In this post I'm going to take a very detailed look at all of haru's reads on everyone else, and all his interaction or lack of, with everyone else.
I have the impression that it was haru's intention to come off as towny and as helpful as possible. I suspect that he might have intentionally distanced himself from his buddy, and might have left breadcrumbs in case his buddy was lynched/vigged, ones that he could point to or even let someone else point to, that would indicate he thought they were scum all along, thus painting himself as a clever townie.
Of course, there is also the possibility that he would have done his best to keep his buddy in the clear (give him a town read), or remain fairly meh about him (null read). I think a lot depends on who the buddy is, and whether haru has any experience of playing with them. For example, I've played a newbie game with racer where he was scum with none other than our mod. Now, wicked played very much like haru has played in this game, and he choose to proclaim his scum buddy (racer) as being town pretty early on in the game. A lot of other players had scum reads on racer (who btw, played very much the same as he has played here so far), and when wicked fell under suspicion, myself and the two confirmed town had a hard time believing that wicked would buddy up to his scum partner as hard had he had been doing the entire game. In that game, scum buddied scum. I'm not sure if haru might have done the same in this game. Frankly, I think haru tried to play as town as possible, which included calling everyone who acted scummy scum. This leads me to believe that he has at some point given his buddy a scum, possibly null read, because let's face it, everyone left in this game (other than me) has come off either scummy or super scummy at some point.
haru's first set of reads:
reck
-after some ISOing in the beginning you didn't think maru was mime. in fact you called those calling for it jerks. you changed your mind for it later, but perhaps this was just a way to go with the crowd? to look like one of "the guys"? i agree with whoever said you were either scum or mime, but i think im leaning towards scum since my only real thought process for mime in this case is WIFOM <curse you mime and how you invite endless WIFOM!>
This read is interesting. I can't see reck pointing out a slight tell on his own scum buddy, especially when the tell was so meh in the first place. I mean, I spotted it, but tbh, I didn't give it that much thought, because heck, haru was right. I was the so called vig until the following day.
scooby
- another who doesnt say all that much, but thinking about it, the game is young <though still seems overly slow>. and in fact his FIRST post was numbered in the 70's. sitting back and letting things happen until theres a clear group/town mentality to follow perhaps? maybe. maybe not. we'll see. nothing really suspicious as of now except that even though there was some amount of real things to discuss, he still apparently felt the need to RVS...unless the empking vote WASNT RVS...in which case, explain yo self foo.
This read was pretty spot on - scooby was slightly suspect, and of course at this point haru couldn't rule out the possibility that he was mime because the mimes hadn't been killed yet.
racer
- posts a bunch of nonsense then lists his top 2 suspicious players...and votes without saying what about them he finds suspicious. worse yet, in a game like this people could be TRYING to act suspicious so they CAN get lynched because they are mimes. now, im not saying dont vote...but to vote without even discussing why? that in of itself seems suspicious. i think im putting this guy on my mime list.
I can understand this read completely. racer comes off scummy, but would haru paint his buddy as a possible mime as early as day one, then suggest later that there be a no lynch, and that the vig should tarted the mime suspects? I don't know. Seems silly for scum to put his buddy up for a possible vigging.
kondi
- a chunk of posts are fluff which is neither good or bad this early on so i wont hold it against you, but it makes a read kind of difficult. at first I almost wanted to say you were trying to protect your scumbuddy maru...then it dawned in me that i don't think maru is scum and suggesting he be vigged is hardly protecting him. overall i think you are town for now.
haru got this read completely right.
kanye
- perhaps a bit overly confident, but like i said, i dig the confidence. but the fact that its overly so, especially this early, is a bit off putting. i honestly cant think of anything against you that isn't WIFOM so im thinking town or mime. in fact i think im leaning mime a little because you are pushing for a vote against someone many others believe to be a possible mime.
I've said it already, but this read played a big part in my decision to target kanye on night 1. Again, Haru was completely right.
hoppster
- agree with his original vig choices 100%, though i would probably add kanye to it as of now. he explains himself well enough. perhaps a bit aggressive in that last post, but aggression in of itself isnt really a bad thing. like my point about confidence, its one of the ways things get done in this game. so i like it.
im thinking town for now. though aggression can potentially lead to bad places, so we'll see.
This read was accurate, but for some reason the part in bold bugs me. I cannot help but wonder if haru might have been giving his scum buddy a subtle suggestion to cease being so aggressive, and calling him town, but also leaving open the possibility that he might be scum, just in case he is killed at some point.
Maru
- on one hand, its a super early game post so i almost want to ignore it based on that alone...but on the other hand it DOES sound like he's trying TOO hard to make us think he's not mime. but at the same time, what he did was almost TOO suspicious <though at the same time for some reason my brain wants to ignore it completely for being so...i dunno> it seems like everything he's done on some level has invites the use of an all caps "TOO". so extreme it either must be true or must be the opposite of what he says. my feelings are that he's definitely town or mime. scum wouldn't so blatantly try to look like a mime since then they just get hit by Vig and die anyway. so I almost kinda wanna say mime like the rest of you...but at the same time I believe what he says is sincere because think of it like this...mimes want to be lynched, correct? well while he MIGHT have said something that may or may not be "mime" worthy, he certainly hasn't said anything, to my mind, that screams scum...if he doesn't appear scum, he doesn't get lynched. no lynch, no win for mime. I say that for now we leave him be. now if he starts giving off scum tells...then he should get hit by vig. unless i missed something. if so then please correct me.
I've left this read for last. haru has a lot to say about Maru in his read, continually pressing the idea that he is town, and that scum would not draw so much attention to themselves (which is my reasoning behind my own maru-town read). However, haru brings up Maru in his reads on two other people (maru is the only player he mentions like this in other peoples reads), and again, he presses the idea that maru is town.
"quick to jump on maru who may either have just been speaking innocently or may have been purposefully inviting votes...either way i feel maru as town or mime. so voting for him isnt pro." "at first I almost wanted to say you were trying to protect your scumbuddy maru...then it dawned in me that i don't think maru is scum and suggesting he be vigged is hardly protecting him."
Is this all a bunch of WIFOM as kanye pointed out day 1? Maybe, but I don't think so. I think haru is too smart for that.
A few thoughts: if maru was his buddy, would haru push the idea of him being town SO hard when there was a huge chance that maru was going to get vigged night 1 and flip scum? I don't think so. It would look too suspect should he flip scum. Did haru give maru exactly the read that he should have knowing that maru was not scum, but could be mime? Yes, he did. Just like he did scooby.
Over all reads at this point?
hoppster: town
kanye: leaning mime
kondi: town
maru: town for now until he becomes scummy. if he becomes scummy, he's a mime.
milkshake: town...a french speaking town so not as trsutworthy <^_~> but town.
racer: i would bet my left nut he's mime...or bad mafia
scooby: so inactive it hurts. with the lack of explanation he seems to be a <i dont mean this as a personal attack, so dont take it as such> but i think he's posting a bit like a tool. so im thinking another one thats either mime or scum. but not gonna lie, im mostly null on him. posts too little to be really strong in any direction.
whisper: lives up to her name cuz i cant hear her. hmm...she's not talking. you know who else doesnt talk? MIMES! kidding aside, i got nothing.
reck: scum or mime
haru's second set of reads:
Hoppster
:...was that attack on kondi in post 91 for real? because if so, i gotta say, that seems to be going kinda far. I assume a joke for now. or maybe I just fail at life and dont see where you are coming from because at the time at least <haven't compared day 2 stuff yet> he seems kinda null to me. I mean it all seems jokey...but then again looking at who is almost ready for lynch now makes me think i clearly missed something haha. at the very least it seems like you are riding him pretty hard for what little you apparently have on him. seems kinda shady. you have a point that he IS flailing a bit, but i dont think anyone really wants to die <save for some roles like mime...but he's not a mime> so, im iffy on it. I definitely dont like it though. however your list of who to target and how to target them <lynch or vig> seems decent enough...null ever so slightly leaning scum. maybe I'll get a better read on you after you post some more things that dont involve kondi =/
From the outside, this might seem like a perfectly reasonable post coming from a pretty towny person, but considering his last read on hoppster, and my suspicion that he was trying to tell him something, this post takes on an entirely new meaning. If hoppster-scum is real, then this entire post was not only haru starting to distance himself from hoppster by calling him shady, but also haru telling hoppster that he should back off of kondi and target other people.
Kondi
- before I was just ok with it because a PR said to do it and everybody else seemed to be on board for it...but after reading im not so sure. on one hand most of the posts are mostly fluff. actually thinking about it its almost entirely fluff. perhaps i missed it but can anyone point out any scum hunting kondi has done? not sure I see it. i dont even see any real reads posted. a vote for reck is the closest it comes that I can see. trying to stay under the radar perhaps? hmm. I suppose taking that thought into account, there is definite potential scumminess here. hasn't even attempted to be an asset to the town. just posts fluff and just goes along with whatever is happening. I can see this working out I guess. is that basically why everyone else is after him? because if it isnt then im afraid I have nothing besides that. if thats not it then please kindly point out what exactly im missing. I'm trying to get better at this and my detective work is still most definitely lacking <though im a bit proud to say that i called kanye being mime. when i saw that i had a little on my face haha>
Here is haru giving his previously town read a scum read. Fair dues, kondi had been posting fluff, but he had been doing that before. Why the sudden change? Probably because hoppster had targeted Kondi, and he was attempting to give his buddy some support in an attempt to make his tunnelling appear not so scummy. If haru found kondi scummy, why wasn't he on his wagon?
DonJosh - [5] - Hoppster, xRECKONERx, Maruchan, whispersilk, racerman13
xRECKONERx - [1] - scooby
Hoppster - [1] - DonJosh
Not Voting - [1] - hahonryuu
haru wasn't on kondi's wagon because his scum buddy was already on it. We know that now because scoobz and kondi flipped town, which means his buddy HAS to have been on that wagon. As I've said, I don't see the Maru-scum partner, and I don't see the reck-scum parter, so who is left? Hoppster and racer. He put racer on his mime list in his first read. No way scum would have his buddy up for vigging on day one, unless it was a mega hard bus, but why do that on day 1 when there is WIFOM all over the place and no one knows wtf is going on? There was no reason for him to bus his partner, and he didn't.
Maru
- seemed to take a bit to come around to the no lynch plan but honestly I believe what i believed before. he hasn't done anything particularly scummy, and since he's not a mime...im not sure I really see anything wrong with him. I'm in another game with him now. its not done so i don't really know which way he will flip, but i read another game of his and this just seems to be more or less how he is. and in the one i read <also not done, but he's dead> he was on town's side. maybe its just my gut but i think he's clean. and maru, if you are scum in this game or the other one, i shall hunt you down IRL and give you such a slapping >_< :p. at the very least he seems to be with me in not understanding
1)why what i did was scummy
and
2) why that is cause for going away from the towns current plans.
but perhaps thats just a little bias on my part. at the very least it makes me feel less stupid
meh, more buddying up to town, now that he knows he's not mime.
Scooby
- posts as little as ever. early on, especially day 1, i generally let it go. but when it happens day 2 as well...seems fishy. and keep in mind im not necessarily talking about post count, but content within his posts. there is literally no real content from him at all. worse yet, he's voted twice...not bad in of itself except that he has not given reasons for either of those votes. neither were RVS <well, arguably the first. but the second was in day 2>. he just popped in and voted. definite scum points.
Calling out a scummy player for being scum? Well, he kinda had to, right? No points for that.
Racer
- I stand by what i said yesterday, only without the mime part <changing to scum>. he posts nonsense then votes with no real explanation. a couple posts later he, imo, sheeps with reck on me. so unless there was some thing really really scummy in my post i don't understand...I'm gonna call BS here. more so on him that reck because of a combination of my feelings on reck and that I think he's just sheeping to hit someone who isnt kondi <scum team possibly?>. I dunno, maybe its just gut, but I get a different vibe from him than reck and I don't like it.
See above.
Reck
- has been active and actively scum hunting and the like. was a bit snippy with me last game day i think when i posted my reads >_>, but admittedly i didn't change the reads off of what was being said as i was typing <takes a long time for me to write my novels and things were said while typing> but after reading what i didnt have time to read because of work, he comes off as frustrated/angry town to me. I fail to see what i did that would cause a vote on me and shall await said explanation with bated breath ^_~.
Pretty much how I see reck. Frustrated town.
@hoppster: is calling the case someone has on someone idiotic really a scum tell? im not seeing it. but then i dont see how what i did was a scum tell either =/, so clearly what qualifies as a scum tell to me is iffy. and like someone else said, im liking your posts less and less. if it wasnt for the people who are seemingly trying to be below the radar seeming more fishy to me than fail scum hunting <which is more than what said under the radar people are doing>, i would probably think you were a good lynch candidate. of course this could be some bias on my part since in another game towns first lynch was a scum who was basically playing it safe.
hoppsters tunneling is definitely iffy, but its not like i haven't seen town tunnel before so im unsure on whether or not to call him out on it enough to say he should be the target of a kill. yet anyway. but of course one of those kills is entirely up to you so that's hardly for me to decide. besides, its not like he's a bad choice per se, i know i wont be crying if he's the choice. afterall he is in my top <bottom?> 3. the only thing stopping me really is that i have indeed seen such actions from town. thats what really bugs me. not saying they are GOOD town choices of course...but me suggesting killing him feels like a policy lynch to me and i dont really care for those. certainly a fine choice though
Again, both posts show haru simultaneously calling hoppster scummy, while not actually suggesting he should be lynched or vigged just yet. Hella distancing going on now.
In post 374, hahonryuu wrote:Hoppster wrote:Maruchan wrote:Hoppster wrote:I'm willing to compromise on Reck as a possible kondi-buddy, but Hell will freeze over before I let Maruchan-scum live if Reck is town.
and if reck is scum?
wut
you said you would not let maru live if reck flipped town...so he asked what happens if reck flips scum. do you still kill maru no matter what? or does he live.
and again with racer not contributing anything.
I think this post could be haru helping his buddy understand what maru was getting at before hopp dug his hole a little deeper. Adding that little racer remark helps it appear very casual.
Hey everyone, ISO haru and hoppster together with that fancy new ISO thing. They have zero interaction the entire game.
"That whisper is quite dangerous. She has been correct 100% of the time. Mime vig, scum vig, and now scum lynch. I've never seen such perfect accuracy before o_o. Enemy or not, I tip my hat to her. Her skillz are in the mad category." - hahonryuu, Paris Mafia 3
