Newbie 1151 ÔÇô Game Over

[Epsilon_Andrew]

Lord, what was it I said that seems like I was buddying up to you? I just wish to know where the origin of this started.

[Epsilon_Andrew]

Stels, I thought of that, but my phone always gave me the message saying my reply was submitted successfully.

[racerman13]

Xeras, I would like for you to explain your scum and town reads. In detail.

[Krazy]

Oh hai thar!
Replacing Off the Mark

and since I haven't placed an RVS vote either this is where my vote will stay for the moment.

Ok, townpoints for this. Not scum mentality. We'll see how you'll perform later.

Buddying to Krazy. =/ Ranmaru ninja'd me by miles.

I'm not really sure this is buddying. He gives a read based on one post, but then goes out of his way to say "We'll see how you'll perform later" if anything you should be accusing him of lampshading a later change of opinion to accuse me. As it is though, an accusation of buddying, over something that I don't really think is buddying, strikes me as something scum would do. Ranmaru also questioned Lord on this but indicated Lord's vote on Xeras as the cause of Ranmaru's vote, something I am still reflecting on, but am leaning that the vote on Xeras was not a scum-tell.

Lord himself I have very mixed feelings on. Prior to this nonsense with Meransiel being his alt I wasn't really thinking he was that scummy, and although I'm kind of annoyed that Meransiel is taking one of the few newbie slots in a game already full of SEs, Lord's #90 struck me as a townish post.

I've been feeling pretty strongly that most the arguments are town are town and that both of our scum are likely in the players that hadn't posted much yet, and right now, Stels I have a gut read on you as scum.

Vote Stels

[Uite]

Isa

replaces

JonWJ007

. Welcome to the game!

[Stels]

@Krazy: meh, whatever makes you happy =/
Ho~ mixed feelings on Lord? Why not sort that out?
Gut read based on what? On a replacement's first post? Good gut.
I think you're just going for the easy target right now. Very IC-like.

I've been feeling pretty strongly that most the arguments are town are town and that both of our scum are likely in the players that hadn't posted much yet, and right now, Stels I have a gut read on you as scum.

Do you policy-lynch lurkers/flakers?

[Krazy]

I think you're just going for the easy target right now. Very IC-like.

I don't really understand why you see yourself as an "easy target" and in any case this is pretty clearly downplaying my vote on you; if my vote on you is based off of a senseless gut read, then why do you feel the need to downplay my position, if it is already a weak stance to hold? This does not strike me as a very town-oriented reaction to my vote.

I've been feeling pretty strongly that most the arguments are town are town and that both of our scum are likely in the players that hadn't posted much yet, and right now, Stels I have a gut read on you as scum.

Do you policy-lynch lurkers/flakers?

No, but when most of the players posting strike me as more townish than scummy, then it only leads to the conclusion that among the less talkative players there are some mafia players. In any case, you are neither a lurker nor a flaker. Both of your posts have included what I consider to be scummy elements and accusations, first against Lord and now against me.

Bringing up a "policy-lynch" seems to have no point other than to downplay my position and distract from the things you actually are saying. I am not advocating a policy lynch, you just were the first person to say something in this game that genuinely struck me as scummy, and your reaction has strengthened my read on you as non-town.

[Ranmaru]

Lord

:

• Again, I don’t really know if you were really caring about his vote because you didn’t press on his vote, just his suspicion.
  
• Yep you will see plenty. : D
  
• Yes you say you don’t believe it, but you don’t state why.
  
• No. I don’t see how me saying that was taking the easy path. I just thought you suspected that me voting a new guy over a player I am familiar with is odd, which I disagree with.
  
• I still don’t see how it was a town tell :/
  
• Not at all.
  
• I find his statements to you as null, they don’t seem to be about your stances or anything. Why does it seem scummy to you?
  
• Also, yes I was serious about the lurker thing.

---

Stels

:
Sup stels!

---

Isa

:
Where you at?

---

Oh hai thar!
Replacing Off the Mark

and since I haven't placed an RVS vote either this is where my vote will stay for the moment.

Ok, townpoints for this. Not scum mentality. We'll see how you'll perform later.

Buddying to Krazy. =/ Ranmaru ninja'd me by miles.

I'm not really sure this is buddying. He gives a read based on one post, but then goes out of his way to say "We'll see how you'll perform later"

if anything you should be accusing him of lampshading a later change of opinion to accuse me

. As it is though, an accusation of buddying, over something that I don't really think is buddying, strikes me as something scum would do. Ranmaru also questioned Lord on this but indicated Lord's vote on Xeras as the cause of Ranmaru's vote, something I am still reflecting on,

but am leaning that the vote on Xeras was not a scum-tell.

Lord himself I have very mixed feelings on. Prior to this nonsense with Meransiel being his alt I wasn't really thinking he was that scummy, and although I'm kind of annoyed that Meransiel is taking one of the few newbie slots in a game already full of SEs,

Lord's #90 struck me as a townish post

.

I've been feeling pretty strongly that most the arguments are town are town and that both of our scum are likely in the players that hadn't posted much yet, and right now, Stels I have a gut read on you as scum.

Vote Stels

First Underline, Why is that? There was nothing wrong with him VOTING, I didn't like him not really focusing on his reasoning AFTERWARDS. Also expand on the second underlined statement. Please tell me why you don't think his town points to you wasn't buddying. Seeing as his reasoning for your town points were not fully... validated in my pov, I do see he said "I'll see how you do later" as more than buddying, and like keeping an eye on you, but I don't see why you don't see it as possibly buddying as well.

The bold, I don't understand. Expand on that please. I mean I don't get the term 'lampshading'.

Why do you think scum would accuse Lord of buddying in your pov?

Also, I want to comment on the Stels v You, but I am still waiting on Stels to reply to you.

[Isa]

Hey folks, I'm Isa. I've read the thread once but I'll do it again, my initial suspicions are on Xeras though.

Ranmaru: HAPPY FEET. WOMBO COMBO! (There can't be too many Ranmaru's around, right?)

[Ranmaru]

LOL. DID YOU JUST SAY WOMBO COMBO xDDDDDD

You from Smash Boards eh? ;o

Welcome Isa!

[Isa]

Yes I am, I dunno if you're still a Doc main...I used to see you post a lot in the Doc boards some months ago (yes I am a Doc main).

Anyway, reading up...

[Ranmaru]

Yeah I'm still a doc main. (He will always be my main, I like Falco and Jiggs as secondaries) I just kinda retired from playing since I was spending so much money without a legit job. I'm kinda rusty. I still host melee tournies tho. : D I still play sometimes too.

Kk, glad to see you here then!

Also give me your thoughts on Lord, Epsilon, and Racerman when you are done, plz.

[Isa]

Page 1:

@

Xeras

: What's wrong with voting really fast?

@

Lord

: It's daytime here.

Aimless voting is aimless. :p

Racercar, If this game started on a night phase, who would you have killed if you were mafia?

Pointless question is pointless. =p Also seems like an attempt to drift away from the RVS. Further embolished in #16 (cat/peacock)

I asked Racerman because he seemed the scummiest out of the people that have posted thus far.

Now THIS is something I feel is scummy. Blaming it on "gut" seems kinda eh. No idea why he didn't just make it a question for everyone. Also,

1. If you feel he is scum, you should be voting him.
2. If something struck you as scummy, you should point it out.
3. You should confront him, and make sure he explains his actions to you.

is a great reply that further points out the scumminess of his actions.


Page 2:

I have thought of voting you as an RVS, but I thought it would be better to use it on someone new to get a read on them.

Huh? Voting an SE or IC doesn't get you reads...?

Nice IC post by Krazy. Not quoting it, just noting it.
Also, let it be known that you shall ALWAYS state when a player is put at L-1 or L-2. If you put someone at L-1 and you're not stating it, I'll take that as scummy.

Regarding the "start on night phase-killing",

Absolutely none. Other than it may have been a good choice for him, seeing as I'd likely be looking for newbscum.

And yet you asked it? Figure out why you'd be asking a question before you actually do it.


Page 3:

and since I haven't placed an RVS vote either this is where my vote will stay for the moment.

Ok, townpoints for this. Not scum mentality. We'll see how you'll perform later.

I have no idea why you'd give this town points. I'm not getting any read out of that comment.

Nah, but it was L-2, and I am quite sure that there is at least one mafia member that has no posted yet, because no one seems to be particularly scummy at this point. If I had to pick someone that has posted at this point to be a possible member of the mafia, I think my best guess at this time would be Krazy.

And so...we wait. Then BAM, and...nothing happened. We still don't know why you found Krazy to be scummy. What's worse, when questioned, you tried to direct attention off yourself and onto Lord, who questioned you. It failed, and that somehow made him scummy.

The Ranmaru/Lord debate reads town-on-town to me.

Page 4:

Xeras, HOW did you have a gut feeling that I was scum when I'd made ONE POST that was an RVS VOTE? That launches my suspicion of you up a bunch of notches. I think you were trying to find an easy mafia target.

Vote: Xeras

L-1, until Krazy unvoted. It's kind of crazy, you accuse me of trying to find an 'easy' target, while you join an existing bandwagon. A bandwagon that only exists because I am being proactive and fishing for reactions.

You are confirming my initial feelings about you. The reason I initially suspected you was because of your 'rvs'. You were the second person to post, and you picked the person that voted for me. Could it be that you were hoping to gain my trust by defending me? Or perhaps you expected me to vote for Ranmaru, considering that he voted for me.

VOTE: Racerman

@Lord. I was only saying that I found Krazy to be suspicious so that why I could have more activity. There has been nothing yet, and I got the reaction I thought I would have got from other people.

This is just a horrible post that stinks of scumminess. First, that was L-2, not L-1.
Second, there's a fine line between being "proactive" and "scummy", and fishing for reactions the way you did it was more scummy than proactive.
Third, trying to make a case on someone due to RVS voting isn't something to go on at all. It's the RANDOM voting stage.

Stels post doesn't really tell me much. Poor catch-up post IMO, not noting anything on Xeras or Ranmaru (or anything of value with Lord, save the possible buddying).

Page 5:
I second pretty much everything Krazy said in his #103 - I get a gut read on Stels as scum as well. Stels reply in #105 is nothing I like to see either (AtE, the "IC-like"-comment).

[Ranmaru]

Well yes voting an SE or IC gets me reads either way. I said that because I have played with Krazy before, so I would rather get a

REACTION

from someone

new

rather than someone I most likely could read after seeing their play in a previous game. It's a preference. Although Krazy's view seems legit too, I just take a different direction with that.

[Isa]

Here you are...

TOWN:
Isa
Ranmaru (I get a very solid feeling of town here, his arguments makes mostly sense and I see nothing really questionable)
Racerman (for having a constant battle with Xeras, also strikes me as genuine)
Lord (same as Ranmaru, really, gut has him as a slightly lower read for some reason - still a clear townread to me)

NULL:
Krazy (Nothing worth mentioning, really...leaning town)
Epsilon (suggesting a No Lynch in #55, nothing else strikes me as suspicious)
Jeffiej (hasn't posted)

SCUM:
Stels
Xeras
These have been explained in my previous post.

VOTE: Xeras THIS IS L-1. NOBODY HAMMER.

[Krazy]

Ranmaru I'll do a more full response to you sometime tomorrow, but for now I wanted to put together a little exercise that I think might be fun that anyone is welcome to respond to.

This is called "Spot the buddying" and they're four sample posts or extracts of posts from completed games (as in they're over and everyone has flipped) either here or off-site. Basically, for each post, say whether you think the player making the post is scum or town. I promise that of the four samples, at least one is scum, and at least one is town. I was also town in all four of these games, and in each case there was little mod-confirmed knowledge, so my read of the player making the post had to be made based on the nature of their posts.

Game 1:

k--r there's no way you actually think there was a chance of m--y getting lynched. what krazy said about your vote is accurate, it's basically a vote for g--o without actually doing it.

Game 2:

Krazy, come here pal! Join the X--X wagon!

Game 3:

yeah krazy is town, althought I think p--v is scummier than w--r.

krazy, would you support a p--v wagon?

Game 4:

What Krazy said.

. . . [post abridged] . . .

If you're so sure XX is mafia with or without S--w, why were you so insistant that we lynch S--w? Why not just push for XX? Because S--w was under pressure from other players and because it was easier to get him lynched. You didn't really care if S--w or XX got lynched because you're mafia.

previewedit: oh hai thar Isa

[Ranmaru]

Hmmm, interesting! I have some answers, but do you think I should wait for others to post first? [Non-Se's I mean] ;p I think it would be fun if we popcorn too. Might learn a thing or two.

[racerman13]

Popcorn this early would be incredibly stupid. Don't mean to sound harsh, but it would give the mafia A LOT of useful information.

[Ranmaru]

I meant popcorn the answers to Krazy's excersize. Only info I think would be leaked is how buddying looks like and how it would be used from town/scum.

[Krazy]

Well spoiler-texts or hidden text is unallowed so there's no way to hide your guesses, but I'd say just go ahead and answer anyway. I won't post the answers for several hours regardless. (since I'm about to go to sleep lol)

[Ranmaru]

1. Null.
2. TOWN. (strong read here)
3. Town.
4. Scum.

Working on reasons later. : p

[Ranmaru]

*I left out the reasoning because I want everyone else to come up with their own reasoning. I'll re-post with my reasoning after everyone chimes in.

[Isa]

I don't think buddying is a tell of any sort.

Null
Null
Null
Null

If I must give a read I'd say
Town
Scum
Town
Scum

[racerman13]

Ranmaru, I thought you meant a popcorn massclaim. Sorry.

1. Null-scum
2. Null (could be either way if you consider it.)
3. Town
4. Scum

[Ranmaru]

It's ok. Sorry for being unclear.


New lesson for everyone: Don't assume Popcorn = Massclaim. Usually when people claim, they name a person, or popcorn, to be the next to claim. Essentially I think you can do this with any kind of 'mass _____ [INFO]' thingy. : D