The Children of Húrin Mafia (GREAT REVIVAL)

[VitaminR]

Vitamin, I think you are in the minority here with saying that Katsuki is town especially after that rampage over a little bit of pressure from MoI. Why is Katsuki town to you?

The emotional reaction is more consonant with townKats, and I never really saw the case against him to begin with. Also, I had a similar reaction to MoI in a different game, so I can sort of relate.

Is this based on the replace-out request? If so explain how scum don’t replace out under pressure.

See above. Having played with Kats face-to-face, this is my intuition about it.

It's basically this:

Kat's town and that "replacement" was pure irritation that I'd bet my life is from town.

Your iso is full of weird contradictions. You say that Kanye might not be a bad lynch, but when Mockingjaye votes Kanye you say that vote was incredibly opportunistic? Does that in your eyes mean that Mockingjaye is looking for an easy vote? Is he bussing Kanye? Is Kanye's scumminess in your eyes independent of Mockingjaye's scumminess?

First of all, my iso is not full of weird contradictions. YOUR FACE is full of weird contradictions.

But anyway.

I thought Kanye was a reasonable vote on the basis of what had been posted up until that point. Then I changed my mind. But that doesn't really matter. Mockingjaye's vote just seemed to make a whole lot out of very little by dissecting one post to death. It didn't feel sincere, but more like it was an excuse to join a growing wagon. That's scummy independently of how I feel about Kanye. I don't think it says much in the way of how they are associated. I could see a scumpartner do that sort of thing to be part of a bus and I could see scum do it to join a townie lynch. It's more to do with the fact that the reasoning felt insincere.

Also, with regards to the Lord Chronos vote, you make the same move by stating the wagon is lazy, but you go on and vote Chronos anyway after his post uses a lot of words to say very little. Why?

I'm having trouble seeing how this is weird to you. Maybe if you only read my iso and don't look at the context. When I said the Chronos wagon was lazy, he had like one post or something and the reasoning for the two votes on Chronos

was

weak (it was based on his apparent avoidance of the game, but that's a very weak tell in my book). Then he posted some scummy shit and I voted him on the basis of that.

Vitamin: I disagree with your opinion that the post of Kanye's that I analyzed is insignificant. I find it VERY significant.

Meh. It was sort of aggressive paranoia without justification, but town does that too. You have to relate it to what kind of player kanye is.

Wisp: Vitamin changed his mind about Kanye after Kanye originally posted Post 227/ISO 16, which could be why he takes issue with my choosing the post that changed his mind and made him think Kanye was town as the post that convinced me Kanye was scum. (I'm presuming here, Vitamin, so if I'm wrong, tell me. Also, as it was the post that appears to have changed your mind about Kanye, why do you find it so insignificant?)

That's sort of right, yeah. The aggressive paranoia read sincere to me, I guess. Dissecting it again now it doesn't seem that significant, but that's what it was.

Dekes and Spy are town, I think.

[Furcolow]

Feysal, be so kind as to point out any mistake I have made other than incorrectly typing the word Noldor

[SpyreX]

While I love how many dashing young fellows are just betwixed by my beauty I wouldn't advise letting it go to your heads.

I do have a question though:

I really don't know what I'm doing now. I could really use some help(I think it's possible that there's some role that might be able to restore my memories, was trying to signal them). I think Plum gave me this role just to fuck with me.

Now I'm not the most learned princess but I do know my letters and numbers.

The interesting part about this is the piece in the parenthesis, the addition, was not part of the initial fairly vague business.

[Furcolow]

If it wasn't for you having a grudge against me ever since I endgamed you as scum, I would be voting you, but I saw in Cold War that you're not going to let that shit go, Feysal

[Plum]

'I ask then for a sword of worth,' said Beleg; 'for the Orcs come now too thick and close for a bow only, and such blade as I have is no match for their armour.'

'Choose from all that I have,' said Thingol, 'save only Aranrúth, my own.'

Then Beleg chose Anglachel; and that was a sword of great fame, and it was so named because it was made of iron that fell from heaven as a blazing star; it would cleave all earth-dolven iron. One other sword only in Middle-earth was like to it. That sword does not enter into this tale, though it was made of the same ore by the same smith; and that smith was Eöl the Dark Elf, who took Aredhel Turgon's sister to wife. He gave Anglachel to Thingol as fee, which he begrudged, for leave to dwell in Nan Elmoth; but the other sword, Anguirel, its mate, he kept, until it was stolen from him by Maeglin, his son.

But as Thingol turned the hilt of Anglachel towards Beleg, Melian looked at the blade; and she said: 'There is malice in this sword. The heart of the smith still dwells in it, and that heart was dark. It will not love the hand that it serves; neither will it abide with you long.'

'Nonetheless I will wield it while I may,' said Beleg; and thanking the king he took the sword and departed. Far across Beleriand he sought in vain for tidings of Túrin, through many perils; and that winter passed away, and the spring after.

The Children of Húrin (96-97)

VOTE COUNT #1.6

gandalf5166 - 3 - kanyeknowsbest, Sun and Moon, SpyreX
kanyeknowsbest - 3 - Will-o-wisp, mockingjaye, Wraith
Feysal -

6

- Mastermind of Sin, MagnaofIllusion, Empking, LordChronos, Andrius, gandalf5166
LordChronos - 4 - Ellibereth, Magister Ludi, VitaminR, Feysal
Will-o-wisp - 1 - Furcolow
Andrius - 1 - PeregrineV
SpyreX - 1 - Gut
PeregrineV - 1 - Dekes

Not Voting (2): Chronopie, Espeonage

With 22 alive it will take 12 votes to lynch.

Deadline for Day 1 will be in approximately (but no less than) 10 days and will be exactly determined soon.

[Magister Ludi]

Unvote
Vote: kanye

Vig List

1. Lord Chronos
2. Chronopie
3. gandalf
4. PeregrineV

[Ellibereth]

thanks for leaving me off ludi <3
usefulness coming in next post aka I've caught scumz

[Ellibereth]

simple things first

Let's make this simple.

TOWNIER THAN TURIN
6. Ellibereth

ANDY DARLING
WHAT IS THIS

Unvote

[Ellibereth]

Oh and me trowling through this =/= thought about.
the few obvious impressions I got
was that Moi is probably town
Magnascum would so be latched on to me here with my scum meta etc.
Andy seeing me as town is wtf and asking me somewhere in there for chronos case is wtf (didn't look at context but he mentioned about meta or something and I don't know what I'm doing).

People wouldn't have balls to do blank is bad argument when concerning anyone with a modicum of experience (you oversoul).

Lurker lynches are awesome, and it's probably easier than going all casey on some big poster even if they're scummy etc. So someone not me.
Or we make vig list lynch list and then vig list vig list.

ummmm what else
I think Katsu is town here. He wouldn't have replaced out as scum.

ehhhhhhh more later.
Ludi, why DIDN'T you put me in anyway?

[Ellibereth]

whats the deal with seraphs and all that and how that would effect massclaim

[Magister Ludi]

Why should I have put you in anywhere? Do you want to be vigged for some reason?

[Ellibereth]

I don't get how someone not me or my mason buddiez wouldn't have wanted me at least deadish.

[Magister Ludi]

I haven't really read you, so, ... It you want, self iso.

How many mafia do you think are in this game?

[Magister Ludi]

Are you scum pretending to be town by saying "lulz someone should vig me", which is exactly how people would expect scum not to act?

[Furcolow]

I want to be vigged, Ludi

[Magister Ludi]

Cool. Let me whip out my six shooter here and *pew* *pew* *pew*

[Furcolow]

*AAAAGH* YE' GOT ME.

[Furcolow]

Espeonage admits to voting 3rd party

Ugh i was hoping to save that debate. To put it simply kanye has every right to want a lynch on Gandalf, however he is using the complete wrong reasons.

It is rather common for there to be non malicious third parties that can co-exhist with the town.

I'm neither here nor there on kanye.

unvotes as he is "Not malicious"

Unvote

Don't think he is malicious.

At first glance, this is great, he's scumhunting. On second thought, though, isn't voting 3rd party something scum do just to take away? I know you all feel that way, else there wouldn't be a wagon on Kanye!

He says "some third parties aren't malicious", as in they're not dangerous to town. That implies they're not dangerous to scum, either. When he decided Gandalf wasn't malicious, he unvoted him, as non malicious third parties help scum out more than anything else in mafia. Fool? Lyncher? Great examples. They often even claim or counterclaim. People who are like "Gandalf is lyncher/reverse-lyncher" are less likely scum than someone like Espeonage for this.

Hidden deep in here, and the reason I'm suspicious, is that Espeonage KNOWS BETTER. If he was town, he would be looking for orcs and such, not resorting to wagonning obvious derpy 3rd party Gandalf

unvote
vote: Espeonage

[Espeonage]

Furc is entertaining.

Unvote

You can be day two lynch.

Hmmm...

Vote: Gandalf

-turns cc cameras on-

See above for reasons why I voted.

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Dekes

– I notice you completely avoid any sort of MoI read in your ‘catch-up post’. I’d like you to commit to a read in your next one.

Feysal’s

498

is an exercise in fairly long paragraphs that say nothing at all about anyone actually being scum. His “breadcrumbing like Spyrex” is a Town tell is useless, he rides the fence on saying anything conclusive re Alignment about Furc and drops more pointless flavor spec. My vote stays.

--

Vig List
1. Lord Chronos
2. Chronopie
3. gandalf
4. PeregrineV

This list lacks Espeonage, Empking, Dekes, Wraith, S&M (nice nickname ) and Feysal. I am sorely disappoint!

--

Lurker lynches are awesome, and it's probably easier than going all casey on some big poster even if they're scummy etc. So someone not me.
Or we make vig list lynch list and then vig list vig list.

I agree, especially after Atomic Mafia.

Current people on my “Day 1 Lurker List” who I will vote for as needed are : Dekes, Choronopie, LC, Sun and Moon, mockingjaye, Wraith and maybe Vitamin R.

I think Katsu is town here. He wouldn't have replaced out as scum.

Um, why? He’s just come off a rather bad string of scum losses where he was killed fairly early. Getting significant heat Day 1 as scum, especially from little ol Me, is certainly something I could see causing scum him to throw up his hands in a tantrum.

--

See above. Having played with Kats face-to-face, this is my intuition about it.

Meh, I don’t buy it. See dram’s latest Large Theme Atomic Mafia and look at DGB. She basically played to her ‘Town meta’ that was supported by ‘face-to-face’ interaction and replaced out under pressure. Tada what do you know … she was scum.

I can understand your stance but don’t buy it.

For the record – what do you think of Kat’s push on Gandalf in light of the LOTR Mafia meta that both Andy and I have repeatedly stated. Independant of your Town read based on Kat's reaction, that is.

--

Oh please don't by calling it "a read" as if I'm trying to discredit a town read on another player.

I have a scum read on you based on your ISO and contributions. You immediately popped up immediately to say “No, you are wrong” while your contributions to actual scumhunting continue to be zero.

Trying to argue a Town game isn’t indicative of your Town play and that my read isn’t a ‘read’ isn’t doing anyting at all to change my perspective.

--

If that's not going to happen I'm going to implore the wagons to consolidate against this Kat wagon. Be it gandalf, will of the wisp or LC.

All of those are far, far better choices.

I’ll have to look back but were either WoW or LC on the Gandalf lulz wagon? If so then don’t expect any support from me without more than “I’m a Princess” unless it is a lurker lynch in which case I might join LC.

But what do you think of Espeonage? He’s on that horrid Gandalf wagon, isn’t providing any content, and generally is scumtastic. Would you support that wagon?

What about Empking? Up for an Empking scum lynch?

[Empking]

Trying to argue a Town game isn%u2019t indicative of your Town play and that my read isn%u2019t a %u2018read%u2019 isn%u2019t doing anyting at all to change my perspective.

Are you honestly saying that you think that as random game is representitive and that there are never any outliers and weird games?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Are you honestly saying that you think that as random game is representitive and that there are never any outliers and weird games?

No. Are you honestly saying that I shouldn't trust my own direct observations of your play as Town and scum when assessing you? How long are you going to continue to "Why me"?

[Empking]

Are you honestly saying that you think that as random game is representitive and that there are never any outliers and weird games?

No. Are you honestly saying that I shouldn't trust my own direct observations of your play as Town and scum when assessing you?

Yes you shouldn't trust a one-off observation unconditionally as if it was the secret of the universe. I'll freely admit that that's what I'm saying.

How long are you going to continue to "Why me"?

How am I doing that?

[PeregrineV]

And just a tip, me and Andy claiming the same role does NOT mean we have the same likelihood of being scum, idiot.

You don't know your alignment, but you know "you do not have the same likelihood of being scum"?
And I'm the idiot?
OK

My point is, just because we both said the same thing doesn't mean we're just as likely to be telling the truth.

So one of you could be lying? Since I doubt you think you are, do you think he is?

No, but apparently you think it's possible one of us are. I'm speaking from your perspective.

Of course it's possible. There's is a possibility that town has two people that don't know they are town. Or each team has one that don't know whose team they are on. Or one or both could be a liar.

I like the Tolkien stories, but have not read this one, so I'm looking at it from the mafia game standpoint.

[SpyreX]

I’ll have to look back but were either WoW or LC on the Gandalf lulz wagon? If so then don’t expect any support from me without more than “I’m a Princess” unless it is a lurker lynch in which case I might join LC.

But what do you think of Espeonage? He’s on that horrid Gandalf wagon, isn’t providing any content, and generally is scumtastic. Would you support that wagon?

What about Empking? Up for an Empking scum lynch?

LC was on the Gan wagon.
WoW was turbo Gan defense and on the Kayne wagon.

*twirls hair*

See, good sir, here's the problem I've got this game and I'll freely admit it to such a strong warrior. I can't separate the weeds from the actual poisonous bushes. There's a few shining beacons I see but, overall, its very dark and cold and full of wolves.

If we were to cut to the heart of things:

If you have less posts than Plum, I would support you being sent away from my beautiful castle.
If you "don't know what your role is", I would support you being sent away from my beautiful castle.

Aside from that I've got very strong feelings about KKB, Furc and you. I've got decent feelings about Kat, Empking and PV. Elli is a gut read.

Everyone else? In the dross.