Mini 1247- Auction Mafia: Abandoned

[Shanba]

/confirm

hi everyone

[Shanba]

Little disappointed that someone has already bid on the 100% nightkill. I think we should have left that unsold day 1.

[Shanba]

We're giving Shanba the BP. No ifs nor buts that's what's happening.

I think the strongest way to maximise bulletproof is to limit the pool of people who we allow to bid on it, rather than flat out giving it to someone. That way we can protect 2 or 3 people with it rather than just one - I'd wager scum probably dont want to play the guessing game of which player actually got it and risk losing a nightkill.

[Shanba]

Has someone really already spent 10 points on the nightkill ability?

Also, why is protect going at 5? Honestly we shouldnt really be outbidding each other on abilities like protect and investigate, so long as they're in town's hands its good. Chances are a townie bid on it first, and outbidding that townie just drains the town's collective resources. Don't do that.

[Shanba]

HOLY SHIT STOP BIDDING ON THINGS ALREADY

THE BIDDING IS ALREADY TOTALLY RETARDED. 100% DERPFEST. PLEASE STOP.

Why the hell does it matter if scum get doc? Essentially that just means they spent their points on something that really isnt that beneficial to them overall simply to deny it to the town. It costs them something (points) which I'm sure they'd rather be spending on disruptive or just plain strong abilities like bus driver or roleblocker or extra nightkill.

Ok, let me explain the setup a little, since it seems people dont understand and are already making really poor decisions that could ultimately cost us the game. We have, as town, a collective pool of resources that we want to spend to collect as many abilities as possible. What we ultimately want is to utilise as few points as possible to get as many abilities as possible. What that means is outbidding a townie as a townie fundamentally weakens the town, forcing the prices up to no net gain for the town. In any sane mafia game, town outnumber scum, which means that chances are you are outbidding townies with each bid and actively hurting the town. Now, if you had information/reads that made you think that a particular bid was made by scum, then it would be good play to outbid them - but most of these bids are being made a) without you knowing who made them and b) at a point in the game where it is totally unreasonable for you to have any solid reads at all.

There are things we can force - in particular, its extremely powerful for us to

know

that an ability was taken by scum, as we can use this to force favorable situations in endgame. If we veto bidding on certain abilities for townies, we can take them out of the pool of abilities and thus strengthen the town. Abilities that are powerful for scum and weak for town we can save money on (not have to outbid scum for them) by taking them out of the pool entirely. If the scum bid on them, we know it is a scum bid and can either outbid or let them have it knowing that they have spent points on a certain ability. As such, I propose that no one should buy the Bus Driver ability (no one should have bought 100% nightkill on day 1 either, but that ship has sailed).

TLDR: STOP THROWING MONEY DOWN THE DRAIN RANDOMLY OUTBIDDING EACH OTHER.

[Shanba]

The amount of WIFOM in this thread has increased by several orders of magnitude.

I am pleased.

Why?

[Shanba]

I'm with magua - certain abilities really really really need to claim today - bus driver being the most important one. It shoudl never have been bought at all, but by forcing it to claim we can run damage mitigation.

DRK - there's value in keeping our points total hidden, but there's also value in keeping our points totals public, too. Magua is quite right (and that was what I meant by endgame situations) in that we can force scum to admit guilt by revealing that they are missing points that they should have. As to which is more important, I'm not sure, but for abilities where keeping the actual ability hidden isnt too important, I think it's better that we out the person and have an accurate claim. Particularly as bidding on bus driver is scummy in and of itself.

Speaking of which: Magua, why did you buy the roleblocker?

uncledaphne could be a troll. Like, a legitimate "I'm gonna go play mafia on this site and act like a dumbarse huehuehue" type troll. Thats one of the options I'm considering when reading his posts. He might be playing the fool in order to get away with the scummy act of bidding all his shit on the nightkill. I really am not sure yet.

BV post was super scummy. hiplop logic on uncledaphne is my normal town logic for these situations. He looks town to me. Voidedmafia is my hipster wagon of choice.

Voidedmafia: you want the 100% nightkill to claim, but you voted uncledaphne for "his actions during the Auction phase". What actions were these?

[Shanba]

Speaking of which: Magua, why did you buy the roleblocker?

The reason I went for roleblock over bus driver is that a bus driven investigation is still potentially useful, a roleblocked investigation is worthless. Bus driven kills are still problematic, but N1 could just as easily backfire on scum as anything else.

The fact that no bus driver has claimed pretty much confirms that scum have it.

I'm more concerned with why you would buy either of them at all.

Shanba: A large amount of his actions in the Auction phase went into that vote, and nothing he's done since has made me want to change it.

This is not actually an answer to my question. Please specify the actions.

[Shanba]

I'm more concerned with why you would buy either of them at all.

...

So the scum don't have them. Seemed obvious to me.

It would be better for town overall if no one had them imo.

[Shanba]

I'm more concerned with why you would buy either of them at all.

...

So the scum don't have them. Seemed obvious to me.

It would be better for town overall if no one had them imo.

The Busdriver situation shows that that's not possible.

Scum taking it (edit: or at least, scum bidding on it) is overall not a bad situation for us, as we then know that scum have spent points on it. Also, the following situation is massively in our favour:

"OK, no one bid on bus driver/roleblocker"
someone bids on it
"Ok, we know that bid is from scum, a townie can now legitimately outbid that shit without worrying that theyre screwing another townie over."

In the situation where people are just taking it blindly, there's a risk that some townie bids on it to take it away from scum, then another townie sees the bid, assumes that scum are taking it and outbids the "scum" and we lose points overall.

I did say don't bid on that shit. I wasn't joking :/

[Shanba]

And yet there's no mechanics to stop scum from buying it (which is what the non-busdriver claim is showing happened). Also note that I was outbid for the roleblocker initially. So me not buying it would be the scum having both the roleblocker and the busdriver for only 8 points.

PEdit: Your next post: your plan-of-attack ignores the fact that scum sniped the bus driver. Following your plan-of-attack ensures that scum get the abilities for the absolute minimal cost.

Scum bids on it, we identify it as a scum bid. We take it back. EZPZ.

[Shanba]

Scum are bv, voidedmafia and sorgster. You can thank me later.

[Shanba]

Uh, wait, bv cleared. I guess he can be town then.

[Shanba]

Did we ever know who bought the 100% nightkill day 1?

Sorgster is pretty scummy even regardless of the roleblocking. The roleblocking makes it distinctly more likely that he's scum overall, too. His vote on the uncledaphne wagon was awful, his first comment today is abysmal too. He also participated in the ridiculous bidding war on the nightkill. He's probably scum.

[Shanba]

EBWOP:If I was scum, how useful would the investigation results be?

The point is not that the investigation would be useful to you as scum, but that it would be useful to stop town having it. Regardless, I think it makes you less
likely to be scum anyway.

sorgsters vote on daphne was awful because it was poorly justified wagon hop; he basically says "he looks slightly different in this game compared to the other game I played with him" which is incredibly vague and woolly and if you were inexperienced scum trying to get on a wagon would be exactly the kind of vote you'd make. I think the followup "I dont care if he's scum kill him anyway" is pretty stupid, but looks townish (frustration). I dont think scum are that likely to say "this guy Im voting I dont care if hes scum" - being scum makes you more areful about your words, since your primary priority is to avoid being lynched.

His first post today was an attack on empking for being suspicious of the dead guy - which is really just dumb, I guess. Anyway, Voidedmafia is where it's at.

Vote: VoidedMafia

Guy should be dead. For real.

[Shanba]

The part of Grey's that I was agreeing with was saying that Soda's post was scummy. I don't think you should get an extra night phase, since if you're scum more than likely you'll just "clear" one of your buddies, but I know I'm in a minority there.

If he gets an extra night phase but we then lynch him the next day, it doesnt matter whether he cleared a townie, a scumbuddy or the queen of england, his result is totally worthless. If he's a townie, then lynching him loses us the result for good. If he's scum, then dead is dead regardless of when it happens.

The only consideration that should make you consider lynching him today is if you think that tomorrow for whatever reason there wont be enough votes to lynch him (perhaps an anti-sorgster townie will be nightkilled and leave pro-sorgsters in the majority).

At any rate, the more I read his posts the less I think he is scum.

[Shanba]

Vote: Uncledaphne

for his actions during the auction phase.

Empking: That's a scummy statement, why?

Vote: Uncledaphne

for his actions during the auction phase.

Empking: That's a scummy statement, why?

Its so...dull.

Not really.

I do agree that the 100% NK should claim (and that we should choose the most town person of the day to bid on it, so that it'll stay of scum's hands), but I do agree with Lurco's thinking that the rest really shouldn't claim unless it's really prudent for them to do so.

These two posts in conjunction were what first made me notice VoidedMafia. He voted uncledaphne for his actions during the auction phase, but seemingly in the second post, doesn't know that uncledaphne had already claimed ownership of the 100% nightkill, which was one of the most egregious of uncledaphne's actions during the auction phase. Or to put it another way, he's voting for uncledaphne without seemingly knowing what uncledaphne has done.

But Shanba, I hear you cry, what if he was speaking generally? That would be extremely strange, considering he was replying directly to Magua and Lurconis who were speaking specifically about this phase.

Wondering whether I had misunderstood, I asked him for a clarification (being careful not to spook the prey) and got a beautifully vague response that didnt really say anything:

Shanba: A large amount of his actions in the Auction phase went into that vote, and nothing he's done since has made me want to change it.

I asked him again for clarification, and he simply didnt reply.

There's a couple of minor things that have happened since: his mediocre prodding of bev on day 1 was pretty scummy, and I'm not overly impressed with the whole "I forgot my ability" thing either. General low content and lacking scumhunting make him my top suspect.

lynchlynchlynch

[Shanba]

post 115 Where daphne claims the nightkill for the first time

post 121 Where daphne reaffirms his claim of the nightkill.

I didn't explain cuz work got in the way <_<. That, and I didn't feel like linking up most of his posts A1 and D1.

Its not about linking all his posts, its that you literally didn't explain at all - at the very least, something along the lines of "He was spamming a lot and trolling a lot". Honestly, there is very very little that is actually scummy in those early posts, so the implication that it was just too much to do is simply mindboggling. Do the damned legwork and tell me what you actually thought was scummy in those posts, please - something you

still

havent done, and which remains relevant as the player slot is still in the game (uncledaphne is replaced by greyice).

If uncledaphne was so god damn scummy, why has everyone stopped voting him now he's replaced out? I suspect the wagon was partly driven by antagonism to uncledaphne personally (which is poor play, but whatever) but there were a few people legitimately asserting, and voidedmafia is among them, that daphne's actions were indicative of scumminess. These people need to do some explaining.

Soda - why are you giving daphne's replacement a clean slate?

Soda's investigation on

beverly

bv looks really townish to me.

[Shanba]

Just as long as it's not OMGUS voting, since I'm currently voting you from post 394.

What a horrific piece of sly insinuation.


I actually kinda agree that hiplop is pretty scummy, but I dont understand how sorgster has managed to get himself into a position of power in this negotiation. Either he agrees to do what we say (give the investigation to someone else) or we kill him. If he's town, he'll give that shit away because losing an investigation is bad news - if he's town who is prepared to die to hold on the investigation, then screw him for sabotaging our game. If he's scum, then whatever.