You still didn't explain what you specifically disliked in the way I asked those questions (regarding "7").

Don't assume. I'm not going to respond to every one of your points, because 1) you are not the only scum in the game and 2) I have only so much time to respond.

2 - You make a good point here. Considering I did not have town reads on them, perhaps I should have allowed them to dig themselves into holes.

Is it your standard practice in general to help out people you don't have town reads on by telling them how not to act scummy? Is this your general behaviour?

5 - By quoting me, you showed how I reacted. What you didn't do was show what was "odd" in my reaction. I'm still waiting on that.

This reads as if you're requesting that I explain the scumtell I detected in your posts. I'm not going to tell you that. Ask me after the game.

Zelink: I said I didn't know whether he was telling the truth or not. If truthful, I asked him to tell his name so we got more info regarding roles fitting flavour or being random. Is that your definition of "asking as many details as possible"?

Short of quoting or paraphrasing the role PM, how many more details do you think he could have provided that you did NOT ask for?

9 - Because I don't think a discussion that is originated from a misunderstanding will be fruitful. If both parties can't understand each other, they will both bash straw men and think they are correct. Waste of energy/time. If you have a theoretical point that recommends you not to clear misunderstandings while playing town I'd like to read it.

This is full of fail. If you help everyone out by saying, "It was all just a big misunderstanding!" then you're interfering in fruitful discussion that could lead to slips, scumtells and discovery. Why would you want to do that? Why would you assume you knew what either party meant exactly, anyway?

You also mentioned there are plenty of reasons for someone to conceal their identities. I'm new to the hydra concept. I'll appreciate if you expand on that.

The hydra concept is new to me as well but apart from some technical issues it doesn't bother me. As for hiding one's identity, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that if people are concealing their identity for out of game reasons (as someone in an ongoing hydra may well do) that it's really none of your business, just as if someone is playing as an alt for their own reasons, that's not your business either.

In other news, I finished my reread of Silver and I'll be working on writing it up when I get more time.

[Rodion]

I liked Pinky's observation on Silver not putting much effort in derailing Zinger's lynch. It does seem like he didn't need to do anything else after people took that as a VT softclaim. Spoiler on Goomba was also pretty funny, I laughed hard!

I now have a scum read on Shotty because he:

1 - hammered Zinger without providing his reasons
2 - active lurking (posting a lot but without contributing, no reads - even though I asked him -, most posts are "one-liners"...)

@Rodion: A definite, consistent and exemplified case for why I am scum please.

ISOing our D1 discussion is enough to reach that conclusion. Quick topics:

1 -

part of your #774 attack on me is not explained.

3. Rodion providing the games. Didn't take much effort so I'm not any more forgiving of him for doing that. The relevant part of his post (last 2 rows) is still pure tunneling on the leading wagon. Scumpoints.

Apparently, I get scum points because of this:

Also, how likely do you think it is that Zinger is scum? How strong is your read?

Zinger is getting under my skin. His behaviour so far has been very anti-town, but I don't know if he's scum-aligned. My vote is on him to hopefully change his behaviour for the better. I could just as easily vote Meran, particularly after his #400 admission that he will contribute if pushed hard.

I still do not understand what is scummy about my reply to Chk. The fact that I also mentioned I could just as easily cast my vote on you makes me wonder about the truthfulness of your read.

2 -

Your interactions with Zinger on his JK claim. ISOs 42, 43, 44, 45, 46 and 50. You mentioned his claim was "opportunistically scummy". The reasoning based on your statement was

A LIE

(there are no mafia JKs). This was #42. # 43, 44, 45 and 46 are you trying to defend your lie. Your #44 response to Pinky catching you is a textbook example of the "No True Scotsman" logical fallacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

After lying and trying to defend your original statement and looking pretty bad while doing all that, Junpei tried to derail the JK discussion and in #50 you commended his intelligence for, essentially, getting you off the hook.

On a side note, you also attempted to lurk on D1 and said lynching/vigging you wouldn't be a good idea because you'd actually contribute come D2. I'm waiting.

[Rodion]

Is it your standard practice in general to help out people you don't have town reads on by telling them how not to act scummy? Is this your general behaviour?

I don't think I've played enough games as town to have a "general behaviour" (you can check my list of games if you ISO me).

5 - By quoting me, you showed how I reacted. What you didn't do was show what was "odd" in my reaction. I'm still waiting on that.

This reads as if you're requesting that I explain the scumtell I detected in your posts. I'm not going to tell you that. Ask me after the game.

Unfortunately you do not have 13 D2 votes. In order to convince people to trust you on your scum reads you have to explain the scumtells you find.

Zelink: I said I didn't know whether he was telling the truth or not. If truthful, I asked him to tell his name so we got more info regarding roles fitting flavour or being random. Is that your definition of "asking as many details as possible"?

Short of quoting or paraphrasing the role PM, how many more details do you think he could have provided that you did NOT ask for?

I can come up with several. Just to name a few:

1 - When you said you were going to "vig" Zinger, did you claim vig? Do you have limited shots? Perhaps you are a JOAT that decided to use your kill D1?
2 - Did your role PM mention any other players/roles?
3 - Do you have "strongman" shots (can't be protected/blocked/redirected)? How many?

9 - Because I don't think a discussion that is originated from a misunderstanding will be fruitful. If both parties can't understand each other, they will both bash straw men and think they are correct. Waste of energy/time. If you have a theoretical point that recommends you not to clear misunderstandings while playing town I'd like to read it.

This is full of fail. If you help everyone out by saying, "It was all just a big misunderstanding!" then you're interfering in fruitful discussion that could lead to slips, scumtells and discovery. Why would you want to do that? Why would you assume you knew what either party meant exactly, anyway?

The question about "assuming' is pointless. If I'm getting in the middle of something to clear a misunderstanding, I assume I know what the parties mean. If I'm wrong they can correct me.

And I don't see how certain discussions can be fruitful at all. Let's assume player A and player B are misunderstanding each other. They discuss. This is a summary of what happens:

Player A attacks Straw Man B (A's misunderstanding of B's position). Player A is convinced that he is correct.
Player B attacks Straw Man A (B's misunderstanding of A's position). Player B is convinced that he is correct.
Careful outsiders know the discussion is pointless, since they are not really attacking each other.

I don't see the harm in clearing the mess up.

You also mentioned there are plenty of reasons for someone to conceal their identities. I'm new to the hydra concept. I'll appreciate if you expand on that.

The hydra concept is new to me as well but apart from some technical issues it doesn't bother me. As for hiding one's identity, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that if people are concealing their identity for out of game reasons (as someone in an ongoing hydra may well do) that it's really none of your business, just as if someone is playing as an alt for their own reasons, that's not your business either.

In other news, I finished my reread of Silver and I'll be working on writing it up when I get more time.

I disagree. Gathering knowledge is important and knowing who's behind a hydra/alt mask is part of the equation. If you don't give me an example of a viable reason for a hydra to conceal their identity I can only assume that he is anti-town in at least one of his ongoing games and consequently don't wish to be "metaed".

[Banshee]

A viable reason for someone to hide their identity is if they are being stalked or otherwise harassed online. And that, as I said previously, wouldn't be any of your business, would it?

I don't think I've played enough games as town to have a "general behaviour" (you can check my list of games if you ISO me).

As this once again looks like playing the newbie card to me, I'm going to refrain from comment on it directly. You have said you're very concerned about not giving off scumtells, but to me it does not seem that you are very aware of what they are.

I'm currently conflicted as to whether this makes you naive town or extremely clever scum.

[Pinky and the Brain]

I don't like this post. Yes the case on him exists, and it's very merit-able. But I'd consider voting him for this bit alone. Considering how suspicious everyone finds him, I feel he's harboring his vote by placing it on Nero. With the classic, "Just following my D1 play!" as his sole excuse.

Why do you single out Silver?

ThAdmiral doing it
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 3#p3306413

Hiplop doing it
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 6#p3306566

Rodion doing it
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 4#p3306594

Leonshade picking up on his list from yesterday
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 4#p3306984

Pappums post has nothing to do with Chevre, but votes her from voting her day 1
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 8#p3307108

drmyshotty doing it
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 4#p3309514

The only people with reasoning behind votes (well, new reasoning presented today) is Rainbowdash and Castle Bravo.

It's too bad a Junpei lynch is off the table, because oh man this deflection post is golden.

-diddin

[silverbullet999]

ugh this town depresses me.

I wanna quote our one lynchee but i'm too lazy to find the quote "eat my hat" or what not.

alright skimming and answering cause I only have time for one post a day.

-Shotty

VoTe sIlvEr
It'S tHe obVioUs lyNch foR toDaY.
WhO Not TO LynCh
RainbOwdash/sLatE/CrOpPy
MoI

I want some reasoning from you

*Reads post 1560*
I REALLY WANT SOME ANSWERS NOW SHOTTY
You recall that last fucking game we played where a similar situation happened, I played martyr and I ended up self hammering as VT so we wouldn't no-lynch and you were the other wagon... so give me reasons why the hell I didn't do it again or how your conviently forgetting that old game.

-Killerjester

Considering how suspicious everyone finds him, I feel he's harboring his vote by placing it on Nero. With the classic, "Just following my D1 play!" as his sole excuse.

What's changed from D1? What I thought was correct and Nero is still scum... nothing's changed except we are down 2 townies, one being the VI pr i thought he'd be.

Also read the section to pinky and brain

-MOI (please stop with your sarcasim as I'd like to be civil and my mood varies)

If you are Town then scum don’t really have a reason to swing the wagon between two Townies

(other than the slight motivation to get the claimed PR lynched over the claimed VT which holds risks).

Are there scum there? Possibly. But the chances of concentrated scum in that segment that swung the vote from 9-8 for you to die over to Zinger is much less likely, IMO.

Well I never asked for the me scum explanation but ok. Expand on the bold, specifically these risks. It's a little scary how your downplaying the swing in that zinger's wagon dies and mine picks up... then mine dies and zinger's picks up again as normal. A Lynched PR is always going to kill off the PR, you have no idea what would have happened if they had to try to NK him instead and it's a MUCH HIGHER risk.

If I can’t get some momentum on Pappums I’ll be voting you. Just a heads up for you. I HATE when Vanilla Town claims get off the hook in leiu of Town PRs.

If you "know" I'm scum then why even bother to wait less I'm at L-1?

-Town
Junpei could be defending me because he knows i'm town and would win townpoints on my flip... he's more than a smart enough player to do that so give him a null if I'm the lynch.

Also yes... I'm VT...

Also if I reach L-1 and someone's willing to hammer please wait up as I'd like to clean up my list below and give percents as to how strongly I believe each below is scum.

-Banshee

I'm still in the midst of an ISO reread, but I have a quick question for you. Can you give me a list of your top three scum reads, in no particular order?

I'm doing a little more than 3 in rising order

1. - Nero (should be obvious.. I've stated it before as silverdrummer I believe)
2. - Shotty (His posts... especially him claiming it's a scum gambit when I've done the nearly same exact gambit in previous game with him and flipping VT) - Everybody whose saying, oh he was quiet when the zinger wagon picked up... especially for the people who bitched about me being outspoken and repetitive in the first place, and really just seems like a pretty crap excuse to pick up the steam on my wagon again) This includes Rod who simply parrots the original one which is Pinky, and Jester is in there somewhere I think but I forget where now and am too lazy to find it (though I might be slightly wrong as to if they were bitching... maybe that was chk... upon which case throw Pinky into 4th, rod stays where he's at)
3 -Izak(Seemed to be opportunistic Day 1) -MOI (his downplay of the swing)

-Pinky and the Brain
Your, I didn't shove the LYNCH ME LYNCH ME "case".
1. I did that with Pine and you saw how well that worked out with you going... well Silver just keeps saying the same SHIT over and over again.
2. It's not like the thing was missed, EVERYONE read it and I constantly said I'm sure he's a VI
Basically your bitching that I'm stating the obvious too many times early on in the day... then when I change it and actually listen.. you bitch some more about me not repeating and capsing and all that shit. Good Stuff

[silverbullet999]

EBWOP

For list

killer also basically parrots while pretending he came to the conclusion on his own. Also states he doesn't like beating a dead horse.. which is what I did with pine... eh...

[killerjester]

killer also basically parrots while pretending he came to the conclusion on his own. Also states he doesn't like beating a dead horse.. which is what I did with pine... eh...

This. THIS IS WHY I DON'T EXPLAIN MYSELF WHEN THE REASONS ARE OBVIOUS.

You either get "Why didn't you explain yourself?!" or "Yea well everyone's already said that." Unless you do it the killerjester way. Then you get both, and want to throw your face into a wall.

/rant, I'm going to sleep

[silverbullet999]

THIS IS WHY I DON'T EXPLAIN MYSELF WHEN THE REASONS ARE OBVIOUS.

Then your vote on me is completely hypocritical...

[silverbullet999]

EBWOP

Also answer my question directed to you... or throw your face into a wall repeatedly... either... or even both would be helpful for this town imo.

[silverbullet999]

EBWOP again (this is unimportant not really helpful to town and only directed to chkballin) sorry for the third one though... I'm done after this for awhile I swear.

Spoiler: ChkBallin Please Click

VOTE: Silver

He should have been lynched yesterday. Also, on a separate note given the amount of activity we've decided to keep things brief. If we are tired of reading crap, we are sure there are others who are tired of reading it too.

If you are scum, ignore this.. and note that I'm not going to get any read from your response if this generates one. Whether it's omgussy insulting, an OMG SILVER YOU ARE RIGHT I SOWWIZ, or a complete ignorance of it as this isn't going to help me get a read on you in any way or form... but this quote needs to be addressed now.

You are stating... that both of you pertaining to this hydra are lazy.... too lazy to read the posts that are made in this game. If you are town... this is %110 anti-town. While I could hold partial mercy if you were one slot... this is not the case. You are two people, you could have one read half... give a light summary.. and the other read the other half of posts or what not. There is absolutely no excuse for this kind of lazy behavior and if you are town i'm seriously asking you to either change your attitude and actually put fourth effort into this game or request replacement (Apologies to mod in advanced but laziness to this extent... especially admitting that it's simply laziness... not life getting to busy... not outside influences... just eh lazy... requires me to state this). If in end game you don't do either of the two actions I ask AND you flip town... just as a heads up (though I highly doubt you'd have any sort of problem with this) your going on my blacklist. Your active lurking... admittedly active lurking from sheer laziness which is a complete waste of a slot. If you don't feel like reading a lot you shouldn't join large games... especially if you can't handle such a game as a hydra nonetheless.

Anyway respond what you wish... as I stated i'm not going to respond to it no matter what you state. I'm also not going to shout TOWN TOWN if this kicks you into high gear or replacing nor will I state SCUM SCUM if you don't do anything about it. My best hope is you either put fourth effort and contribute to this game, or allow someone else to.