Mini 1250: That 70s Smalltown - GAME OVER

[The Fonz]

Farside22 (0)
ConSpiracy (0)
IceGuy (0)

Quilford (2) kondi2424 Farside22

jasont1981(0)
kondi2424 (0)
Seacore (1) JasonT1981
kdowns (0)
mb53 (1) Quilford

Not voting: Seacore mb53 ConSpiracy IceGuy kdowns

With ten votes in play, six are required to lynch.

[kondi2424]

I'll offer my observations when farside and

kondi's replacement

have posted their night actions.

*cough*

I copycatted Seacore.

[jasonT1981]

@Mod - I am voting Seacore.

Fixed

[IceGuy]

farside22 - ?
ConSpiracy - No claim
Quilford - Blocked mb53.
jason - Kill delay IceGuy
kondi - Copycat Seacore
Seacore - No action
kdowns - No action possible
mb53 - No action possible

[kdowns]

.... Wait... Did Kondi just post?

[kondi2424]

.... Wait... Is kdowns a douche?

[jasonT1981]

would you two be interested in making a valid observation or point in this game instead of bickering and posting non sequential rubbish? Neither of you seem to have made ANY valid contribution to this game so far at a quick glance of your ISOs and it is rather alarming.

@ Both of you, I would ask to post reads and a list of reasons on your main two scum suspects please.

[The Fonz]

Magua replaces mb53

[Seacore]

@Mod - I'm not voting for anybody at the moment.

I don't like IceGuy's contributions today. It looks like 'busywork' to me. Particularly when, 1) He ignored Quil's immediate claim of Night Action and 2)He demanded responses from those of us who have no action.

kdowns - You think I'm likely scummy because I championed Iam's early push to lynch you based on your role? Please, I know I haven't been scum often (Once ever) but two out of three scum making noise about a policy lynch would just really be bad play. Also, you think I'm scummy because I asked why I wasn't JK'd? Why? It was discussed yesterday that I was the best JK candidate. I asked to be a 'likely' JK target, but not definitely, to keep the scum guessing. I like to ask about people's reasons and motivations as it helps me to build cases.

Jason - For the last time. I was never saying we should definitely lynch kdowns based on the role. I was saying that this D1 need not start with RVS since we already have a person who is the best option to discuss. All things being equal, kdowns was the best lynch of yesterday, but all things did not stay equal for long. I didn't like kdowns responses, and I still don't. But ConS and MoI quickly became scummier to me. Please quote where I have said that no informed lynch can occur on D1. Because you are blatantly misrepping me.

Also, I never voted for MoI, so again, if you're making a page by page case on me, why include things that didn't happen?

Finally, lynching me today is dumb. Particularly if you have other suspects. Sure, if I'm the only possible lynch today, go for it, but if you wait for tomorrow, you'll have a confirmed town to replace me when I flip town.

Finally, Kondi, why did you copycat me? I was likely to either a) be killed, or b) be JK'd. I was a terrible target!

I'm going to get a little bit of work done and then come back to read and vote somebody.

[jasonT1981]

.

Please quote where I have said that no informed lynch can occur on D1

. Because you are blatantly misrepping me.

Day 1 is nearly always a random lynch, since nobody has good evidence yet, unless somebody wants to claim scum?

So a good place to start with a lynch is "what role can we remove that will hurt scum the most to lose, and hurt town the least to move?" And the answer is it's the Hyde role.

bolded to highlight answer

[jasonT1981]

no good evidence to me seems like it means no informed lynch as you said..

[Magua]

Hai guyz!

Catchup was pretty easy, being only 11 pages or so after the draft, but my god, that's a lot of walls between IceGuy and Magna.

Right off the bat:
I think that kdowns is town -- first, the IAAUN RVS push at the start of the Day makes me think not mafia, and then, oddly enough, by the hammer on Magna. It was such a bad hammer, with such a scummy "sorry" on it that it's just screaming "shoot me." But for the SK that'd be suicide, and mafia want as few of their number as possible to be on that wagon (for obvious reasons) -- in both cases, mafia or SK, it's far safer to NK a vengeful than to lynch them anyways.

I don't think Seacore is mafia, again from IAAUN interactions D1 -- not only would that be a lot of effort to put into a conversation with a buddy, but the reactions of both of them afterwards when they started both getting slack for it doesn't seem like buddy material either. That said, I highly suspect Seacore of being the SK at this point, because I know he can be analytical, but his analysis here seems off. That's ok; he can still live until tomorrow and give us a confirmed townie, because if he is the SK, he's going to give the name he gets since otherwise there's the chance he names a mafia, outting himself to them and sealing his own fate if they flipped mafia.

IceGuy reads as town. There's a lot of effort in his Magna-is-scum case and it shows. Again, scum wouldn't want to be in the vanguard when it came to lynching a vengeful -- too much attention and chance of getting shot when they could simply NK.

Farside/Conspiracy is an interesting case for me to read, since my previous interaction with them both was in Open 273 where each of them was town, and each of them was dead-to-rights certain that the other was scum (which was nice because it allowed me, as scum, to milk it for two mislynches). I'm feeling a lot of deja vu reading over their interaction here again, moreso on Conspiracy's side than on Farside's. I'm not really sure what to make of it at this point, but I'm highly against them both being mafia partners. Other than that, I'm fairly null on them as a group.

kondi is a big blob of null, and only seems to speak when spoken to or spoken about.

jason is scummy. A non-entity D1, and not much to like from what I've seen D2. Voting Seacore is a downright terrible move. Suspicious of mb53 for lurking while doing the same thing is hypocritical. Suspicion of kdowns for his hammer as "opportunistic" when that doesn't even make sense. Thinks Quilford is town.

Quilford is scummy (bet you didn't see that plot twist coming). "mb53 must be mafia who was used to perform the kill" comes out of nowhere and reeks of inside knowledge (which is, note this, proven to be accurate later). It's not "I jailkept mb53, only one kill, die nao," but specifically "mb53 is mafia" and "mb53 was proxied." This reads entirely like an opportunistic lurker-lynch attempt that can be explained away D3 with "Guess I must've protected against the kill" or "Guess a kill got delayed".

VOTE: Quilford

[Seacore]

So you read that and then ignore the context?

The next bit after the bold reads "So a good place to start is". Not "So the only option is to lynch Hyde" What I was saying and what I said several times is that we should start with that discussion.

Also, did I get proved wrong? No, MoI got lynched and he was town. Now we have better evidence, but D1, as usual, was all gut reaction and vibe. Information was gained FROM it, but it was hardly the most informed lynch.

Any response to other misreps you've made of me?

[Seacore]

Magua

Awesome starting post, glad to have you in the game, and will totally consider following you on the Quil lynch for much the same reasons as you stated.

But where the hell is my analysis off?

[Magua]

But where the hell is my analysis off?

So I totally agreed with both you and IAAUN at the beginning when it was, "If we're going to lynch with no information, the best lynch is kdowns." That part's fine.

But then as the

argument

conversation went on, you shifted it more and more to *actually* trying to lynch kdowns -- eg, "Policy lynches on roles, not always bad things." in #111, which rings really off. Then you're all "I'm using it to gauge reactions," which is fine, but you never comment on anyone's reaction except for kdown's. In #154 you call out both MoI and Conspiracy, in a way that can either be MoI is scum or MoI and Conspiracy are scum together -- and then you vote Conspiracy and FoS MoI. That seems heavily survival-oriented, to not vote the Vengeful even when your words make them your biggest suspect.

[Seacore]

Okay, I can kinda see it on the Cons/MoI thing, except that I found Cons scummier and wanted MoI lynched day to so that if I was wrong, he would have had a more informed vengeful (turns out I didn't need to worry about that, MoI is great). That being said, if we had lynched Cons yesterday, I would have been first person the MoI wagon today (baring useful information from elsewhere)

On the kdown from, well I actually find his reaction scummy. You've definitely persuaded me part of the way out of that with your post, but I still don't like so much of what he's done. His reasons for me are terrible and seem opportunistic. I also wasn't using the policy lynch so much as a reaction guage as just a conversation starter, and it got pretty derailed early, which was fine because real conversation had started. I then will admit I kinda just faded out for a while, waiting for the lurkers and flakers, popping back in to clarify points now and then.

[jasonT1981]

jason is scummy. A non-entity D1, and not much to like from what I've seen D2. Voting Seacore is a downright terrible move. Suspicious of mb53 for lurking while doing the same thing is hypocritical. Suspicion of kdowns for his hammer as "opportunistic" when that doesn't even make sense. Thinks Quilford is town.

Hold on one minute and re-read what went on.

I replaced out of the game as I could not play due to illness and other personal issues, this is very well highlighted D1 and at the start of day 2 where reasons were clearly given. I did not lurk, i replaced out and came back to the game when things cleared up for me and saw Fonz still had not found a replacement.

Please explain how that is lurking and please explain how it is hypocritical. MB53 lurked, did not ask to be replaced (that I can see, as Mod usually states X asked to be replaced) and ignored the game fully before being what looks like force replaced by the mod due to inactivity.

I am not the only one suspicious of the hammer, a few have asked questions about it.

I said Quilford is leaning town, but I have also pointed out a few things about Quilford that I do not like. I have played with Quilford a few times and this game does not conform to his scum meta that I know and therefor is leaning town.

So again, please explain to me how I lurked all D1 when I asked to be replaced. I will show you.

Trying to catch up, but very slowly, in bed dying with flu today

Guys, I am sorry. I have requested replacement.

Right now I am dosed with flu, spending most of my time in bed and not getting to catch up. On top of that, I am going to be away a bit next week unexpectedly due to training on a possible new job. Sorry.

and 9 days later, when D2 started

As Fonz said, I am staying. I will quickly explain

As you know, last week I was quite ill, but the main reason is that I had a huge interview, as well as entrance exams and basic training for a job with an airline which was the job I have always wanted since highschool, and when I saw it come up, I applied expecting not to have a shot but made it all the way through to the final stages and the last 50 in the UK out of over 2000 people.

But didn't get it so everything is completely freed up again. I am fully caught up in game as well btw now.

Game thoughts coming up ASAP, just have to find my word document that I saved them on.

Note: During the night it would not allow me to quote as game was locked, so I referenced post numbers where possible.

So yes, please show me how that is lurking and show me how that is hypocritical, as the situations are black and white in contrast to each other between BV53 and myself who, if you look in ISO you will see that he didn't even ask to be replaced or give any reasons for anything. He just disappeared while continuing to post actively on the site.

Right now I am seeing nothing but OMGUS and BS rubbish and lies in your arguments against me

Quilford suspects BV53... BV53 Replacement goes after Quilford.
I suspect BV53... BV53 replacement goes after me.

Funny that isn't it?

So you read that and then ignore the context?

The next bit after the bold reads "So a good place to start is". Not "So the only option is to lynch Hyde" What I was saying and what I said several times is that we should start with that discussion.

Also, did I get proved wrong? No, MoI got lynched and he was town. Now we have better evidence, but D1, as usual, was all gut reaction and vibe. Information was gained FROM it, but it was hardly the most informed lynch.

Any response to other misreps you've made of me?

I don't believe it is a misrep, I stand by what I said and have pointed out. However

unvote
vote:Magua

Lies, OMGUS and spouting nonsense.

[Seacore]

Again you refuse to address the other points of misrep.

You also refuse to discuss Magua's case on Quil. Instead you use some of his poorer points on you as a reason why everything he's said should be thrown away.

FOS: Jason

Vote: Quil

I think Magua has found our two remaining scum.

[jasonT1981]

Magua

Awesome starting post, glad to have you in the game, and will totally consider following you on the Quil lynch for much the same reasons as you stated.

But where the hell is my analysis off?

you do realise, until Magua brought Quil up you had not ONCE made any mention of Quil this entire game. I just checked your ISO and the only thing a 'find' check found on Quil was you attacking Iceguy here

[quote="In post 308, Seacore"

I don't like IceGuy's contributions today. It looks like 'busywork' to me. Particularly when, 1) He ignored Quil's immediate claim of Night Action and 2)He demanded responses from those of us who have no action.

[/quote]

And a quote of Con that mentioned Quilford.

You had not once made any mention of a suspicion on Quilford until the Magua post not so long ago where you then replied with you could get on his lynch for most of the reasons he stated. Yet before hand had not made one mention of him aside from 2nd hand reference.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... er_sort=Go

[jasonT1981]

You also refuse to discuss Magua's case on Quil. Instead you use some of his poorer points on you as a reason why everything he's said should be thrown away.

I don't see any real case on Quilford from him apart from him thinking it is a lynch the lurker deal by the looks of it. I would like to see a deeper, and more in depth case on Quilford from him but right now, I fail to see how one paragraph gets you behind a quilford lynch when you had not made one mention of suspicion so far the entire game of him.

[Seacore]

So nothing about Quil's strange assumptions regarding mb53?

No, Magua's case on Quil is gone now, because I've never mentioned Quil and yet agree with Magua, and because Magua thinks you're scummy too.

Also, I don't voice all of my concerns all the time. I speak up when I need more information or when I'm pushing for a lynch.

[jasonT1981]

As I said, his suspicions on both me and Quil seem nothing more than OMGUS on the two people who find his slot scum.

Quil's assumptions are strange, maybe wrong. But as I said before I believe Quil to be town due to Meta from games I have seen him as scum before. It is possible Quil jailkept BV53 and no kill was made by BV53 Scum or scum using him to submit the kill and was blocked.

My only suspicion on BV53 D1 as noted was the mass lurking he did (and no,, Mag... this is not hypocritical on my behalf) but Mag's OMGUS on two people who expressed concern or placed a vote on the slot is alarming to say the least.

Mag has openly lied about me saying I lurked all D1, when in fact I had replaced out and then back in when the slot was not filled and things had cleared up for me in an attempt to make me look bad, and this is now why my vote is on him.

Goodnight folks.

[farside22]

Everybody claims their night action in their next post.

For real.

farside22 - No action

ConSpiracy - ?

Quilford - JK mb53

jason - ?
kondi - ?
Seacore - No action
kdowns - ?
mb53 - ?

fixed the bold

[farside22]

I said sorry because I hate being the hammerer in this situation.

And Ice Cube I don't know why you are asking for a night action from me, I have none.

why did you vote for MOI?
Who do you find scummy and why?

Quilford needs to explain why he thinks the mafia did not do the kill last night.

@Magua: My arguments were based on the fact CS ignored me and wasn't making sense at the start and probably a bit for a more recent game.
As of right now I'm null to leaning town. Still concerned in the back of my head.

@Jason: Why are you ignoring that I made the same point and question to Quilford?

[Magua]

Please explain how that is lurking and please explain how it is hypocritical. MB53 lurked, did not ask to be replaced (that I can see, as Mod usually states X asked to be replaced) and ignored the game fully before being what looks like force replaced by the mod due to inactivity.

Well, let's play a game, shall we? mb53 got replaced. Do you believe that he got replaced because he was scum-lurking, or do you believe he got replaced because he flaked?

Do you believe that getting replaced is a scum-tell?

Because that is the sum of your argument: mb53 flaked and got replaced. You find this scummy.

I am not the only one suspicious of the hammer, a few have asked questions about it.

The difference is that Farside asks questions, to get answers. You are "Don't like Kdowns hammer though, especially with the 'sorry' comment... seems opertunistic." One of these is trying to actually get information and reads, and one of them is just lazy.

Also, your vote for Seacore is terribad.

Quilford suspects BV53... BV53 Replacement goes after Quilford.
I suspect BV53... BV53 replacement goes after me.

Funny that isn't it?

It's hilarious. Laugh riot.