Newbie 1151 ÔÇô Game Over

[Meransiel]

How much money are you willing to put where your mouth is? $20? $100? More? I'll gladly take whatever amount you're willing to offer.

How much do you have?

So if I follow your current line of reasoning correctly, the reason that Xeras is "confirmed town" is because you are so certain that me and Johhog are scum?

Yep. I'm less certain of you than I am of Johhog (that doesn't mean you're not my second highest scum read), so I won't call everyone confirmed, but the way Johhog is using Xeras as a mere tool for advancement is not exactly what I would call bussing.

Can you expand also on why you believe Isa to be town (outside of your absolute certainty that you have discovered the scumteam)?

Beyond that I do not believe her catch ups to be poor, as he did get to logical conclusions, even though they weren't original, what struck me as relevant lately was that he outright stated he disagreed with Johhog's read of me, WITHOUT expressing suspicion of Johhog. This is something scum wouldn't do.

[Lord]

*facepalm*

Ok...don't worry people, I will fix this!

@Mod: Can you please copy paste the content in the above post into this one, and delete the above post? Thanks in advance again.

[Krazy]

Yep. I'm less certain of you than I am of Johhog (that doesn't mean you're not my second highest scum read), so I won't call everyone confirmed, but the way Johhog is using Xeras as a mere tool for advancement is not exactly what I would call bussing.

So it's not so much that Xeras is confirmed town, but that you favor me significantly more than him because me + Johhog makes such an excellent scumteam?

But some players, fypov, have demonstrated townsidedness outside of their association to Johhog: ie, Isa, Racerman?

Can you indicate which players you simply see as "less likely partners with Johhog" as opposed to players you actually see as town outside of your suspicions of other players? For example, I can't tell whether you're now taking Stels to be confirmed town in the same vein as Isa and Racerman, or if they are simply a less likely candidate.

[Johhog]

Wait, what just happened? Meransiel, please explain this. You are an experienced player and shouldn't be so sure on a wrong read D1. Is this some kind of gambit?

[Lord]

No, if Johhog is scum, which I find extremely likely, Xeras IS comfirmed town. Just because his OWN posts don't contribute to said status is a completely unrelated thing.

I didn't say Raecerman has demonstrated townieness outside of his interaction/association with Johhog. I said his other posts are what would be expected of him (like defending from Xeras' fail arguments), and therefore perfectly null.

Less likely partners with Johhog and town, from my PoV, is the same thing, but have at you. If you are asking what players I would find as town had Johhog never posted, I would stick to the list of reads I gave in my second last wall. Stels is town due to her interactions with you, also her stubborness, which (though I admit is partly gut) I can call town-flavoured by relating to similar examples in games I've played (GreyIce, for instance, different styles of speech, same underlying line of play).

Wait, what just happened? Meransiel, please explain this. You are an experienced player and shouldn't be so sure on a wrong read D1. Is this some kind of gambit?

This is so wrong on so many levels that I don't even feel the need to answer.

[Krazy]

So let me get this straight.

You decide that Johhog is scum.

You are now basing your reads of every single other player in the game based on their association with this person.
Johhog himself is scum, according to you....... Because....... He voted you.

So what your big wallpost and revelations boil down to is a tunnel following an omgus.

I am dissapoint.

Vote Lord

Yeah, I think that's L-1.

[Meransiel]

Whatever. Just don't listen to Johhog and don't lynch Xeras tomorrow.

I'm out.

[Lord]

Cause I can't defend against strawmans. They're simply wrong.

[Isa]

I suppose that all that Lord said might hold some merit if the actual case on Johhog was better. As of now, I don't see the case at all.

Lord, please focus on the Johhog case alone, without mixing in Krazy/Xeras/whoever.

@Krazy
I'll openly admit to sheeping cases in my first wall, which seems to be my main offense (I'll defend my reads though). It was a catch-up post at a point in time where we had left the RVS but still didn't have a lot to go on. I didn't have a whole lot to add. Furthermore, I was lazy.
I targeted Xeras with the L-2/L-1 statement because of #36. Not mentioning that someone is at L-1 is a scumtell in my book, same for L-2 although much weaker and not something I'll comment frequently on.
Did you read Xeras case on Racerman's RVS vote? Racerman agrees with me and I with him on this one, #78 is just horrible.
Stels was put on my scumlist as scum and not null-scum because hey, we have two scum. You had made 11 posts at the point of me writing my list of reads. You were hinting at the towny side of the spectrum at the point of writing (you still are), but so marginally due to your general lack of content that I couldn't place you as a townie just for talking with Stels.
Finally, I still believe buddying in general to be a null tell.

[Lord]

There's no need for a case. The chaining up of lynches is so painfully obvious that if I was a dayvig I would snipe 'em. I would also argue that he bases his reads solely on gut, which he openly admits, but that would be a side point and detracting from the true reason why he is NOT scummy, but actual scum.

And please don't ask me to tunnel, that's kinda awkward. Plus, there's this little thing called relational tells and interaction. About them? They work.

[Johhog]

There's no need for a case. The chaining up of lynches is so painfully obvious that if I was a dayvig I would snipe 'em. I would also argue that he bases his reads solely on gut, which he openly admits, but that would be a side point and detracting from the true reason why he is NOT scummy, but actual scum.

And please don't ask me to tunnel, that's kinda awkward. Plus, there's this little thing called relational tells and interaction. About them? They work.

You're already tunneling, thank you. How is there "no need" for a case? You aren't even giving me anything to defend myself over, and you know that.

And how is it scummy to base my reads solely on gut? I always do that, I do it as town and I pretend to do it as scum.

Please point out the "chaining of lynches" too. Yeah, if you flip town I admit I'm suspicious of Xeras, but how is that to chain lynches?

[Johhog]

And Meransiel/Lord, how on earth can you post from the wrong account so often? I have a weak suspicions, weak however I admit, that you're doing this so we will have a harder time ISOing you. Not common, but it wouldn't be the first time.

[Lord]

Yeah, if you flip town I admit I'm suspicious of Xeras, but how is that to chain lynches?

*facepalm*

[Uite]

Meransiel/Lord, please use only the Lord account when playing here. Technically, you're not even supposed to be in the game, because you're a non-newbie using an alt to play in a newbie slot, which is against the rules. I haven't made an issue out of it before because we know who you are and there was a shortage of newbie sign-ups to begin with, but it's starting to get disruptive, and if I see you posting under Meransiel again, I'll replace you out. Please be careful.

[Lord]

1. I'm not allowed to play as an IC because I don't remember what my last 5 games were exactly.
2. It obviously happens by mistake.

[Johhog]

Lord, are you even trying to play the game? You give no explanations at all and it's overall frustrating trying to argue with you.

[Meransiel]

You have no right to say that. Your explanation for everything is gut, while I gave 4+ reasons why you're scum.

[Lord]

DAMN IT!

[racerman13]

...Wow.

How is it so hard to, before you post, scroll up and see what account you're logged on to? I really want to vote you, but I have a strong gut feeling that you're town. And the last time I hammered someone for being the scummiest player, he was the jailkeeper. Gives you a small sense of paranoia.

[Epsilon_Andrew]

Another thing is, if he has to change log ins, wouldn't he have to have 2 different e-mails?

[racerman13]

...Though I don't have an alt on most sites (including this one) I have created different emails. It's not hard, takes like 3 minutes on gmail.

[Epsilon_Andrew]

Thing is, shouldn't he know which email is to which account?

[Isa]

Different browsers, different cookies.

also, inb4forcereplace

[racerman13]

lolwut?

[Johhog]

You have no right to say that. Your explanation for everything is gut, while I gave 4+ reasons why you're scum.

If you're trying to say that my only reasoning is gut, you can't read. I only take my gut into account when creating my reads, but I give reasons too to create others. Also, the only reason for me being scum is "chain lynching" and you haven't explained that further.

...Wow.

How is it so hard to, before you post, scroll up and see what account you're logged on to? I really want to vote you, but I have a strong gut feeling that you're town. And the last time I hammered someone for being the scummiest player, he was the jailkeeper. Gives you a small sense of paranoia.

I see a contradiction here. You have a gut feeling that Lord is town, but you're also talking about "last time I hammered the scummiest player" like you had a scumread on him.

Another thing is, if he has to change log ins, wouldn't he have to have 2 different e-mails?

Not if it's registered as an alt. On this site you're allowed to have alt accounts, but they're NOT allowed to take a newbie spot, like Meransiel did here.

inb4forcereplace

+1