Newbie 1136: DarthYoshi's Dystopia of Death (Fin--who won?!)

[theamatuer]

BTW: is soulblade or now DH-star still suspicious as scum?

[hiplop]

I'm going to give the slot a fair chance, but its still my #1 thought for a buddy. Not nearly as sure about that as I am about ghostlin though.

[hiplop]

Amateur, why do YOU think Ghostlin is scum? explain in your own words

[DH-Star]

Um hey, I need some time to read through everything that's gone one before I share my thoughts.

[Stels]

@theamatuer: Well, it depends. I'm always up for a theamatuer lynch today over Ghostlin. You still didn't explain your random stats.
Giving you the position of hammering is kind of bad, even if you were to take "responsibility" for hammering. The people that wagon'd all take responsibility, and there is a chance that you might hammer a bit earlier than needed.

You probably skimmed my post and didn't read the second line. ;_;

um..

Yeah I did, my bad lmao. I stopped reading the top part at the ;_;

Good choice of time though

Don't worry about it. Just assumed that after people saw the enlarged ;_; they would look at the "Won't" and continue reading on out of curiosity.

[Stels]

Um hey, I need some time to read through everything that's gone one before I share my thoughts.

Take your time. You have almost 5 days at your leisure.

[theamatuer]

Well, it's pretty obvious that he's not a Vanilla townie.
he's acting like an IC, but in reality he's posted minimal content.
He essentially follows others when posting his ideas, and such tries to keep as low of a profile as possible.
when attacked, he counterattacks, but rarely substanciates.
So he's either scum, or PR. Based on probably, with figures from his own post.

there's a 2/9 chance of being scum, there's a 7/9 chance of being Town, with at least a 1/9 of being a town PR in a 2x4.

scum is highest, PR has the proability increased a little based on how he tries to hide, and Townie exists since we could be wrong, and it might just be how he plays.

[theamatuer]

EBWOP: the stats are used by me only for PR, since he is most likely scum.

[Ghostlin]

I doubt hes claiming VT, he'll claim cop or Doc. Pretty much sure that hes scum

Jailkeeper, actually, is the PM I got. Then again, I bluntly think you know I got a PR.

What you do next theory wise is up to you: I generally hammer Cop claims Day 1 mostly because scum hide behind them and Doctors I generally leave alive.

To answer the question about me asking questions, I was gathering information without being totally overt about it; trying to figure out who to protect/block and I was going to lean towards the scum part of the list mostly because shutting off other useful town abilities would be pointless. (Plus, if I somehow used the ability on the same person twice after getting a no kill and got a no kill both times, odds are good the person I was blocking would be scum).

About my reads:

TM has spent most of the day either trying to make sure he didn't get lynched (Post #28). He then said he thought he'd be suspect due to rage posting a lot (Post #42)--which still sticks out to me because he hasn't been rage posting at all. Then he made another concern about being lynched Day 1 again (Post #53); his votes earlier in the day don't follow a town suspicion pattern, mostly used to wagon, but they lose points because they're obviously pressure votes (Post #66, Post #69). If you want something that's really odd, he essentially contradicts himself in what he says in one post by not self voting (Post #93) and then self votes himself (Post #118). He also has waffled on my defense, claiming that I'm town, but all of a sudden reverses when I'm scum (about the same time my wagon became popular, he was tunnelling Soulblade continuously before this point). Post #281 is hilarious in retrospect---you could use the same things to describe himself, really. As for my 2/9 of being scum, at least 1/9 of being a PR, and 7/9 of being town....um, that's true of everyone, so I don't see how that's much of a case. (This was my actual point when I originally made that post: to SB, I believe.)

Honestly, I dislike hiplop less and less because of none of the actual proof of anything he's felt (he's claimed TM's "sincere" when bluntly some of his play contradicted itself a lot) and frankly? I've played a lot of games with a lot of VIs, new ones DO NOT TEND to vote themselves as obvtown. The fact that hiplop has blithely ignored this lends more credence to the fact that I feel he's buddying TM--I do not usually do this, but if I were to pick a scum team: it'd be hiplop-TM. By the way, kids, he's called his scum team early on and hasn't deviated from it at all--he's not really scumhunting, he's trying to string up whomever he can find to ride to lynch at the moment.

(Also, if you read parts of the ISO, TM and hiplop read like this:

TM: You hate SB? I hate SB! Let's string up SB!
hiplop: Let's kill Ghosty first due to scum ICness. I'm so sure he's scum. However, SB's his scum buddy so he should die too, not now, tho'.
TM: SB. SB. Let me give you my reads. OK, well, if I'm going to hang, let's go hang Ghostlin first.)

My alternate lynch would be AeR for waffling in the early game--had BK's replacement been worse, BK would of been in this slot.

Why am I giving you this information now? Because odds are about 50/50 you're going to lynch me and if I die, I want you to remember, read the points I've placed above and act on it.

Oh, and hiplop? I want your address after the game to collect on the whole 'Ghostlin is scum' bet. 'Cause you're wrong.

[Ghostlin]

EBWOP: A few things: SB I don't find to be scum because none of his play screams scum play and PoE: if even two of hiplop, TM, and AeR are scum, SB cannot be scum. He read a null to me.

AeR does also seem scummy for her pretty much aping the current wagon (mine), and hiplop's reads closely--it's even possible that only one of the three is scum, and is using and agreeing with the suspicions of the other two to setup mislynches--but I promise you scum is on my wagon. (Or that for example, if hiplop is scum but tm is not, hiplop is agreeing with tm's reads to create a possible mislynch later--or vice versa.)

I would ask one more thing as the IC--let the replacement (hey, replacement!) read through the thread and post before casting any hammers--there may be something I'm missing.

[theamatuer]

Damn that is a big post. Lets see now.
UNVOTE: Ghostlin to prevent self-hammering and accidental hammers.
I post my analysis of his post later.

[Morthas]

Me and CS can take care of you guys anyway; do not need a scum IC telling you what to do!!! I don't have much else to say, so im jokingly putting my point across

WUT? I am SE too D:

OK, analysis time:
Character Analysis (Scummy level from 1-10. 1 least 10 most)
Aeryung:pulls the noob card out, both directly and indirectly. Usually after being attacked. Possible mistake. 4
ConSpiracy:Tunneller of thematuer. 7
Ghostlin:2nd ta tunneller. posts little content in general for an IC. 8
hiplop:Apparently helpful. Mostly attacks Ghostlin and ConSpiracy. possible scumpartener with ta. 3
Johog: To early to be sure. 5 for Null
Morthas: can't tell. More suspicious than not though. 6
Soulblade: Didn't post since mistake. Very possible scum. 9
stels: Mostly counterarguments against ta. null. 5
thamatuer: Self-voting. Very Defensive in the beginning. jumps on bandwagon's in the middle. Self-vote. Becomes offensive towards SB. Probable scum. 7
This is being as objective as possible.

Why would you ever read your own posts? Don't ever give reason for someone to believe you are scum. It's bad from both alignments.

Siiigh, the game goes on in circles.... Yaaawn.

[Morthas]

so i caught up. Ghost, how likely is Hiplop scum if you are town?

[Morthas]

Oh and hey Johhog ;D SWEDISH TIME

[Stels]

Still waiting for CS to come back... And to get a bit closer to the deadline.
@Ghostlin: I see the connection you made with hiplop and theamatuer.

[Johhog]

Wow. I don't believe that JK claim at all. Seems like scum who desperately want to survive.

[Johhog]

And hello Morthas, I'm a SE too so we're 4 guys here to take care of you.

[AeRyung]

@Ghostlin, why is that the only ones you suspect are the ones voting for you? Seems kinda weird.

@Morthas, who do you think is scum?

[AeRyung]

@Johhog, if you can, can you go into detail why you don't believe his claim?

[theamatuer]

What you do next theory wise is up to you: I generally hammer Cop claims Day 1 mostly because scum hide behind them and Doctors I generally leave alive.

So is that why you claimed Jailkeeper. We can prove if a cop’s real or not simply by forcing him to investigate someone while the rest nolynch/lynch 2nd most suspicious. If person pulls scum and lynchs VT, we lynch him, if yes, then he’s real. Of course, we could just see if scum NKs him, but if they lynch someone else on purpose, and we lynch a real cop, that puts us at an disadvantage. However, doctors and jailkeepers can’t be proven since we can't force him to save the exact person others lynch, since its a 1/7 chance. We could wait and see if NKd, but thats the same effect as cop. Why wouldn't a scum claim Doctor, when it is obviously a role that can't be proven?
secondary ability of Jailkeeper sucks too, unless you tell us who is 100% mafia. As long as you don't say that I am the scum, like you were doing for most of the day, you tunneler.

He then said he thought he'd be suspect due to rage posting a lot (Post #42)--which still sticks out to me because he hasn't been rage posting at all.

I've been trying very hard not to do so, thank you very much. I vent my rage by laughing and insulting at everyone in my other game that I got lynched in silently.

If you want something that's really odd, he essentially contradicts himself in what he says in one post by not self voting (Post #93) and then self votes himself (Post #118).

Post 90. Then referencing and reasoning at post 195. You should have found them when you were doing a post-by-post analysis of me. 93 was an explation of why self-voting might be a modkillable offense.

Then he made another concern about being lynched Day 1 again (Post #53)

Paranoia, K? I came here to learn and get first hand experience on mafia. Hard to do that when you're dead and can't post anymore.

his votes earlier in the day don't follow a town suspicion pattern, mostly used to wagon, but they lose points because they're obviously pressure votes (Post #66, Post #69).

Yess, I'm pretty sure I said so specifically. post 70

He also has waffled on my defense, claiming that I'm town, but all of a sudden reverses when I'm scum (about the same time my wagon became popular, he was tunnelling Soulblade continuously before this point

Yeah, you being an extremist is not scummy, but other people noted you post fluff. Fluff posting is scummy. STOP WASTING POSTS!!!

Post #281 is hilarious in retrospect---you could use the same things to describe himself, really. As for my 2/9 of being scum, at least 1/9 of being a PR, and 7/9 of being town....um, that's true of everyone, so I don't see how that's much of a case.

I tweaked the chances based on your posts. Or maybe I just ratted the percentages out to what I felt like. I do that.

(Also, if you read parts of the ISO, TM and hiplop read like this:

TM: You hate SB? I hate SB! Let's string up SB!
hiplop: Let's kill Ghosty first due to scum ICness. I'm so sure he's scum. However, SB's his scum buddy so he should die too, not now, tho'.
TM: SB. SB. Let me give you my reads. OK, well, if I'm going to hang, let's go hang Ghostlin first.)

That was so funny, that I'll do this

Spoiler: counterread (no offense to cs)

CS: *votes theamatuer*
Ghostlin: *votes theamatuer for completely different reason*
Ghostlin: hey lets be tunneling partners.
CS: Okay!
CS:
Ghostlin:

Also, it just occured to me that we might just be stealing his job.
My response: Tough luck pal. It's a hard world out there.

[Morthas]

The one i am voting if not, hiplop seems very likely. I am slowly becoming clueless on the partner though. hm, i used to have suspicion on Stels, might have to read him up.
I still think Ghost is scum sooo after replacement vote we should lynch.
There is 0% how chance to confirm he is indeed a JK so yeah. That's that.

[Johhog]

@Johhog, if you can, can you go into detail why you don't believe his claim?

Because it was so obvious he would claim a PR when cornered. Sure, he can be a PR, but it's a low risk that's the case. Remember, scum always claim a PR if they are forced to claim.

[Stels]

Wow. I don't believe that JK claim at all. Seems like scum who desperately want to survive.

We could always resort to outing our 'actual' PR. We get 1 scum and lose 1 town; we clear Ghostlin; or hope luck is on our side. Either way, we have one claimed PR of possible 2.
I don't want to resort to the 'other' PR claiming, unless our situation is really hopeless, if we even have one. So, I am hesitant to disbelieve his claim at the moment.

[Johhog]

I don't see why we would have to out our real PRs, to me the claim seems like a obvfake. As I said, scum always claim a PR (they have to, VT claims get lynched) and we can't let them live because of that.

[Johhog]

Aw sorry for the fence sitting but imo I have a good reason for it. In my book either Ghostlin or Theam must be scum, and both almost can't be, that would be ridiculous.